I don't know what it's like in Australia, but there are so many galleries around that take a wide array of art. You may not make it as a big name in New York, but you can have great success painting what you want if you just make sure you search for people and galleries with the same interests as you. It just takes a little looking.
No one else's art is really having anything to do with your own success.
Edit: It's probably fair to note that several times in this post I say things such as "art is _____". Please note that this, obviously, is personal opinion and so far as you are concerned, I might as well be from the planet Teegeeack.
The term..."artist", is not a fancy title. It is not a goal, it isn't a label anyone here should be concerned about in any way, shape, or form. It is, by incredibly simple definition, someone who practices "art". Which I think we can all agree, is up for a lot of interpretation.
This may just be my definition of the word, but I would share it with the community for any who are interested.
Anyone can call themselves an artist. Most everyone in the world has the capacity for creativity, and the ego to proclaim themselves as whatever they want. It is, however, as with most everything else -based singularly on their opinion or interpretation of the term.
It is a term, it isn't anything to worry about, and it is NOT something you should be trying to "achieve" in life. I can't stop anyone from calling whatever they want, whatever they want...but in truth, whether or not anyone thinks you're an artist, a great artist, or full of crap, it matters not.
In my opinion, what makes someone an artist is much more than their artwork. Maybe it's completely and utterly asinine, but there are some people who can produce AMAZING artwork, of mindblowing quality. But I do not consider them artists, because of the way they live their lives.
An artist to me, is more than someone who doodles or paints, it is more than what you produce on paper for the sake of appealing to the senses. What makes one an artist, is how they live their lives, and in what they decide to do every single day.
The handling of a difficult moment in life with a friend, how you treat your girlfriend, the way you carry yourself while walking around Wal-Mart, the way you control your emotions, and how you deal with your own failures. Depending on how you do it, it can almost all be an art form in and of itself. How you choose your words when you're in an argument, how you avoid certain topics and approach situations with your family members to try and maintain a sense of "peace" in the household - it's practically a dance, a very delicate balance that takes effort, practice, control, and experience to maintain. Just like what we usually call "art".
Art is...beauty, and I suppose you could say it's similar to religion. To say one is "religious", can be completely and utterly different from saying they're a good person. Similarly, one can easily be labeled an "artist" when the ONLY decent thing about them, is their paintings. Hardly beautiful, and hardly worth worrying about.
Personally, I care not whether people define me as an artist. I don't even really care if I'm able to refer to myself as such. It doesn't matter how many people respond to your posts, it doesn't matter how much money you're making, it doesn't matter how talented you are or aren't, it doesn't matter if every single painting you post gets criticized beyond reason, or that the people whose art is frequently displayed in museums makes no sense. And while I would like to do what I do as a career one day, and be acknowledged as a talented artist and a powerful force in the artistic community - even that, really, does not matter. It won't stop me regardless. All I want is to be able to put my various talents to use in some way as to make my wife happy, so that at the end of my lifetime I know they were not wasted.
Maybe that makes me an artist. Maybe it doesn't. Maybe my defining an artist with all of the above, and striving to be that, makes me completely and utterly hypocritical as per the opening statement to this post. I'd like to think that I can safely call myself an artist without being hanged by an angry mob of city folk, but if I can't that's ok. And if some jerk who spreads feces on a canvas prior to painting over it with splatter marks wants to call himself the best artist in the world because he's reaching multiple senses, that's fine. Because the title isn't my goal, and it never should be.
Last edited by Two Listen; December 3rd, 2009 at 01:40 PM.
Artist is a romantic tag. As soon as I felt like I sort of knew what I was doing I became embarrassed every time someone referred to me as an artist. Call me anything, but late for dinner, but don't weigh me down with the artist title.
Last edited by bcarman; December 3rd, 2009 at 09:51 PM.
Daz, weren't you the guy who made that "Hail Satan" thread? And now you've made a "abstract art isn't art" thread?
For a sorcerer, you have a remarkably low charisma modifier.
Please, visit my SB ~ N E C R O S K E T C H I K O N ! [Updated :: November 2011]"Twisted by the dark side, young Artist has become. The boy you trained, gone he is... consumed by Deviantart."
My DeviantArt Profile: http://dyspezzia.deviantart.com/
So Daz, one minute you say you are not serious and that you are trolling, which basically should set you up for at least a ban from the lounge.
And then the next post is the same ridicolous yapping that people doing art that doesn't fit your short list of criteria are hurting art in some way, by reducing the focus on traditional skills.
So basically, you're trying to rationalize your opinions by claiming you don't have them, only to wait a few hours and then state the same opinions with the type of indignation that just can't be faked.
but what if that problem doesn't solve itself? In fact what if that problem grows and becomes a modern definition of X or even the entire alphabet?"It's not that I don't agree, it's that I don't CARE. This is a problem that solves itself; they'll either drop out, or they'll actually start to learn something, or they'll manage to bullshit their way through to graduation and then never be heard from again"
We dont have to CARE for as long as it doesnt affect us, but what if it grows to a point that it does? Because we are not the producers of X, yet that's what is in demand. And we only have a choice to either also start making X just to make a living, or continue to make our different letter, but watch it fail compare to how well X is doing. And we should be disappointed because X sucks and should not be tolerated.
A healthy Industry is something that has room for all the alphabet, some letters are more popular than others because everyone has preferences, but an industry will crash and burn if one letter grows too large and takes over. Especially if its X, because to me, X is not just a different genre, but a disease, corruption, problem, X = a work that wont pass the test of time, because it lacks quality.
This analogy might be confusing so I should follow with examples:
The game industry crashed before Nintendo, because companies were only churning out quick-cash crap.
The comicbook industry is not as huge and profitable as it used to be. Same with the American 2D Animation industry. because, i think, both of these industries were defined by 3 companies(Marvel/DC, Disney). And if those companies arent as great as they were before, neither is the industry.
Did you know Tom York gave both Kanye West and Miley Cirus the cold shoulder when they wanted to talk to him? Its a bit rude but I cant blame him, because they are a part of the Music industry's X, and lately that letter has been getting way more airtime in media. X is in more demand than Radiohead.
Its a matter of taste by the (ignorant) consumers, sure. But we are not the consumers, we are part of the alphabet and we would cheer X on, even if its not our own, but like I said, X doesnt care for quality in itself, so we should hate it.
Also I think we already know this, but I have to stress it out: An industry (the whole alphabet) depends on the money of the ignorant mainstream (the only supporters of X because they dont know any better) to flourish, but an industry will only survive for decades because of the hardcore critics and makers who take it seriously, and they all hate X, because if we all supported X, the industry will burn the moment people realize how much X sucks.
Last edited by nauvice; December 3rd, 2009 at 10:05 PM.
ALSO what kind of troll discourages jew jokes on the grounds that it might be offensive to other members? Isn't a trolls job to offend other members?
No no none of this is adding up at all!
Im confused... in the same breath that you're saying anyone can be an artist. You're denying those who create art because they don't live a life that you would personally define as an artist's life?? could you clarify?In my opinion, what makes someone an artist is much more than their artwork. Maybe it's completely and utterly asinine, but there are some people who can produce AMAZING artwork, of mindblowing quality. But I do not consider them artists, because of the way they live their lives.
Last edited by nauvice; December 3rd, 2009 at 10:22 PM.
I dont want to make enemys here, I was sitting in a room with some people the other day who were attending a local art school on a government loan, the art schools mainly focus on non-figurative styles and i felt a bit ruffed up because they could go to art school to study their type of abstract art for free, but i have to pay.
I also noticed that technical drawing isn't taught as a primary subject anymore and got a bit disgruntled
It wasn't until after I posted my comments that I reallised that since in America and the such you have to pay for pretty much all tertiary schooling that my comments might not make the world of sense.
and as for being anti-jew jokes its because I was commenting on a 14year old girl from Israels sketchbook and was like "good on you" you know, then i read that and felt kinda pissed because its not wether your joking or not, its whether she percieves it as that or not.
yeah i admit my post was in anger, i wanted to stir peoples opinions about the subject and it was kinda stupid so what?
Some people say art is just the expression of emotion, and since we've all had a jolly old jump on this thread aren't we all somehow contributers to the artwork that is this thread?
Maybe.. Maybe not.
Man I just with my art didn't suck so much
Then USE the opportunity to learn from others here, instead of wasting your time complaining about something you can't change and which is irrelevant anyway.Man I just with my art didn't suck so much
There's a huge amount of educational content - and people only too willing to share information about how to draw and paint better - on this site. Go read it, and practice.
Yay internet drama!
Lets all stop drawing and define the term "artist" in such a way we can all agree.
I vote you're not an artist until you're a mentally ill bisexual with at least one substance abuse issue. Oh yeah and you have to do some art. Doesn't matter what it looks like. The key is bisexuality, mental illness, and substance abuse.
Also rockstars get to be artists. They do it all the time. Rockstar + shitty art = crowded gallery showing in LA. Brilliant!
You're right, to a certain extent, how we are identified in this world is very dependant on what other people think of us. But the point is, that regardless of the world, you need not impress in order to be a worthwhile artist. It is fact, in my mind, that everything has a place. Sometimes its just a place that's stupid as hell to a lot of people, but it still has a place.
Criticism is obviously helpful to us, as artists. We ask for it, for opinions, for advices - and they can help a great deal. But at the same time, if I post a picture, and I only take half of the criticisms into action, that is by all means my right as creator of the works and it makes no sense to do anything else. If I have a really cool idea, and everyone else hates it, I will still think it is a really cool idea and if I manage to pull it off, then I have succeeded. So long as my goal was not to please the world, yes? And really, to please the world is a relatively impossible dream, anyway, hence - its irrelevance. And if it is my dream, and makes me happy - then regardless of criticism, I must proceed forward, yes? What is the point of dreams, or goals - if you settle for anything less than exactly what you're striving for?
If I were to approach someone and say:
"Your art sucks, and you are a jerk. You are not an artist in my mind."
And they responded:
"Thanks, friend. You are a tool - I am the very definition of artist, and will choose to live the entirety of my life with such a mindset."
I would then reply with:
And we would then part ways, and we both, if it was what we were passionate about, would continue to do our work and wouldn't let eachother's existance or definition of "artist" bother us at all. At least, that's the general idea. Hopefully illustrating my view of just how pointless the term "artist" - or at least, getting upset over people using it, is.
It's like...this thread, as everyone realizes by this point. It really doesn't matter in the end. Even the crap I've been spouting off, coherent, consistant, or otherwise, whatever it may be. I don't feel like I've gained anything, I don't feel like I've lost anything. And this is ok.
Who am I to disagree with blue wingmen? Im certainly not the judge of who gets to be blue, let alone own wings. In fact, everyone can have a pair of wings while having blue skin. Spread the word and lower some standards, all are welcome!
So can we all hug and be friends now?
I'm sending e-hugs and e-kisses. Feel the love people. FEEL IT.
My SketchBook http://www.conceptart.org/forums/sho...d.php?t=139784
http://www.conceptart.org/forums/sho...d.php?t=192127"Everything must serve the idea. The means used to convey the idea should be the simplest and clear. Just what is required. No extra images. To me this is a universal principle of art. Saying as much as possible with a minimum of means."-John Huston, Director
I didnt mean artist, you're right that the word is really open to interpretation. However, the word "great" is an opinion that has to be shared with others (not everyone, you're right that you cant please everyone, but at least other people, especially those with experience to pass such judgment), in order to be true.
And yes Irishdrunk, people actually DO care. That's why award shows exist though obviously its not the only reason people want to be great. People want to be great for a selfish reason; the satisfaction of knowing that others appreciate what you do.
nice rendition of blueman
oh ok, I know you classified it as just your opinion, but Im just curious for an example, what artists with great art would you not qualify as such because of their lifestyle, and why? what about their life? Im not looking for something to debate about, just interested in knowing more about that thought.Two_Listen It's like...this thread, as everyone realizes by this point. It really doesn't matter in the end. Even the crap I've been spouting off, coherent, consistant, or otherwise, whatever it may be. I don't feel like I've gained anything, I don't feel like I've lost anything. And this is ok.
I never thought this post would get so long...O_o
Living in the middle of the midwest and having very little contact with well...any, other artists, outside of the "Interwebs". It's hard (well, probably...unfair, moreso than difficult) to judge people based on what you see on some forums. I just kind of assume there's at least a few assholes out there who happen to possess some great talent, from an artistic standpoint.
I guess to toss out an example of one possibility, let's say that someone possesses some serious talent, and can render an idea with incredible style and realism. They choose to use their talent to depict vicious rape scenes, or in real life, they're having an affair or kick puppies or something. Beauty is...great, yes? I like puppies. The aforementioned, that would be terrible, and the exact opposite of beauty in my mind. And I would, as a result, not very much like to classify them as an artist. Or great. Talented? Yes. Talent...wasted? Yes. That's not great at all. That actually kind of sucks.
And of course, I'd go about it realizing all the while that the majority of the population would still probably give them the title artist and perhaps some even would call them great, but not worrying about it too much either way. Just words, afterall, and it wouldn't have any affect on me or my artwork.
Truly, it's likely just a small portion of my mindset as a whole and how I judge most everything. I do not like to look at just one aspect of an individual, I like to look at the individual in their entirety. People deserve that much, at least. And so when I look at someone's artwork, I also look at the person doing it. We are akin to our artwork, and like I said - for me, being an artist is what you do every day, all over the place. I see very little point as a result, to work incredibly hard on producing quality art and then turn around and be a terrible person. Art deserves better than that.
Hopefully that makes sense. If it doesn't, nonsense is good too. It's just sense with a little something extra tacked on. So no worries.
I can't believe I got pulled into posting in this thread. haha
"This planet has - or rather had - a problem, which was this: most of the people on it were unhappy for pretty much of the time. Many solutions were suggested for this problem, but most of these were largely concerned with the movements of small green pieces of paper, which is odd because on the whole it wasn't the small green pieces of paper that were unhappy." -Douglas Adams
My goal: To get good enough to post in the Finally Finished Forum.
Allow me to demostrate my understanding, in the grand scheme of things, of what my mentality is actually able to affect beyond my own happiness. Demonstration will end when the bold text does.
You question my posts. You are not a member of these forums.
Did it work?
...point being, no. It does not make complete sense. Nor does that matter, to me. It feels good enough, and has not caused issue in my life or...anyone elses. And while I'd like to think my mentality is slightly less ridiculous than the demonstration above...well...it's not about what I think. At least not unless you want it to be. You don't, do you? Because if you do, you can send me a PM and I will send you pictures of puppies that are cute, because that is nice.
Edit: Hopefully these posts' relevance to the OP, or rather, iterance of points already made and then explained further as has been requested, is somewhat maintained and doesn't make this look off topic. It's not supposed to be.