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  1. #1
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    David and Goliath Art Theft

    No, I don't mean the stop motion series from the 50's (though I wish I did), I saw this on digg the other day and was really angered by it. Scroll down for tons of examples.

    How lovingly flagrant...

    I actually saw a D&G "Peas on Earth" shirt in the UK the other day that reminded me of the Pea Series that Conduct Happiness is doing, but didn't think too hard until I read this blog.

    How can a major clothing line get away with this?
    Last edited by Steph Laberis; April 19th, 2007 at 02:42 PM.


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  3. #2
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    read a tiny bit about this in a link from the Linda Bergvitz thread I think.
    Absolutely disgusting, hope this gets rectified soon.
    Brendan Noeth


  4. #3
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    Lots of companies steal stuff unfortunately.

  5. #4
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    Yeah, those of us who are protected have been following this one for a while.

    THE NERVE!
    *shakes fist*

  6. #5
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    Quote Originally Posted by Slash
    Yeah, those of us who are protected have been following this one for a while.

    THE NERVE!
    *shakes fist*
    D'oh, looks like I got olded ^^; Has there been any more news on lawsuits or settlements?

    Edit: Awh man, he ripped off Rein Poortvliet with the gnome shirts... Again, how is this guy still working?
    Last edited by Steph Laberis; April 19th, 2007 at 05:28 PM.

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    I already had a grin on my face when I saw an encyclopedia dramatica link. thanks for sharing, real good laugh.
    Brendan Noeth


  9. #8
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    god,reading the whole thing (link "what didn't fit in here" at the bottom of the dramatica page) makes me really angry. i hope his ass gets sued into oblivion and him never finding work anywhere anymore.
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  10. #9
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    Wow, this guy just gets worse and worse. I hope he gets financially owned and ends up begging for money on the side of the road. This goes beyond stupid into just being a malicious, greedy, lazy prick.
    "Every generation sees the past though the lens of its own time." - Thom Hartmann

  11. #10
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    Ok so let me get this straight.... if a guy takes a picture of the Ferrari and he sells the photo... is he infringing on the concept art of the original artist?

    Or how about... someone draws a sculpture and then sells that image... is he not stealing the sculptor's image?

    What about collage? If someone takes a bunch of photographs and then combines them ... is that infringement on the originals?

    What if someone takes a picture of you and then sells it? Do you have rights to that picture? Do you have rights to your image?

    What about culture? Did you know that the birthday song was owned by a company? Did you know that you're not allowed to sing it unless you pay royalties to them? But it's part of your childhood and culture is it not?

    What about if a photographer takes a picture of some building? Who own's the original art? Is it the architect? Shouldn't the photographer then pay royalties for the intellectual property of the architect?
    Last edited by LaPalida; April 19th, 2007 at 09:46 PM.
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  12. #11
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    LaPalida - Well, I agree that copyright and intellectual property (in general) has gotten out of hand, and admittedly some of the stuff Todd Goldman has "ripped off" is kinda fishy in my eyes (I mean the Gnomes? Or how about Calvin taking a leak? Please!). However, there are some pretty flagrant displays of art theft there (notably the Purple Pussy comic) for which he deserves to be sued for every penny he's worth.

    As for your specific questions, I'll give two answers, one based off of my own moral views and the other based off of my layman's (mis)understanding of copyright law.

    My moral view is as long as you are going "cross-medium", no real problems (as long as the artist doesn't claim right to the concept itself, only the artwork). For example, a drawing of a sculpture is fine (provided you cite whose sculpture it was), along with a photo collage or a photograph of a building.

    As for the legal answer, well...

    (Note: This assumes we are talking about US copyright law and aren't talking about "Fair Use" or any similar exceptions)

    Quote Originally Posted by LaPalida
    Ok so let me get this straight.... if a guy takes a picture of the Ferrari and he sells the photo... is he infringing on the concept art of the original artist?
    Possibly.

    Quote Originally Posted by LaPalida
    Or how about... someone draws a sculpture and then sells that image... is he not stealing the sculptor's image?
    If it is clearly a derivative work, then yes.

    Quote Originally Posted by LaPalida
    What about collage? If someone takes a bunch of photographs and then combines them ... is that infringement on the originals?
    Since they are components of a larger work that is unique in it's own way, no.

    Although the way intellectual property is being handled nowadays, it might not stay that way.

    Quote Originally Posted by LaPalida
    What if someone takes a picture of you and then sells it? Do you have rights to that picture? Do you have rights to your image?
    Yes, it is your face and your identity. News agencies get around this with "Fair Use".

    In fact, in my Civil Rights History class, my professor got side tracked talking about research. He explained that if you take an interview of someone but don't secure the rights to their words and ideas through a release form, you can't legally use that interview for your research.

    And that's just for words, let alone a picture!

    Quote Originally Posted by LaPalida
    What about culture? Did you know that the birthday song was owned by a company? Did you know that you're not allowed to sing it unless you pay royalties to them? But it's part of your childhood and culture is it not?
    Yes I did know about the birthday song. Try to think about birthday songs in movies, they are always somehow altered specifically for this reason.

    Quote Originally Posted by LaPalida
    What about if a photographer takes a picture of some building? Who own's the original art? Is it the architect? Shouldn't the photographer then pay royalties for the intellectual property of the architect?
    Possibly the architect would own the rights and he may be able to sue the photographer for royalties (unless there is some sort of "Fair Use" exemption).
    _____________________________________

    If any of my views on copyright law are wrong, feel free to correct, it's not like I'm a lawyer or anything so I probably screwed something up. But right or wrong, the moral of this story is...

    The United States is an incredibly litigious society that will milk you dry and leave you lying in the gutter for even the slightest of mistakes, so if you make any sort of business off of your art make sure to study up on copyright law and cover your ass!
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  13. #12
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    Who owns the Birthday song? Isn't it Paul McCartney?
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    I think it's hallmark.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Anid Marco
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by LaPalida
    Or how about... someone draws a sculpture and then sells that image... is he not stealing the sculptor's image?

    If it is clearly a derivative work, then yes.
    Technically, I don't think so. Selling a sculptural copy of the sculpture would probably breach copyright as a derivative work, but a drawing of a sculpture I believe in the vast majority of instances falls under fair use (assuming the sculpture were out in public... not sure about a gallery). Same with a photo... since what you own is that particular photo, *not* the design or the sculpture itself. Similarly, Wes Burt doesn't owe McDonald's anything for those paintings he did a while back, even though he paints their cup design.

    That's my impression of it anyway, I don't really know
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  16. #15
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    For some answers on taking photographs of buildings, sculptures, etc:
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Freedom_of_panorama

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    I have a friend that this happened to on a major clothing store in Sweden ( H&M ).. What could he do?

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    Looks like Goldman's most famous and profitable drawing was partially stolen as well, judge for yourself:

    David and Goliath Art Theft

    I didn't see a direct link to the original thread by Dave 'Shmorky' Kelly that started it all, so for those who want to know how this developes further click here (thread is huge by now!)

  19. #18
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    wow.... art theft of epic scale..
    My work: [link]

  20. #19
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    The biggest crime here is people actually calling this art. Theres no way in hell that guy made 90 million on that trash.

  21. #20
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    ugh,his "original" gives me headaches.
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  22. #21
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    Looks like this story is gaining more publicity. Goldman's sicking lawyers after some sights for slander. Saw the story on Slashdot yesterday.
    "Every generation sees the past though the lens of its own time." - Thom Hartmann

  23. #22
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    actually it is Paul McCartney
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  24. #23
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    Hey! I posted this same thread... but nobody cared

    Anyway, things are getting more interesting:

    Juxtapoz took down the article pertaining to this after receiving a cease-and-desist letter from Goldman's attorneys - other sites also got the same letter.

    Some poster at SomethingAwful found a ripped-off version of Bambi, along with a ton of other clip-art-derived images.

    Shmorky (Dave Kelly) has asked the posters over there to stop speculating: it seems Goldman may be monitoring the thread and removing items from the company's website as they are pointed out as possible examples of plagiarism. Shmorky's also mentioned that he can't talk about the case, and it's driving him nuts.

    Funny thing is, according to Shmorky, if Goldman had just apologized and coughed up the money from the 5 or so paintings he sold (which isn't much at all compared to what he's worth), this whole thing may have just gone away.
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  26. #25
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    Apparently someone contacted Disney about the Bambi image as well (which had 'Bambi' in it's title and was an exact trace of the original Bambi). If Disney get's in on this, Goldman will defenitely be ruined.

  27. #26
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    i hope to god he does. what an asshat.
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  28. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by LaPalida View Post
    Ok so let me get this straight.... if a guy takes a picture of the Ferrari and he sells the photo... is he infringing on the concept art of the original artist?

    Or how about... someone draws a sculpture and then sells that image... is he not stealing the sculptor's image?

    What about collage? If someone takes a bunch of photographs and then combines them ... is that infringement on the originals?

    What if someone takes a picture of you and then sells it? Do you have rights to that picture? Do you have rights to your image?

    What about culture? Did you know that the birthday song was owned by a company? Did you know that you're not allowed to sing it unless you pay royalties to them? But it's part of your childhood and culture is it not?

    What about if a photographer takes a picture of some building? Who own's the original art? Is it the architect? Shouldn't the photographer then pay royalties for the intellectual property of the architect?

    Copyright laws should cover all of these things quite thoroughly. You should do some research on Canada's copyright laws.
    I think you are awesome, and I wish you the best in your endeavors, but I am tired of repeating myself, I am very busy with my new baby, and I am no longer a regular participant here, so please do not contact me to ask for advice on your career or education. All of the advice that I have to offer can already be found in the following links. Thank you.

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