Art: Baked Super sculpey question + new product - Super Sculpey Firm

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  1. #1
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    Baked Super sculpey question + new product - Super Sculpey Firm

    Hey all,

    I baked something today. After baking..it's.uhm..'hard' so to speak, but not really ceramic that I can tell (isn't ceramic almost like a fine china type hardness...like a plate?)

    It still feels brittle (as I chipped it by poking with a sculpting tool. I was trying to do this anyways, but haven't been sure if it's supposed to be this weak or not)

    Also, anyone try the super sculpey firm? Since I sculpt more miniature scale stuff (or want too), I am wondering if that would be better for me. (most detail miniature sculptors use green stuff, and brown stuff instead, which are both stronger, and seem better for detail).

    Any help would be appreciated.

    Will put pics of my current work (even though it's not that good) up later.

    Regards,

    Sanjay

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  3. #2
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    Super Sculpey does not bake to a ceramic hardness. Your description is the same as I've experienced. How hard and how crumbly depends on how well its baked.

    Super Sculpey FIRM is the same once baked as regular Super Sculpey. Its firmness is in its unbaked state and is more conducive to traditional sculpting techniques.

    You might want to look into epoxy clays such as Magic Sculpt and Apoxie Sculpt. These harden through a chemical reaction over a period of hours: no baking just like green stuff. When hard they are very comparable to ceramics.

    http://www.avesstudio.com/Products/products.html
    http://apoxie.sculptingstudio.com/#
    http://www.magicsculp.com/index.html
    http://www.kitkraft.biz/catalog/Scul...p-6-c-273.html

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    :)

    Hi,
    I use apoxysculpt (using it right now for feet of the creature made from super sculpey) and i use green stuff.

    SInce i'm not that good, i need more time to work, so super sculpey is fine.

    Since these are gaming models I make generally, as long as don't drop em they are fine with super sculpey. BUt it was a question, since in Smellybug's tutorials he never mentions the hardness of his creations

    Sanjay

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    Super sculpey fanatic.

    his right..just make sure u don't keep it for to long an again like I tell evry1 make usre u have something to support, depends on what u make or build..

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    I don't think any compound clay will bake to be as hard as StarFyreXXX describes ?

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    I baked a 13 cm tall super sculpey sculpt in light heat for 20 minutes, and it burned badly! Thankfully it was a prototype.
    Any recommendations on how to bake it?

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    IIRC I've heard that baked fimo is pretty sturdy in comparison. In my own experience, I baked one of my first fimo (soft) experiments and tried to carve back some parts afterwards. I was surprised by how much I had to work to even scrape the surface, and that's from a similar viewpoint as your own: sculpting minis, often with hard-curing epoxy clays.

    Also, from the viewpoint of mini-sculpting, the softer media can be tricky to tease into fine details without being smudged, torn or crumbled. At least if you've cut your sculpting teeth on stiff, elastic stuff like green stuff, brown stuff or procreate. In my opinion this is the area apoxie sculpt falls into - although it firms up nicely within the working window, and mixing it with green stuff makes a bee-yootiful composite to work with.

    Of all the stuff I've tried, I think pink super sculpey is the softest. Combined with that blinkin' translucency and infamous brittleness, I'm not overly impressed by it's prospects for gaming minis. If you want to switch polymer clays, I'd definitely back your decision to go for something firmer.
    I can't comment on super sculpey firm. I haven't managed to get my hands on it yet. But I can say that Tre Manor of Red Box Games recently got a bunch of pro and amateur mini sculptors interested in cernit, which he liked partly because of it's firmness. After trying it I can't argue much. You can see the goblin he immediately sculpted, and his thoughts on cernit scattered through the topic, here. You can see the rest of the gobbo's mates here.

    Quote Originally Posted by StarFyreXXX View Post
    SInce i'm not that good, i need more time to work, so super sculpey is fine.
    I'm starting to get the hang of polymer clays and their weird 'I don't cure' properties, and tend to take my time myself, so I can appreciate where you're coming from. But like I said in a recent topic: the key with epoxy putty, if you don't work too quickly, is to concentrate on smaller parts and areas at a time. Build up the general shapes and proportions, the understructure, then skin it with a final layer or two.

    Last edited by Vermis; September 1st, 2010 at 06:45 PM.
    ...which is only my opinion.
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    If the baked Sculpey is kind of brittle, that's definitely not how it should be. If that happens bake it longer. I usually bake thicker stuff for 5-6 hours (at 110-120°C) and let it cool in the closed oven over night.

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    Hi, I have noticed that the burning of sculpy doesn't seem to have a lot to do with the time in the oven, but more like it seems to discolor in some strange places,{ sometimes its kinda cool, and gives insite on painting. } I think it may have to do with the oil on our fingers or something like that.
    I love Apoxie and use it all the time for all kinds of stuff. It does dry very hard, but I had my heart broken when I dropped a Apoxie piece and it shattered, like a plate.
    I totally agree with Vermis, that you really need to work in small amounts because of the working window being around an hour. That is quite often not enough time to add all the details you want, so working a smaller area makes a lot of sense.
    What we need is something that has a longer working window, say, maybe three hours, and dries so hard a cat couldn't scratch it.
    My 2 cents worth.
    Mah ' Crub

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    I totally agree with Vermis
    Huzzah!

    you really need to work in small amounts because of the working window being around an hour...
    What we need is something that has a longer working window, say, maybe three hours
    Well... I'd say green stuff (kneadatite) has a relatively short working time, but that's still 1-2 hours compared to the 2-3 advertised for some other putties; although it'll depend on the ambient temperature. (I'll concede that Orlando can be fairly sunny. ) Couple of nights ago I was cursing a piece of procreate about three hours after mixing, because it still refused to firm to the state I wanted, for a certain detail.

    On that note, as an extension to 'the key': try to work with the gradual curing and stiffening within the working window. Stick on and shape the major masses first, then work in the smaller details. That's sculpting 101; but with epoxy products it's easier to throw on the basic shapes when the putty's freshly mixed and at it's softest, and to refine the detail as it firms up. Contrary to (hypothetical) expectation, it can be easier to add finer details when the putty offers increasing resistance, and you don't have to worry as much about using a light touch, or accidentally denting flat surfaces and mashing tiny details with a slight twitch. Depends on whenever the putty starts offering too much resistance, but IME in this part of the world that's usually not within the hour. And sometimes I'll work right up to the point of hard cure, smoothing surfaces and touching up details.

    That's one of the problems I have, getting to grips with polymer clay. Besides the fact it hasn't cured by the next day, it's also a little strange that I don't experience - or can't rely on - that gradual resistance. I know polymer clay sort of 'settles' again after conditioning, but it's not exactly the same thing.

    Do I sound like I know what I'm talking about yet?

    Last edited by Vermis; September 2nd, 2010 at 07:13 PM.
    ...which is only my opinion.
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    Well, regular sculpey isn't very strong...it will break very easily after baking. For sculpting, it is crap. Super sculpey is lot better, and when baked it is more like hard plastic...it's got a bit of flex. However most people don't like the translucent flesh color so they mix it with something else for color.
    You can get small blocks of colored sculpey, fimo, or some other polymer clay and mix it with a block of super sculpey to get the color you want.

    -Mike Cross


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    Wink

    Hi everyone !
    At the moment I'm working on my shark (you can have a look at "Jaws shark / work in progress", if you wish).
    I'm progressing and soon I will upload new pictures of the shark.
    I'm using Super Sculpey firm and I have questions about this product.
    Initially I thought the piece at home baking and design its dimensions suitable for that purpose.
    As I progress I think it might be better option to use a heat gun and go applying it in areas meanwhile the work is on the way,before this can be considered complete. I say this because while I work, for instance, in the head, other parts are affected by the manipulation of the hands (dorsal, central part of the body ...)
    What do you suggest about it?
    If I use a heat gun, "can I be very selective in the areas over which I want to work?
    Also, what is the proper distance for the use of the gun and what is the time of heat exposure appropriate?
    I know there are many questions but the truth is that I can't stop thinking about it while I work.
    Any suggestions or possible solutions will be very well received.
    Finally, when heat is applied to harden the area, is it possible to return to a soft state if I wish to implement improvements to modeling?
    Thank you very much in advance.

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    To Alexshark:

    I use the heat gun only for small jobs, and I try not to set it too high, about 300F. You probably could use the heat gun exclusively, but I don't think it is a good idea because it is hard to heat the area evenly, and you run the risk of scorching the area and make it blister. Or you get areas that are not cured and areas that are too done. Also, it's kind of slow.

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    Wink

    Thank you very much for the advice. Most probably I'll use the oven.
    The shark measured 18 inches. If, for example, bake a first time and then, once I decide to add details on the hardened piece (work inside the mouth), can I re-bake the entire piece?
    I ask because I do not know if a second baked may affect supersculpey firm.

    Finally, some of the key pieces of shark (pectoral fins, pelvic fins and clasper)
    must be separated to produce the mold. My question is: At what point and how can I separate these parts so that the cut is clean and precise?
    Obviously, these flaps should be placed in the resin piece and should fit perfectly.
    How do I proceed with these steps?
    Greatly appreciate answers to these questions, because I worry a lot.

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    Hi Alex, I honestly don't know what would happen if you twice baked the shark,but since you are using the firm sculpy, you really should not be getting a lot of accidentals as you work. I think you should go ahead and sculpt all your details and then go back and do a final smoothing.
    Now to address you question about all the other segments that need to seperate for molding.
    These are usually all thought out in advance, and you are learning that now.
    { usually building somthing the first time teaches us how to build it better the next time} You must now figure out a way to attach and remove the pieces that you want to mold and then be able to re-attach when finished. If you look at some of the other sculpts that come apart, you will see that the artist planned for it by using methods of joining by using small rods on one end,{ male,} and a socket on the other of some kind that the rod can fit into,{ female}.... so you could insert a small tube into the shark body, and then insert you rods into the sculpt of the fins so that they can fit into the tube. You will want to make the rods and tubes into the sculpt so that they can't twist and fall out so make them part of your armature of the fins. Of course the rods and tube must be of a size that makes for easy installation and removal. ....I am sorry... typing is a crapy way to speak.... it takes so long to convey a thought.... this is probably as clear as mud now... but basically you have to have some sort of semi-mechanical method of joining the pieces, square stock, round stock, ball and sockets.... doesn't matter, as long as you have a method. Sounds like a lot of work, but really once you have done it a time or two, you will have it down completly and you will realize that a bit of pre-planning is very advantagous, and you will know what to do.
    I hope this helps.
    Mah ' Crub

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    Wink

    Thanks for help.
    I understand what you mean about separating the pieces and later make them fit.
    I suppose that this action must be performed with the soft clay. Then carefully separate the fins and bake separately.
    Correct: Once you have the piece in resin once attached fins to the body, how does delete (or stealth) the cut line?
    One last question about the inside of the mouth. Should I leave the empty inner cavity prior to the completion of mold?
    Thus, all the details (rows of teeth, gums and details in the cavity) are added to the resin piece and these are necessary to produce a specific mold inside the mouth.
    Is this the correct procedure?
    Maybe I could do the modeling of the cavity prior to the completion of the general mold, but I'm not sure the procedure is successful.
    Any answers..?

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    To give you an idea of the work in the mouth look at this photograph.
    This is the level of detail to which I referred.
    Thank you very much

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