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  1. #151
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    total newbie, just found COW, thought awesome i'd love to try. now i'm a bit confused should I start working on a creature for a deadline thats already two days past, or wait for the new creature? how long does this normally take?


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  3. #152
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    Wait damouse

    Fozzy the admin is a busy boy working in the Biz and he get's around to it when he has time. It is best to wait until the new one to give yourself more time to work on it. Plus you can always work on other weekly posts, or just the sketchbook posts.
    That is not dead which can eternal lie,
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  4. #153
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    okidoki
    determined little blighter

  5. #154
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    Arrgh! My arctic undead creature was rejected because my 3 lines of text written in 10 minutes wasn't clear enough to describe that every storm has a spirit and when a particularly strong and destructive storm rises in the arctic a wendigo will rise with it to hunt. So my description of a spirit was not done well...Fozzy made mention at the start of the arctic undead creature cow that spirits this time would be allowed...I really thought I was following that lead, given permission to make a spirit I went ahead and described a spirit...that I was describing an individual is ambiguous at best.

    12 hours of art was rejected for 10 minutes of bad english.

    Many other pieces CLEARLY defined individual unique characters and made it to the poll - those artists texts wasn't ambiguous at all...I think this is wrong and I feel like I was not given equal consideration among those other artists. Why did their text get overlooked and mine didn't?

    I would really like an explanation of the distinction...I very much want to know what I need to do or not do to insure my time spent on art is not wasted by the few minutes I spend on description.

    I didn't do cupids pet because it really stings to be rejected for something that so many other artists did and got away with it. It still stings.

    I have had work rejected by bosses and colleagues many times in my career and education, but universally they have discussed their decision and offered constructive comments with which I could grow and learn. I have never had the experience of being rejected for something that other artists pieces did and were still accepted.

    Well I have now and I don't like it.
    Last edited by TomCardin; April 21st, 2007 at 12:53 PM.

  6. #155
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    TomCardin
    I already apologized if i misunderstood your concept. And i also mentioned that i didn't have the time to read all the concepts...

    I founded COW and was taking care of all rounds and entries until now. I always wrote reasons why i rejected pieces and mostly if i had time i commented directly in the posting thread so artists could react. It's the first time for the last 2 rounds that i didn't do that because of lack of time and people are ranting and complaining.

    I am sorry that i am not having the time for the last rounds as i had a deadline project going on and also was/am moving to a new flat.

    I think it's not very fair to rant and complain, particularly after your comment in a different thread, that you learnt much in COW and after my note to all that i won't have time for this phase.

    It would have been easier for me to announce a break for COW for a few weeks to get my business done and return to COW. Instead i decided to keep this activity going, just because i wanted to provide this platform for ca members and artists. As i did the summer break back then many people were upset, i thought it would be good for all not to do a break, but i think i again learnt from the community.

    My thoughts were just confirmed by this again, you can't please everyone. For the future i think i will just do what i think is right to do.
    Last edited by Fozzybar; April 21st, 2007 at 05:24 PM.

  7. #156
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    Fozzybar: Just to let you know: you're doing an awesome job as it is. Just taking time every week to keep this going is something I deeply respect.

    I think people are taking this challenge far too serious latetly and forget this is all about having fun. As a result, people get very frustrated when not even getting to the poll. I can understand that, I wouldn't like that either after working on it for hours, but it would only make me want to do better next time instead of blaming Fozzy for it.

    With the Arctic Undead Creature challenge I saw some people complaining about how their piece was rejected for being a character while other pieces which were just as much of a character were taken to the poll. Well, the point here is: I guess they're just as guilty as you for braking the rules but they were lucky to be overlooked by Fozzybar. If you want to be absolutely sure it will be taken to the poll, don't try to find out where the mazes in the rules are. There's plenty of other ways to come up with an original creature without do this, so don't go yelling it limits the creativity. If you still want to be creative and do something the rules don't seem to cover completely, feel free to do so I'd say but remember that in the end it's Fozzy who decides.

    You're in it for the fun and experience (that is to say: I am), and Fozzybar happily provides it..what more can you ask?
    Last edited by yoitisi; April 21st, 2007 at 06:35 PM.

  8. #157
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    I didn't see any apology but I accept your above post as one. Thank you.

    I posted here because it seemed more appropriate to post a complaint here due to the title of this thread.

    I appreciate your time to address my concern.

  9. #158
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    Im not sure if anyone has asked this before, but is it ok for us to post the finished pencils instead of a colored piece? Just wondering because I dont have PS or any other program for coloring, and no way of attaining one at the moment.
    "Imagination is more important than knowledge"- Albert Einstein


    Eric wants to LEARN! Sketchbook



  10. #159
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    yoitisi
    thanx a lot. You have the right attitude. People forget that this is all about fun And you can learn and improve a lot as well if you have the right attitude.

    TomCardin
    You're right, i apologized to someone else who had the same reason for rejection, that's why i mixed it up. So i apologize to you especially

    Envisor
    Finished pencils are fine There is no need for colors as long as the b/w piece is finished and good enough.

  11. #160
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    Fozzybar, I read about you moving to a new flat and being very busy because of deadlines... so best luck to you and I will wait until you are able to answer my questions... I apologize for not posting them in the proper thread before... My bad.
    I read all written rules for COW and what I found were some explanations in the FAQ thread where you started from explaining what Cow was started for and how you see this activity.
    I read that you would prefer a creature to be a composition, of fantasy, not existing before... just because it is more challenging and enjoyable to look... bu I didn't get impression that it is strictly what it should be... you used a word "recommendation". That's a bit vague.. is it a rule or just preferences, a guidance?

    I understand that it is about fun... but it is a model of real life project in a way where artist should follow certain requirements... I wish you were as clear as possible about what exactly is very important and where an artist can have some more freedom.

    The other thing you mentioned that it shouldn't be a humanoid... because it makes it an easier task.

    Sketches and images with not enough efforts put into it will be rejected...

    You said the professional artwork will never be rejected for its artistic value... or educational value...
    I would like to ask you to explain about the requirement that creatures shouldn't be characters... because frankly speaking I don't know what it means in this context...the word character has few meanings.
    Thanks in advance.
    With respect.
    Sveta

  12. #161
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    Quote Originally Posted by sve
    I would like to ask you to explain about the requirement that creatures shouldn't be characters... because frankly speaking I don't know what it means in this context...the word character has few meanings.
    Let's say we are a very old and advanced alien race. We have to make an encyclopedia of beings we met in our million year long history and journeys through the galaxies...

    What would you put into an encyclopedia when you want to present the species "homo sapiens sapiens"...considering anatomy and typical vizualization??

    I think it wouldn't be a photo of a dressed Michael Jackson with his name under the photo.

    It would be a photo of a naked anonyme man or woman, just like we find it in the biology books in schools.

    Michael Jackson is a character.
    The naked anonymous human is a representative of our species in common.


    Quote Originally Posted by sve
    I read that you would prefer a creature to be a composition, of fantasy, not existing before... just because it is more challenging and enjoyable to look... bu I didn't get impression that it is strictly what it should be... you used a word "recommendation". That's a bit vague.. is it a rule or just preferences, a guidance?
    It is definitely not a rule, more a guidance for the participants. I just want to avoid people drawing existing animals without nothing new in them. Of course 99% of us are starting with known patterns and animals in our head, but the question is how far away is the result from the starting (known) animal.


    Quote Originally Posted by sve
    You said the professional artwork will never be rejected for its artistic value... or educational value...
    i don't know if i said "never", but even if it is of course meant this way as long as the entry is sticking mainly to the topic and rules. I am only more forgiving to the pros




    I hope this will answer some questions now, also for masque who might have asked the same questions

  13. #162
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    Thank you so very much for explaining this. I sure appreciated. I think for everyones good it would be useful to cut and paste your clarification to the thread where all rules are. I can do it myself, it seems tobe allrigth thing to do with mentioning your name,,, but it will be on the bottom of the thread, not where all rules are listed.

    Quote Originally Posted by Fozzybar View Post
    ..


    Michael Jackson is a character.
    The naked anonymous human is a representative of our species in common...
    . OK, it is like when a movie director wants to have actors with fresh unknown faces casted in a new movie... with purpose to get rid of all possible associations with other masterpieces. I can understand this... It makes an artist's job harder and the fun activity to have certain direction... but it is all right in my opinion. That's your vision.

    I have to say, Fozzybar and I'm saying this believing that you were not aware of it... just because I think very good about you and trust you... well. this rule about creature not being a character was not documented in rules... it was mentioned in threads with art, but only now it is explained for me fully...It could be easily skipped by people, IMO...
    So, Fozzybar when you said that it was a known fact, a rule but it was ignored by an artist (rules being bent) you were not being fair I think... it was not written in rules unfortunately. And the requirement I thought was crucial... his entry being a stylized animal as you just confirmed to me is just a recommendation, not a strict rule.
    Chip is an honest man like you, I think... he wouldn't do such a thing...From what I know about him he is very serious about rules, and few times he pointed to my own careless attitude about them... So... I hope you see things through my eyes.

    You don't need to rule this activity overcoming opposite opinions forcefully,,, you have much bigger force... your good sympathetic fair nature and the fact that you are well liked...I would say loved... you know... love from your subordinates and respect are much more powerful, everlasting and durable force than fear. Much more productive too. You have it, no need to use a whip or plug, you can have your way with simple fair reasoning.. I would like to ask you, please, don't be silent when it is about rules ... explain your position and people will understand because I believe in your good choice and common sense.

    I'm sorry for saying this to you, but it was done with total respect and because it hurts me seeing this misunderstanding between two people I love and respect equally.

    All the best
    Sveta
    Last edited by sve; April 25th, 2007 at 06:04 PM.

  14. #163
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    hey, Sve, thanks for the nice comments, but i have to disagree and say that the "new" explanation of what a character is in regards COW doesn't clarify a thing, and instead just makes things less clear.

    first off, Michael Jackson would never appear in COW because he's a humanoid (barely, some might say ), but even so, as an example to clarify what constitues a "character," there isn't any new information. Foz claims Michael Jackson is a "character," but says nothing about why. he seems to assume everyone would know why he'd make that distinction, but there's no reason to assume that. so lets look at what distinguishes Michael Jackson from the anonymous human Foz leads us to believe is not a "character" in his estimate.

    Michael Jackson has a proper name. in fact, most humans do, afaik, even mister "anonymous". and, in many cases, non-humanoids do also. my cat's name is Casseopeia. that doesn't make her a "character," does it? she is a bit of a flake , but if the proper name makes her (or a COW submission) a character, then say so.

    Michael Jackson is famous within some cultures. does fame make one a "character"? if so, how could that be applied to a non-human? i guess any well-known non-human could be a "character," but if portrayed in COW, then the originality rule would probably apply more appropriately, so fame isn't a relevant aspect of a "character" for COW. anyone using a well-known character would be roundly chastised by the entire CA community!

    is Michael Jackson a unique organism and not part of a species? well, again, some wiseacres might say so, but unfortunately, he is actually part of the human species, though a poor specimen of such imo. in any case, the question of a unique organism being a "character" is still open. does being one-of-a-kind constitute being a "character"? if so, say so.

    so what other ways can Michael Jackson be considered a "character"? since the only COW "character" definition mentions no accessories, lets strip all those away (there's goes my appetite!). no clothes, no makeup, no wig, hairdo, whatever. just ol' MJ, unplugged. still a "character"? if so, why? what other qualities not already mentioned define him as a "character"?

    simply saying he's a character doesn't define the nature of a character, it simply expresses Foz's opinion about Michael Jackson. i'd like to know what informs that opinion, since it seems to be the only source for the COW "character" rule.
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  15. #164
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    because Chip when 100 artists are asked to draw or paint Michael Jackson, I guarantee to you you will not see blond with blue eye looking at you from the paper. You will see certain eyes and hairdo and even certain style in his cloth... I bet more than 50% will base their picture on the same image they saw of him... the character has certain well recognizable features which will not allow you to mistake him with someone else, IMO.

  16. #165
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    jeez I hate to weigh in...

    as I see it
    A.. Creature is define as not indulging in anthrpomorphic antics ie carry ing guns, wearing clothes etc.

    B. A character is an individual. period ... yes your cat is a character... in that sense it is very difficult to portray one animal and have it NOT be a character
    but the goal is to protray the species. not the individual

    sveta and chip.... kiss and make up... foz you can too....
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