The FUBR phase..

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  1. #1
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    The FUBR phase..

    I believe I've hit the FUBR phase [fucked up beyond recognition]. None of my art pieces seem to turn out right, I've abadnoned 20+ sketches in a little over 30 hours. I'm a fast sketcher, but slow with details.

    But no matter what I do, nothing seems to turn out right, I tried the 'look at a reference and draw it" bit but it just didn't work. I'm depressed lately so I know that has something to do with it, but that shouldn't be an excuse as to why my hands won't work right. x.x'

    I'm having the problem where, I see something in my head and go to draw it down, then fuck it up so badly I just lose the image all togeather. Does anyone know how to pull yourself out of this stage? I already set up three art trades, one trade per week in hopes that will help. So far though I feel very uninspired.

    An artist I looked up to, last night, told me my work was 'worthless crap'. I haven't really been able to look at a pencil since. My goal was to go to Ringling, but I'm afraid that I cannot get there.

    Please help, I know all artists go through this, I did once before and forgot how to get out of it. Or maybe if someone who is reading this has this problem too, they can post and we could try to help eachother. I don't want to discriminate in this thread, it's for everyone. I merely stated -my- resoning, who knows, I think it'll help out more than just me. I hope.....

    ~Tanika

    It's better to live on your feet than to die on your knees.
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  3. #2
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    first, kick this 'artist' in his arrogant butt.

    Then, participate in the DSG.
    There was no place where I made more improvements than there, ever.

    What my problems were (and are, still) when drawing from refs:

    I look once at the object, maybe a head, and think "Ah, eyes, ok, two eyes" and then I draw two eyes.
    I always failed, because I never analyzed the true shapes of an eye or the position, size relation to other face features etc.
    Maybe thats a problem, don't just look at the ref, analyze it.
    How long is the nose in relation to the rest of the head? If it's four times smaller, then draw it four times smaller than the distance from the upper head limit to the chin, etc.

    I hope I could help a bit

    cu (dont give up)

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  4. #3
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    Re: The FUBR phase..

    Originally posted by Tanika
    An artist I looked up to, last night, told me my work was 'worthless crap'.
    Is this quoted directly from the person ? If it is, well, I'm in shock.
    Yes what you're experiencing can happend to everyone.. I guess you could try to change subjects and do more observation drawings in order to get out of that frame of mind. People, objects, sceneries,.. whatchathink ?

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    You gotta keep drawing. You're going to move in and out of ruts, it's the way of the world. Actually I fond it's a alot like working out; you'll draw and draw and draw and not improve for a long time and then one day you are exponentially better than you were before, and you improve a little and then plateau again. Really, you just have to keep at it, I garauntee you will eventually come to another rise, you just have to keep going, no matter how tired you are and how much it hurts Suck it up soldier!

    - Rockstar Ninja Artist Extraordinaire
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    "that which does not kill you only makes you stronger"
    good words of advice. i had android tell me my drawings weren't up to par and that basically i better sit down and draw and study my ass off. that is NOT a direct quote, but this is "I saw your sketches and you have years of work ahead of you until you reach the level you will need to be competative now, and the bad news is that the bar gets higher every year it not going to ever get easier to become a concept artist" while this comment hurt me deeply, i realized that this was the honest damn truth.... and i didn't put down my pencil. i picked it up... everyday, i got anatomy books, i frequent the reference section here on this site, i try to draw from life as much as possible, i try to draw at least 15 minutes a day. i told android i was gonna be better then him!!! hahahahahahahaa.... anyway the point is do not give up!!! keep pushing and i swear your art will improve, and you get over this hump or rut you're in. if you need an inspiration, check out MindCandy Man's post... this guy is giving it 150% everyday and it just boggles my mind and inspires me to do the same. hope this helps.

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    cucaracha: Thanks, when I look at something, I see what is there, how it's placed, and can normally grasp some of the anatomy. but I NEED to look at something, I cannot draw blindly. But if I see something, I will draw what I see, for instance, if I see a girl sitting saddly by a window gazing out at the sun, I will se an angel, not a mere girl. That's most likely just my creativity sparking. I hope.....but yeah. I'll try more references and see if I can pull up anything. I'd kick the artists' butt, but his 'millions' of fans would go after me. x.x

    egerie: Actually it wasn't crap, it was a synonym for that word that starts with an S and ends with an 'hit'. *sigh* I'm going to the mall today so I'll tug my sketchbook along and see if I can find something/someone to draw. It just seems that all the stuff I do comes out looking like total.....ickyness. Maybe it's just those words stuck in my head.


    Nimrod: heh, I'm hardly a soldier but thanks, maybe this is the start of another plateau. I normally get blocks just before I improve. Nnn....I -really- wish my stuff didn't look so crummy right now. I hope I'll improve. I sketched like mad yesterday, but that only made me worse. x.x I was kind of going for an oposite effect. I just need my confidence back, I think....

    Stickler: oops, sorry I almost forgot you, I was writing this when you posted. I've been drawing a few hours a day. Android is a nice fellow and he said it in a nice and mature way. When you hear "what is this worthless shit?" From another artist, it really does kind of hurt. x.x But I'll keep going. I've set a goal, don't know if I'll get there but I'll try. x.x It just seems so hard, like there is a weight or something on my shoulders keeping me down.


    Thanks all, more help is welcome if anyone wishes to offer. I'm really stuck on this. x.x sorry to be such a bother.

    It's better to live on your feet than to die on your knees.
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    ouch.

    first step to do: that person who gave you that insulting comment - don't refer to him/her as an artist anymore. maybe he/she is a damn skilled painting a**hole but not an artist. artist got something to do with attitude as well, imho.
    receiving comments like that from a**holes, be they as skilled as they want, isn't as bad as receiving them from artists

    second step: just draw. i always come to the point that when i "just draw", the results come out far better than when i force myself to make something like this and that.
    do whatever gets the job done. no sticking to rules that hinder you.
    (my dad for example always told me to let my drawings be graphic works: line, dot, exact hatchure. working with the side of the pencil and smeang are wishy-washy and lower the quality of the drawing. i sticked to that too long, in fact until a few days ago. when i sharpened my pencils and came to the conclusion that these tools are capable of more than what i use them for. long story short: i abandoned the rule, now draw with whatever side of the pencil i think does the job best and my drawings have made a huge step forward and i am far more content with them.)

    just hang in there.

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    no, i never had anyone say my art is Shit, and yes android said it in a nice, helpful way but it still hurt so i can kind of relate to you as can many others. even if a drawing is getting to that FUBR point, finish it. i find myself getting really upset with a pic, but force myself to finish it and it turns out really good. oh and as far as not being able to draw from your mind and still needing to look at reference... foster put up that thread where he posted his progress... guess what? he used reference pics. of himself no less!! and this guy is like almost 40!!! (i think, if my guesstimation is right) anyway... i think all great artists will use reference. davinci did, bonnet, frazetta, rembrandt.... etc. don't get frustrated, don't get discouraged and just draw. put the pencil to the paper and don't think, just do. you may be surprised. and if your goal is to make it to ringling, you can do it.

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    Probably hit a no-draw-period. Usually they pass within 2 or 3 days. No-draw-periods are when you know that it is FUBR when you put the first line on the paper or even when you pickup the pencil.

    IMO it's something that you have to sit through, usually your brain is figuring something out and a new insight follows.

    Don't worry and take the frustration as it is dealt out ;-) It's all for the better.

    Edit : oops sorry i didn;t read the post carefully. \
    About that artist that plainly said worthless crap - that's just wat narrow minded people do. There are millions of those. Luckily you have CA.org where you'll get useful comments. He doesn't.

    Well - everything is relative and remember you do art for yourself only. If it's ok to you then its good art - i'll trust anyone on this board that they;re hard enough on themselves as it is to try and get better every time. So what if it's not giant steps all the time sometimes you have to turn back a little before you can go forward. And i've never heard of an artist that was happy with their own stuff for more than 30 minutes or so most of the time.

    Keep it up!


    Good luck

    Last edited by Erik; April 25th, 2003 at 03:40 PM.
    Power is nothing without intelligence.

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    i am going to say this directly, bluntly, no fluff. you are young! any artist who tells you that your work is crap or shit, whatever, is missing the point. you are working! you draw, you like to draw you want to get better. when i was in college a professor told me i had to work very hard to get mediocre results and that others of my peers were just more naturally able to make good work. i was demolished! but i was also freed. somehow i let go of my worries and preconceptions of what was good and what was talent and just made art. i mean if i suck, then i suck, but at least i will have fun. and then presto i made a little leap forward. not leaps in skill but leaps in perspective and maturity. i still work hard to get mediocre results but i make sure i am having some fun along the way. there is always someone better, stronger, faster, meaner, prettier, that's just life, but they are not you and only you can make sure that you are comfortable in your own skin. when you are, and you are truly happy, then you are the best!

    as for your work at this stage. i would like to see you move away from the furry stuff. i know that you have more interests visually than that. the furry stuff is a very short dead end. i am not saying don't do it, but learn to like the myriad of other art forms. there is some way cool stuff to learn and experiment with.

    as for seeing something in your head and wanting to draw it. that is also a tricky thing to do. we all think that if the picture is clear enough in hour heads then we can make it appear just like that on paper. but the fact is that images in hour head are constantly in flux. there is no composition yet, as it is not nailed down on paper. the color all works, because it is in your head and you imagine it working. start to learn composition and color theory and anatomy. these tools are what make your imagination real. and be prepared to change your vision on paper to make it work. it took me awhile not to be too attached to the vision of the piece and let the painting form on the paper or screen of it's own accord. practice seeing in the real world by scribbling on some paper, random marks, straight line, curves, loops, squiggles, then let yourself see what takes shape in these marks then go in and slowly pull them out while all along still looking for other marks that add in to the chorus. what is happening is that your experiences and knowledge are superimposed upon the abstract to find meaning in it, and as you get more experience in life the more you can find in the abstract.

    as for the rest, just try to find a way to practice the fundamentals of art technique that are interesting. if you find you are not interested, then you are not trying hard enough to find the angle that does engage you.

    there is a great big world of art and ideas out there, explore and have fun. do not narrow your search at this point. give yourself at least 10 more years before that!

    jon

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    This may sound strange, but how much caffeine are you consuming? Some of the symptoms you are suffering from sound like they may be physical. Let me explain.
    Caffeine can disrupt your mental process immensely. Your mind will race and trying to focus on something for an extended period is nearly impossible. This sounds like the trouble you're having with your visualization. Plus caffeine depletes the body of water and this, in turn, often leads to headaches, another art roadblock. Rehydrating with Gatorade and then switching over to water should clear most of this up. You'll notice that your mind will 'slow down' and you'll find you're able to hold the same thought longer.

    (Not all people are affected by caffeine the same way. Different body types can handle varying amounts. There are probably people here who could slam a gallon of coffee and build a three-story card house with no problem. But I just offered this up in the hope that it might provide an avenue you haven’t explored yet. Good luck!)

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    gekitsu: I'm already trying the just draw thing, but when I fail it seems to lower my confidence.

    stikler999: Thanks for the support about ringling. I have some reference pics I took, I was just showing off some amature modeling skills and stored them for reference, I don't have a digicam...yet. I'm waiting to earn 400$ to get a good one.

    Erik: Aye, some are narrow minded. I can't improve in big steps, I tried once when I first started getting serious about drawing and I almost ruined myself emotionally over it.

    foster: Nice long post :3 I'll go through it step by step, or try to. x.x Aye, I am young, for an artist. I've been at it hard core for....nnn! About five years now, though I keep saying four, I lost track of time. Five years is nothing in the art world, and I know that. Fortunately I've improved a little so it isn't a waste.
    I do draw non-furre stuff but I don't normally post it online. I only do furres because well A) I play an RPG and get tons of requests from people to draw their characters. and B) I just find the little buggars cute. My art class is a little....low. Though, hell, we were practically fingerpainting a while ago. I tend to favor watercolor/prismacolor works. I put watercolor down on 100% cotton paper, add a texture, saran wrap is good, then I remove it when it is dry. You are left with dark shapes, then I use them to form into something. It's a beautiful style I like, but sometimes I'm too scared to 'waste paper' which is funny because with watercolor and cotton paper you can literally wash it off.
    Furres are what you see of me online, People really judge me on that, I -really- don't care too much about that. My greatest work of art in my eyes was actually of a woman, drawn from a photograph of myself.
    Anatomy seems to be my weekness, that is the hardest thing to visualize in my head, I love playing with colors though, I could do that for hours. :3

    Beer Baron: I drean 16oz of Dr. Pepper a day. Well...normally less. I have a thing for milk so I'm normally drinking that when I'm at home. I tried a sports drink but I wasn't too fond of it. It was too sweet *makes a face* I can take a 12 pack of Dr. Pepper and not get a 'buzz' off of it. Though I am tiny. I've never gotten a headach after drinking a lot of Dr. Pepper. I think my body has adjusted to it. I really cut down on it two years ago when I found that it will actually dissolve your fingernails. x.x' so yeah, just a small bottle of day and milk/water in the evening. My hands are naturally a little shakey but you have to really look hard if you want to notice. Mostly my pinky finger, and I know that sounds really weird.
    I have clear thoughts and can normally sort things out. I think that right now it is just the stress I'm under with exams comming up and a C mark looking ugly on my report card next to the A's and B's. X.x' I would meditate but I can hardly find the time anymore.
    I really liked your thought though, I used to have that problem and I think I've adjusted to it, but yeah, not too much caffeine. Though I wish they had caffeine free Dr. Pepper. x.x

    Thank you all very much for the help. I was kind of feeling bad about comming to these forums until now. This is helping in many ways.

    It's better to live on your feet than to die on your knees.
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  14. #13
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    draw everyday and you will pass that artist you look up to now. Listen to foster he knows what's up.

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    Thanks, MCM ^^ I'm going into an advanced art class next year, I was promised homework over the summer, so I'm really excited. ^^ Maybe I'll finally get something interesting done. I've been sketching and doodling daily but nothing 'amazing' has come out of it yet.

    It's better to live on your feet than to die on your knees.
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    I have huge ruts where it is very depressing I don't "give up" per-se merely give myself a short break to get things into perspective. Then I find something that sends shivers up my spine (going to see x2, watching movie trailers, looking at art ref books, listening to amazing songs, and damn anyone here wanting to be inpsired watch the opening scene in x2 *drools* I'm back on the horse again) It is a small horse, but atleast its a horse

    Now like cuca said go to dsg!!! the crits are enough to want to draw a masterpiece let alone nice ppl who will do paintovers (he knows who he is) and the ppl there who will push you further than you could normally expect(he knows who he is too

    Yes an incoherent response, but best of luck to you Tanika

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    Most everything else has been addressed here, but as far as getting into ringling, the one thing that will do it is life drawing and painting and drawing from direct observation, not photos. If you have a senior portfolio of 17 pieces, only one or two of those should be illustrative(out of your head)-type pieces. THe rest should all be observational drawings or paintings. Right now, you are better than some people who graduated with me from art school. If you still have another year of high school ahead of you, then you have plenty of time to develop a killer (scholarship-winning) portfolio, provided you drop the Furries/fantasy/photo-copying art and go headlong into observationonal stuff. Enroll in a summer life drawing course at the local art school, use what you've learned in watercolor to do some portraits, still lifes, etc. Art schools generally don't take illustrative stuff seriously from high school students. They really respond to observational art, though, especially big animation schools like Ringling. Good luck.

    -Sean

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    Next year is my big class that is virtually ALL observation, it teaches me how to put what I see onto paper. Right now I don't fully trust my hands, though I've drawn a few things from observation. I refuse to drop fantasy art/illustrative art completely, mainly because it grabs extra money for me on the side. I know that sounds weird, considering my level, but it does grab money for much needed supplies. Sometimes, like for self portraits, I need to use photographs, the best example is the watercolor I did for my mom for mothersday. God bless my digicam. I like drawing outdoor scenes, animals in parks, but I seem to overly express things, like flowers, I pull those out and make them the focus of things, anything colorful is my focus. My teacher hates it but I kind of like it. x.x So, yeah, I'll be focusing hard on life drawings next year, the biggest reason I don't do a lot right now is because I wasn't really taught how, one point perspective and things like that are pretty easy, but how do you select what to draw? How do you get it down fast and add details later? Etc etc. Don't worry, I'll be focusing on that and be playing with fantasy stuff on the side. A fellow artist [who goes to ringling] told me "Hey, Porn sells" Meaning furres N' things, so I'm not going to just down it all the way. But thank you :3

    I only have one fantasy/illustrative picture planned for my portfolio, and it hasn't been drawn yet, it would be sort of character concept-like but include the character's anatomy, weapons, clothing, how everything works, etc.
    Oh yesh, I will let you in on a little secret, the main reason I'd like to learn to draw from life is my Boyfriend, I really wish I could capture him in a drawing/painting. It'd be good for my portfolio.....*falls over and crawls away*

    Last edited by Tanika; May 12th, 2003 at 09:40 PM.
    It's better to live on your feet than to die on your knees.
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