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  1. #1
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    Some new project designs...

    In order:
    "Cain and Abel" (a Biblical story about the first men)
    "Great Star and Small Star" (from Cheonjiwang Bonpuli, a Korean creation myth; Jeju Island)
    "Emergence" (one basic type of creation myth)
    "Ex Nihilo" (a second basic type of creation myth)

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  3. #2
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    Boring and pretentious. I'm sorry but I can't see how you think you're going to convey big ideas with a limited palette and geometric shape. There is no frisson, nothing of interest. If you need to say before showing, you've already lost people. Art should work even if you don't know the story behind it.

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  5. #3
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    Quote Originally Posted by Black Spot View Post
    Boring and pretentious. I'm sorry but I can't see how you think you're going to convey big ideas with a limited palette and geometric shape. There is no frisson, nothing of interest. If you need to say before showing, you've already lost people. Art should work even if you don't know the story behind it.
    How dare you calling crudely drawn circles and rectangles boring! D:

  6. #4
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    So i'm guessing that Cain is the black block that symbolize his tragedy , and Able is the red block that symbolize blood and sacrifice .

    andddddddddddd that's pretty much what i'm getting at
    People keep telling me : " Why do you keep suggesting courses and books instead of just giving me the solution directly ? "

    Well if i could condense all the necessary informations that take hours of explanation and demonstration into a single post, i would gladly do it

  7. #5
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    I actually find the pieces with the large black square and the smaller squares oddly attractive. It's sort of intimate in size, and reminds me of some sort of puzzle or ancient language (I play too much MYST). I know I left a rather scathing review of your artist statement along the lines of Black Spot's critique. And I do still have this issue where while I appreciate the work from a formalistic standpoint, I wouldn't be able to get into any of the spiritual meaning of it through the work itself without reading about it.

    Still, I like the work itself.

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    Hi Joe, you weren't scathing. You said what you needed to say and we came to an understanding that helped us both.

    And, you helped me again with this feedback--I'm just starting to integrate the message and the final product. It'll take a long time to get that just right (considering the scope), but it'll get there. Thanks for commenting!

    P.S. There's absolutely no shame in working to understand content. It's half of the story.

  9. #7
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    No, but keep working at it. Part of abstract art is to pull the piece apart, rather than impose a quick interpretation of it onto the work. It actually has a lot more to do with what your psyche recognizes in it.

    *BTW, that black block is meant to be a midnight (anthraquinone) blue.
    Last edited by briannahjkelley; October 19th, 2017 at 06:33 PM. Reason: *

  10. #8
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    Hey, these are only designs (rough drafts). I'd appreciate that you not openly mock my work--even if just a rough draft--on my own post. They might be crude arrangements, but I respect what I do.

    *BTW, these are black/blue/red pieces of paper arranged on top of a blank white sheet of paper.

  11. #9
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    Hi, I understand that you're an administrator on this website, but your comment is extreme and ironically, pretentious.

    "Those who have followed the course of abstract art over the past 20 or 30 years will have been struck by its persistence. When the Circle et Carré exhibition was held in April 1930, the Parisian press informed us that such painting was 'the mere ghost of an experiment which we thought had died long ago,' and that 'all this has nothing new to offer.' In 1955 the same outbursts of weariness and boredom, if not anger, can be heard at any exhibition of abstract art: 'about time the joke was buried...same old bag of tricks...poor old public...'

    Maybe. But things become entirely different if we are patient enough to take a closer look. Then we see that abstract art has never stopped adding to its range and means of expression, never faltered in its search for greater depth. ... Kandinsky and Mondrian, both of whom lived to a good age, thanks to their long working life were able to show their successors what a range of values can be drawn out of such simple elements; Kandinsky stressing inventiveness and Mondrian the importance of increasing depth."
    (A Dictionary of Abstract Painting (1958), Chapter 2: Persistence and Vitality of Abstract Art; Seuphor)

    The earliest critics of abstract art saw it as an annoying distraction. They tried to decide what abstract art was for the public/artists. They ended up with an egg on their face.

    That being said, my work might be immature, but I have respect for it and I will decide whether it works or doesn't work. Those whose work I don't respect or am frustrated by, I don't pay much mind to. Or I focus on what I do admire about it. Or, if they ask me what's wrong with what they've done, I tell them what I cannot see.

    I would never dream of going up to an artist to volunteer an opinion that their work is pretentious or boring. Because that is not only presumptuous, but it would be gauche and humiliating for me. I would never do that to myself. Your relationship with the work is between you and it, never you and the artist and it. I'm not looking for a threesome.

    By the way: each description next the the titles do not explain my work, but briefly describe the stories upon which the work is based. I felt that it was necessary to include that and I don't feel any differently now.

  12. #10
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    Your work has neither giraffes nor pigs in it, therefore it is without value to me.

  13. #11
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    So be it--but please don't waste my time, or degrade my posts anymore.

    Good luck.

  14. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by briannahjkelley View Post
    So be it--but please don't waste my time, or degrade my posts anymore.

    Good luck.
    I can only degrade your posts because you let me.
    Poking inflated egos is fun. Poke

    Good luck to you too.

  15. #13
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    You know, you had the choice to ignore this post--especially since you just admitted that you were never interested in it in the first place. I have an obligation to protect what I produce.

    I also just gave you an out, to quietly leave my post with some dignity--but you're back, for absolutely no reason. Just to waste my time again, further degrade this post, and make a fool out of you and I. I don't know that you understand what an inflated ego actually is.

    Please do not comment on this thread again.

  16. #14
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    oof, this could be a lesson in communication skills.

    Without any hint these were works in progress and the inclusion of the titles/descriptions, it's not unreasonable for the rest of us to presume these were complete works.
    Usually mostly-resolved traditional media art gets posted here.

    Is the Cain and Abel supposed to be the whole thing with all four squares, or are the right ones you just playing around with composition layout?
    If I didn't now know these were WIP, I'd think you spent ~2 mins in MS paint on the bottom two. Which is probably not the reaction you want from your viewers.
    Do you have any other iterations or tests you did for them, any thumbnail sketches?

    Abstract artists are going to be hard pressed to find receptive eyes here. In part because the genre is subjective (okay, yeah, art is general is rather subjective but abstraction even more so).
    But mainly because most of the members here come to hone their craft in more immediately-digestible and mainstream figurative projects for work in multimedia entertainment: stuff like film, games, ads, illustrations, comics, etc.
    Have you checked out the wetcanvas boards at all?
    I'm not saying don't post here, but be aware of your audience.

    For instance, spend any time in the general forum and you'll know to take most of Tiggeraz comments with an heap of Lot's wife.

    Maybe start a sketchbook for consolidating your various works in progress, and just post the more resolved stuff here or on Finished.

    Slightly off-topic: you can add text between attachments, you might have to go in advanced settings, but that way you could assign the names above specific works in the future.

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  18. #15
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    InfernoKing, yes, I think I'm in the wrong place. I misunderstood what this forum and community would be. I assumed it attracted artists from all walks of life, who do all sorts of work. This is absolutely the wrong audience to grow in--multimedia entertainment is not my arena. WetCanvas, on the other hand...that seems awesome. Thank you for recommending that.

    You're right--including a 'WIP' or 'rough draft' note would have helped. But to be fair, I did post in the title "project designs." That implies that these are not final products, but in the planning stage. The replies to this thread are a heap of embarrassment and misunderstanding.

    As far as planning each piece went, I'll just say that Cain & Abel went through many, many phases and took a couple of months to find a balance and story. As for the final product, recursion has a lot to do with it. Recursion (self-similarity, repetition) has a lot to do with all of these pieces, because truly religious behavior is, at bottom, recursive. I would have said that, but didn't feel the need to. I felt the post was self-explanatory and fine in and of itself. I didn't expect that people would feel so deprived of something. I didn't expect them to respond so angrily, or to see an administrator lashing out; I just posted and left it alone. I was happy with the designs because for me they were a step in the right direction, although immature. Then I came back tonight to find all of the above. That was really distressing. I don't feel any differently about the art, of course, but I feel differently about this website and who it attracts. I'm going to stop recommending ConceptArt.

    I actually just asked that my account be deleted, so this is it for me on here.

    Thanks again.

  19. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by briannahjkelley View Post
    I'm going to stop recommending ConceptArt.
    Eh, no one recommends this broken graveyard of a website, so it doesn't make a difference.

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  21. #17
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    How long did it take to finish it? No offense but it's not really my cup of tea. It's just a couple of squares and thats it, anyone could create that within a couple seconds. I never understood the stories behind them. Like I mean it's just a square or a couple shapes right? There was a guy in town who had an art workshop here, and one day he invited some artists. And they displayed their artworks, it was similar to yours. No offense but it's kinda funny because anyone could do it without any training or practice.

    I liked the last two because they look like boobs, especially the first one it looks like a boob of a pregnant woman ... someone is thirsty... milky milky time!

  22. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by briannahjkelley View Post
    I actually just asked that my account be deleted, so this is it for me on here.
    You probably haven't seen this thread: http://www.conceptart.org/forums/sho...eletion-Notice

  23. #19
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    To digress for a moment since the OP is not coming back, but when did the onus on handling criticism shift from the creator to other folk providing feedback? That other opinions must be censored or framed in a package such as not to offend the OP in any fashion, instead of OP being a human adult and understanding not everyone approaches something the same way or communicates in the same fashion.

    I mean what's the worst that got batted around? The word "pretentious"? Ooooh. Super duper vicious. Come on.. that's fairly banal and - what I can only guess - an accurate point of view from blackspot frame of reference.

    The OP then fires back all heated.. flips out, describes things as "angry", and then throws in a healthy dose of "Eekghads! How dare an admin express opinion on.. *breathlessly* ART!?". As if any interaction must be with kid gloves, and anyone with a title must censor opionions least someone becomes offended.

    It wouldn't have stuck in my craw if the OP just would have taken the criticsm like an adult and thought about acting on it or not. Instead she throws it back at the masses in a vitrol shot telling them to regulate *THEIR* opinions and thoughts because anything that conflicts with the sunshine and rainbows shooting out of their asses is a massvie affront to the OP.

    She continues that the commentary _distressed_ the OP. Okay - conflicting view points, or modes of communication, can do that. Embrace it like an adult. Perhaps, reframing how to view the art you made through other's eyes, but naw - why do that? How about instead the OP tries to shame those with opinions and thoughts differently than her own.

    In short - being able to handle criticism is on you, and trying to shift it to everyone else with a temperatunrum is a poor strategy in life.

    Life is conflict; without conflict there is no growth.


    Some new project designs...
    My commentary is a gift to you.

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  25. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by InfernoKing View Post
    with a heap of Lot's wife.

    Bwahaha! Too soon!


    Briannah: I'm sorry you feel that way. Your responses made me think a lot about about how to view abstract art. And I've realized that all art is to some extent abstract. It's the abstract qualities that give all great art its power. However, every artistic medium is limited in its range of expression, which is why artistic media are so often combined. Music can communicate nothing about specific events and characters which is why it is so often combined with poetry: singing.

    Mondrian, whom I admire, knew this. Which is why he wrote a play explaining his ideas about art. Yet you don't need to read it to get a sense of what De Stijl is all about, or enjoy his work.

    Abstract art is weak at communicating narrative. And while context enriches the experience of any work of art, you are needing to explain your ideas with english, instead of with art. To me this is a problem. I get the sense that you want your viewers to go and do some reading, which is fine. But I just thought I'd explain my opinion on the matter which is: art should speak for itself.

    The idea for Ex Nihilo actually works pretty well by this standard. It's something out of nothing. There's a something and there's a nothing. I like that it's not defined which is which.
    Last edited by JoeCowan; October 20th, 2017 at 03:44 PM.

  26. #21
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    You have taken everything too personally. Your thread was not about me, but I will address some of the points you raised in the two emails you sent.

    Jules, I looked at your website and I have to tell you that I’m deeply annoyed with what I saw. I don’t do figuration, I do abstraction. You don’t do abstraction, you do figuration. Each are vastly different games to be played; on top of that, our artistic goals are not even the same. There are already people who’ve done figuration perfectly. They’ve concentrated the ethereal into one space, and I want to do that—just abstractly. I’m not looking to paint like you, or appreciate art the way you do, or produce in a way that you (a member of my audience) approve of. Know your place, or leave me alone.
    Yes, this place is figurative, but it doesn't mean that we don't appreciate abstract work, as it is after all, the basis for all composition. However, we like members to be able to show some craftsmanship beforehand. And for your information, I do occasionally delve into the abstract.

    My art is the hill I’ve chosen to die on, so I will defend it no matter the consequence.

    I know it hurts when your work is pulled apart - pretty well everyone here has suffered that at one stage or another, including me. You need to grow a thicker skin, or you'll drown in self pity. You either accept critique, don't or choose which parts you do, either way, it is your choice. Here we can vocalise our thoughts as much as we wish, but it's up to you what you take away from it. Please remember, this forum is about improving and growing as an artist. No one is above critique and that includes professional artists. We are here to help, but you have to want to improve.

    P.S.—In your ConceptArt biography, you say that you’re there to improve (your) drawing skills. So, as a student, why do you offer so much unsolicited advice?

    Everyone here, regardless of ability, is expected to learn to critique – it's how we all grow as artists together. Currently, all the posts you have made, have been about you. BTW, I hadn't updated my biography since I joined over 9 years ago as I tend not to look at my profile much.

    You’ve welcomed feedback, so I’m going to give you mine.
    Your about section: one of your interests is ‘capturing the essence of a fleeting moment.’ That doesn’t really make sense—you can’t reanimate a dead person, just as you can’t breathe life into the past. Even more, Albert Einstein proved that the past, present, and future all occur simultaneously. All you can do is work with what remains in this moment, and this moment, and this moment. Then you carve something out of your experience of it, which in turn becomes part of the past; a fleeting moment. A Jewish-Brazilian author named Clarice Lispector once wrote: “Are objects halted time?” It’s a captivating question. I recommend you read her Agua Víva. You might like it.

    Can you capture the essence of fleeting, itself? Or illustrate the progression of time?

    You wrote all that critiquing my words? Nothing about my art? Your priorities are wrong and it shows. Now go draw. I have wasted too much of my art time on you.

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