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    -Insert eye-catching title here-

    Hello everyone,

    I've been reading some of the forums here and the honest and helpful critique people are giving here, lead me to the decision to upload my own attempts at drawing as well.
    This is a rough sketch with some color blocks. I'd like to hear your opinion on anatomy, pose, coloring, color and detail balance as well as anything else that catches your eye before I start going further in detail.

    Thanks in advance :3

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    Cute girl!

    Her neck is pretty long, and another thing that stands out to me is the rather pointy shoulders. I think it is easy to imagine that the top of the shoulders are the widest part of our body when the arms are directed downwards, but typically the lower part of the shoulders or the upper arms would be a little wider.

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    Here is a rather muscular example by Ira Korman: http://irakorman.com/irakormanjune13updateadj2_051.htm (I know it is a man and not so similar, but I really like the drawing, and it makes the point )

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    Thanks, I'll fix it as soon as I get back to it.
    Is there anything else I should change while I'm at it?

    Last edited by Lejana; June 11th, 2013 at 03:34 AM.
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    After the neck and shoulders, the anatomy that stands out to me the most are the hands and breasts. The hands aren't necessarily wrong, but I think they could use some work to feel a tad more relaxed and natural. Take a reference photo of yourself in the pose or get out a mirror. For the breasts, they feel very far apart to me, as if she's wearing a bra that's pushing them way out. Just bringing her right (our left) breast in to the center would really help I think. I know those are kinda nit-picky crits, but those areas tend to catch the viewer's attention. I would also say that the linework feels a bit choppy, but seeing as this is a work in progress, I imagine that's something you're already planning to improve.

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    I've tried to make the shoulders look less pointy and did some quick lasso-fix with the neck. Not sure if the changes I made are still too subtle. Is it the way you envisioned it, Aqualeot?
    Honestly, my reference for the picture was this lady. I guess, taking reference from a pixelated muscle-mannequin is the wrong attempt, as I'm not adept in human fat distribution and it shows.

    No, you're not nit-picking, this sort of stuff is what I want to hear. I tried to change the hands, as dierat suggested (I own only 2 hands, so crossing two and taking a photo at the same time proved practically impossible, so I made them look more like in the ref pic =P ).
    in the meantime she got some breast surgery (I think they grew by 2 cup sizes).

    That aside, don't hold back whatever your opinion is, I can take the critique, I'd actually love to get more. Since I've never visited an art school and haven't drawn for over 6 years, I'd like to have a strong push in the right direction. So please, go ahead.


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    Last edited by Lejana; June 12th, 2013 at 05:47 AM.
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    Hi Lejana, I did a quick paintover to illustrate some problems you had with the arms.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Lejana View Post
    I've tried to make the shoulders look less pointy and did some quick lasso-fix with the neck. Not sure if the changes I made are still too subtle. Is it the way you envisioned it, Aqualeot?
    Honestly, my reference for the picture was this lady. I guess, taking reference from a pixelated muscle-mannequin is the wrong attempt, as I'm not adept in human fat distribution and it shows.
    I envisioned the shoulders like fireblade's paintover

    Whenever possible, use yourself or another person as a reference. When not possible, use a photo of a person, preferably a photo you took. If not possible, use a photo by someone else. Last resort would be to use a drawing or painting by someone else. At least that would be my order for using reference

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  13. #8
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    Damn, I didn't realise you used pose maniacs, bad bad bad.

    The problem with 3D models is that it is extremely hard to animate the shoulder area due to the huge range of movement, the amount of rigging involved is difficult. So while it may look good in the standard position with arms down, it'll look completely shit once you raise the arms above the head. what this means is in order to get an accurate model, you would have to have seperate animation rigs for various shoulder positions.

    So bottom line is don't use posemaniacs for detail anatomy ref.

    General pose ref is ok I suppose.

    cheers.

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    Quote Originally Posted by fireblade View Post
    Damn, I didn't realise you used pose maniacs, bad bad bad.

    The problem with 3D models is that it is extremely hard to animate the shoulder area due to the huge range of movement, the amount of rigging involved is difficult. So while it may look good in the standard position with arms down, it'll look completely shit once you raise the arms above the head. what this means is in order to get an accurate model, you would have to have seperate animation rigs for various shoulder positions.

    So bottom line is don't use posemaniacs for detail anatomy ref.
    General pose ref is ok I suppose.
    cheers.
    Yep, both the shoulders and neck looked off, but I thought it was my bad for not adding enough fat to the upper arms. Never posemaniacs for anatomy, lesson learned =P

    And thanks a lot for the paintover, it really helps me see my flaws. (Though I'm sure there's still a lot)
    Would you tell me what brush/opacity/softness you used to PO her arm? I like the plastic look of it.

    Quote Originally Posted by Aqualeot View Post
    I envisioned the shoulders like fireblade's paintover

    Whenever possible, use yourself or another person as a reference. When not possible, use a photo of a person, preferably a photo you took. If not possible, use a photo by someone else. Last resort would be to use a drawing or painting by someone else. At least that would be my order for using reference
    Will do, thank you very much :3

    Last edited by Lejana; June 12th, 2013 at 05:38 AM.
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    One thing with your posemaniacs reference is that the head is looking at us and you've put it differently without altering the neck.

    In any case, don't use posemaniacs

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    "Yesterday is history, tomorrow is a mystery, but today is a gift. That is why it is called the present.."

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    Thanks for pointing it out.

    Changed both her arms and head position as well as her adductor curve, since it seemed too concave before.
    Started rendering a little to make her look more like an actual human being...somehow.
    I will be working on her legs and hair next.
    Don't mind the awkwardness of her face yet, she's undergone many smudge surgeries and it will take some time to heal ><

    Btw, is it just me or did the "Thanks"/"Like" buttons disappear?

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    Now looking at it again makes me realize that I should still smooth out the curve between her trapezius and deltoid, as the shoulder looks a bit glued on.

    Last edited by Lejana; June 14th, 2013 at 02:41 AM.
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    So much better. Yup, the buttons are gone for me too

    気計 - Quike
    "Yesterday is history, tomorrow is a mystery, but today is a gift. That is why it is called the present.."

    The Spaniard's Sketchbook... No holds barred
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    Much better. IMO the legs are too long (and it's someone liking long legs that's talking ;-) ). I haven't mesured precisely but you character shows around 9 heads height which is quite high even for a male character.
    A fore arm looks long too, especially the left one compared to the upper arm. Maybe you wanted to suggest some fore shortening but for my eyes it doesn't show clearly.
    You lost on the way the valid anatomy of the calf muscle: the external part must be higher than the internal one, which totally disappaered in your last version.

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    It's supposed to be foreshortening since you can't have a completely straight arm in that position without bending forward, which she obviously isn't. I think the problem here lies with the elbow, as it should be tilted more towards the viewer. Also the arm might overlap the hand below. I'm just not sure yet how to fix that without redoing the whole pose.

    As for the length of the legs, you're also right. I ended up completely redoing them, as the way they're in the picture above looked too unnatural to me.

    Thanks again for the comments, they're a big help :3

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    I took the liberty to make a slight paint over. I haven't changed that much: just some lasso tool to make her left forearm higher, then I painted over it, to simulate the foreshortening I only erased the part of her top that was over lapping her right upper arm, made her right biceps overlapping her brest and that's about it. It seems better to me.
    Oh, and by the way I've shortened a little her legs.

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    To me, her value looks really photographic, but yeah you got this off posemaniac so it cant be helped much. I'll just mention it to let you know.
    I also think you should keep the linework on her, she looks better with it.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Lejana View Post
    Would you tell me what brush/opacity/softness you used to PO her arm? I like the plastic look of it.
    Sorry I missed this part, I just used a generic soft edged round brush with 100% opacity, plus opacity adjust on pressure.

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    @PeteJ: I don't get your point. What exactly can't be helped? I got the idea for the pose from posemaniacs. The coloring and shading have nothing to do with it. You make it sound as if having photographic value is a bad thing. It's what I was going for. But if it makes the piece lose it's charm or whatever, let me know. The lineart was there to give people a general idea of what I was planning to do before I went ahead and started coloring. But I guess it's a matter of taste =P


    @fireblade: Thanks for sharing :3 I've edited the post right after I wrote it, so maybe that's why you missed it. Still, I'm surprised you found it after that xD

    @StefRob: Yeah, I think removing that tiny frill-thing really did it. Thanks for taking the time to do a paintover :3

    Last edited by Lejana; June 17th, 2013 at 04:20 PM.
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