Is there too much competition and not enough jobs.
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Thread: Is there too much competition and not enough jobs.

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    Unhappy Is there too much competition and not enough jobs.

    So i like to browse this forum when i get a chance. I practice ALL the time like 6 hours or more a day but holy crap EVERYONE on here is So good. That is a good thing that the standards for art are getting higher and higher but is there TOO much competition for how much an artist is actually needed. I go to a community collage/tech school and cant find anyone close to my level of skill even if also an Art major but on here seems like everyone is crazy good. Just really afraid there might be to much competition for how much art actually needs to be done

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    Yes, the field, like any creative field, is incredibly competitive. If you find that discouraging, well, you probably should.


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    Well, it really depends on jobs that you are interested in doing. In pretty much any high-skill field there are usually plenty of poor quality jobs that no one else will do. Usually they are too poorly paid to make them worth anyone's time, or they are reputation-wreckers (seedy erotica, hate material, etc). There are plenty of jobs. However, desirable jobs are always in high demand, because people will always want better jobs - everyone from the beginner trying to land their first job on an indie game project, to the pro trying to land a mainstream movie project, is trying to step up. Yes, the industry is highly competitive, but it is also bigger than ever, so there are many more vectors for entry. As for the high quality, it is simply a by-product of progression - art standards have improved since the 50's, but it much, much easier to learn now than it was then considering all the books, videos, courses and contacts we can access.

    Also, 6 hours a day is not a terribly high average drawing output for illustrators - if you ask any medium to high end professional, answers often vary from about 8-9 hours to as many as 14-15. You can reach professional quality at that pace - it is just that it will take about a third longer than some one who does 8 hours, or twice as long as someone who does 12. On top of that you have to bear in mind that you will have to draw a minimum of 8 hours a day for an inhouse job, or be paid for your work as a freelancer, so if you are only capable of 6 useful hours, you won't earn much.

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    6 hours a day is ok for practice by oneself, some people actually have to work and/or go to unrelated classes and they still manage to become professional artists. It's better to work hard on specific training for shorter and always be at 100% than just doodle for a long time. Look into deliberate practice and how it works.

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    Come to Australia. The unemployment benefits are indefinite and you don't have to pay back your College fees until you reach a certain income bracket. It's essentially a free pass to work your ass off enough to not have to compete until you're absolutely ready.



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    Quote Originally Posted by Beeston View Post
    Come to Australia. The unemployment benefits are indefinite and you don't have to pay back your College fees until you reach a certain income bracket. It's essentially a free pass to work your ass off enough to not have to compete until you're absolutely ready.
    Get a job bludger.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Atreides View Post
    Get a job bludger.
    Freelance will do for now, you can declare any freelance you do as part of a positive integration and they deduct your payment accordingly. I'll gladly go to a Studio when one will hire me, though, but there's no reason to do something you don't like in order to continue on doing things you don't like.





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    Hmm...don't you have to be a citizen of AU though ? I personally would love to be able to draw 6 hours a day..but full time job does not allow such things along with family life. Feck. If I could draw that much a day I know I would get better so much faster (or at least my illusory thought of getting better would think that

    Right now can barely manage 2-3 hours before my brain implodes...of course *shhh* I sneak some time in at work when no one is looking.

    Getting off topic sorry. My advice. Just draw. And then draw some more. And then draw more than that. And in your off hours, find out about marketing yourself effectively. Then go back to draw some more. It is going to take time and patience...and if you do not have the latter you are in for a heap of disappointment.

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    Zodiarkk, there is a very big difference between comparing yourself to other people in your college class and then going online to an internet forum for professional artists and comparing yourself to the top pros in the world! Sometimes young artists are needlessly intimidated by the standard of the work they see online, forgetting that many of the people whose work they are looking at have been doing what they do professionally for 20 or 30 years. And the ones who are younger and seem incredibly good are just that - young people who are incredibly good because they train hard, but because you are in a community which attracts the most committed artists, you are seeing the ones in the top 1% who are at the top of the pile, not an indication of how good the average trainee concept artist is. It's useless to fret about the fact that there are a lot of good artists here, it'll just prevent you getting nearer to that top 1% yourself.

    Regardless of this, it's true that there is a lot of competition, and what that does is weed out those people who don't have the commitment or ability to reach a high standard. That's the way it is in all industries. It's no secret that it takes some longer to reach that standard than others, and there's a balancing act between how long it is taking you and your level of motivation to keep going. It might help you to look at the level of progress you've made in, say, the last three years. Imagine making that amount of progress again and whether that might make you match up to other pros yet (not the best pros, but those who are managing to successfully begin breaking into the industry). If you don't think that's the case or you don't want to have to train for another three years plus to break into the industry, then realistically you either need to change something about what you are doing and how you are training, or re-evaluate your career choice.

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    There are many different ways to make a living in art. If you compared Dilbert or Garfield to a professional digital painting you would say that they are both poorly drawn, and yet Davis and Adams are making a terrific living off their questionable art. If you say "that can't be done now, the days of newspapers are past", look at xkcd and the Oatmeal. Now, you have to have great business skills and writing skills to make it as a cartoonist, but there are niches like this all over. Someone designs patterns on fabrics. Someone makes infographics. Someone models the human body in 3D to make training simulators for doctors. There are all kinds of jobs that people don't explore because they are so focused on drawing big-chested elf chicks in bikinis.

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    Quote Originally Posted by clockodile View Post
    Well, it really depends on jobs that you are interested in doing. In pretty much any high-skill field there are usually plenty of poor quality jobs that no one else will do. Usually they are too poorly paid to make them worth anyone's time, or they are reputation-wreckers (seedy erotica, hate material, etc). There are plenty of jobs. However, desirable jobs are always in high demand, because people will always want better jobs - everyone from the beginner trying to land their first job on an indie game project, to the pro trying to land a mainstream movie project, is trying to step up. Yes, the industry is highly competitive, but it is also bigger than ever, so there are many more vectors for entry. As for the high quality, it is simply a by-product of progression - art standards have improved since the 50's, but it much, much easier to learn now than it was then considering all the books, videos, courses and contacts we can access.

    Also, 6 hours a day is not a terribly high average drawing output for illustrators - if you ask any medium to high end professional, answers often vary from about 8-9 hours to as many as 14-15. You can reach professional quality at that pace - it is just that it will take about a third longer than some one who does 8 hours, or twice as long as someone who does 12. On top of that you have to bear in mind that you will have to draw a minimum of 8 hours a day for an inhouse job, or be paid for your work as a freelancer, so if you are only capable of 6 useful hours, you won't earn much.
    I know that 8 is the average and im trying to increase how much time i put into it. I have to balance work and school so the in between times can get rough. Also i understand that professional artist do draw for 8+ hours of straight as there job demands it, but i am in school and have a job so taking those two things out of the equation would greatly improve my time. Thank you though for your help.

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    Quote Originally Posted by vineris View Post
    There are all kinds of jobs that people don't explore because they are so focused on drawing big-chested elf chicks in bikinis.
    And even within the game industry, it's not all glamorous high-end concept art... There's a whole huge range of production art tasks, and also a plethora of medium-to-small companies where a less established artist could potentially find work.

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    Quote Originally Posted by QueenGwenevere View Post
    And even within the game industry, it's not all glamorous high-end concept art... There's a whole huge range of production art tasks, and also a plethora of medium-to-small companies where a less established artist could potentially find work.
    Can anyone explain this further. This is something i did not realize.

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    Well, in this day and age, game development includes small games like Facebook games and apps... Many of those are made by smaller companies or even start-ups, so they're easier to get work with. Also, even on a large game, the concept art is just the beginning. During production, production artists need to actually make all the things in the game - building and animating the models for everything (including less glamorous things like props,) making a ton of textures, plus less glamorous things like signs and graphics and titles and interface.

    If it's a 2D game (and a lot of apps are 2D,) there will be a ton of minor bits of art that need to be drawn - everything from backgrounds and props to animation frames or miscellaneous moving parts.

    Production artists can be less high-end than concept artists, so those kinds of jobs may be easier to get into than a concept art job.

    Plus, as has been pointed out, there's a whole world of art jobs that are NOT related to games or concept art.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Zodiarkk View Post
    afraid there might be to much competition
    I would just like to offer an alternative view as someone who is not in the art business. I am yet to meet someone in any field that says getting jobs is NOT competitive. Those that get jobs straight away, usually plan towards it for a long time. If you read across other forums on the internet, be it physics, social science or photography- everyone will tell you that getting a good job is insanely tough, and that often years of meagre pay have to be taken into consideration (lab assistant, number cruncher at market research companies, crappy wedding photography offers). Sure the type of competition differs- since art has a greater propensity for freelance than, lets say, financial economics, it will inevitably look differently and in ways that I do not feel qualified to comment on. But to think that only art is competitive is missing out many people struggling in other areas. Maybe it is some consolation to you, maybe not.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Beeston View Post
    but there's no reason to do something you don't like in order to continue on doing things you don't like.
    yeah no. not everyone has that freedom. circumstances, money, family, whatever, get in the way, even in Australia. and the benefits aren't indefinite, and not everyone can live off centrelink payments, especially not if they have dependents, and can't get recognised by cl for things (pretty common). sometimes you just gotta have the ovaries to suck it up and push through the bad times, and you're no less of an artist than those who run off and pursue their dreams free from responsibility. and their are plenty of artists who pursue their dreams and then realise that what they thought their dream life would be like is not the reality, and they go off and do something else entirely. "artist" is not a qualitative word that defines whether or not that person is spending every waking hour pursuing their "dreams".

    and if you're getting paid so little from freelancing that you can still get cl payments, then either you need to be charging more, or start producing art that is worth more, because cl unemployment benefits is pittance in the australian lifestyle.

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