Help with Scene Involving Perspective Figure
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    Help with Scene Involving Perspective Figure

    Hello,

    I'm looking for some criticism on this piece that I'm working on for a contest.



    Before moving forward with rendering/lighting/color, I want to get a second opinion on if anything looks wonky here. I feel like something might be wrong with the main character's forward shoulder. Keep in mind that I'm quite a newbie, so if you see any other glaring flaws with the preliminary work, or if you have any suggestions at all, lay it on me!

    Thanks in advance!

    P.S.: The image seemed to get a bit darker when I saved it as a JPG. Hopefully the areas that I'm concerned about are still visible enough for critique.

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    I'm not sure about some part of the table, and the stool to the right part of the picture...

    I like the way you suggested the bottle on the shelves !

    About the guy... Do you have a reference ?

    I think you have a problem with the neck-head attach, it's like he have no neck actually... The head is a little too small I think...The shoulder may be too much on the left I think, it feel "cut" from the main body...

    May this help you ? It's not exactly the same posture, and not exactly the same point of view but it could help you figure out about the neck and shoulder...
    Name:  stock-photo-male-and-female-hands-holding-green-apple-on-athlete-torso-background-76142644.jpg
Views: 286
Size:  36.1 KB

    * My current blog
    * Sketchbook page on CA.org coming soon...

    Have a good and creative day !
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    Hi Griffonnage, and thanks for your reply!

    I wasn't sure which table you were talking about. I went ahead and added some context for the right-side table. The left side table has different angles on different levels by design, so that might be what you're seeing. That said, if it still doesn't look correct to you, let me know!

    I messed around with the stool, and decided it would be very stout. I lined it up on the perspective grid and everything, but I'm not certain it looks believable. I also had the unintended effect of muddying the surrounding area, but that's okay.

    I didn't have any reference for the guy. Tried using myself, but... well let's just say it didn't work out XD
    Thanks for the picture. I changed his mask into something of a balaclava, enlarged his head slightly, and tried to sculpt away a bit of the trapezius to suggest more neck.

    I'm almost certain that the changes to his shoulders are going to require a re-positioning of his far arm.



    What do you think?

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    Ok, here are your problems:
    Name:  Untitled-1.jpg
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    Ok, I explain now. Obviously, you chose a 2 vanishing points (roughly, the red and blue ones). The red is far on the left and the right in the middle of the picture. You could have used a one vanishing point (VP) perspective but let's stay with 2, why not after all?
    At the begining of your skteching you're supposed to decide where your horizon (or eye level) is. Once you did that, you chose the first and second vanishing point location and draw based on those two ones. And you must stick with it.
    So, basically, horizontal lines will go toward the left (red) VP, vertical line stay vertical (if you had chosen a 3 VP perspective it would be different) and lines going from your feet to the horizon go toward the centered (blue) VP. And that's it!
    Actually I believe you made a patchwork of different pictures and blended together but I might be wrong.

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    Hi StefRob,

    Thanks for clearing the perspective up for me. I wasn't sure if one VP or two (or more) VPs existed here. The horizontals confused me. Your insight brings another question to mind: had I chosen a 1 VP perspective, would all horizontals and verticals be exactly horizontal and vertical in relation to one another?

    You're right about the patchwork, but the strange thing is that everything you drew lines from existed in the same picture naturally. The patchwork isn't being cross-referenced by your lines. Could it be that the objects aren't aligned in the scene? Would that cause them to have different VPs? Or is something else going on here?

    Thanks in advance.

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    you're interior is fine for what you want.. however ..if you draw the figure in scale and show feet on the floor... you can solve the problem of... no bottom to table ..stool not sitting on the floor

    ..and most of the objects from the lower third of the painting floating in mid air..draw the objects in the room Firmly sitting on the ground..then you may see perspective anomalies..

    best wishes

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    Quote Originally Posted by KaoReal View Post
    Hi StefRob,

    Thanks for clearing the perspective up for me. I wasn't sure if one VP or two (or more) VPs existed here. The horizontals confused me. Your insight brings another question to mind: had I chosen a 1 VP perspective, would all horizontals and verticals be exactly horizontal and vertical in relation to one another?

    You're right about the patchwork, but the strange thing is that everything you drew lines from existed in the same picture naturally. The patchwork isn't being cross-referenced by your lines. Could it be that the objects aren't aligned in the scene? Would that cause them to have different VPs? Or is something else going on here?

    Thanks in advance.
    The simpliest way to make you understand is a picture:
    Name:  Untitled-1.jpg
Views: 237
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    As you can see, the blue cube is 1 VP: horizontal and vertical lines are horizontal and vertical (da!).
    As you can see with the red and green ones you have 2x2 differents VP but ALWAYS the same horizon. You"ll ask me "why aren't they linked to the same 2 VP?". Simple, the cubes faces aren't parallel or perpendicular. If they were, VP would be the same.
    I hope I made myself clear. If you have others questions I'll be glad to answer if I'm able to. But the simpliest way to understand perspective is to read "Perspective Drawing Handbook" by D'Amelio or "Perspective made easy" by Norling. It really worths the time you'll spend on them.
    EDIT: I wrote "cubes" but as you see they aren't cube, they're made of different lenghts.

    Last edited by StefRob; January 31st, 2013 at 05:12 PM.
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    Name:  alchemy-workshop figure.jpg
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    suggestion for pose..

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    Quote Originally Posted by KaoReal View Post
    You're right about the patchwork, but the strange thing is that everything you drew lines from existed in the same picture naturally. The patchwork isn't being cross-referenced by your lines. Could it be that the objects aren't aligned in the scene? Would that cause them to have different VPs? Or is something else going on here?
    Could you post the original pic, without your overpaint?
    Also, if you don't understand the perspective of the scene, and you don't understand how to construct a figure (which you evidently don't), there's no way you're going to be able to place a figure convincingly in that room. Sorry, but that's simply all there is to it.


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    StefRob, thanks for the mini-lesson in perspective. I picked up the D'Amelio book and even a quick skim through cleared up a good few misconceptions I had about perspective.

    Kliest, I really like the pose you suggested! Unfortunately, at the time of your post, I had already redone the figure from some reference I made. I considered switching to it, but I don't want to do too much backtracking on a deadline, and I'm pretty satisfied with the new pose I made. Not as interactive looking as yours, but I can live with it.

    Elwell, I worked out some of the perspective issues in the scene. I don't think it's perfect yet, but it's better than before. There is a cylindrical object on the side of the scene that doesn't look right to me. I don't know if the issue is in the rendering or the structure. I think I just still struggle with ellipses or circles in perspective. Hopefully the figure looks more convincingly placed in the scene now.

    What do you guys think?



    EDIT: This post got swallowed by the forum until I posted the post below this post! Just explaining why this post and the one below it contain some of the same text!

    Last edited by KaoReal; February 6th, 2013 at 05:25 PM.
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    Hi again everyone,

    I think ConceptArt ate my last post. I was waiting for it to go through for a few days, and nothing happened. I don't know how long it usually takes, but I'm going to assume it's not going through now.

    kliest, I solidified/removed some objects and got a better idea of the perspective of the scene. It's still a little bit off, but not enough that I'm bothered by it. Let me know if you disagree! I really like the suggestion for the pose, but unfortunately, I already had a new pose from reference worked out before I saw your post.

    StefRob, I picked up the D'Amelio book. Great recommendation! Thanks! Even just skimming through it cleared up a lot of misconceptions I had about perspective.

    So hopefully, with my improved understanding of the perspective of the scene and the rework of the figure from reference, it will look more believable. I got started on color while I waited for my other post attempt to go through.

    My thoughts: The orange glow from the fire behind the rat character might be too strong. The rat needs more refining. Objects on shelves need work. Unsure about the yellowish glow on the side; might just be distracting and not contributing to the scene. I'm thinking a color change may help it? Having a bit of trouble with the tube running from the foreground object into the background.

    Thanks in advance!



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    Well, I'm in the final stretch now. I've one more day to work on this, so any final C&C would be greatly appreciated.

    I feel like I really took the punch out of the picture when I tried to take the refinement to the next level. It is supposed to look good blown up, not just small, but it seems like I can get only one or the other. The less refined sketchier picture looked much better from further away, but it looks like a mess zoomed in. The opposite is true of the more refined one. Maybe I am refining in the wrong areas or wrong way?

    I'm confused about whether or not I actually improved my image in my last session.



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    Quote Originally Posted by KaoReal View Post
    Hi again everyone,

    I think ConceptArt ate my last post. I was waiting for it to go through for a few days, and nothing happened. I don't know how long it usually takes, but I'm going to assume it's not going through now.

    kliest, I solidified/removed some objects and got a better idea of the perspective of the scene. It's still a little bit off, but not enough that I'm bothered by it. Let me know if you disagree! I really like the suggestion for the pose, but unfortunately, I already had a new pose from reference worked out before I saw your post.

    StefRob, I picked up the D'Amelio book. Great recommendation! Thanks! Even just skimming through it cleared up a lot of misconceptions I had about perspective.

    So hopefully, with my improved understanding of the perspective of the scene and the rework of the figure from reference, it will look more believable. I got started on color while I waited for my other post attempt to go through.

    My thoughts: The orange glow from the fire behind the rat character might be too strong. The rat needs more refining. Objects on shelves need work. Unsure about the yellowish glow on the side; might just be distracting and not contributing to the scene. I'm thinking a color change may help it? Having a bit of trouble with the tube running from the foreground object into the background.

    Thanks in advance!

    I'm glad if i've been of any help and yes D'Amelio is a really great help perspective-wise.
    In a general way i like what you did of the original sketch. That said few points that bother me:
    I agree with you the yellow is at best useless, at worst distracting and not adding anything to the scene.
    The rat is... well, let say if you hadn't tell us it's a rat I wouldn't have guess it.
    The glass instrument with red liquid is not defined enough while it's very well lit. I'd work on that if I were you, especially considering it's the point of attraction. Maybe use some reference like this one?
    I believe his right hand is a little tiny considering how big he is.
    I feel like everything is a little "fuzzy" due to all those lines we still can see. I think it's not that a problem in lit areas but for the shadow parts light the back of the table I think it is. Maybe you shoud "block away" the dark parts?

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