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May 30th, 2012 #14Registered User
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Jeff your right I just gotta look harder.
Lapp I think Rogie Custudio would be good choice but then again theyll play it down to nothing but style. Hell they even said a pro couldnt tell them they were wrong. Maybe I try to hard to help people.
Hide this ad by registering as a memberMay 30th, 2012 #15
Ah, well in that case just hope that they mature sooner rather than later and move on like people have said Good luck with your art studies
May 31st, 2012 #16
As for the actual problem I can't say much other than what has been said and that you can lead the horse to water but can't force it to drink. It's not your loss if your friends don't want to study and all I can say that keep improving on your own. Maybe at some point they notice that they too want to get better, especially since you didn't specify what age your friends are. If you're all 16 years old, then the attitude shown is not surprising and they have plenty of time to grow up and think whether they even wish to improve or not.
Trying to "force" them to improve or see the quality in Loomis books will only cause headache for both parties and at worst just give negative feelings of Loomis/anatomy/etc books to them, making sure they will avoid it in the future too.
Now put up your own Sketchbook in here and get crackin'.
Last edited by TinyBird; May 31st, 2012 at 01:20 AM.
May 31st, 2012 #17
growing up from around 7 or 8 (im 25 now) i was submersed in anime. my cousin showed me akira, ghost in the shell, vampire hunter d, and fist of the north and it blew my mind..
these were like real adult movies but drawn, even as a child i understood that and i knew its what i wanted to do. growing up i drew and studied manga and it wasnt until i was about 20 did i realize you have to learn to really "see" and draw form as it actually exist before you gain the ability to truly change and warp it to your taste..
a lesson i wish i knew much sooner than i learned it.
im studying pretty much all of burne hogarths books (which ive had access to for about 3 years even while doing these serious studies) and while they are always so highly recommended i never "liked" them because while i respected his understanding of life, i didnt like the way hes shapes were so rounded and traditional.
it wasnt until about a month half ago that i truly learned that the point isnt force you to draw like he draws or make all your pictures rounded looking, but that hes making all form its most simple so that you can understand that once you master light and shadow on basic form...thats it. you can begin to draw anything you can imagine.
ive been studying about 8 hours a day for the last month half incorporating the fundamentals and basics into my work and ive had honestly about 6 years worth of artistic epiphanies in just under 2 months. as i went back and really re learned how to see in its most basic form my eye is starting to catch up extremely rapidly with the technical level ive acquired from drawing for like 20 years.
your friends might not be quiet there yet, and if they are really your friends and you guys are all serious about drawing you should try to get them to understand its not about changing your style, but teaching you how push your style to its peek. and if they arent ready to hear that yet then a year or 2 from now when youre doing work far beyond theirs then they will finally listen.
sorry i wrote alot but this is a super personal topic to me, and one of the greatest personal struggles i wish i knew 10 years ago.
May 31st, 2012 #18
Meh, sounds like clueless teenagers being clueless. They'll either wise up eventually or they'll never get anywhere, in which case you might be leaving them behind anyway...
A lot of kids go through a similar "I know better than any teacher, you can't tell me what to do, it's my styyyyyle" phase... If they ever get as far as art school, they usually have that attitude knocked out of them in the first semester.
Just for laughs, you could encourage them to start posting in the critique center here. It might open their eyes a bit. (Or they'll whine about "style" and leave in a huff... But if they do, that's their problem.)
May 31st, 2012 #19
May 31st, 2012 #20
If you're drawing manga, you're probably ignoring most of what Loomis taught anyway.
May 31st, 2012 #21
Well, sometimes you have to ask yourself whether you'd rather be right or whether you'd rather have people to hang out with. Sometimes the overall group dynamic is good and you just put up with the stuff you disagree on (...or argue about it loudly, now that I think back to the last five pub nights we had...). Sometimes it's obvious that you're just not going to fit in and you should cut and run.
Either way, your improvement doesn't have to be dependent on your friends' improvement.
May 31st, 2012 #22Meh, sounds like clueless teenagers being clueless.
Also sounds like the OP might actually be having a breakthrough that drawing Naruto all day may not be the best time spent. If the friends haven't had the breakthrough yet, then so be it.
Plenty of artists have and will continue to learn their craft as solo artists.
You really don't need a "study group". It can be fun, it can be educational if it's the right people, but you definitely don't need it.
You also don't need to be a dick about it, too. Offer up ideas, but if the group isn't a fit for you, then just politely say you aren't interested in being a part of it. Why create strife?
May 31st, 2012 #23Registered User
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Well I get what the general idea is I guess.
Its not that I was trying to be a dick it was me just saying I cant get with the idea of us teaching people in our style of drawing if its flawed. They continued to answer that its there style and Loomis is a nobody and his way is not the only way to learn.
They wont show there work here they know what will happen but I do have there DA accounts if youd like to see.
June 1st, 2012 #24
June 1st, 2012 #25
Anime is for most people something you are starting out with, because of the fact you can youtube it. Talking about style is easy, recognizing style is ok, but recognizing your own style and recognizing your quality in an image is a process that will take you years.
I thought I knew: untill I started art-school, and yes kiddo`s screaming and ignoring the teachers have all dropped out by the time the third semester started, still saying that that school is not suited for them. They are just not willing and open enough to learn.
A situation that recently happened in auditions in my school:
Teacher sits in the hall to check out portfolios for people who might want to apply for art school.
Girl comes into the school, being very social even though shes never been there talking with students, she talks pretty big and I`m actually quite impressed and thinking that she must be awesome.
Girl shows the portfolio to my teacher. sadly these are all anime drawings and most of them straightly traced google images.
Teacher says: funny drawings... that`s pokemon..... or something.... right?
Girl went home, probably to pick up some loomis..
Loomis is about fundamentals, which are essential, you cannot create your own style without knowing what you are doing.
June 15th, 2012 #26Registered User
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Uhm, I don't mean to be rude or anything of the like. But, as far as learning the basics goes, if you only draw manga, you will never become a well rounded artist.
Manga is a very stylized form of art, just like regular american comics. I absolutely love both, and I'm a total geek for the work done in the golden age of comics in America. However, as with any stylized form, it tends to be extremely repetitive and in the end, limiting. For instance, these styles only make use of a very primitive lighting, going only from extreme light to extreme darkness. Little to none is ever done to describe the turn of forms with subtle gradations of tone. Virtually all of the forms in those styles are done instead with outlines, which almost never ocurr in nature, and forming this habit will only harm your career. The same goes for anatomy, the famous American icon, Jim Lee, outright advices to NOT copy the anatomy from his drawings, as he simply exagerates and even invents his own muscles as he goes. He, of course is able to do this, because he thoroughly studied the George Bridgeman books to heart, untill he felt comfortable altering reality to his will. As far as Manga goes, anatomy is ignored all together. The chemistry and proper use of colors is another thing you will never properly learn from manga. Just learn from life!