Page 1 of 4 1 2 3 4 LastLast
Results 1 to 13 of 50

Thread: How many bargues did you draw and how long it took

  1. #1
    Join Date
    Apr 2012
    Posts
    65
    Thanks
    50
    Thanked 19 Times in 18 Posts

    How many bargues did you draw and how long it took

    Hi everyone,

    For those of you who drew or still draws bargues, I wanted to know how many bargues did you draw before you started feeling that you aren't getting much out of the practice relative to the time spent? Also how many bargues have you drawn so far?

    Also I know that it can take hundreds of hours to get one bargue right, but with practice, one should get some kind of efficiency boost. So I was wondering if anyone remembered how long it took them to draw their first bargue and what was the average/best time per bargue once you got the hang of it?

    Your answers will help me gauge my progress as well as show me what I need to shoot for, so even approximate numbers will help tremendously. Thanks.
    Reply With Quote Reply With Quote


  2. Hide this ad by registering as a member
  3. #2
    Join Date
    Apr 2009
    Location
    Northern California
    Posts
    5,234
    Thanks
    3,512
    Thanked 4,906 Times in 2,547 Posts
    I have a better question: how many top pro artists that you admire have drawn a Bargue?
    What would Caravaggio do?
    _________________________

    Portfolio
    Plein Air
    Digital
    Still Life
    Sight Measuring
    Fundamentals
    Reply With Quote Reply With Quote

  4. The Following 4 Users Say Thank You to JeffX99 For This Useful Post:


  5. #3
    Join Date
    Apr 2012
    Posts
    65
    Thanks
    50
    Thanked 19 Times in 18 Posts
    JeffX99: Can't think of anyone who went through modern atelier training without drawing a bargue. So I guess more artists than I can list. Which brings us back to my original question
    Reply With Quote Reply With Quote

  6. #4
    Join Date
    Dec 2009
    Location
    Ottawa, Canada
    Posts
    1,882
    Thanks
    1,455
    Thanked 1,439 Times in 748 Posts
    As far as I am aware, most programs only have students do a small number of Bargues, but spend a long time on each. I'm sure the numbers vary a fair bit, but a lot of places you probably only do maybe 2 or 3.

    That being said, it is important I think to remember that Bargue plates were originally copied without sight size and were not meant to take hundreds of hours each--it was possible that a student would copy many or all of the plates, which simply isn't possible anymore using the methods people use to copy them now.
    Website
    Sketchbook
    Blog

    "Complacency is the womb of mediocrity. " -- Jason Manley

    "If you always put limits on everything you do, physical or anything else, it will spread into your work and into your life. There are no limits. There are only plateaus, and you must not stay there, you must go beyond them." -- Bruce Lee
    Reply With Quote Reply With Quote

  7. The Following 4 Users Say Thank You to Andrew Sonea For This Useful Post:


  8. #5
    Join Date
    Apr 2009
    Location
    Northern California
    Posts
    5,234
    Thanks
    3,512
    Thanked 4,906 Times in 2,547 Posts
    Quote Originally Posted by Blackbridge View Post
    JeffX99: Can't think of anyone who went through modern atelier training without drawing a bargue. So I guess more artists than I can list. Which brings us back to my original question
    This is true for academic, atelier training. I guess I should say it depends on your goals? I doubt any in my top 50-100 artists ever drew one. If your goal is to go the academic, atelier training route more power to you.

    Edit: Not trying to give you a hard time btw...I just think it is a question worth really considering. If the artists that you admire and inspire you have spent a great deal of time and effort on Bargue drawings then by all means, follow that lead. Just make sure you're doing it for the right reasons, and not just because you've heard people say you should do Bargue drawings.
    Last edited by JeffX99; April 27th, 2012 at 02:12 AM.
    What would Caravaggio do?
    _________________________

    Portfolio
    Plein Air
    Digital
    Still Life
    Sight Measuring
    Fundamentals
    Reply With Quote Reply With Quote

  9. The Following 3 Users Say Thank You to JeffX99 For This Useful Post:


  10. #6
    Join Date
    Mar 2007
    Location
    Hamburg, Germany
    Posts
    972
    Thanks
    618
    Thanked 448 Times in 245 Posts
    I copied four Bargues at Angel Academy of Art. All together took me about one trimester, that's 3 months.

    Right now they've decreased the number to 3 Bargues to make sure that really every student can complete them before the trimester is over.
    Reply With Quote Reply With Quote

  11. The Following User Says Thank You to Maidith For This Useful Post:


  12. #7
    Join Date
    Jul 2009
    Location
    WA State
    Posts
    2,364
    Thanks
    796
    Thanked 1,272 Times in 887 Posts
    Quote Originally Posted by Maidith View Post
    I copied four Bargues at Angel Academy of Art. All together took me about one trimester, that's 3 months.

    Right now they've decreased the number to 3 Bargues to make sure that really every student can complete them before the trimester is over.
    But. . .

    Was it useful?
    Reply With Quote Reply With Quote

  13. #8
    Join Date
    Oct 2009
    Location
    The Internet
    Posts
    195
    Thanks
    24
    Thanked 127 Times in 87 Posts
    I've done 4, spending over a month on each, and it's been extremely useful to me. I was literally a clueless beginner (well I still am, but somewhat less clueless) when I first started working on them. Everything in my sketchbook before the value studies have been the only stuff I had ever drawn up until my bargues, bar a terrible selfportrait I did before I started working on them.

    It taught me how to take my time and observe and it taught me how far you can take something, even if you really have no idea what you're doing, with patience alone. Part of the reason I learned so much was probably because of how little I had drawn before them, but I don't regret doing them and I'd recommend it to anyone interested in academic drawing! Van Gogh did all of them multiple times I think.
    Reply With Quote Reply With Quote

  14. The Following 2 Users Say Thank You to yochanan For This Useful Post:


  15. #9
    Join Date
    Mar 2005
    Location
    Montreal, Quebec, Canada
    Posts
    464
    Thanks
    102
    Thanked 181 Times in 101 Posts
    Umm.. so someone I know who totally isn't me is kind of curious as to what a "bargue" is?

    Not me though.
    Follow Me! | DeviantART | Twitter
    Reply With Quote Reply With Quote

  16. The Following 3 Users Say Thank You to sanya For This Useful Post:


  17. #10
    Join Date
    Sep 2009
    Location
    Virginia
    Posts
    5,008
    Thanks
    2,853
    Thanked 6,104 Times in 2,489 Posts
    How many top concept artists copy Bargues? None of the good ones. As Jeff said, great if you want to be an academic painter, pretty useless for anything requiring speed and imagination.
    Reply With Quote Reply With Quote

  18. The Following 2 Users Say Thank You to dpaint For This Useful Post:


  19. #11
    Join Date
    Jun 2006
    Location
    Torrance, CA
    Posts
    6,802
    Thanks
    2,278
    Thanked 4,258 Times in 2,074 Posts
    Quote Originally Posted by sanya View Post
    Umm.. so someone I know who totally isn't me is kind of curious as to what a "bargue" is?

    Not me though.
    http://www.conceptart.org/forums/showthread.php?t=45404

    The answer is it doesn't matter. I don't care if one thinks a "top concept artist" has or has not done a Bargue. If you find it useful go ahead.

    I do not care if Emily is a top concept artist in the eyes of some people. Not everyone is going to be a "top concept artist" and a top concept artist may have done a Bargue drawing.

    It may help you if you want to be an artist, and you may be a good artist in other areas. If you find it useful, go ahead, if not - you don't have to do it.

    everyone learns differently and one doesn't have to knock it if it isn't for them.
    Reply With Quote Reply With Quote

  20. The Following 9 Users Say Thank You to Arshes Nei For This Useful Post:


  21. #12
    Join Date
    Jun 2007
    Posts
    79
    Thanks
    211
    Thanked 54 Times in 41 Posts
    Bargue drawings are just master copies. I don't understand this hostility towards them. People have been doing master studies since the Renaissance.

    The Bargue plates are used because they are specifically suited for copying from. They have simplified light and shadow and some include intermediate block-in stages that show you how to simplify. They also nicely link to cast drawing. The sighting and measuring techniques can be applied to any master study. There have been drawing courses before Bargue's, that similarly consisted out of plates to be copied.

    I think I did around 5 copies, but that includes the simple ones like the features. At first I was very slow. You can spend as long on them as you like. It's up to you to decide when the drawing is "done".
    I knew someone that did over 50 Bargue drawings. He was only able to do so many because he didn't strive for complete accuracy, and I think neither did Van Gogh. The way they are being copied nowadays is taking it further than what they were likely intended for (too far perhaps). Although it's a good exercise to push yourself to the extent of your abilities. And I think you get more out of doing a few accurate copies, than 50 more or less inaccurate ones. Quality over quantity.

    They don't have to be done 1:1, although it is the easiest to start with. I recommend doing a few using comparative measuring; blowing them up or scaling them down. You'll learn more that way. I believe the original Bargue book consisted of just the plates, with no instructions. Students at the Grand Central Academy use the drawings only for practicing their block-ins, which is what I've been doing as well.
    Last edited by Norkagar; April 27th, 2012 at 09:45 AM.
    Reply With Quote Reply With Quote

  22. The Following 4 Users Say Thank You to Norkagar For This Useful Post:


  23. #13
    Join Date
    Dec 2004
    Location
    Alberta, Canada
    Posts
    1,680
    Thanks
    699
    Thanked 596 Times in 283 Posts
    Quote Originally Posted by JeffX99 View Post
    how many top pro artists that you admire have drawn a Bargue?

    Dozens. Including at least 3 or 4 at the top of each page on this sites banner display.
    Last edited by Craig D; April 27th, 2012 at 11:11 AM.
    Reply With Quote Reply With Quote

  24. The Following 2 Users Say Thank You to Craig D For This Useful Post:


Page 1 of 4 1 2 3 4 LastLast

Similar Threads

  1. Replies: 22
    Last Post: March 19th, 2011, 01:50 AM
  2. Can't Draw Long Hair
    By Sorlin in forum ART DlSCUSSION
    Replies: 6
    Last Post: February 16th, 2011, 07:44 PM
  3. Art: Bargues/Master Copies
    By JParrilla in forum FINE ART
    Replies: 33
    Last Post: July 1st, 2008, 03:53 PM
  4. Long time not draw...
    By GweeMingKun in forum ART CRITIQUE CENTER
    Replies: 2
    Last Post: December 12th, 2006, 12:13 PM
  5. How Long do You Think it Took Adam Hughes to Draw This?
    By NoSeRider in forum Artist Lounge
    Replies: 8
    Last Post: January 12th, 2006, 04:48 PM

Members who have read this thread: 6

Tags for this Thread

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •  
  • 424,149 Artists
  • 3,599,276 Artist Posts
  • 32,941 Sketchbooks
  • 54 New Art Jobs
Art Workshop Discount Inside

Developed Actively by vBSocial.com
SpringOfSea's Sketchbook