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  1. #91
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    Christ this thread has snowballed. i agree much better image. lose the circle and make the image like 700 pxls tall so we can see it. Try getting some references for igneous rock and obsidian for the rocks as they look like guess work atm. I said this before and i'm pretty sure it went by unread... please don't use the smudge brush for rocks, it just doesn't make sense. get your reference on...combined with your chalk brush...on :/

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  4. #92
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    Quote Originally Posted by dog-faced View Post
    Christ this thread has snowballed. i agree much better image. lose the circle and make the image like 700 pxls tall so we can see it. Try getting some references for igneous rock and obsidian for the rocks as they look like guess work atm. I said this before and i'm pretty sure it went by unread... please don't use the smudge brush for rocks, it just doesn't make sense. get your reference on...combined with your chalk brush...on :/
    oh yes, I will be referencing throughout the entire piece
    skin,armor,lava,rock.etc.. the whole deal, however I am keeping the circle.You guys can hate me all you want on that one

     

  5. #93
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    I'd like to see the image a bit bigger too. Not huge mind you, just big enough to fit on the screen so my shitty eyes can see it better.

    The thumbnailing discussion had me interested too. I know about composition and making a possible picture up using blobs and shapes, and I know about working through an idea process to get to an end result. But I don't call it thumbnailing, I call the rough ideas sketches, so maybe thats where some of the confusion on Zoe's part is coming in. People are quick to tell everyone to thumbnail but not everyone uses that term so it can be confusing.

    I also think it might be a bit elitist for people to say they don't usually bother critiquing a piece if they think the poster is an amateur. Thats something I would never do because not everyone who uses this forum is a professional or near it yet. And it's not always possible to tell who is and who isn't by the work they post in the Critique Centre. Making assumptions about people's skill level or professional status is pretty narrow minded and egotistical and it's a real shame that there might be a culture like that in this forum. It surprises me to hear it.

    Regardless of whether Zoe had a bad attitude or not, I think crits should be given freely and openly to all who ask. But if people don't have time, or feel they're not being appreciated for their efforts, then just don't crit. It's pretty much that simple.

     

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  7. #94
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    You are getting lots of good advice. I wouldn't dismiss it. Seems a lot of what's been said would apply to how I would of treated a quick po of an older pic of yours.

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  9. #95
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    Quote Originally Posted by Candra H View Post
    I also think it might be a bit elitist for people to say they don't usually bother critiquing a piece if they think the poster is an amateur. Thats something I would never do because not everyone who uses this forum is a professional or near it yet. And it's not always possible to tell who is and who isn't by the work they post in the Critique Centre. Making assumptions about people's skill level or professional status is pretty narrow minded and egotistical and it's a real shame that there might be a culture like that in this forum. It surprises me to hear it.
    That is probably the first time I've ever mentioned it...and it was because it had come up so I thought it was relevant in context.

    What saddens me is when you try to help people, offer insight, recommendations for books, etc. and as often as not get nothing but crap in return.

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  11. #96
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    Quote Originally Posted by Candra H View Post
    Regardless of whether Zoe had a bad attitude or not, I think crits should be given freely and openly to all who ask. But if people don't have time, or feel they're not being appreciated for their efforts, then just don't crit. It's pretty much that simple.
    The problem is that you've often already posted your crit only to get an attitude afterwards, meaning you've wasted your time.

    I agree though that there's no need for elitism or arguments from authority.

     

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  13. #97
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    Every one here has BEEN helping you. Artists here are not stingy or stuck-up. I would take some of their advice. They only come across as rude because they've made an effort to help you, and so far have only gotten mostly argumentative replies.

    Last edited by jacobanderson; April 28th, 2012 at 02:38 PM.
     

  14. #98
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    Quote Originally Posted by Blankstate View Post
    You are getting lots of good advice. I wouldn't dismiss it. Seems a lot of what's been said would apply to how I would of treated a quick po of an older pic of yours.
    this is decent
    there's some things I like and some things I don't.Just by making it brighter I think it reads like the sun is rising instead of the sun is setting which isn't the mood I was shooting for.It was a piece doomed for failure I'm afraid.I wanted dark and looming also to have a ton of detail in the figure..but like someone said there's too much landscape to be that..I think it ended up being exactly what it was.A painting conceived from the mind of a young artist who knew very little about composition..so when I went back and digitally remade it..didn't really help the picture much..sure it looks more realistic and the coloring looks better than crappy old oil paint but as a whole it's just nothing special at all.I never go back and fix old work I just move onto the next.

     

  15. #99
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    thought I'd post an update on how the actual piece is coming along.I might start getting a little crazy with this guy not sure yet..almost feels like the more horns and plates I add to his skin the better he looks.

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  16. #100
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    Quote Originally Posted by JeffX99 View Post
    That is probably the first time I've ever mentioned it...and it was because it had come up so I thought it was relevant in context.

    What saddens me is when you try to help people, offer insight, recommendations for books, etc. and as often as not get nothing but crap in return.

    Later.
    No worries. I'm not trying to single people out, just making general comments triggered by things being said and attitudes that I see. I havent seen the kind of elitist attitude I mentioned from you so it surprised me when you said that and felt I had to comment on it.

    Quote Originally Posted by Lhune View Post
    The problem is that you've often already posted your crit only to get an attitude afterwards, meaning you've wasted your time.
    I agree with both you guys about this. Getting an attitude after giving what you feel is a constructive critique does make it feel like a waste of time. But that doesn't mean we can all go around assuming everyone who posts is going to have a bad attitude and wording our own comments aggressively or defensively in advance. It's that kind of thing I sometimes see in critiquers that makes me speak out. Not saying thats the case in this thread, just that I hate to see any kind of arrogance or belittlement on either side of the critiquing fence because for me, there is no level of better than or less than.

    But yeah, I'm beginning to ramble and probably repeat myself, so I'll shut up now.

    I'm also bowing out of this thread because I cant find anything constructive to say to someone who thinks oils look crappy.

     

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  18. #101
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    Quote Originally Posted by Candra H View Post

    I also think it might be a bit elitist for people to say they don't usually bother critiquing a piece if they think the poster is an amateur. Thats something I would never do because not everyone who uses this forum is a professional or near it yet. And it's not always possible to tell who is and who isn't by the work they post in the Critique Centre. Making assumptions about people's skill level or professional status is pretty narrow minded and egotistical and it's a real shame that there might be a culture like that in this forum. It surprises me to hear it.

    Regardless of whether Zoe had a bad attitude or not, I think crits should be given freely and openly to all who ask. But if people don't have time, or feel they're not being appreciated for their efforts, then just don't crit. It's pretty much that simple.
    Actually we did assume Zoe wanted to be a professional, not the other way around. So...everything you said here makes no sense to me. No one assumed he was an aspiring amateur, it was the opposite. Only after he said that, Jeff said he would rather pass on helping an aspiring amateur, which I also said, and I think everyone agrees with lol.

    And you say there's no sense of better than or worse than? Are you sure about that? That's...I don't think you meant that quite like that.

     

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  20. #102
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    Quote Originally Posted by Artfix View Post
    Actually we did assume Zoe wanted to be a professional, not the other way around. So...everything you said here makes no sense to me. No one assumed he was an aspiring amateur, it was the opposite. Only after he said that, Jeff said he would rather pass on helping an aspiring amateur, which I also said, and I think everyone agrees with lol.

    And you say there's no sense of better than or worse than? Are you sure about that? That's...I don't think you meant that quite like that.
    I think that making a distinction between whether the artist is (aspiring to) making a living of her work or not in terms of giving feedback on a forum is kind of an arbitrary criteria. The main criteria should be how the artist responds to the feedback and applies it in later works/exercises.

     

  21. #103
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    critiquing on this site is like walking up to fat person and saying goddamn you're a fucking fat ass you need to not be a fat ass anymore..quit eating so much.

    just kinda harsh, you could say hey cut back and crappy food,run,get protein etc..do a paint-over of them skinny ya know be nice about it. lmao!

    I leave here wanting to say ok 1st off Fuck U and 2ndly thanks for the advice I might try some of this shit out
    all the advice kind and rude alike have broadened my mind though..I went and found some more gold on youtube just cause artfix said "my 3rds were ok" I had no idea wtf he was talking about..so I googled it and like everything it wasn't visual enough so I typed into youtube and found aaaall kinds of goodies..I think I've learned more about color and composition in the last few days than all of high school art class.I don't think oil paints are crappy as a medium btw I just don't like painting..I used to paint 24/7 and it was very frustrating and took so long to dry..I could never do what I wanted to do with them..when I went digital it was my dream come true.I think art is just straight up fun now.

     

  22. #104
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    Quote Originally Posted by IIIzoeIII View Post
    critiquing on this site is like walking up to fat person and saying goddamn you're a fucking fat ass you need to not be a fat ass anymore..quit eating so much.

    just kinda harsh, you could say hey cut back and crappy food,run,get protein etc..do a paint-over of them skinny ya know be nice about it. lmao!

    I leave here wanting to say ok 1st off Fuck U and 2ndly thanks for the advice I might try some of this shit out
    all the advice kind and rude alike have broadened my mind though..I went and found some more gold on youtube just cause artfix said "my 3rds were ok" I had no idea wtf he was talking about..so I googled it and like everything it wasn't visual enough so I typed into youtube and found aaaall kinds of goodies..I think I've learned more about color and composition in the last few days than all of high school art class.I don't think oil paints are crappy as a medium btw I just don't like painting..I used to paint 24/7 and it was very frustrating and took so long to dry..I could never do what I wanted to do with them..when I went digital it was my dream come true.I think art is just straight up fun now.
    And trying to help you is similar to shooting yourself in the knee- really stupid.

     

  23. #105
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    Quote Originally Posted by IIIzoeIII View Post
    critiquing on this site is like walking up to fat person and saying goddamn you're a fucking fat ass you need to not be a fat ass anymore..quit eating so much.

    just kinda harsh, you could say hey cut back and crappy food,run,get protein etc..do a paint-over of them skinny ya know be nice about it. lmao!
    Either way it's up to the fat person to choose whether they want to feel offended, ignore the advice and remain fat, or whether they want to ignore the harsh words and take the advice. You can't punish your critics by ignoring advice, you can only punish yourself.

    So follow advice or don't. It doesn't *really* matter to anyone but you.

    (If you say "thanks for the advice" though you might get more of it. If you say "this is total bullshit", expect to do a lot more problem solving by yourself.)

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  25. #106
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    Quote Originally Posted by Artfix View Post
    Actually we did assume Zoe wanted to be a professional, not the other way around. So...everything you said here makes no sense to me. No one assumed he was an aspiring amateur, it was the opposite. Only after he said that, Jeff said he would rather pass on helping an aspiring amateur, which I also said, and I think everyone agrees with lol.
    I know people assumed Zoe was a professional, but that still makes no sense to me. Because assuming someone is a professional or aspiring to be shouldnt be the basis of how a critique is given. So either way, I feel the same. It's narrow minded and presumptuous to give critiques or refuse them based on someone's professional status or lack thereof. And that people decided to pass because it turned out Zoe doesn't aim for professional status is what surprised me.

    And you say there's no sense of better than or worse than? Are you sure about that? That's...I don't think you meant that quite like that.
    No, thats not what I meant by that, but I'm not wording things clearly so I'm coming across wrong. I think.

    What I meant was that I don't approach critiquing, or any creative interaction, from a position of "I'm better than you because I'm a professional and you're an amateur" or "you're cool and so much better than me because you're a professional and I'm an amateur". I've seen both those attitudes lead to people looking down on others or playing groupie roles and neither of those types of behaviour has any place in giving or receiving critiiques.

    It's all related to the elitism thing I commented on in my earlier post but I don't think I made myself clear enough. So I'll just point to DaEvil's post below, who said it much better than me, and leave it at that -

    Quote Originally Posted by DaEvil1 View Post
    I think that making a distinction between whether the artist is (aspiring to) making a living of her work or not in terms of giving feedback on a forum is kind of an arbitrary criteria. The main criteria should be how the artist responds to the feedback and applies it in later works/exercises.
    Anyway, sorry if I sounded argumentative or like I was disputing where you were coming from, Artfix. That wasn't my intention. I like reading your critiques because they're useful to me too. I might have been paid for my work but I'm by no means a professional, so I'm here to learn as much as anyone else, and I plunder what I need from other critiques as well as my own.

    Quote Originally Posted by IIIzoeIII View Post
    I don't think oil paints are crappy as a medium btw I just don't like painting..I used to paint 24/7 and it was very frustrating and took so long to dry..I could never do what I wanted to do with them..when I went digital it was my dream come true.I think art is just straight up fun now.
    Well, thats where you and me are different. I'm a traditional artist who occasionally tries to figure out digital, but I don't consider either method more fun or less fun than the other. They're just different mediums. To say you don't like painting is fine, thats your personal preference, but saying oils look crappy because you don't like using them is a gross generalisation. And by doing that, you're belittling the medium based on your personal opinion.

    I could give you my personal opinion that in your digital pieces, you don't seem to have an eye for colour or light because the reds and blues in the op are too bright and badly chosen shades, and the light in the picture someone quoted for you in this last page makes everything look like it's made of some kind of shiny plastic. But thats only my opinion and giving it doesn't mean I think all digital art looks crappy. Do you see?

     

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  27. #107
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    Quote Originally Posted by IIIzoeIII View Post
    I leave here wanting to say ok 1st off Fuck U.
    Same to you, please don't come back.
    And you can take this as a warning.

     

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