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  1. #1
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    Are we underated?

    Are we underated?

    I post this thread becuase I think that the visions, looks, and designs we provide to proprietary movies, games etc are xtremely valualeble. Yet we are so Fucking desperate to get to work on the next game or movie it is PATHETIC!

    So many talent artist try to make their way into this field , but I truly don't see the benefits? Why are soo many talented artists willing to give up their creative ideas and designs?

    WE are the ones who design the look and feel to every movie, scene, and character. Ofcouse the director has the "idea" , but they usualy don't know what the #$%% it's supposed to look like until we step up!

    WE DO THAT FOR THEM!

    If you design the next Darth Vader, or the next Spong Bob, don't you want credit? Yet in our industry, we get NONE. YES that's right, NONE!

    We get no royalties, or recognition for OUR designs!

    If we did not sell outselves soooo #$%%^ short in this industry, maybe... just maybee.... we would get more credit and money for our work.


    But as long as we play the humble, and desperate artist just looking for "work" we will get NOTHING!


    Any thoughts?

    I know I'm going to get it for this thread,...I just want to stir some thoughts.....
    "If one advances confidently in the direction of
    his dreams, and endeavors to live the life he
    has imagined, he will meet with a success
    unexpected in common hours."
    - H.D. Thoreau


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  3. #2
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    Well, it's not mainly the director who stole the show, but art director, special fx director and so on. If you listen to them, they've done everything and sometime more

    True artist are often forget, who know who design the vehicule in star wars?(By who, I mean people not passionate about the design...)

    Most of us don't know how to sell their skill. I'm still a student, but I never know what to ask for a piece. Most of the time I don't track how many times i've work on it, couldn't remember paper's price and so on... When people ask me for a price, I'm allways surprise

    I think most of us don't find theirs pieces worth a price(money or other thing... exposure, royalties). It's probably the main problem here - we're not conscious about our value.

  4. #3
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    Yes, we are underated, but that´s probably because we´re too cool for the human mind to comprehend. :cool:

  5. #4
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    i dont know. i mean...just because you are not getting paid millions for something doesnt really change the fact that you did it. for me, if i could do what some of these guys do i would be fairly happy with that. though i dont take to well to getting screwed either.. so i dont know what i would do with myself.

    probably could never work for a gaming or movie company i guess. whatever the case i have my own stories to tell, i dont need to bring everyone else's to life.

  6. #5
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    Hey Sean,

    plain and simple:

    money makes money, unless you have the dough to bankroll your own film, game, whatever. we will always be hired guns. period. Just try to cut yourself the best deal you can and moreover bring something more to the table then just great drawing skills. be smart be professional and have fun.

    see ya in austin
    dan

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    I really, REALLY like Vanilla Ice Cream. SO that probably explains ALOT....

  8. #7
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    Otis - I had a feeling someone would soon post this thread.

    Dan - Agreed.


    Also, if at the right company it's possible to build a good name for yourself and get credit for your work if circumstances allow it. And it's almost always pure circumstance and timing that allows it. Kim Tae Hyung for example was able to do that with the game companies he worked at, he didn't always have a big name. But if your unlucky, your company may be more supressing of the growth of your skillz, and won't allow you credit and fame, which is usually the case. Best thing to do is put all your talents into your own stuff and get that going. If you can't use all of your talents and get the credit you deserve at a company, then don't rely on the company, get it on your own. Thats the only way I see it.

    -C

  9. #8
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    if you're good and dedicated you'll get the recognition you deserve..

    where do you think art directors and directors come from?

    they get noticed by people with money for their previous work..

  10. #9
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    When you consider that you're dealing with the commercial world, it really shouldn't be all that supprising. (Though I'm no pro yet) I do see how you could have a very good reason to be frustrated.

    What bugs me the most however is the lack of recognition within the artistic culture. The so-called finearts culture seems to exist in it's own bubble apart from the rest of society. Accessable forms of art such as film and graphic design are not taken seriously by this subculture that seems to only appreciate ambiguous symbolism are pre-approved styles. This is what I find most ironic too. the very classical artists that this culture admires most were great inovators, yet those who choose to explore new mediums, express new ideas and tell new stories are pretty much ignored.

  11. #10
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    I agree with all of you guys. But regarding Art Directors...imop, I've never worked w/ one that had any drawing or desing skills. They are just usualy better at managment. So, I guess if your going to shoot for a career ..Creative Director is the one that pays and allows creativity.

    Chris, you hit it right on the head. I think that the only way to get true recognition for your work is to do it on your own.

    I can't wait to meet you guys in Austin.

    Cheers!:chug:
    "If one advances confidently in the direction of
    his dreams, and endeavors to live the life he
    has imagined, he will meet with a success
    unexpected in common hours."
    - H.D. Thoreau

  12. #11
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    Exo - Yep

    Otis - I can't to meet everyone too, I may be going there with Sean McNalley and Chukw if they decide to go.

    PT Osborne - About what you said about art directors and directors, thats what I used to think, but thats not entirely true. At one job I used to have, one of the directors had no real directing, art, or industry experience, the person used to be a construction worker. He got the job because of circumstance, timing, and the people he knew. This is not to say he wasn't a good director, but he didn't get the job the way your saying, the way most people believe. That company made many products for about ten years. As for being good and dedicated giving you the recognition you deserve, thats also not entirely true. I've seen artists who worked extremely hard, being very dedicated, and talented, and never went anywhere beyond their position.

    My point is, you can't really rely on being good and dedicated to go far. Thats how it should be, and what most people think, but thats not how it always is. Thats what I used to think. But in most cases, it's about getting into the right circumstances at the right times with the right people. Whether you good or not, if circumstances don't work in your favor, it's up to you to make those circumstances work in your favor. Don't rely on things to come to you, thinking that one day someone will recognize your abilities. You usually have to force the right circumstances work for you so you do get recongition, etc. At least thats from what I've witnessed.

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  14. #12
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    I'm with you with the art director thing. With a couple of honourable exceptions, most of the art directors I've worked under couldn't tell their arse from their elbow.

    But, this whole recognition thing? At the end of the day, you're getting paid to fill your portfolio. Also, look at the proliferation of 'art of' books for movies and games. There's recognition.

    For now, I'll keep my unreserved praise for nurses, cleaning up shit, piss and vomit for next to no pay.

    Well, that last bit might be a bit harsh, but I've had jobs where being paid on time was your bonus. We're doing what we love to do. There's thousands of hugely talented, unemployed artists out there, doing shitty McJobs who'd bite your hand off to be in your position.
    Last edited by Summer Pudding; May 28th, 2004 at 09:54 AM.

  15. #13
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    Summer Pudding - Agreed, there's many artists working Burger K jobs who'd love to have my position. I used to be one of them. I enjoy, appreciate, and respect my job. All I'm saying, is if you feel your skills and career goes beyond the job, then make that happen, but always appreciate and respect your current job.

    About proliferation of 'art of' books for movies and games. For big budget games like Final Fantasy, yes, they have art books. For 90% of the games out there, no. For movies it's the same. Meaning a lot of great artists out there don't get any recongition. And usually the artists who get recognition are all ready big names, or an artist who got lucky getting into that circumstance with the right job to allow it, or artists who decided to take their skills and career beyond the average art position to force circumstances to get them recogniition.

    And it's not really all about the recognition, it's more about knowing you exist by people enjoying your work, and you influencing people. If no one knows you did any work, to them, you don't exist.

  16. #14
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    Yeah, you're right enough Chris. I was in a foul mood when I read Otis' original mail. But I bet BK didn't reject your burger flipper concepts!!

    fuckers!


  17. #15
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    :evilbat:heh heh HAHAHHAHAHAAHAH!!!!:evilbat:

  18. #16
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    if your working on in a collaborative medium (i.e. film, games) then you cant really say that one role is more important than the other. I mean can you honestly say that concept art is more important than programming? or modeling? with out any one of them there is no final product.

    yes your right otis there are alot of desperate artists out there--because drawing cool shit for a living is a an extreme luxury and theres tons of people who want to do it

    ty

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