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  1. #31
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kirkkh View Post
    But,

    If your going there, if your piece is about the beauty, or sex appeal; then feel free, go there. Holding back, or a mixed message will only dilute your work. I'd love to see this revised with the focus being more on the sex appeal. Were all adults here mostly. I wouldn't be modest about what your piece is trying to encapsulate.
    You so missed the point. The "complaints" were not because we're childish, prude or otherwise have problems with sex appeal. If sex appeal is what he wants to go for, then he should. It's done to death but if that's what he wants, nobody is going to complain. The problem was with the fact that in his first post, he makes it very explicitly clear that he has a problem with sexism and the treatment of women as objects of lust in art, and then makes a piece just like it himself.

    Not going to start the discussion again, if any moderator reads this. Just felt the need to clarify.

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  2. #32
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lhune View Post
    You so missed the point. The "complaints" were not because we're childish, prude or otherwise have problems with sex appeal. If sex appeal is what he wants to go for, then he should. It's done to death but if that's what he wants, nobody is going to complain. The problem was with the fact that in his first post, he makes it very explicitly clear that he has a problem with sexism and the treatment of women as objects of lust in art, and then makes a piece just like it himself.

    Not going to start the discussion again, if any moderator reads this. Just felt the need to clarify.
    Oh, lol. I confess I didn't read the preliminary explanation, I didn't want it to effect the way I saw the piece. whoopsies.

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  3. #33
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    the foreground head which is dead on mug shot destroys the dynamics of the rest of the picture. THere is still something weird going on with theforeshortening of her arm holding the guy by his head. Her expression is weird. Its like "i dont give a f whats going on around me, im bored, can i go home?" which is fine but not in the situation you are giving us here.

    I would disagree with other pple saying that a rendered face cannot be placed in an expressive or even abstract environment. But it has to be done properly for it to look right. But that is aside from topic since that is not what you are going for. Although i wish you were going for that - something different and unique would finally come up on conceptart lol

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  5. #34
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    maybe getting somewhere. the thumb looks pleasing to me. thinking about tinybirds lighting sug. doing a repaint of bottom corner next. show more of the ground. new arm idea? neck needs much redoing. but tonight i just tried to like it again.


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  6. #35
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    Yeah, lighting is not strong enough. that will be the next focus. Strong cohesive lighting.

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    Bendy giraffe neck is bendy.

    Man, you have to fix her neck. That is not an angle that anyone holds naturally while doing what she's doing. Seriously, just take her head and tilt it 15 degrees to the left and adjust the hair to match and it'll be fine.

    I can't shake the feeling that's she's about to fall over backwards on purpose right now.

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    well sex sells....it always has it always will.
    there are few things in this world as aesthetically pleasing as a nude female body.It was designed to captivate man,and make him want to procreate.If you are trying to sell your work keep truck'n cause it never fails,as long as it looks good.

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  9. #38
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    i'll say this once again, I am not working on the neck right now. im working on getting the comp solid, neck and then light. in that order.
    things ive noticed : eyebrow too heavy. and im not sure if i like the white space.

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  10. #39
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    Quote Originally Posted by spiritvanished View Post
    im working on getting the comp solid, neck and then light. in that order.
    So, why not take this back to the basic thumbnail level? I think you'll just end up being restricted by what you have already finished and try to build the composition around that even when it might hurt the composition/image as a whole.
    I'd say ditch the image, do thumbnails until you find a solid composition you like and then come back and look what you can salvage and use from the old image so you don't necessarily have to repaint every part.

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  12. #40
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    Quote Originally Posted by TinyBird View Post
    So, why not take this back to the basic thumbnail level? I think you'll just end up being restricted by what you have already finished and try to build the composition around that even when it might hurt the composition/image as a whole.
    I'd say ditch the image, do thumbnails until you find a solid composition you like and then come back and look what you can salvage and use from the old image so you don't necessarily have to repaint every part.
    Thats starting to look like the next logical step.

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  13. #41
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    Sometimes you just gotta murder your darlings.

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    Wow, what a thread! Really interesting read.

    Crit wise-
    Be careful, your really close to a known character with a more or less trademark pose.


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  17. #43
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    I figure you need some outside perspective here. I know this is your darling as TinyBird said...but its really obvious that you're building around the part that you like(the face) and that is a terrible way to do illustrations. Never do that. I would say that you do that with every piece I've seen from you. Its a bad habit that I encourage you to work on.

    Start over..its not working. I say that plainly because its obvious from my standpoint. Don't mean to sound rude, but I want it to get through!

    Good luck.

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  19. #44
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    I agree with Tiny Bird and Artfix.

    However it is a digital piece after all so there is nothing to stopping you from cutting out the head and make it in to some sort of portrait instead.

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    Hi everybody,

    I just wanted to say thank you for all the interesting links. Especially Justa's.

    Also I'm very interested in seeing what will become of the picture this thread originally was about.

    (Oh, wow, I just went from lurker to regular poster, scary.)

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    Some "thumbs."
    S wanted to try out as many different ideas as i could. not so much variations yet.
    & frida i was thinking about doing that. esp since my canvas was large.

    && Double thank you for tinybird and artfix for always keeping me in check and calling me out. i really appreciate it.

    Last edited by spiritvanished; April 26th, 2012 at 05:23 AM. Reason: posted wrong image
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    Have you considered a crowd of guys encircling them maybe, I think something along those lines might drive home the "protector" theme a bit more. With the girl always off in the corner, that point is getting lost in all your thumbs. Bring them together and I think the image will become more cohesive with the theme.

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  25. #48
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    I like 3 and 5 so far.

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  27. #49
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    This is a great start! I like 5 the best--especially that dutch tilt.

    Is it important that this be a moment of action? Because it would be MUCH easier to show the heroine standing defensively in front of the other woman, surrounded by attackers, or at least with attackers coming at them from one direction.

    Then you can do that thing you like where your heroine is looking up with that "come get me" expression. But its still important that she doesnt look ready for a porn shoot---so put some hair in her face or something.

    You can put some guys laying unconscious in front of her. I'm picturing a very low horizon line, maybe so the men approaching are only feet and ankles, and we're looking up at the heroine guarding the other. Or maybe HL more near hand-level so the men approaching are a few hands, and one or two are holding lead pipes or something?

    How does that sound? Lame or totally awesome? I could do some roughs if you like my idea but not sure what I mean. Let me know.

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    @snails place. its funny i thought of that but opposite. a group of scared city people cheering her on for protecting her. you know like. "this bad guy has been giving us so much trouble please hurt him terribly" aha.
    i think your idea in a mi with artfis could be really interesting.

    that being said~
    Artfix:
    I dont really have any "motion shots" in my port. so i wanted to challenge myself.

    Some visuals would be sooo helpful. im having a hard time picturing it.

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    I think this is where im going. triangle on our left, supposed to be the back of oncoming attackers leg.
    I'm worried it might not look she's protecting the girl, or her legs might be in a too of a submissive pose. I liked the idea of her breaking the guys arm. but having her arm out in front of the girl might be strong storytelling.
    I'm on the fence.
    Please help.
    oh and dont mid the current "lighting". its sporadic, and not indicative of the final product.

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    Or maybe this?

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    They kind of look like they're having a bit of a hug, especially when we can't see the break in the guy's arm. Not to mention that her arm coming forward is crazy long and it doesn't read like you're going for exaggerated perspective (I guess that's what you're doing?) it just simply looks way long.

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  34. #54
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    I think a main step forward and towards an actual illustration of a scene, rather than a pinup, would be to consider her expression. Pinups may gaze into space looking mysterious. A gal beating the crap out of a bad guy should have some indication in her face of what she's doing and how she's feeling about it.

    Looking away from her opponent indicates she doesn't consider him a threat, which is fine. Maybe she out to look over her shoulder to some off-camera baddies lurking in the shadows, like telling them "Come here if you dare, you're next"? Or maybe she ought to have a triumphant look? You decide! But for me, it needs something.

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    For me, grappling a guy to the ground and breaking his arm seems like it's both too time consuming and too focused an action when you're surrounded by enemies and trying to protect someone helpless. When I think about scenes like this in martial arts movies, the hero is usually bouncing around between enemies, kicking them down, throwing improvised weapons, and doing everything they can to clear a path for escape.

    I think that it could work if there weren't enemies behind the pair. For instance, if she thought the guy she had grappled was the last enemy, brought him to the ground to interrogate him, and then uh-oh, here comes this guy. Of course, that's if you want the hero to succeed. You could also make it clear that the hero is about to fail at protecting the little girl from being kidnapped. If the little girl is about to be murdered though, well, that probably calls for a different composition all together.

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    The second version was a last second addition.
    My quick drawing skills are something im working on/struggling with.
    Sometimes, I cant always convey whats in my head in a short amount of time. (gesture studies are helping)

    goldseven:
    The idea was that shes looking up into the guy in the foregrounds eyes.
    its still just a large thumb/sketch though. Rough enough that I can still change around the comp at will.

    grunler the initial concept was that she was protecting her mid assualt. this is more than halfway through the fight.


    i know the face in my sketch is all wrong. It was quick.

    (Some) of my two sources of inspiration:


    I like the cinematic approach, because shes a hero.

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    ive decided to scrap this idea and go in a different direction of the theme protection.
    group of kids in a downtown city. regular everyday stuff until a giant man appears and starts attacking the city, thye hide behind a street ad, and then a woman appear and starts attacking the man trying to protect the kids and the city. She makes weapons "appear and shoot them. (the three lines by her hip)

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