24HD Now or Later?

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    24HD Now or Later?

    I've never followed Wacom or their products, or even used a tablet in my life, but I've been drawing and designing my whole life. It's natural to me, so I feel I shouldn't sell myself short and buy a lesser than awesome tablet.

    So I've been researching the 24HD for a month now. I want it!

    However, I know there are some problems (art pen, thick screen, light output)

    Do you think Wacom has plans to release an updated 24HD within the next 6-8 months, or should I just order one now because it would be longer than that?

    So should I go ahead and order, or wait and see.

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    Quote Originally Posted by billakong View Post
    Do you think Wacom has plans to release an updated 24HD within the next 6-8 months, or should I just order one now because it would be longer than that?
    Given their track record (where they don't update anything for years).... No. I don't think they will update the 24HD any time soon.

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    Ah that's exactly what I wanted to know, thank you so much! Since I haven't even used a tablet.. not having the Art Pen shouldn't be a big deal I imagine. They should be able to fix that though right?

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    According to this blog post from another CA member, Wacom is working on the Art Pen.

    http://managingcolors.blogspot.com/2...n-problem.html

    I've never used the Art Pen and I've loved every Wacom tablet I've had for the past decade and I totally love my new Cintiq. If you want it, get it. This sucker feels like a major overhaul that they'll stick with for a while. I've no inside info though. Basically I'm just echoing fes's response

    Cheers

    Twitter: barrymcw

    Sketchblog (Mostly the same content as here): SketchyRobots
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    Quote Originally Posted by barrymcw View Post
    According to this blog post from another CA member, Wacom is working on the Art Pen.

    http://managingcolors.blogspot.com/2...n-problem.html

    I've never used the Art Pen and I've loved every Wacom tablet I've had for the past decade and I totally love my new Cintiq. If you want it, get it. This sucker feels like a major overhaul that they'll stick with for a while. I've no inside info though. Basically I'm just echoing fes's response

    Cheers
    Thanks! Your responses are very helpful, and yes I want it soo bad. I am dying to paint in photoshop with a pen in my hand!!

    Next, a Keurig Coffee Maker! (if you haven't seen one.. they're magic)

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    I really hoped they'd have the gesture capabilities like the bamboo create, but I'll take it!

    www.findphil.com for a look at my older stuff
    www.facebook.com/vig.illustrationgraphics for recent stuff
    http://velikan.tumblr.com/ for the latest up-to-the-minute stuff, and process nonsense
    And finally, http://www.here-there-be-monsters.net/ is the place to be if you want to buy some of my work that has been kitted by the talented hand of Dave.
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    Quote Originally Posted by billakong View Post
    I've never followed Wacom or their products, or even used a tablet in my life, but I've been drawing and designing my whole life. It's natural to me, so I feel I shouldn't sell myself short and buy a lesser than awesome tablet.

    So I've been researching the 24HD for a month now. I want it!

    However, I know there are some problems (art pen, thick screen, light output)

    Do you think Wacom has plans to release an updated 24HD within the next 6-8 months, or should I just order one now because it would be longer than that?

    So should I go ahead and order, or wait and see.
    The Cintiq 24HD is the cream de crop of tablets. If you have alot of free time and money is no object then by all means go for it. But for your very first tablet......I would highly advise against it. Most artists work their way up, from Bamboo/Tablet PC to Intuos and then to Cintiq. Much like how if someones's taking Swiming lessons, they start in the shallow end, not the deep end. The Cintiq 24 HD....IS THE DEEPEST END.

    Not all artists like using tablets, the medium transference from Analog to Digital is sometimes....not whats expected. Most of the used Cintiqs you find on Ebay are buyers who found their either didn't care for the experience, or didn't really use it enough to justify the price and space it takes up.

    I would recommend you start out with an Intuos4 Medium first, or if you really need to on-screen approach, you can pick up some decent tablet PCs under the $500 range on ebay.

    But if you want to take the plunge...."art pen, thick screen, light output"

    This is your First Tablet........Those issue won't matter to you at all.

    and it would be very unlikely for Wacom to release a new Cintiq 24 update anytime soon. If anything, since the thing is eternally out of stock...If you order it now, it may very well take 3-6 months to get it.

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    Apparently the Art Pen problem with the 24 HD is not universal. I know one person in the US who bought one early on and his works perfectly with the Art Pen.
    I am not saying there aren't problems or that it works with all or most, just saying that I know of one that does work just fine.

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    a working art pen is news to me. the eur wacom site had several testers verify it wasnt working. must be those dang Europeans =P

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    Quote Originally Posted by darkmagistric View Post
    Much like how if someones's taking Swiming lessons, they start in the shallow end, not the deep end. The Cintiq 24 HD....IS THE DEEPEST END.
    When you're taking swimming lessons, you are trying to learn the skill of swimming. I'm not trying to learn how to draw, and I have a fairly strong understanding of painting in photoshop already, I did it for years with a mouse, I hate the mouse!

    I draw all the time, everyday. If my scanner wasn't possessed, my sketchbook would be a LOT bigger (another reason I want a tablet, draw in PS, no scanning!). I will not be wasting this product, whether I make profit off my art or I use it for personal use.

    So.. I just feel like I'm ripping myself off by not getting myself the best. It would be like getting an older version of photoshop (almost).

    PLUS I will be finishing my school with game design, graphic design, illustration, or some form of digital media. I have a feeling I'd use the 24HD in my studies, and have a huge edge.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Kangum View Post
    a working art pen is news to me. the eur wacom site had several testers verify it wasnt working. must be those dang Europeans =P
    I am the author of the http://managingcolors.blogspot.com/ blog. I am talking in this days directly with the Technical Support Supervisor. I know for sure that Wacom knows that the ArtPen has problems. This problems are diffused and are not related to a particular Cintiq 24HD or a particular ArtPen. The problems are related to all the Cintiq 24HD and ArtPens (working together). Otherwise Wacom would have replaced all the defective units!
    Please notice that I own one Cintiq 24HD in Roma, Italy and the other one in Miami. I had experiences with both customer supports, and I know for sure that in Europe there are no real technicians, just people that report problem to the USA.

    I really hope that this problem is driver related, but I suspect that is not (I have tested different drivers, also the 6.20 that now have been removed for reasons that I don’t know, both on Mac and Windows 7).

    Quote Originally Posted by ClaudiaP View Post
    Apparently the Art Pen problem with the 24 HD is not universal. I know one person in the US who bought one early on and his works perfectly with the Art Pen.
    I am not saying there aren't problems or that it works with all or most, just saying that I know of one that does work just fine.
    This is the first person that I know that reports that the ArtPen is working fine. I have tested 3 Cintiq 24HD and none of them was working correctly. I have also tested 3 different ArtPens. Can you please send me a PM with the email of the person that has a Cintiq 24HD working with the ArtPen?

    I had reports from more than 10 Cintiq 24HD users that own the ArtPen and all of them are experiencing the same problem.

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    I am not trying to say (as I said clearly in my original post) that there is not a problem or that anyone is wrong. All I was saying was that I know of one that works just fine.
    I am not going to name the person here without his permission but I will ask him if he will come to this forum and let you know I'm not crazy.

    My point was that if one works there are probably more out there that work too.

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    Maybe you don't understand how important is for me and other users to know if there are working Cintiq 24HD out there. All users that asked for information were told that Wacom is working on a solution and that all the units have the same problem. This is why we don't get a new Cintiq 24HD or a replacement unit. Otherwise Wacom should send us a working unit.

    I have confirmation from different people in Wacom that this problem is not related to specific defective units, but is common to all Cintiq 24HD.

    If a single user is reporting that he/she has no problems with the Cintiq 24HD and the ArtPen this means that other units are defective and need to be changed. At the moment there are 12 people that asked me to give them email updates on this topic.

    I have tested the Cintiq 24HD on almost 10 different computer configurations and never find a working one. I can understand that you don't want to give personal information without asking, but I am sure that the person that we are talking about will early understand how important is for me and other users this news that you gave us.

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    I do understand how important this is that is why I posted what I did, but I cannot give out someone's email without their permission. I can tell you that this man is a student at Tim Shelbourne's The Artist's Quarter, http://www.theartistsquarter.com .

    We have discussed this in class because Tim has a 21 UX with the Art Pen problem that he purchased from the man with the working 24HD. Oddly enough the very same art pen that works with the 24 HD worked with the exact same 21 UX that will not work with another art pen now.

    I have emailed Tim and asked him to please contact Mike and to please post to this forum. I wouldn't expect any response before tomorrow though because he is in England. The working 24 HD is in Brooklyn NY.

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    Actually I have had the ArtPen since it first came out in 2009 for the Intuos 4, and it has intermittent problems.
    I have had a cursor flip problem and stray lines and Wacom insists I must me imagining it or insane.
    As Sheldon Cooper would say "I am not insane, my Mother had me tested."

    ~John

    John Garrett
    Illustrator-in-training
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    For everyone else, I did contact Mike and he gave permission to give VitOne his email which I did via private message.

    I am having another thought on this, Mike had the art pen that worked with the 21 UX that he sold to Tim. Mike's 24HD works fine with the same art pen he used with the 21 UX. Tim's art pen does NOT work with the 21 UX that he got from Mike.

    Maybe Mike does not have a rare 24 HD, maybe instead he has a rare art pen.
    I wonder if the problem lies in the art pens rather than the Cintiq?

    That said I'm salivating at the thought of having a Cintiq,
    Alas none are to be found and I still haven't figured out how in the world I'll fit one in my small workspace. The 12 WX would be perfect sizewise, but I use the art pen almost exclusively and I don't want to step backwards from Intuos 4 technology. At this point I think I would be looking at the second generation 21 UX rather than the 24 HD because of the size.

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    Thanks ClaudiaP, I have sent an email to Mr Cetta.

    Notice that I have personally tested, as I wrote, 3 different Cintiq 24HD and 3 different ArtPen, 1 in the USA and 2 in Europe (replacement units from Wacom eStore). None of them was working.

    The thing to notice is that if one Cintiq 24HD and ArtPen is working this means that all the non-working units can be replaced with working ones. If none of the Cintiq 24HD/ArtPen are working correctly than we have to wait for a fix from Wacom (it may be new hardware of software).

    Wacom told me (and other users) that this problem is not related to specific units (ArtPens or Cintiq 24HD) and this is why we are not getting a replacement, we have just to wait for the problem to be fixed and then we will be told about what we should do.

    This is why I really hope that Mr Cetta has a working Cintiq 24HD/ArtPen!

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    So I was again, hesitant to order the 24hd.. Until last night, when I tried to color a sketch in PS using my mouse... Below is how far I got in about. an hour. I immediately said, screw this, I'm getting the tablet, there is no way I will ever color with a mouse again (when I first learned PS I colored with a mouse for YEARS.. unfortunately a computer virus wiped everything I've done in the last 8 years)


    If anyone has any FREE lessons on light source/color, that is what I'd love to dive into with my free time over the holidays.. I stress free, because the rest of my money is going towards Christmas gifts.

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    Claudia: Do you know what model ArtPen the one that worked on the 21UX was?

    I ask because I have a 2nd gen 21UX. I bought an ArtPen a little while back and it works fine. I can't remember all the specifics now, but before I ordered it I do remember reading that I had to make sure I got a specific model. I checked the box it came in just now and I have the KP701E2. I think there is a KP701E01, or something like that, that doesn't work with the 2nd gen 21UX. But don't go by that as solid, because this was a few months ago. I don't have the links anymore to where I read that. When I have time I'll try to find the information again and post it if I have any luck.

    Billakong:
    Just a couple thoughts you might want to consider on the 24 vs the 21, and I realize these may or may no be issues for you.
    I got my 21 back in May, and when the 24 was announced I looked into it thinking I was going to have buyer's remorse. I can happily say that hasn't been the case at all. For starters, when the 21UX is paired with an Ergotron arm, it's about as close to a natural drawing environment as I can imagine. I don't like rotating the canvas on screen as things seem to be displayed slightly differently (especially straight lines). But I LOVE being able to physically turn the tablet. I turn my paper/sketchbook/whatever a lot and being able to rotate the Cintiq that way is just more intuitive.

    Also, I work with two monitors. On the Cintiq I typically zoom in a lot, but on the regular monitor I keep a zoomed out view so that I can see the overall composition at a glance. For me, the ideal set up is for the regular monitor to be just above and behind the Cintiq. So I move my Cintiq around a LOT. Even with the stock Wacom stand, moving the 21 was a chore because of the weight. Sure, you can tilt it, but any side to side repositioning was really a pain. At +63 lbs, the 24 would be next to impossible to slide around.

    I have heard that the display on the 24 is better, so that's a fair point to consider. But so far I haven't been disappointed with the results I have gotten with the 21UX, and I've been quite satisfied with my printed results. If it matters, I use a Spyder calibration device and a Canon printer. Now, take all that with a grain of salt because while I am pretty comfortable with traditional media, I am still learning the digital side of art.

    For availability of either model you might want to check with Dury's of Nashville, www.durys.com That's where I got my Cintiq. The folks there were incredibly polite and helpful. They have been in business for over 100 years, so it's not some fly by night operation. They just aren't as well known because it's a local business and they are primarily a photography shop.

    What sort of lessons are you looking for? If is digital, www.ctrlpaint.com has some pretty great videos on all sorts of topics.

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  24. #20
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    http://www.itchy-animation.co.uk/tutorials/light03.htm
    Tis good!
    I have no experience with cintiqs, but i recently changed from an intuos4 to a tablet pc, and its alot better drawing on screen. Specifically for actually drawing, like sketching or outlineing, because painting large scale isnt really a challenge on an intuos.

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  25. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by InuyashaIncarnate View Post
    http://www.itchy-animation.co.uk/tutorials/light03.htm
    Tis good!
    I have no experience with cintiqs, but i recently changed from an intuos4 to a tablet pc, and its alot better drawing on screen. Specifically for actually drawing, like sketching or outlineing, because painting large scale isnt really a challenge on an intuos.

    If you don't mind me asking, what Tablet PC model did you switch to? And have you had any trouble adjusting to the difference in pressure between the Intuos 4 and the Tablet PC?

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