Spartan Camp #192 - 50 gestures + Optional "Master Anatomy Study" - Page 2
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  1. #31
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    starto Input for gestures? Well now that I've looked at the darker images you posted, I can definitly see your action line, but your shapes seem a bit off. I don''t know how often you look at the image, but extra observation and practice should get you improving with gestures with leaps and bounds. Just don't concentrate on the paper so much, like for a 30 second gesture, look at your paper maybe 5 times at 1 second a piece to know where your pen is, then look at the image the other 25 seconds, it should really help solidify you shapes in space. Alternatively you could try a contour drawing (I believe it's called) exercise, where you just look at the object/subject, and never look at the paper when you draw, and see what comes out. Personally for gestures I get the action line, then the main torso masses (ribcage and hips), and then add lines and main masses for the limbs and head. I'll post some pictures that I like below (I didn't do either of them), and you can see how some people do gestures, the action line is kind of lost in all the details/fill to see, but the action line often turns into a spine or center line for the torso and gets lost that way (since the trunk is important in balance).

    So just remember to look at the subject a lot, and to keep proportions and shapes in check even though it's a gesture drawing, keep things loose but don't break reality (for gestures at least, you can always try playing with proportions in studies for fun, like with characitures).

    I don't know if that was the kind of input you wanted, I might've just rambled on, but it's too early in the morning to tell.

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    The Law of Fives states simply that: All things happen in fives, or are divisible by or are multiples of five, or are somehow directly or indirectly appropriate to 5
    The Law of Fives is never wrong.

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KKatrdKvBkc

    Sketchbook : http://www.conceptart.org/forums/sho...d.php?t=196859
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  3. #32
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    You're awesome, you know that right? Thank you so much for going out of your way to help me out. =)

    You're right that I spend too much time looking at the paper instead of the subject, filling in what I think is right instead of what I should be observing. I try to follow Hogarth's hierarchy of important elements of the human figure (Torso->Pelvis->Legs->Arms->Head) I've done a few blind contours, but not any lately. I'll do another one tonight first thing. As for your other points, I'll do my best to apply them. Thank you once again. =)

    Edit: Oh, in your examples it's pretty clear how I should be applying blind contour to gestures. That was another thing I wasn't able to figure out on my own. Thank you.

    Last edited by Strato; August 10th, 2011 at 01:06 PM.
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  4. #33
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    samming, Strato: I actually try to look less at the reference while drawing (but it's strange as well) because I usually looked at the reference too much and my eye see but my brain doesn't work and I got nice results without learning nearly anything. I value what I can do without a reference.
    Maybe I wrote before but I think the best when I draw a figure two times at least, once looking at the reference, then "by myself", relying on my memory.

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  5. #34
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    Well, this round blew my mind... Everyone did an amazing job. The progress is inspiring, as is the critique going on.

    Here's some things and thoughts.

    ShiNIN; I was working on a Bouguereau last week but didn't finish. Should pop up in my sketchbook at some point. Doing great on those heads. You know the Loomis books are now freely available for download, right? I like how you're rotating those heads, now try rotating them on a vertical axis too! Sometimes it's just that little challenge and the ability to pull it off successfully that can get you going. You're doing good on exploring different ways to draw figures. Go with what feels best, perhaps?

    BlackDelphin; Although this may be Da Vinci, I think you picked a tough piece of reference. The muscles are somewhat exaggerated for study purposes and I'm having some trouble discerning them. You won't see this on 'regular' people, and in that sense your other figures are more accurate. I can clearly see some big muscle groups that are almost always apparent, Trapezius, Latissimus dorsi, some of the External Oblique.
    Good job on the digital experiments. Digital will grow on you but it takes some trial and error!

    zy.; You've picked up some elegance in your drawing that's resurfacing in the last image (no ref) you posted. You don't just move the line along the shape of a leg carelessly, but you 'weigh' the pencil along the way, capturing the small irregularities of the human shape. In some cases like the far left and right figures, a stiff arm or pose studdenly reappears and the feeling is lost.
    Which is why drawing from imagination is good practising too!

    0xym0ron; If "too large?" refered to your image, I'd say no. This way we can see your images, and this place is (usually, haha) not that crowded either way. Doing very nice on those gestures. I like how dynamic they are and how this method allows you to pull off some of the tougher poses. Should add some of your own though! Or some refined ones. That way what you've learned will really sink into your mind. Perhaps I've said that before. Also, watch those feet when it comes to balance!

    Guardian G.I.; Exactly.. he probably did. And I believe that's a comforting thought. Most people attained the level they are at trough lots of practice, and the same principle should apply to us. Your approach is good. By trying some different methods and focusing on different aspects, you can grasp different elements of figure drawing. Proportion, flow, balance, anatomy, etc. Lordlouis has some good comments on the use of photographic reference. Additionally, drawing from life is great too. You pick up diffent things everywhere. For now; heads are on the small side. Sometimes it's good to check proportions on small intervals trough drawing.

    logistic puppet; Good question, should have answered earlier. Some of the others have gotten the idea across though. Basically, by copying is just that; copying. No active involvement in the process, no knowledge gained. When studying, you do not necessarily imitate every single line precisely, but rather imitate or emulate the artists method, process, style, or anything else. You try to understand his work and 'draw along'. Perhaps the difference is in the intention.

    This is getting somewhat late.. I'll get back to the rest of you tomorrow!


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  7. #35
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    Slightly off-topic but I have to say;

    This thread nearly made me cry.

    I've done so little drawing since high school, and I've always just drawn dragons, knights and anything else that has obscure anatomy or is covered up in some way.

    When my girlfriend asks me to draw her naked, I say no, not because I'm afraid I'll screw up, but because I *know* I will and am afraid of getting eye to eye with what I already know: I draw like sh*t.

    So yeh, this thread has made me reconsider. I'll start at the beginning this time. Take it back to the core. Strip it all down and start by getting the first step right.

    Cheers guys, glad I joined these forums yesterday.

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  9. #36
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    Jeez. Spartan Camp #192 kicked ass. =P

    Hope to see you in 193 ;D

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  10. #37
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    Quote Originally Posted by Strato View Post
    Jeez. Spartan Camp #192 kicked ass. =P
    Yeah, mine, lol

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  11. #38
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    AboutaDirk: Welcome here! You better come and draw gestures this week...
    I totally understand you but if you can't draw, you have even more reason to practice
    And you should appreciate your girlfriend's offer, because
    1. not everyone has a real life model
    2. real life drawing is the best. Even compared with very high quality and resolution photos, 3d gives more information

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  13. #39
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    Here's some more. Yes, this has been an astonishing round. On to the next one!

    Strato; I assume you mean Marshall Vandruff's stream here on CA? I recognize the advice. You got some good points on the anatomy there already. Nice to include the reference and your thoughts on it. I'll add mine. The "weird" and "wrong" side seems intended and certainly adds to the mood. There's some artistic freedom, the anatomy is great. The gestures are uncomfortable, showing how they fight for their lives writhing in pain. You don't see much of the face; all of the expression is coming from the body. I'm not sure about the size of the original. Sometimes it helps to draw bigger if you want to cover the whole body, as you're including so many muscles. Samming got some great advice on the lifedrawing. Unless you're going for a long figure pose, elaborate construction may not always be required. Go with free, organic drawing and try to capture what you see.
    LordLouis; These are absolutely great studies. You're covering the arms and legs in just about every way possible. I recognize the mirror drawings, I use that a lot. I think especially those wrists are really improving troughout. There's some good advice in your notes too, like about the muscle groups (applies to forearms really well). Keep adding those drawigns from imagination (they're good!) and show the feet some love! Wonderful work!
    samming; Recognized the Bouguereau! They have great poses, think you did a good job at capturing those. Those value drawings are really working for you, it's clear you're drawing with round forms n mind. Proportions and placement occasionally get lost, perhaps when you start rendering too early? Nice advice in your last post, very helpful.
    aprat; Hah, I see what you mean there. I like that you're not using too many lines. It may be tempting to outline lips and noses and such, but lines are not required if you are simply picking the right value and color to distinguish shapes. The far right one is very effective, good expression too. Especially considering she's pouting. I'd like to advice you on how to blend colours more effectively, but I'm afraid I'm at a loss myself on that point.


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  15. #40
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    Original size is as tall as an A4, so I felt a little cramped. I normally like to work on A2 paper, but it's too big for my scanner. A4 is...surprisingly tight feeling once you move up paper sizes. I probably shrunk it a little too much for fear of posting something too big. If it matters, I can post a bigger version.

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