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    Egotistical peers or coworkers

    I had a problem with certain peers at my school since I found their ideologies very disagreeable. I wanted to know some of your opinions about arrogant artists with elitist attitudes.

    A peer of mine believed he was the best of the school. The professors showered him with opportunities because he won some reputable art awards that would enhance the school's reputation. Plus, he was hired as an artist by a very, VERY well-known company during the year through some diligence and a lot of smooching. Alot of students and professors praised him, yet, he had made quite a number of enemies. The peer's belief was the dissatisfied classmates would not make it to the industry anyway, so he didn't care who's toes he stepped on. He was going to be more careful at work. He believed if classmates didn't get hired after school, they were failures.

    Anyone have any irritating experiences with artists who think their hot stuff when they were not great, in your opinion? Do conceited artists with phony personalities go very far in the industry?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Judith_Artemisia View Post
    A peer of mine believed he was the best of the school.
    ...Was he? As in, was he the best artist/whatever in the school? I mean, you talk how he had a bad personality but from your description it does sound that his belief was not completely wrong, so...

    Quote Originally Posted by Judith_Artemisia View Post
    Do conceited artists with phony personalities go very far in the industry?
    That probably depends more on their work quality and how well and professionally they do their work and whether their personality affects that.
    If you're completely unable to work civilly with others and do what you're told, then yeah the word does get around the industry (at least in the game industry in here since it's very team-oriented) but it depends on what you do and where.

    Then again I'd say that some real life work experience is probably the best cure for overblown ego.

    Last edited by TinyBird; May 30th, 2011 at 06:01 AM.
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    I can't speak to arrogant peers as I never went to art school, but there is a difference between being an artist and succeeding as an artist, and it has less to do with talent than any of us would like.

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    Heh. The most obnoxious guy from my graduating class later applied for a job where I worked. I had the supreme pleasure of taking my boss aside...

    I was once on the receiving end of a critique so savagely nasty, I marched straight out of class to the office and changed my major (sketchbook).
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    Someone once said along the lines, "When climbing up the tallest mountain, you pass the same people going up as you come down."

    Maybe that guy is all that and a bag chips and is good as he says he is. We all make mistakes. While rushing to the top we can slip and sometimes the only people who can help is the people we just passed by. If your friend disrespect others or take them for granted, help will seldom come when they really need it.

    I would just take it with grain of salt. Its not like they are stopping you from doing what you do. I'm sure you can still learn things from the person's success.

    Last edited by Pigeonkill; May 30th, 2011 at 06:48 PM.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Judith_Artemisia View Post
    A peer of mine believed he was the best of the school. The professors showered him with opportunities because he won some reputable art awards that would enhance the school's reputation. Plus, he was hired as an artist by a very, VERY well-known company during the year through some diligence and a lot of smooching. Alot of students and professors praised him, yet, he had made quite a number of enemies. The peer's belief was the dissatisfied classmates would not make it to the industry anyway, so he didn't care who's toes he stepped on. He was going to be more careful at work. He believed if classmates didn't get hired after school, they were failures.
    Er...you sure you that isn't all in your head? Cause it sounds like it is.

    The person's clearly succeeding, gained some respect, but then suddenly they've made enemies (I assume just you) and they're stepping on other people (HOW, exactly? By making a name for himself at this stage?). Is this just envy talking?

    How does he have an ego? How are they conceited? Have you even spoken with this person?

    Last edited by Psychotime; May 30th, 2011 at 02:32 PM.
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    Thanks for the replies.

    As for the questions
    Quote Originally Posted by TinyBird View Post
    ...Was he? As in, was he the best artist/whatever in the school? I mean, you talk how he had a bad personality but from your description it does sound that his belief was not completely wrong, so...
    In my year, he was the best of the class , but I had friends who were humble graduates and great artists during their years. They didn't step on or glower at others since it wasn't in their personalities to do so.

    Quote Originally Posted by Psychotime View Post
    Er...you sure you that isn't all in your head? Cause it sounds like it is.

    The person's clearly succeeding, gained some respect, but then suddenly they've made enemies (I assume just you) and they're stepping on other people (HOW, exactly? By making a name for himself at this stage?). Is this just envy talking?

    How does he have an ego? How are they conceited? Have you even spoken with this person?
    No it's not in my head. Maybe I didn't come across as clear since I only provided a summary. The first impression he made towards many people wasn't the best. Actually students who took classes with him, felt a lot of animosity towards him, while others tried to get some points. It was all phony, such as "if it wasn't for my classmates, I wouldn't have improved this far." He barely knew half of the class.
    Another example, what if he chatted with a student, looked at the student's portfolio, saw his skill wasn't up to par and completely ignored him after that? It happened at certain art cons.
    I'm acquainted with the person, but his ideologies was so disagreeable and ridiculous when working with him in a group. He demanded a lot of things to get pointers from the professors.

    My belief was being supportive of artists who treat people with respect. It's difficult for me to be happy for people, such as him in general. Is that what you call envy?

    Is there egotistical people who sours the workplace? Clash heads with others?

    Last edited by Judith_Artemisia; May 31st, 2011 at 02:29 AM.
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    A little ego can be very healthy for an artist.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Judith_Artemisia View Post
    The first impression he made towards many people wasn't the best. Actually students who took classes with him, felt a lot of animosity towards him, while others tried to get some points.
    Animosity, why? Points, how?

    Quote Originally Posted by Judith_Artemisia View Post
    It was all phony, such as "if it wasn't for my classmates, I wouldn't have improved this far."
    What's wrong with saying that?

    Quote Originally Posted by Judith_Artemisia View Post
    He barely knew half of the class.
    So? I've been a SCAD student for 2 years and I can't even remember the names of ANY of my actual classmates, even the awesome ones, which there are many! I can't even say I know anyone in my actual major after all this time! And it's not just classmates, I can't even remember the names to my professors when I should! Earlier today I had to look up what my current teacher's name was! And I'm in my final week of this semester!

    ...Huh. Maybe I have a problem.

    Quote Originally Posted by Judith_Artemisia View Post
    Another example, what if he chatted with a student, looked at the student's portfolio, saw his skill wasn't up to par and completely ignored him after that? It happened at certain art cons.
    Er...I don't know what to say to that.

    Quote Originally Posted by Judith_Artemisia View Post
    I'm acquainted with the person, but his ideologies was so disagreeable and ridiculous when working with him in a group. He demanded a lot of things to get pointers from the professors.
    What were his ideologies? You haven't said what they are.

    And getting pointers from professors is a bad thing?

    Quote Originally Posted by Judith_Artemisia View Post
    My belief was being supportive of artists who treat people with respect. It's difficult for me to be happy for people, such as him in general. Is that what you call envy?
    How was he unsupportive? How was he disrespectful?

    Last edited by Psychotime; May 30th, 2011 at 04:22 PM.
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    So he's proactive with get up and go and you're not.


    I didn't think it was possible to be called an artist when you have nothing to say. It's like being a writer who publishes individual words as books and expects to be praised for it.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Psychotime View Post
    Animosity, why? Points, how?

    What's wrong with saying that?
    I made this topic to see if anyone had issues with people who were conceited or how they dealt with them?
    Not to be nitpicked about my story.

    Animosity due to his disrespect students who were not up to the par but were trying. Refer to the example. You wouldn't want people looking at your work and saying "this sucks?" in a condescending tone in front of a group. You are a stranger, so I wouldn't know. Points as in sucking up when they usually don't do that to other people. They wouldn't give him free rides without some kind of compensation.

    It's phony that's why it's wrong because it contradicts to what he does and says outside of class. Talks badly about students' work.

    His idealogy, if a student didn't graduate with a job, they were failures. So is that true? Students suck because they didn't work hard enough. He didn't give a chance to students who were barely making it, but trying. etc etc.

    I am enrolled in a university where the art program's instruction was insufficient. Professors worked in the industry 10-20 years ago, believed they knew everything. We only had 2 paint courses. We barely touched photoshop.

    I mean I can go on and on about the guy and another person in the class or the professors, but that would get dull. The point of the thread was to see if anyone had any experiences with people like them or how they dealt with them.

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    I've known some peers--artists or otherwise--who have been jerky by directly comparing my artwork with someone else's (they were at a higher level with their art than I was, but that artists was helpful and kind with me, and encouraging).

    That's as close as I got to knowing someone with a heavy ego personally. Sounds like the fellow you're talking about is networking and is confident about it. I have pals who have gone that route--making a sort of bond with people who could get them closer to where they want to be. Personalities differ, I suppose, but that path doesn't seem to be a problem.

    Anyway, it also sounds like that person rubbed you the wrong way more recently, whether directly or not. I won't imply anything, but I'll advise you not to get wrapped up into his life and how he goes about things. It'll make you feel worse, believe me. I did that, and I had a chip on my shoulder about some artist I didn't know, who came off conceited. But I didn't KNOW the person, didn't get to know them, either. All I did was set myself back.

    Even if you don't wish for that advice, that's something I learned for dealing with artists and anyone else who might get on my nerves. No good dwelling, just do YOUR thing, and do your best at it so you can succeed as YOU need to.

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    Unless you're forced to be on a project with this person, in which case you'd better learn to work with or around him, he is Not Your Problem. I'm not sure why you're going out of your way to make him your problem. You control yourself and your actions. He controls his. You can't make him be the person you want him to be so it's either time to up your game or get over it.

    Really the only kind of people I hate (apart from the terminally stupid irrational ones) are the ones that interfere with your own projects. I hate fixing other people's fuck-ups.

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    The problem is the examples you give are life as an artist outside of school. As an art director or lead if you hand me something I don't like I'll tell you it sucks in front of the team. Don't like it? Too bad. Its not my job to make you feel good about what I think is crap. As long as I am talking about the work and not you personally there shouldn't be a problem.

    What everyone is trying to say is it sounds like you and your classmates have the problem. It is not the responsibilty of someone who is more successful to make someone feel good about their mediocre attempts at things, sorry.

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    Thanks for the replies!

    He's not really a problem, the least of my worries since I won't see him again. I wanted to know what gave certain students the right to belittle others whether they're good or not in terms of skill. If they kept it to themselves, it would've been a different story. He's not an art director and a project was not on the line. It's a school with limited teaching, students were barely scraping off of what they know.

    To tell you the truth, I worked hard, and still am. I treated people fairly, so I get really steamed when people mistreat friends unfairly over petty reasons.

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    If you're going to be anywhere with other people, you will meet egotistical people. You will meet people that are condescending jerks who think they are better than you. Some people are just like that. There are always going to be people you don't like, and people that don't like you.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Judith_Artemisia View Post
    I wanted to know what gave certain students the right to belittle others whether they're good or not in terms of skill. If they kept it to themselves, it would've been a different story. He's not an art director and a project was not on the line. It's a school with limited teaching, students were barely scraping off of what they know.
    Telling lazy people they're lazy is hardly belittling them.
    In my classroom we also get people who I like to call "tourists". People with a lot of money, no common sense who want to be "arteests". I laugh in their faces every chance I get. With the shit I'm creating my chances are astronomically low, and these shit for brains think they can make it.

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    Maybe they'll be less fail eventually with my gentle nudging.
    If anything, it's an act of kindness.
    Anger is a great motivator.


    edit: on the other hand, if they need help and genuinely want to learn, I'll explain every detail to the best of my ability ofcourse.

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    We are who we are, do you really think he would be a lot different if he wasnt as good as he is? No..

    -We are what we repeatedly do. Excellence then, is not an act, but a habit.

    -Some are born great, some achieve greatness, and some have greatness thrust upon 'em.

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    Not really lazy, more like they are unmotivated and/or have health issues from stress, but I digress.
    And here I thought artists with humble and nice personalities went far, but only for certain studios. I guess it depends on the circumstances and luck.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Judith_Artemisia View Post
    Not really lazy, more like they are unmotivated and/or have health issues from stress, but I digress.
    And here I thought artists with humble and nice personalities went far, but only for certain studios. I guess it depends on the circumstances and luck.

    Not really, it's mostly the people who are good at sucking anus of influential people and working hard that get the furthest.
    The way he treats people who don't matter to him and have zero influence on his future will never matter.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Judith_Artemisia View Post
    Animosity due to his disrespect students who were not up to the par but were trying. Refer to the example. You wouldn't want people looking at your work and saying "this sucks?" in a condescending tone in front of a group.
    You NEVER said that until just now!

    Quote Originally Posted by Judith_Artemisia View Post
    Points as in sucking up when they usually don't do that to other people. They wouldn't give him free rides without some kind of compensation.
    Sucking up, yeah, I expected that. What's the rest mean? Do I even want to know?

    Quote Originally Posted by Judith_Artemisia View Post
    It's phony that's why it's wrong because it contradicts to what he does and says outside of class. Talks badly about students' work.
    You never said he did that until just now.

    Quote Originally Posted by Judith_Artemisia View Post
    His idealogy, if a student didn't graduate with a job, they were failures. So is that true? Students suck because they didn't work hard enough. He didn't give a chance to students who were barely making it, but trying. etc etc.
    Did he actually say that? Who is he to give anyone a "chance" in the first place?

    But yeah, I'd agree with the "students suck when they don't work hard enough" part.

    You know, I've never met a good artist that didn't appear humble, at least in public.

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    Hrm. Seems to be some angry art vibes going down in this thread. Of course some people are utter dicks about their art, people are dicks about everything. But at the end of the day, no matter how many privileges said person has, no matter how much they suck up, and put everyone else down, it won't help them. Your art is either good enough to get you the job, or it's not, and no amount of "I love that tie" is going to get them past that.

    However, while I disapprove of ridiculous egos, I do approve of being motivated, and actually being proud of your art. Various professionals here have made the point that if you talk shit about your art, or say you don't like a certain piece, or that it's wrong, then why should people hire you? If the artist doesn't think they're good enough, then why should the client?

    And lastly, it doesn't matter what happens to them, whether they fail or become the best. Keep your eye on your own work, and focus on making it better.


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    Some people who are just good or focused or just whiling to go an extra mile doing their own thing get alienated and have shit trown at them by their peers, it happens often in school enviorements so i`m hessitant as to really what should i take from the thread.

    Usually some extra ego is a self defense made up against this very same sort of pushing aside.

    I think in any given case is best to just keep focus on your own stuff and do your own thing, others succes doesnt equal your failure, everyone tries to get by the best they can.

    And some assholes make up great coworkers, maybe you would like to piss on them if you ever met them on a social occasion but have their shit together brillianlty on the job.

    Last edited by JDSart; May 30th, 2011 at 07:40 PM.
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    Thanks for the comfort people.
    I agree it would be difficult to understand my situation unless you were experiencing it too.
    Quote Originally Posted by Psychotime View Post
    You NEVER said that until just now!Did he actually say that? Who is he to give anyone a "chance" in the first place?

    But yeah, I'd agree with the "students suck when they don't work hard enough" part.

    You know, I've never met a good artist that didn't appear humble, at least in public.
    Yea my apologies for not being too clear in the first post. I didn't want to remember a lot of moments, so summarized everything. Thinking of him, made me think of school, and then those horrible professors *shudder.* My alumni friends were the nicest people and worked at well-known studios, so it boggled my mind that some jerk received an opportunity too. I'm usually happy for people who get industry jobs, but not this person.

    Anyways, a story artist from an esteemed studio said being nice is the key. It would get people far. He would rather work with an artist who was nice rather than a douche who was a better artist. I took those words to heart, so that's why I'm asking people in the end if he was right.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Judith_Artemisia View Post
    I had a problem with certain peers at my school since I found their ideologies very disagreeable. I wanted to know some of your opinions about arrogant artists with elitist attitudes.

    A peer of mine believed he was the best of the school. The professors showered him with opportunities because he won some reputable art awards that would enhance the school's reputation. Plus, he was hired as an artist by a very, VERY well-known company during the year through some diligence and a lot of smooching. Alot of students and professors praised him, yet, he had made quite a number of enemies. The peer's belief was the dissatisfied classmates would not make it to the industry anyway, so he didn't care who's toes he stepped on. He was going to be more careful at work. He believed if classmates didn't get hired after school, they were failures.

    Anyone have any irritating experiences with artists who think their hot stuff when they were not great, in your opinion? Do conceited artists with phony personalities go very far in the industry?
    In life in general, a bigger key to success is 'who you know' rather then 'what you know'. A nice personality opens the doors to "who you know".

    Also, there are a lot of people out there with artistic talent who don't have a lot of emotional (and general) maturity. This is not all that unique to art circles, same thing happens wherever there are people.

    While a crabby and crappy personality talent can on occasion achieve stuff, generally, it's a hinderance... in many facets of life, not just a career.

    Quote Originally Posted by Judith_Artemisia View Post
    Thanks for the replies!

    He's not really a problem, the least of my worries since I won't see him again. I wanted to know what gave certain students the right to belittle others whether they're good or not in terms of skill.
    Most things people do, they don't do it because they have a 'right to do it', they just do things.... and often get away with doing not so nice things to one another.

    In a large number of cases, we really can't do much but to move on. If we don't like how a certain person behaves, the best thing we can do is mind our own business. If that gets you steamed... you;re going to spend most of your life steamed, because things like this happen everywhere.

    Yes, it can be irritation to be around someone like that. The best thing we can do for ourselves in those situations is to learn coping skills to ignore them (as oppsoed to confronting them or picking a fight with them). Learn personal boundaries, and how far our influence will reach, and how not to push it so rar that it creates more conflict.

    When we are in a position of some authority (like being a boss at work, or a teacher etc... we may be able to do a little bit to keep that kind of a person in check, but even then it can be limited, if we want that person to stay on board. Yes, destructive personalities can be a royal PITA to deal with.

    Quote Originally Posted by Judith_Artemisia View Post
    Anyways, a story artist from an esteemed studio said being nice is the key. It would get people far. He would rather work with an artist who was nice rather than a douche who was a better artist. I took those words to heart, so that's why I'm asking people in the end if he was right.
    Think of it this way...
    No matter how good someone is, someone else will come along that is just as good (even among the very top people).

    If the main difference between those two comparable talents and skills is one having a nice easy to work personaloity, vs. someone not so nice and hard to work with... guess who will be hired for a job????

    Yes, when working, things other then just raw skills and talent matter. Often a PITA coworker can hinder overall project sufficiently that their little bit of extra talent can't make up fot the extra work and tension and stress their wonky personality can create.

    Last edited by Conniekat8; May 30th, 2011 at 10:01 PM.
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    It's a good thing that success is based on niceness and fluffiness then.

    Yay!


    Nobody tell Michaelangelo, Caravaggio, Bernini that though, because they were kinda dicks. Ssshh.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Flake View Post
    It's a good thing that success is based on niceness and fluffiness then.

    Yay!
    Nobody tell Michaelangelo, Caravaggio, Bernini that though, because they were kinda dicks. Ssshh.
    Well, when you get into savant territory, most of their extreme development came at the expence of other personality facets... By nature and by learning.

    I doubt that the guy the OP is talking about is of Michelangelo caliber.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Judith_Artemisia View Post
    Anyways, a story artist from an esteemed studio said being nice is the key. It would get people far. He would rather work with an artist who was nice rather than a douche who was a better artist. I took those words to heart, so that's why I'm asking people in the end if he was right.

    Almost everybody has a list of people they would love to work with again. Co-workers who were easy to get along with and hard working. We can't always pick who we work with, but certainly offer a good recommendation if something comes up. Trouble makers and prima donnas tends to go on the bottom of that list.

    When you leave a studio and the job is done, you want people to say good things about you. Call it artistic karma...or whatever...Stoat's post made me laugh.

    Last edited by Pigeonkill; May 30th, 2011 at 11:03 PM.
    Make a sketchbook happy, feed it a tip to improve!

    http://conceptart.org/forums/showthread.php?t=85628
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    Quote Originally Posted by Flake View Post
    It's a good thing that success is based on niceness and fluffiness then.

    Yay!


    Nobody tell Michaelangelo, Caravaggio, Bernini that though, because they were kinda dicks. Ssshh.
    Didn't Michelangelo go around the Medici house and critique people when he was done with his drawings...and basically saying that his were better?

    BLAHBLAHBLAH
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    dpaint is offline Registered User Level 16 Gladiator: Spartacus' Retiarii
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    Quote Originally Posted by Conniekat8 View Post
    In life in general, a bigger key to success is 'who you know' rather then 'what you know'. A nice personality opens the doors to "who you know".

    Yes, when working, things other then just raw skills and talent matter. Often a PITA coworker can hinder overall project sufficiently that their little bit of extra talent can't make up fot the extra work and tension and stress their wonky personality can create.
    The mantra of mediocrity "I'm nice and can barely do my job, hire me." The problem is untalented mediocre people are just as bitchy and in my experience even more the prima donnas. Give me a talented asshole who knuckles down and works and spare me from nice people who spend their time sucking up trying to figure out who to blow to get ahead because they more than anyone, know they are talentless and their careers depend on those blowjobs.

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