Art: Cast drawing using sight-size, HELP!!!?!
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    Unhappy Cast drawing using sight-size, HELP!!!?!

    Ok, so this year I got really excited about the whole idea of the atelier and the technical mastery you can learn from atelier schooling. I want to go to an atelier but I am not able to go for another year (I'm a senior in high school). I have been reading Juliette Aristedes's books and the cast drawing book by Darren Rousar. I have done a few master copies and sketch from life daily, paint with oils often etc....I even went the whole 9 yard and bought the Nitram Fusains charcoal...BUT the other day I tried cast drawing using the sight-size atelier method, and it was SO frustrating I felt like I had no idea how to do it.

    Any tips on this? do most ateliers even use the sight size method? I wasn't sure if the method that you use to draw the object counts as much as the result?
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    Depends, if you go to American ateliers, then sight size is all the rage.
    If you go to Russian ones, then they teach real drawing.

    So put away the notion of sight size, practice getting accuracy and a sense of proportion for a few years through sight(it takes longer and is more difficult).

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    This is a laborious process - that is true.

    For doing Bargue drawings and cast drawings, most ateliers use the sight-size method. But when you´ve mastered it and it comes to figure drawing they use realtive measuring.

    I would recommend that too - first get an idea of how to eyeball and make exact measurements with your eye and then use this later without sight sizing. If you rely too much on it it will become a crutch.

    Show us your progress.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Hyskoa View Post
    Depends, if you go to American ateliers, then sight size is all the rage.
    If you go to Russian ones, then they teach real drawing.

    So put away the notion of sight size, practice getting accuracy and a sense of proportion for a few years through sight(it takes longer and is more difficult).
    I don't know man, I think more that they teach you how to go to an academy for 11+ years in Russia

    When it comes to the sight-size method, we could debate it for days here and it already has been done, I guess it's what you want to achieve. For me, it is a great tool for my instructors to judge the accuracy of my work.
    Also, it kind of is like cubes and perspective, it is impossible do draw a decent cube, let alone from imagination, when you don't know what a correct cube actually looks like. Sadly most perspective for artists books and courses are so narrowly dumbed down that a lot of artists will never have constructed or studied a single good cube in their lives and therefore all their cubes will look strange and distorted. I guess this is one of the reasons russians let their childrens draw those things first.
    What i want to say is, though, it is easy and very possible, to convey a good _impression_ of something and if that's what you want, go for it, you don't need any measurements or anything but practice. But if you want to achieve accuracy, you have to know what accuracy looks like, first. And I don't mean photocopy accuracy, but deeply studied and meticulously observed perfection. For that, you need help, I am reluctant to use sight-size as a self-study method though becuase as I said, I think it is maybe good for checking, but in the end it is your own eyes and problem-solving abilities that should do the trick.

    That said I advice you to use WHATEVER means neccessary to check on your work, Without an instructor I guess it would be fine to do tracing paper overlays and photo-overlays on fixed intervals in order to see your mistakes. Measuring in general is not a bad thing, Antonio Lopez Garcia said in an interview that he uses pretty elaborate tools to measure the proportions carefully and he came up with stuff like this: http://www.epdlp.com/fotos/lopez3.jpg . If the russian academy discards work like that, I discard the russian academy.


    But I personally think that using your eye and brain is indeed much better and thinking about relative sizes, structure, consecutively design, and values will make for a more complete and clear picture. Only thing is, have a Plan! Drawing is a creative process that requires a strategy and a lot of tactical decisions, it's complicated and a lot of people will never get it, even if they learn how to copy perfectly. Don't follow rules people set you, think WHY you are doing things and set goals.

    As for your specific question about casts in sight-size
    Here's a sight-size cast setup:
    Name:  cast1setup.jpg
Views: 1158
Size:  72.6 KB

    Be sure to manange your darks and lights so that you can distinguish them and reduce reflections to a minimum in the shadow areas. You don't want some strange green light coming from an unknown lightsource messing up your sense of light. Down the road, when you are more apt and understand form and light better, you can compensate for that though. The reason that there is a black background is so that you can get familiar with the concept of unified values. That means you can never be as dark as the black you see and never be as light as the whites in nature since every medium will and hs only a limited range. By maximizing it you have to cope somehow. again, you can do midtone-only stilllifes and dark and light ones to trin your sensitivity. If vlues are your weakness that is.
    Also, if you work in charcoal, the paper is actually more important than the charcoal, look for _mildly_ textured and stable paper that can hold a lot of charcoal. You don't want your shit to fall off or limit your value range becuse the paper can't hold a lot. Arches wtercolor paper is what I use but it is possibly not available for you so I advice getting something thick and try it out. Since in the beginning the block-in is the important step anyway, I don't hink it hurts when you don't get to the value stage because the paper is not yet a good one.

    Hope that helps a bit.

    Last edited by ~Faust~; May 25th, 2011 at 03:23 AM.
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    To get you started all you probably need is this book. It's got a good explanation in the back, along with lots of cast drawings to copy to get you warmed up.

    http://www.amazon.com/Charles-Bargue...6307882&sr=8-1

    I self-published a book on the fundamentals of drawing from life.

    http://www.amazon.com/Fundamentals-D...8951905&sr=8-1

    http://www.endlessunlimited.com
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    Smile

    Thank you all so much for the helpful advice! I feel a lot better now b/c I've been focusing on relative measures using my pencil, etc. to measure. I'll check out all of the resources and post some work when I'm done

    @~Faust~, as to perspective/cubes I have this book not sure if it's the best or not. I definitely want to get the Charles Bargue book even though it's a bit pricey but it looks good...

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    There's several resources on this way of drawing. I wouldn't invest in all of them. It can get pretty costly. But I think it's possible to do a decent job of teaching yourself using a few of these. There's probably more to be found if you google, but these are the ones I collected when I first got interested in this method. I think the DVD that goes along with that book would probably help the most.

    http://www.sightsize.com/dvd.html
    http://www.amazon.com/Cast-Drawing-U...dp/0980045401/
    http://www.amazon.com/Charles-Bargue...dp/286770166X/
    http://www.amazon.com/Classical-Draw...dp/0823006573/
    http://www.arc-store.com/castdrawingdvd.html
    http://www.academyofrealistart.com/dvd.html
    http://www.classicalartonline.com/


    Some stuff to read:

    http://www.learning-to-see.co.uk/sea...sight-size#916
    http://www.480bc.com/news/sight_size/sightsize.htm
    http://www.johnpeck.com/Links.html
    http://www.artistdaily.com/blogs/tec...nstration.aspx

    http://www.conceptart.org/forums/showthread.php?t=12104
    http://www.conceptart.org/forums/sho....php?p=1719439
    http://www.conceptart.org/forums/sho...d.php?t=113729


    However, I'm not a fan of this way of drawing. Before you get hung up on Sight-Size you should read this article. It makes a strong case against it.
    http://www.atelierstockholm.se/index...ntid=64&lang=1

    Last edited by nickydraws; May 13th, 2012 at 03:07 PM.
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    Haha, nickydraws! That´s a lot to read

    To add another two links, just look into my signature. There you will find my CA-thread and also my website where I sell affordable plaster casts - actually only Europe wide - with additional links.

    www.ClassicalAtelier@HOME.com
    My website for learning traditional fine art on your own! --- Derived from THIS thread at CA.org
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    drawing casts (geometric shapes, anatomical casts, skull), tutorials on Bargue drawing and cast drawing, Willow Charcoal, free drawing exercises
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    Look, there's a ton of info out there. Don't get bogged down in this way or that way. Try to learn from one reliable source if you can and I am sure you'll get much more help once you do finally go to an atelier. The most important thing is to be doing a lot of drawing.

    I want to repeat this for emphasis: The most important thing is to do a lot of drawing.

    Don't get frozen by doing it this way or that way. Don't worry about the setup or the details of this or that. Do the best you can to get it right, and then hammer out a bunch of drawings. The nuances will be ironed out once you get into an atelier... in the meantime, WORK. Knowledge is good and helpful, but no substitute for experience.

    I self-published a book on the fundamentals of drawing from life.

    http://www.amazon.com/Fundamentals-D...8951905&sr=8-1

    http://www.endlessunlimited.com
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    On another note, I'm looking for a good online store to buy another cast. I'm looking for a bust. I like the Apollo bust. I'd also consider Michelangelos David if I could find a good one.. anyone know a good online resource for purchasing plaster busts at relatively cheap prices? 100$?

    I self-published a book on the fundamentals of drawing from life.

    http://www.amazon.com/Fundamentals-D...8951905&sr=8-1

    http://www.endlessunlimited.com
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    You´d have to look at ebay and need luck.

    Buy clay and make your own from photo reference - you´ll save money and learn how to sculpt

    www.ClassicalAtelier@HOME.com
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    drawing casts (geometric shapes, anatomical casts, skull), tutorials on Bargue drawing and cast drawing, Willow Charcoal, free drawing exercises
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    Quote Originally Posted by ~Faust~ View Post
    I don't know man, I think
    more that they teach you how to go to an academy for 11+ years in Russia
    You look like a florence academy guy. The ones with crooked feet and all the sight based errors I keep seeing. No sight size is not a valid tool for learning oneself, learn form and only form. Learn to triangulate points and use logic and cannons of proportion to determine where everything goes. The moment you start copying shit from real life with sight size, that's when it all falls down. As humans change position every 4 seconds. And trying to millimeter landscapes and casts and everything stationary is illogical and unuseful if you want to actually go for large scale compositions with your work. Sight size is at best something people use to keep their students busy while they rake in 12k per year of said student.
    When it comes to the sight-size method, we could debate it for days here and it already has been done, I guess it's what you want to achieve. For me, it is a great tool for my instructors to judge the accuracy of my work.
    The basis of an education isn't to make the teacher's work easier, it's to help the student understand. If teacher's need a tool to see if something is correct, then they should not teach. If they cannot explain that an object has different proportions, then they shouldn't teach either.
    Also, it kind of is like cubes and perspective, it is impossible do draw a decent cube, let alone from imagination, when you don't know what a correct cube actually looks like.
    Hence why they have rules in perspective for determining the perfect cube. Again, not sight based.
    Sadly most perspective for artists books and courses are so narrowly dumbed down that a lot of artists will never have constructed or studied a single good cube in their lives and therefore all their cubes will look strange and distorted. I guess this is one of the reasons russians let their childrens draw those things first.
    Simple forms first to help the child see form and more and more complex forms later on. For them drawing a cube and a human being follows the same logical way of thinking. It's why their work has form.
    What i want to say is, though, it is easy and very possible, to convey a good _impression_ of something and if that's what you want, go for it, you don't need any measurements or anything but practice. But if you want to achieve accuracy, you have to know what accuracy looks like, first. And I don't mean photocopy accuracy, but deeply studied and meticulously observed perfection.
    Vision is flawed, especially after 3 hours. It's why any program based on sight will succumb to visual errors sooner or later.
    For that, you need help, I am reluctant to use sight-size as a self-study method though becuase as I said, I think it is maybe good for checking, but in the end it is your own eyes and problem-solving abilities that should do the trick.
    Hence no need for sight size.
    That said I advice you to use WHATEVER means neccessary to check on your work, Without an instructor I guess it would be fine to do tracing paper overlays and photo-overlays on fixed intervals in order to see your mistakes. Measuring in general is not a bad thing, Antonio Lopez Garcia said in an interview that he uses pretty elaborate tools to measure the proportions carefully and he came up with stuff like this: http://www.epdlp.com/fotos/lopez3.jpg . If the russian academy discards work like that, I discard the russian academy.
    Naturalism isn't their aim. For them everything is subject to the composition. That guy is good at doing that type of work, but it's no more impressive than someone who spends 5 months perfectly copying a barque. All it requires is patience and eyes. Not knowledge. So I can't call him a master. Then again, it does take a practised eye to see how flat something looks.

    But I personally think that using your eye and brain is indeed much better and thinking about relative sizes, structure, consecutively design, and values will make for a more complete and clear picture. Only thing is, have a Plan! Drawing is a creative process that requires a strategy and a lot of tactical decisions, it's complicated and a lot of people will never get it, even if they learn how to copy perfectly. Don't follow rules people set you, think WHY you are doing things and set goals.

    Now he has heard my part twice. If he has any intention of becoming an artist, instead of just another portrait or landscape painter, someone who tries and make art instead of trying to depict what they see before them, he will need to know form. And knowing form will dictate what he sees. And how he will put it on the screen.

    But alas, talking to the acolytes of sight size(I've found) is usually a waste of time. They seem to lack the common sense for self evaluation after spending 3-4 years at florence academy or Angel and spam out work which wouldn't even impress a 15 year old in Russia.


    Good luck to both of you on your art endeavors though.
    Cheers.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Hyskoa View Post
    You look like a florence academy guy. The ones with crooked feet and all the sight based errors I keep seeing.
    whoa, that's pretty rich coming from an Angel student, where you draw rubber people floating in the air. I keep seeing people leaving Angel for FAA, but not the other way around. Wonder why that is?

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    I don't see any reasons for flaming here, Nor do I see any reasons to become an acolyte of one school or another. If you want to reduce people to the academy they are going to, that's your business I will not take part in it. I've seen horrible and uninteresting work being done by students of ALL academies, including the russian academy. Also, I don't see a reason to bash Angel or FAA. You get what you pay for and what people are doing there isn't exactly a secret, so you should decide for yourself wether you actually want to go there or not and learn what those schools have to offer.

    My post was to help the OP who is apparently not coming back and not to bash with my "skills" I know I still suck at drawing and my eyes aren't exactly very accurate, nor is my sense of form.

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    Quote Originally Posted by duztman View Post
    whoa, that's pretty rich coming from an Angel student, where you draw rubber people floating in the air. I keep seeing people leaving Angel for FAA, but not the other way around. Wonder why that is?
    I did leave Angel. And it is a shit school

    And truthfully wasn't trying to bash you Faust, but this part "If the russian academy discards work like that, I discard the russian academy." got my goat, hence why my post might be more aggressive than intended.

    I just have zero respect for sight size. If FAA replaced their sight size techniques with normal drawing, it'd be an awesome school.
    It just makes me angry why they would willfully make their program worse with such a horrible, horrible thing as sightsize.

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    normal drawing?

    I self-published a book on the fundamentals of drawing from life.

    http://www.amazon.com/Fundamentals-D...8951905&sr=8-1

    http://www.endlessunlimited.com
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    Quote Originally Posted by jetpack42 View Post
    normal drawing?
    Yes .

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    sight sizing is a tool for training your hand eye coordination, so yes it is very useful for that but shouldnt be the staple of an artists arsenal.
    And normal drawing? there is no such thing.

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    I posted a thank you post before but I can't find it so apparently my computer is messing up, sorry!
    anyways, thank you all for your wonderful advice, I never thought so many people would comment! I really appreciate the time you took to answer--I've decided not to use sight size but I still want to focus on the atelier/old master ways.

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    Interesting thread here imo. The debate about sight size instruction is nearly guaranteed to get people going.

    I've been in a similar situation to OP for the last 6 months or so trying to figure out the most effective way to learn to draw in a classical sense.

    I m on vacation visiting Boston and NYC over the last couple weeks and I've managed to visit the realist academy in Boston and I swong by the grandcentral academy for the opening of their student show. Both schools have very solid work and but take a slightly different approach. Boston teaches a sight size approach while the grandcentral takes a more comparative measurement and relative value approach. By relative value I mean that they use graphite for drawings so they need to compress the value scale to achieve the sculptural effect. I think both systems have merit and it's up to the student to achieve his goals.

    For OP who's studying on his own I d recommend starting with sight size as it's easier to judge at first. Start with bargue/master copies to get a handle on the idea of working from general to specific which seems to be the core of any realist system of teaching. I wouldn't even bother bringing the copies to a complete finish and concentrate on getting the cartoon/major shadow shapes accurate. So much of what is hard for beginners is in getting those initial stages done accurately.Also don't completely rely on measuring with a needle or w/e to copy. Make sure you carefully observe shapes and angles/triangulation as you'll learn more and get a more accurate copy in the end.

    Once you do start modeling your drawings focus deeply and get into a sculptural mindset. Think of the light source and literally sculpt the drawing in it's space. Learn to draw a sphere well out of your head. This is the main thing I learnt talking to a student at the grandcentral academy and they all draw little spheres with the same relative light source on the bottom of their page.

    Hope this helps

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    Yes, that phrase has gotten my attention as well:

    "If the russian academy discards work like that, I discard the russian academy."


    (Btw, "Russian Academy" is spelled with capital letters.)

    I was going to start a huge argument but Hyskoa has already expressed his opinion, which is very close to mine. So I decided not to defend what doesn't need to be defended.

    What I'll do instead, I'll post a message from the Ashland Academy (now a Private School in Maui, Hawaii):

    "A vast majority of private art schools today are teaching drawing and painting by the sight-size method. This is a copying method, resulting in complete dependency on “tracing” the subject in the same size as it intersects the picture plane. This method has been used by some artists, previously classically trained, specifically for portraiture. However, it never has been taught in any educational institution, academy or atelier until it was invented in the 1970’s by Richard Lack as an educational method.
    Any claims that the sight-size method has been used for education in academies or ateliers are without merit."

    (original is located at this link)

    The bottom line is:
    Why in the world you're trying to invent a wheel?

    The model of the academic drawing system as it exists in the Russian Academy was taken from the best art academies of the world: Italy, France, Spain, etc. Not contemporary academies, of course, but what used to be called "academies" prior to the 20th century.
    They've never had anything even close to so-called "sight-size" method.

    What sight-size does is it fakes a student progress. You see a fast result, you can show it to your parents and say, "see? i'm an artist now!" - and they'll exclaim "wow!"
    But a little later the same student would admit "I don't have a slightest idea what I'm doing".
    The funny part is, often such "sight-size" schools would even invite our art professors for master classes. So they go, they give a one-week master class, all students try to follow the "Russian method", and then they proudly show their "academic drawings" to their parents and they hear "wow!" again...
    But unfortunately, they later admit they didn't understand anything they have been doing either. (Of course, you can't comprehend what's taught during 6 years within a one week period.)

    Guys, frankly, during last years my mostly often mentioned phrase is:
    "There is no business like ART business".
    And that refers to everything. To so much fuzz about contemporary art, to art "specialists", and of course - to art schools.

    Don't let others fool you. You might don't understand it now but you'll definitely understand it later.

    Btw, Hyskoa -
    The Angel Academy is now in our list of clients, they recently started buying our teaching aids (which, as you know, are pure "traditional, academic, NOT sight-size").
    Which means the Angels are not that bad after all.
    (yes, sometimes I'm just baldly optimistic)

    Last edited by Book Guru; June 5th, 2011 at 01:48 PM.
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    Russian Academy of Arts thread - all about it

    There was a sign on the Academy building, “Free Arts”. “What’s that?”, we asked our professor. – “That’s to be able to create anything, but to create what you want to.”
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    Book Guru I m in a very similar situation to OP in that I'm to learn how to draw and eventually paint from life but am without formal instruction atm. How would a student in the school your representing set up his/her workspace in order to do a study from a cast or a still life?

    Also I am nearly certain that doing master copy drawings is encouraged for a variety of reasons at this school. To me setting up the master drawing beside your paper and doing it 1:1 is going to be most effective at getting an exact copy of the master work. How would your school instruct students to do a master copy? Reduce or enlarge the scale of the original so that it's not sight size?

    Thanks

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  28. #23
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    cquinn,

    Imagine that your cast is 2 meters big or 10 centimiters small. How will you go by sight-size?

    In regards of good references.
    My mistake. By some reason I assume everyone here is familiar with our partner's website, Practicum.org.
    It has a huge database of all important informaion on classical art education with very valuable tips, rich visual information, and interesting historical facts.

    For start, go directly to the article related to cast drawing.

    Next, read about the art system that existed during the Renaissance.

    And if you're curious about how the system of academic art education has been implemented in the Russian Academy, read this article.
    [don't pay attention to what's written in quotation marks there, it's the text from archives, with old Russian language style, even I have a hard time comprehending it.]

    The only problem with that website - all info is in Russian. It's a valuable source for all Russian students, but foreigners have to use the Google translation (the language button is at the bottom).

    But it's worth it. Even without a perfect translation, much information is pretty clear. Again, there is a great visual support to each article.

    I also recommend reading an article by the Atelier Stockholm. Though I don't find them really following academic traditions, they at least refused from the sight-size system that was used there earlier.

    Please let me know if some information at Practicum.org is too confusing. I'll help you with correct translation.

    www.4-art.org - art educational books
    www.Practicum.org - art educational portal
    guru@4-art.org - my direct e-mail
    Russian Academy of Arts thread - all about it

    There was a sign on the Academy building, “Free Arts”. “What’s that?”, we asked our professor. – “That’s to be able to create anything, but to create what you want to.”
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    I believe you can be skilled at both sight size and comparative drawing and benefit from both experiences. I see too many posts in this thread that revolves around absolutes - as if one school of thought somehow is more true than another. The intelligent student would seek to reap the benefits from either "method," not merely discarding the practical downsides as "faults of the method," but realize that they need to be more flexible in how they work.

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    Book Guru- For the 2m tall sculpture I d use a huge piece of paper and a ladder. Might take a while though to render a 2 m tall drawing.

    Jokes obv. Seriously though you can just back up your easel and draw it at a more reasonable size while still getting the 1:1 ratio. I know what your saying though and this is why I think it's best served for either beginning exercises and exercises where super super exact comparison is needed as naturally 1:1 is easiest to see and compare. For example I ve seen munsell color rendering exercises where sight size is recommended so you can compare as directly as possible.

    I think andreasM is quite correct though. Being dogmatic and irrational to your approach in any endeavor will lead to problems in the long run. Most situations don't call for sight size drawing or painting so I don t think this is where most of the effort should be. Being completely ignorant of the method will leave you blind for the times that it ll make your life a lot easier.

    I've done a fair amount of reading and looking at different sources and I've found a few things that any realist school/teacher all seem to have in common. First make sure you can blockin and turn it into an effective contour/structural drawing. From what I can tell this solves most issues when making a beautiful drawing. Perscpective, anatomy, gesture and even some sense of form can and should be expressed at this point. When you can master that get onto modelling form and make sure you think sculpturally. Your pencil is a chisel working away at the paper marble. Even if your working very directly and closely to life and more or less copying what you see I think it'll improve your results dramatically.

    Just my 2 cents.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Book Guru View Post
    Btw, Hyskoa -
    The Angel Academy is now in our list of clients, they recently started buying our teaching aids (which, as you know, are pure "traditional, academic, NOT sight-size").
    Which means the Angels are not that bad after all.
    (yes, sometimes I'm just baldly optimistic)
    It's run by a moneywhore and an old drunken braggard who knows nothing about drawing or painting.
    They know less than me about drawing and painting and art in general, and that's saying something.

    They are.. and allow me to emphasize this, horrible, horrible, horrible, horrible, horrible, horrible, greedy afterbirths that should've been vacuumed out of their mother's womb when they were still sperm.

    And that's when I'm being nice about it, otherwise, boy, the internet would not be big enough for my hatred.


    And fine, if you want rationality, first objectively prove that sight size is a better learning method than just doing it without.
    It's up to the people who bring in new theories to prove them. And so far, have seen zero proof that it actually aides in any way in making the process faster, in fact, it's slower because you have to learn both comparative and sight size.
    It is the proverbial appendix of contemporary art, it just sits there, sometimes causing you problems and doesn't actually facilitate anything.

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    It's up to the people who bring in new theories to prove them. And so far, have seen zero proof that it actually aides in any way in making the process faster, in fact, it's slower because you have to learn both comparative and sight size.
    It was never a goal to make the process faster, and in the long run, I don't see how spending a big amount of time learning both will be to the disadvantage to any student. The way I see it, sight size is very restrictive in it's nature and the advantage of this, is that you can focus directly on how you percieve visual/optical appearances, ie. values, edge variety - how it affects line quality and so on. It is a method that helps you see better, but it doesn't make you draw any better.

    I think the main issue you guys are having with this methos is: It will eventually cripple the student who doesn't already know how to draw comparatively (or who isn't trained in the "pure, academic manner," whatever that really means).

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    Quote Originally Posted by AndreasM View Post
    I think the main issue you guys are having with this methos is: It will cripple the student who doesn't already know how to draw comparatively (or who isn't trained in the "pure, academic manner," whatever that really means).
    Sounds like reason enough to never use it.
    And I see people who do know comparative drawing get bad habits from sight size.
    Once you start out with a visual, rather than an idealistic means of determining your baseline(where features are, etc etc). You will always get distortion and visual errors.

    If you don't know how light works, then no matter how much you look at something, you won't understand it.
    This includes edges.
    So it's all based on rules and theories that define what it is you're supposed to see, rather than trying for 5 weeks to figure out what you're looking at, then guessing and trying again and again until it somewhat looks alike.

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    I personally don't get what the big deal is. Working at a 1:1 ratio just simplifies the measuring and finding the correct proportions. It's def not going to solve any of the more complex issues like perspective and how form is shaped with light and how to represent that. I'd think it's likely that the angel school could be lacking in other ways and it doesn't mean that working to a 1:1 ratio is inherently wrong. Sounds like they make it a guessing game when it's really a well informed educated guessing that should be going on. Understanding the theories of perspective, how light reacts, anatomy etc is going to help you a great deal when your looking at a 3d object and trying to conceptualize it into a 2d representation. Saying that angel is lacking cause they ask you to do your drawing to a 1:1 ratio doesn't make sense me and they are probably screwing it up somewhere else in their approach.

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  36. #30
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    Quote Originally Posted by ~Faust~ View Post
    Also, it kind of is like cubes and perspective, it is impossible do draw a decent cube, let alone from imagination, when you don't know what a correct cube actually looks like. Sadly most perspective for artists books and courses are so narrowly dumbed down that a lot of artists will never have constructed or studied a single good cube in their lives and therefore all their cubes will look strange and distorted.
    I disagree.

    Actually to draw good cube all you need is being able to draw accurate square. The rest is relatively easy to figure out. And to draw accurate square you don't have to see how it looks like in real life. You can check if the lenght of the sides is equal on paper

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