Tokyopop shutting down
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Thread: Tokyopop shutting down

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    Tokyopop shutting down


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    I was wondering why they weren't accepting admissions anymore.

    This is sad because I met someone who worked for them.

    Edit: Something just hit me though.

    This is going to affect the popularity of manga. Which may or may not affect the market of manga in Japan, which may or may not affect - anime. A lot of shows that haven't been licensed or about to be licensed are based on manga or light novels. Few are non-adapted.

    Edit: Nevermind, the European branch is still open.

    Edit: And... There are other companies still publishing manga. I don't know how long they will last.

    Last edited by velderia; April 15th, 2011 at 03:28 PM.
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    Quote Originally Posted by velderia View Post
    Edit: Something just hit me though.

    This is going to affect the popularity of manga. Which may or may not affect the market of manga in Japan, which may or may not affect - anime. A lot of shows that haven't been licensed or about to be licensed are based on manga or light novels. Few are non-adapted.
    How terrible! You might have to read some non-Japanese comics and check out non-Japanese cartoons. About things that are not Japan. And support some domestic cartoonists who are likely also making interesting stuff despite it not being the least like manga.

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    Most american cartoons...suck!



    And name a current cartoon that's not either super hero or The Boondocks, or the up and coming Black Dynamite cartoon, venture bros., american dad, that doesn't rip from anime, that is american, and doesn't suck.

    (Playing Devil's advocate)

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    Last I checked, a lot of the major manga series seem to be coming from other publishers these days anyway. (I can't say I've been very impressed by Tokyopop's recent offerings, honestly. Their newsletters over the past year have been full of Hetalia, Hetalia, and more Hetalia...)

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    Quote Originally Posted by OmenSpirits View Post
    Most american cartoons...suck!



    And name a current cartoon that's not either super hero or The Boondocks, or the up and coming Black Dynamite cartoon, venture bros., american dad, that doesn't rip from anime, that is american, and doesn't suck.

    (Playing Devil's advocate)
    This.


    And superheroes got old after the first time I heard of them.

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    Quote Originally Posted by zwarrior View Post
    i don't know if i may be happy. Are they the same manga publisher with a contract that is insanely disadvantageous to the artists? or am i thinking of a different one
    That would be yes. Hence my schadenfreude remark.


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    Quote Originally Posted by OmenSpirits View Post
    Most american cartoons...suck!



    And name a current cartoon that's not either super hero or The Boondocks, or the up and coming Black Dynamite cartoon, venture bros., american dad, that doesn't rip from anime, that is american, and doesn't suck.

    (Playing Devil's advocate)
    American cartoons have been sucking since the early 2000s IMO.

    OH YES, the old days....I miss them. And by old days I mean the 80s and 90s shows.

    And looney toons. I actually hated looney toons but okay.

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    Quote Originally Posted by vineris View Post
    How terrible! You might have to read some non-Japanese comics and check out non-Japanese cartoons. About things that are not Japan. And support some domestic cartoonists who are likely also making interesting stuff despite it not being the least like manga.
    Oh dear I sense some hostility. What for?
    People just like what's been coming out of Japan for a while now.. The same American movies dominate the silver screen and Brazilian footballers dominate international leagues. Some countries are just good at stuff and known for it.

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    The Beat has a good follow up/postmortem: http://www.comicsbeat.com/2011/04/15...pop-follow-up/


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    Quote Originally Posted by OmenSpirits View Post
    Most american cartoons...suck!

    And whose fault is that... hmmm? Could it be us as audience and us artists? Who's creating this shit and who is watching it, if not us? It's not like Japan is magic. Their anime and manga industries got started just like everything else.

    Quote Originally Posted by ThabisoMhlaba
    Oh dear I sense some hostility. What for?
    It's not hostility so much as sarcasm. Heaven forbid we should be proactive and find ways to make our own entertainment and step into creative holes that are opening up. I mean, we're only a forum full of commercial artists and commercial artists-to-be. You'd think an artist here could come up with *something* instead of going "oh no what if the animes go away?" Isn't that the entire point of us being here?

    Quote Originally Posted by ThabisoMhlaba
    People just like what's been coming out of Japan for a while now.. The same American movies dominate the silver screen and Brazilian footballers dominate international leagues.
    Some countries are just good at stuff and known for it.
    People like what's coming out of James Jean too AND YET you and I keep drawing. If you really had that attitude you're sporting here you'd have given up long ago.

    The crown can always be taken by a new contender! Nothing lasts, so why not be ambitious?

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    Quote Originally Posted by OmenSpirits View Post
    Most american cartoons...suck!



    And name a current cartoon that's not either super hero or The Boondocks, or the up and coming Black Dynamite cartoon, venture bros., american dad, that doesn't rip from anime, that is american, and doesn't suck.

    (Playing Devil's advocate)
    Well theres Ugly Americans and Metalocalypse which are probably the best original American shows I've seen in awhile.






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    Quote Originally Posted by vineris View Post
    It's not hostility so much as sarcasm. Heaven forbid we should be proactive and find ways to make our own entertainment and step into creative holes that are opening up. I mean, we're only a forum full of commercial artists and commercial artists-to-be. You'd think an artist here could come up with *something* instead of going "oh no what if the animes go away?" Isn't that the entire point of us being here?
    ... Well, it's not like we're coming up with nothing. There's also a lot of barriers involved in trying to get published, or even self-published at times, especially here, where (color, at least) printing isn't exactly cheap.

    "Oh no what if the animes go away?" That's actually a serious problem. There are some wonderful shows that don't make it to the US. If manga declines, anime might decline. Maybe it will get better in the future, maybe it won't.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Elwell View Post
    That would be yes. Hence my schadenfreude remark.
    Actually, I talked to an artist from Tokyopop and she said she gets paid very well, page rates and everything. At one point someone was lettering for her, but she eventually was even able to do the lettering herself. If she does all the penciling, inking, sometimes coloring and lettering herself, AND says she gets paid well, something must be right.

    Although, yes, maybe it varies, maybe some artists were paid low, but the only people who complained, from what I've heard, so far, that Tokyopop doesn't care about the creators - Are people who almost made it, but didn't. There was also this group of people who had some problems with the contract but honestly, if you're going to work with a publisher, you HAVE to give them some licensing rights. I've seen a lot of idiots who look at that part of the contract and go, "OH MY GOD, DOES THIS MEAN I HAVE TO GIVE THEM MY CREDIT CARD?!?!?" ... No. Gawd, I would hope not at least.

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    It's not like they publish anything interesting anymore. Last good thing they published went out of print back in 2005. The first dozen volumes of Cyborg 009.

    Shame about people losing their jobs, of course. Hopefully they can move to another publisher quickly.

    If there's one thing they deserve points for is taking a risk and unflopping books. Apparently they were the first to actually do it.

    Last edited by Psychotime; April 16th, 2011 at 11:51 AM.
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    Quote Originally Posted by velderia View Post
    I've seen a lot of idiots who look at that part of the contract and go, "OH MY GOD, DOES THIS MEAN I HAVE TO GIVE THEM MY CREDIT CARD?!?!?" ... No. Gawd, I would hope not at least.
    Maybe account information for a direct deposit.

    So was TokyoPop a middle man? in publishing?

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    Quote Originally Posted by velderia View Post
    ... Well, it's not like we're coming up with nothing. There's also a lot of barriers involved in trying to get published, or even self-published at times, especially here, where (color, at least) printing isn't exactly cheap.
    The barriers aren't really all that huge. Most manga isn't published in colour, so we can disregard colour printing. You can get a hundred copies of a b&w 200-page trade paperback printed up for $500 on Ka-blam. If you have a quality product and manage to scrape up a couple thousand fans on the Internet you can move that without much problem.

    Quote Originally Posted by velderia View Post
    "Oh no what if the animes go away?" That's actually a serious problem.
    No it's not. A form of entertainment going away is a serious problem? If it goes away it's because people don't want it. They want something else. That something else will employ people and it will probably be good. Sad for us who might enjoy a specific form of entertainment, but most people won't even notice.

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    Since when has Tokyopop ever been a representative of people's interest in Japanese pop culture?

    When VIZ closes it's doors, then it's a sign.

    I'm certain part of what killed Tokyopop was the fact that their few mainstream licenses got swiped up over the years, and once Kodonsha decided to officially start a branch in the states, it was just another nail in the coffin. And since then they've had to scrape around for obscure licenses for better or for worse. A huge chunk happening to be Korean comics. I don't think anyone cares about Korean comics. And the fiasco that Elwell's referring to didn't help either.

    Vertical (who publishes mostly old Tezuka works licensed through Kodansha) got off easy and merged instead.

    I'm really not sure what the situation with Dark Horse is. Akira and Ghost in the Shell are printed with Kodansha's logo now (even though they're the exact same flipped translations Dark Horse made back in the 90's, if I'm not mistaken), but I'm not certain about Astro Boy or other works.

    Last edited by Psychotime; April 16th, 2011 at 01:57 PM.
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    For some background, an old CA thread on the Tokyopop Manga Pilot program. Pretty much a moot point now, except for those creators who have to deal with how the current situation effects them.


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    Quote Originally Posted by Elwell View Post
    For some background, an old CA thread on the Tokyopop Manga Pilot program. Pretty much a moot point now, except for those creators who have to deal with how the current situation effects them.
    Well, now that I think about it, the artist I talked to did mention about negotiating contracts to get where she was...

    But yeah, maybe it was a mistake on my part to freak out over this. There's plenty of other companies that are providing good manga. I grew up with Tokyopop but... Geez... Cine-manga? What? It's more like a stab on my childhood rather than a stab in the industry.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Psychotime View Post
    Since when has Tokyopop ever been a representative of people's interest in Japanese pop culture?

    When VIZ closes it's doors, then it's a sign.

    I'm certain part of what killed Tokyopop was the fact that their few mainstream licenses got swiped up over the years, and once Kodonsha decided to officially start a branch in the states, it was just another nail in the coffin. And since then they've had to scrape around for obscure licenses for better or for worse. A huge chunk happening to be Korean comics. I don't think anyone cares about Korean comics. And the fiasco that Elwell's referring to didn't help either.

    Vertical (who publishes mostly old Tezuka works licensed through Kodansha) got off easy and merged instead.

    I'm really not sure what the situation with Dark Horse is. Akira and Ghost in the Shell are printed with Kodansha's logo now (even though they're the exact same flipped translations Dark Horse made back in the 90's, if I'm not mistaken), but I'm not certain about Astro Boy or other works.
    The way you describe it. It would seem the main company are cutting of the middle man. I'm assuming TokyoPop is an American company, and Kodansha is the holders of the actual comic(s) among other Japanese companies.



    "I also find that manga is more coherent, despite it being from a completley different culture. Western comics are usually full of panels (usually during action scenes) that are just uttlerly unintelligible and I have to spend a while trying to get my bearings. "

    That's weird, but then again I read bande dessinée comics more then U.S comics.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Sulphur View Post
    I also find that manga is more coherent, despite it being from a completley different culture. Western comics are usually full of panels (usually during action scenes) that are just uttlerly unintelligible and I have to spend a while trying to get my bearings.
    Then you aren't reading a good comic. It's that simple.

    I'll be honest, the people who constantly try to make any comic or cartoon discussion an east vs west are very, very annoying.

    There's good comics, there's bad comics. That's it. Stop using bad examples to justify your aversion to another genre/demographic/country of origin and just be honest, you just don't want to read them. It's like saying "I don't like American movies because I saw Battlefield Earth." Or "I don't like Japanese cartoons because I saw K-On."

    Quote Originally Posted by Sulphur View Post
    Its just that they have a ridiculous amount of issues and are about 6 pages long or something - they're not designed for casual readers like myself.
    And then they use ignorant half truths such as this, which is even worse.



    Quote Originally Posted by Flashback View Post
    The way you describe it. It would seem the main company are cutting of the middle man. I'm assuming TokyoPop is an American company, and Kodansha is the holders of the actual comic(s) among other Japanese companies.
    Oh whoops, I thought I made it clear instead of just imply it. Yeah, that's it. It was only a matter of time, really, seeing how Shueisha and Shogakugan are in the states as Viz, (which was originally a middleman before they bought it out).

    Earlier Kodansha was going halfway with Del Rey, which was a cooperation with Random House. But they folded that last year once they decided to go all the way.

    Last edited by Psychotime; April 17th, 2011 at 12:38 AM.
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    Hearing about them shutting down is a little sad, I have bought a fair chunk of manga from them over the years, but not in a long time, both due to my changing tastes as a comic book consumer and them simply not having anything I care to read.
    I've been trying to turn my eyes towards more North American comics because some of them I've really liked. Y The Last Man, Watchmen, Blankets, Sandman, Bone, Strangers in Paradise, but trying to find mainstream American comics not starring big buff Superheroes or based on a video game with super buff (or impossibly sexy) protaginists is really, really damn hard. And then the other half is poofy experimental junk that just leaves a bad taste in my mouth.
    So what are you guys reading? Maybe could I get some good suggestions?

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    I like "Local" myself from Brian Wood and Ryan Kelly. Got "Books of Magic" by Neil Gaiman. I also like "Pride in Baghdad" about a family of lions during the Baghdad assault by U.S. forces post-9/11. "Fables" is another excellent series.

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    Wow... Just... Came across this and reading at the moment. It's a bit drama-infested though: http://mangacritic.com/2011/04/15/a-...bout-tokyopop/

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    Quote Originally Posted by Cherry_Cheesecake100 View Post
    So what are you guys reading? Maybe could I get some good suggestions?
    I'm wanting to start reading The Walking Dead - the show is awesome but apparently the comic is even better. I've been told that everyone starting should get the compendium.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Cherry_Cheesecake100 View Post
    I've been trying to turn my eyes towards more North American comics because some of them I've really liked. Y The Last Man, Watchmen, Blankets, Sandman, Bone, Strangers in Paradise, but trying to find mainstream American comics not starring big buff Superheroes or based on a video game with super buff (or impossibly sexy) protaginists is really, really damn hard.
    Well then don't read as many mainstream comics. There's plenty of good, more indie stuff coming out, especially if you include (good) webcomic collections.

    Try Finder, Fables and Castle Waiting. They're three of my favourites. If you include BDs, add Blacksad and Miss Don't Touch Me. For webcomic collections try Digger and Rice Boy/Order of Tales (both are finished now so it's a good time to buy!)

    There's a bunch of other stuff I've heard good things about but haven't had a chance to check out yet, like 100 Bullets and The Walking Dead.

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    Quote Originally Posted by vineris View Post
    Well then don't read as many mainstream comics. There's plenty of good, more indie stuff coming out, especially if you include (good) webcomic collections.

    Try Finder, Fables and Castle Waiting. They're three of my favourites. If you include BDs, add Blacksad and Miss Don't Touch Me.
    Blacksad is an European comic! Just thought I'd mention it.

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    Oh I've been cruising the webcomic scene for awhile now but the problem is that right when I'm really getting into a good story the author will suddenly say "Ok I'z bored writing this lol goodbye." I know most of them are doing it for free and is just a hobby but I'll pay for a good story if it means the story will keep going until its conclusion.
    And I do love a good indie comic.
    Thanks for some good suggestions.

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