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Thread: NASA scientist finds evidence of alien life

  1. #31
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    GET AWAY FROM HER YOU BI..

    Quote Originally Posted by arenhaus View Post
    Sorry, guys, looks like it's another false alarm. http://scienceblogs.com/pharyngula/2...ver_bacter.php The publication it's in isn't even peer reviewed.
    Oh. Really? Damn.

    Well, we should nuke them from orbit anyway. It's the only way to be sure.

    They mostly come out at night.




    Mostly.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Oden View Post

    "Science" fail.
    Surely this is an example of science 'pass'? Science is extremely good at self regulation, taking criticism and policing. The moment a researcher comes up with a 'discovery' or 'theory', there are a host of others prepared to take that theory apart to look for the cracks. That's the thing about evidence, it's its own proof.

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    Yeah, it's pretty impressive how quickly this one got shot down. It was more of a media fail really. And science fail from the source, I guess.

    Jamen jag tror att han skäms, och har gömt sig. Vårt universum det är en av dom otaliga spermasatser som Herren i sin självhärliga ensamhet har runkat fram för å besudla intet.
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    I'm not so curious about IF it exists as I am about how far away it is...

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    Where is your skepticism guys? How many more of the stories need to be debunked before you start to question them?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Liffey View Post
    don't see what alien life has to do with religion

    or why anyone would possibly want to bring it up
    Easy, most people hate God. That's why religion will always be brought up even if the subject is how to make brownies.

    Years ago I signed up for a US Government course offered by our local public school system. The teacher's main goal was to slam all religions. I didn't want to study religion (actually anti-religion) so I dropped the course.

    So get used to this my friend. Whenever great almighty man thinks he has found a way to disprove the Bible he'll jump for joy and shout from the rooftops. But then one day (like all of us) he must die.

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    Quote Originally Posted by bigpanfish View Post
    Easy, most people hate God. That's why religion will always be brought up even if the subject is how to make brownies.

    Years ago I signed up for a US Government course offered by our local public school system. The teacher's main goal was to slam all religions. I didn't want to study religion (actually anti-religion) so I dropped the course.

    So get used to this my friend. Whenever great almighty man thinks he has found a way to disprove the Bible he'll jump for joy and shout from the rooftops. But then one day (like all of us) he must die.
    You should search Christopher Hitchens on youtube. There are quite a few points that he makes, that no religion can reasonably argue. Just food for thought.

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    Aaw, that's a shame, maybe next time

    bigpanfish...what?

    Mate, it's not healthy to have such a closed mind, or to make such sweeping generalizations about atheists.

    If I was religious I would jump at the chance of doing an 'anti-religion' course, to test my faith, surely if it's true, no amount of bashing will make it untrue? What are you afraid of? And at the end of it you'll come out with your faith strengthened

    I don't hate God, I really wouldn't mind if he was real, although I prefer the infinitely more beautiful real universe. The life and death of a star, the spontaneous eruption of life, much more vivid, beautiful and feasible, no?

    Atheists are much more humble than theists.

    Now, let's all be friends eh?

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    What I'm confused about is why the implications for the human race are staggering and even more-so "reality altering"?

    That doesn't even make sense, reality has not changed just because a bunch of humans figured something out haha. The bacteria has always been there, nothing has changed. Reality remains the same.

    I guess they were refering to percieved reality. But even then, don't most people know that given the infinite nature of our universe it is statisticaly obvious that alien life must exist?

    Quote Originally Posted by ThabisoMhlaba View Post
    You should search Christopher Hitchens on youtube. There are quite a few points that he makes, that no religion can reasonably argue. Just food for thought.
    Nah, I can't say I agree he should do that. The reason being is that people that make such intense statements as bigpanfish have very personally held beliefs which aren't based on arguments but rather a personal sense of faith. Afterall the whole concept of faith is just that.

    Therefore I learned that arguments, points, and proofs are irrelevent to those that have already chosen to be deeply religious.

    In, honestly, much the same way I don't see myself ever listening to arguments FOR the existence of god.

    We have all already decided for ourselves, and our beliefs are probably not up for re-consideration.


    Anyways, what do we think of arenhaus' link? Are the original scientists not credible?

    Last edited by Pavel Sokov; March 7th, 2011 at 02:51 PM.
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    Quote Originally Posted by gjpetch View Post
    Several studies have found approximately half of the US population to be creationists, the mindset is alive and well. link
    Creationism does not imply a self-centered / self-important attitude, insofar as a creationist would have trouble with life existing on another planet.

    I'm not creationist in the traditional sense, but still I'd rather false assumptions about people of other beliefs not be made.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Pavel Sokov View Post
    What I'm confused about is why the implications for the human race are staggering and even more-so "reality altering"?

    That doesn't even make sense, reality has not changed just because a bunch of humans figured something out haha. The bacteria has always been there, nothing has changed. Reality remains the same.

    I guess they were refering to percieved reality. But even then, don't most people know that given the infinite nature of our universe it is statisticaly obvious that alien life must exist?



    Nah, I can't say I agree he should do that. The reason being is that people that make such intense statements as bigpanfish have very personally held beliefs which aren't based on arguments but rather a personal sense of faith. Afterall the whole concept of faith is just that.

    Therefore I learned that arguments, points, and proofs are irrelevent to those that have already chosen to be deeply religious.

    In, honestly, much the same way I don't see myself ever listening to arguments FOR the existence of god.

    We have all already decided for ourselves, and our beliefs are probably not up for re-consideration.


    Anyways, what do we think of arenhaus' link? Are the original scientists not credible?
    I think the relevance is that it would reignite interest in the Space Program. Because as a collective species we can do a lot of good when focused on a goal. Lots of awesome technology came out of the first Space Race, imagine what another one would produce.

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    If only America were in an economic position to worry about space... not that other countries shouldn't for it if they're up to it of course.

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    Well, even if the story isn't true, this could still be an interesting discussion about aliens (and not about religion ).

    I mean, there probably ARE other beings out there, the universe is so vast that there's a really slim chance of earth being the only habitated planet, but what if we're the smartest form of life there is out there? Aliens in movies are most of the time depicted as being far more intelligent than us, but what if they aren't? Personally, I find it scary that we might be the best the universe has to offer

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    "Sometimes I think we're alone in the universe, and sometimes I think we're not. In either case the idea is quite staggering." - Arthur C Clarke

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    Quote Originally Posted by Liffey View Post
    Creationism does not imply a self-centered / self-important attitude, insofar as a creationist would have trouble with life existing on another planet.
    Well, denying the relationship between humans and other apes could be described as self centered and self-important. A literal interpretation of scripture places man at the center of the universe, the very literalism you're saying has been abandoned since Copernicus. Nevermind that Galileo was examined by the inquisition decades after the death of Copernicus, that their work was withheld by the the catholic church fur another hundred years or so, nevermind that an apology to Galileo didn't come till 2000, nevermind that Ratzinger said in 1990 "The Church at the time of Galileo kept much more closely to reason than did Galileo himself" and "Her verdict against Galileo was rational and just". Abandoned since the 16th century? You mad?
    Quote Originally Posted by bigpanfish View Post
    Easy, most people hate God.
    You can't really hate a being that you don't think exists. It's a convenient rationalization for a believer to explain non-belief, but it has more to do with an absence of evidence to the existence of any deity.

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    Somewhere, in a land far, far away, people are having a discussion on a scientific topic that doesn't turn into a debate on theology.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Wooly ESS View Post
    Somewhere, in a land far, far away, people are having a discussion on a scientific topic that doesn't turn into a debate on theology.
    Sounds made up.

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    Deism is convenient because you're not tied to any Church's fallacies, so you can be all like "Well, that seems incredibly reason, guess that alters what I believe and stuff". Faith becomes a lot more flexible in itself, which really helps in religious debates and whatnot because there's nothing against saying that you can listen to others.

    Even so, have to agree with just about everyone else in this thread that alien life really has absolutely nothing to do with religion, barring that self-centric policy of "man is obviously better then anything and everything, and screw you for questioning that". Bit of a shame that this evidence got shot down really quickly, but hey, I've yet to see a sample, a "proof" of alien life that hasn't (weren't there microorganisms on mars or something?).

    Either way, not holding my breath - there's people who do that for a living.

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    Part of the problem with most religious discussions is that people (on both sides) tend to use "religion" and "Christianity" (or perhaps "Christianity/Judaism/Islam") interchangeably. Evidence of extraterrestrial life would be problematic for fundamentalist Christians, Jews, and Muslims, but it would just join the mountain of other scientific evidence that they have to either rationalize or ignore/deny. It would be less of an issue for, say, Catholics and mainstream Protestants (as already noted, the Vatican has made an official statement), and no problem at all for Hindus, Buddhists, Mormons, and Scientologists.

    Last edited by Elwell; March 7th, 2011 at 07:33 PM.

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    people who cry over religion are just as annoying as the religious zealots they whine about.

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    Quote Originally Posted by zwarrior View Post
    people who cry over religion are just as annoying as the religious zealots they whine about.
    People who cry about other people who cry about other people who cry about other people who cry about....

    We're not really getting anywhere are we.

    In any case I think that focusing on space is not only a really cool thing to do, but it would be really awesome for mankind in general. Nothing unites people better than a simple task. If you see how crazy people get at the world cup imagine that same fervor with regard to developing whole new technologies for traveling space. I wish I could have Ripley as my girlfriend. She'd kill all the aliens.

    I've always felt that we'd never be completely united as a species until there's an alien race to battle with. While that sounds silly to some, you can see it in a lot of popular sci-fi. Racism tends to disintegrate once we're fighting weird tentacled bugs. So lets get out there find those Aliens. We're gonna have to leave earth eventually (well some of us.) Lets go overpopulate and destroy the environments of other worlds. There's a whole host of new disease and awesome crap to find on other planets tooo!

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    People who cry about other people who cry about other people who cry about other people who cry about....

    We're not really getting anywhere are we.
    as long as we're all aware that the same people who constantly bitch about the same subject in every thread are annoying, we're getting somewhere.

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    Quote Originally Posted by zwarrior View Post
    as long as we're all aware that the same people who constantly bitch about the same subject in every thread are annoying, we're getting somewhere.
    Oh teh ironies.


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    Quote Originally Posted by Aly Fell View Post
    Surely this is an example of science 'pass'? Science is extremely good at self regulation, taking criticism and policing. The moment a researcher comes up with a 'discovery' or 'theory', there are a host of others prepared to take that theory apart to look for the cracks. That's the thing about evidence, it's its own proof.
    Heh, of course.

    I didn't mean the scientific process as whole somehow failed, I meant this guy failed at performing science, instead resorting to pseudo-science, where he resorted to pretty subjective and qualitative methods to help push an idea he is in favour of, regardless of evidence.

    His paper doesn't merit being called science, and certainly not a theory except maybe in the colloquial sense of the word.
    Thus, "science" fail, with science in quotation marks.

    Quote Originally Posted by Prometheus|ANJ View Post
    And science fail from the source, I guess.
    yarp, that is what I meant.

    Last edited by Oden; March 8th, 2011 at 12:14 AM.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lhune View Post
    Doubt that; the die-hards will never believe evidence was found.

    Not very shocking news in my opinion; of course there's alien life out there. There are as many stars in the universe as there are grains of sand on the Earth, and lots of those stars have a system of planets like our own solar system. I seriously doubt that of all of those billions upon billions of planets, we're the only one to have life.

    Now if only they found an alien that was far bigger than that, -that- would be news.
    how does it disprove there is a god though? i'm not too religious myself, but I'm not atheist either, I can't see how this would somehow change anything. What if a god created a universe? religion is man made, but the idea of a god isn't a totally unbelievable idea like some people think.

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    Quote Originally Posted by gjpetch View Post
    Well, denying the relationship between humans and other apes could be described as self centered and self-important. A literal interpretation of scripture places man at the center of the universe, the very literalism you're saying has been abandoned since Copernicus. Nevermind that Galileo was examined by the inquisition decades after the death of Copernicus, that their work was withheld by the the catholic church fur another hundred years or so, nevermind that an apology to Galileo didn't come till 2000, nevermind that Ratzinger said in 1990 "The Church at the time of Galileo kept much more closely to reason than did Galileo himself" and "Her verdict against Galileo was rational and just". Abandoned since the 16th century? You mad?
    I'm well aware of the history of the church's ignorance, my statement was made for simplicity's sake and its point stands. The official position of the Catholic church does not represent the opinion of most theists.

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    Liffey, Catholicism is the largest christian denomination, for you to dismiss it seems disingenuous.
    I'm all too happy to acknowledge that there are plenty of enlightened modern theists of various faiths, but there are also those who cling to outdated aspects of scripture.

    Anyway, it's really an unimportant point that I shouldn't have bothered arguing in the first place, and I've probably gone too far. (I said "you mad?" as a joke, but I'm thinking now that it could have come off as really insulting, sorry if that's the case Liffey!)

    One additional point I would like to make: religion is commonly exempt from the level of scrutiny that all other aspects of life are subjected, so consequently even the slightest criticism seems shocking, outrageous, like outright bashing. Whereas in reality, that level of "bashing" would seem unremarkable if directed towards music, art, food, movies, fashion, politics, etc. Are those matters less weighty? Not to the Musician, Artist, Cook, Politician, etc. who has devoted their life to that subject. My point being that the unfair "bashing" people are complaining about may be nothing more an illusion.

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    Wait so that picture up top is a picture of an earth bacterium? Just as an illustration? Way to be misleading..

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    Quote Originally Posted by Serpian View Post
    Wait so that picture up top is a picture of an earth bacterium? Just as an illustration? Way to be misleading..
    Yep, that's a real terrestrial bacterium. Not alien. In the article these are interspersed with photos of structures that the author thinks look like bacteria. Except they are not the same size. And the photos are not the same scale. And things like those can occur in minerals naturally.

    This piece of "research" also was not affiliated to NASA, AFAIK.

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    Came in ready for a discussion about aliens, came out having my religion politely bashed. Gah! Can't you people ever stay on topic?

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