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Thread: Confused about gesture drawing

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    Quote Originally Posted by Conniekat8 View Post
    I think the reason this gets dissected so much is for the purpose of attempting to teach it to people who don't fully get it intuitively.

    .... and for art critics and analysts to have something to do....
    I think it's more about that people need to know what they are doing, I think of it like a job description. Art is skilled labor, anyone working as an artist must be clear on what those skills are. I'm writing this to clarify my thoughts, and I'm also annoyed at the ambiguity of the word "gesture".
    All styles follow rules. Some styles are more useful in the profession of concept art than others. I take it for granted that most people here will agree that Reilly style is more useful for our purposes than Van Gogh style. In regards to that KChen diagram, I don't think much of it, it's just a tip regarding linear harmony and extension(both of these are explanable). It's useful for people who want to work in that style. Some observations are more valuable than others, I think it's the job of teachers to point these things out.
    At the most basic when we say gesture we mean movements taken in response to nature: outer nature, and human nature. These movements are both caused by, and are intended to have effects on nature. In Niccolaide's example "a man ties his shoe". The cause of the action was the untied shoe and the goal of the action was the tied shoe. In everyday life we usually just say "what happened" or in the case of sports we will say "who's winning".
    There are certain actions that are universal, that show themselves in specific situations. Even the blind smile when they are happy, and frown when they are sad. It doesn't only happen in the face but throughout the whole body. I don't think there's anything mind blowing in these statements.
    So taking the general situation of "grieving" we can set out to find the general way the body will compose itself in it, and this can be abstracted in x number of ways. Here is a planar analysis of the gesture of grief in a William A Smith drawing:

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    This is a typical pose taken when in extreme emotional pain.

    That gesture was the focus of his composition.
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    But diagrams aren't drawings. In Niccolaide's examples the main goal of the drawing is not that it just describe the guy tying his shoe, but actually become it, to embody it something like a voodoo doll.

    It's often said that the gesture, and I mean it here only as movements that people do in reaction to nature, is the beginning of the drawing. This is not true, especially in concept art where poses are chosen only to show of the design of the character. This can be likened to a bodybuilder who takes a double bicep pose only to show off his physical develpment. A fat guy can also mimic the posture, but without thickness, seperation, vascularity, and peak, in a word details, it will only be a parody of the real pose.

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    This week the classes started again, and I'm taking life drawing again (just credit/no credit) to force myself to keep practicing. We had about an hour long lecture about gesture drawings before starting to draw.

    The teacher showed gestures from several books, some from Loomis, some from Villpu, and about three or four other books, showing various styles of gestures, some varying in lice speed and quality, some adding values, some showing more edge, others more scribbly... etc etc. There are many ways to capture a gesture.

    What is common to all is that 1. you can see it;s a human figure, and you can tell what it;s doing. Is it slouching, it is posing, it is stretching, etc etc...

    The longer the gesture pose, the more detail you would have a chance to depict.

    The session started with a model doing a very slow mostion set of poises, where the model is contimuously moving, and you're scribbling on the page very fast and loose sort of trying to record it's movements.... to warm up what to watch for and hand/eye coordination. Then we did sets of 30 sec. 1 min and 5 min gestures. Each progressively capturing more detail, and more proportional refinement.

    Main focus to start with, as the teacher explained was to get us in a habit of working from general to specific. Pick up the general 'blob' in first few seconds to get you started, then start correcting and refining from there.

    Much of the detail that you tend to focus on, is exactly what the teacher DOESN'T want us to do while doing gestures.

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    "Much of the detail that you tend to focus on, is exactly what the teacher DOESN'T want us to do while doing gestures."

    I don't know what you're talking about here.

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    Quote Originally Posted by armando View Post
    "Much of the detail that you tend to focus on, is exactly what the teacher DOESN'T want us to do while doing gestures."

    I don't know what you're talking about here.
    stuff like this "It's often said that the gesture, and I mean it here only as movements that people do in reaction to nature, is the beginning of the drawing. This is not true, especially in concept art where poses are chosen only to show of the design of the character. This can be likened to a bodybuilder who takes a double bicep pose only to show off his physical develpment. A fat guy can also mimic the posture, but without thickness, seperation, vascularity, and peak, in a word details, it will only be a parody of the real pose."


    Let's say you;re walking down a loong gallery of statues in various poses. Instead of looking at the nearest statue first, you look at the farthest, which may be 200 or more feet away. All you can see at that distance is a hint of a body posture, what it may be doing in very general terms. You may see it's a large human body leaning over. You can't really tell yet if it's fat, or muscular, or dressed in a number of clothing layers, or maybe carrying something, or leaning over something.

    Or, you stand back ans squint... you mostly see a silhouette and a hint of lights and darks. That's the primary idea of a gesture. Capture the very first impression. Even a skill observer can't pick up a lot of detail in the first 1-3 seconds of the observation. They pick up the general mood, feel of what they see. Details start getting more resolved with longer observations.

    One of the reasons gestures were even developed, so I gather is that many artists, and especially art students tend to get lost in the detail, long before they learn to capture that first impression really well.

    I suppose it can be a lot like getting your proportions all wonky in the initial stages of still life drawing and painting. You get the initial stuff off, no matter what else you do to it, it's still going to look off.

    Gestures, as we use them are there to train you to pick things up fast. Why... because people (And same apparently applies to animals) tend to move around, and when you see something, you better get it before it goes away.

    Very skilled figure artists can actually fill just about everything after the gesture from memory, from knowing how to draw humans, from their study of anatomy and proportions and understanding of the body mechanics and musculature.

    It trains your observational skills to know what to look for first... Overall figure envelope, movement, height width, general positions of the limbs...
    For total noobs n the class today... we have a mix of people who had life drawing before, and those who never had it, he also emphasized that he wanted us to operate on a quick intuitive level, loosen up, don't try to control things (yet), get past the inhibitions. He likes to get the students to 'get something on the paper' first, then when he sees where each person is, he starts correcting and nudging them from there.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Conniekat8 View Post
    Let's say you;re walking down a loong gallery of statues in various poses.
    A teacher of mine used to judge our gestures across the room: if it is readable from a distance, it works...

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    Conniekat8: What I meant was that sometimes the design is more important than the pose. I'll just have to assume that people on conceptart.org know what I mean. I'm aware that it's impossible to draw a figure without a pose, technically the anatomical position is a pose. The Smith drawings and accompanying text make it blatantly clear that I was talking in generalities. The first part of the post was giving 1 definition of gesture, and the last part was commenting on that particular definition, meh too hard to explain on the net.
    I get what you are trying to say about "gesture", it's just that you don't need the word "gesture" for any of it. I said so much in my first post.

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    Quote Originally Posted by armando View Post
    I get what you are trying to say about "gesture", it's just that you don't need the word "gesture" for any of it. I said so much in my first post.
    I don't understand, why not call something gesture? Most people understand it to mean capturing the action or attitude of the pose. What else should it be called?

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    Quote Originally Posted by JeffX99 View Post
    I don't understand, why not call something gesture? Most people understand it to mean capturing the action or attitude of the pose. What else should it be called?
    Let's call it a snarffling, to avoid further confusion...

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    Quote Originally Posted by armando View Post
    Conniekat8: What I meant was that sometimes the design is more important than the pose.
    For what outcome? There are different reasons one would engage in drawing gestures. Sometimes it's for observational practice, sometimes it;s for study of particular motion or position, sometimes it's to build on for more elaborate studies, sometimes it's to start capturing info to build a more finished piece on it... Seems like each of those would lead the artist to shift focus and level of completion and refinement to suit the goal.

    Within the scope of this thread, I tend to think of a gesture as a figure drawing learning tool, or exercise, we're we're mostly noobs, and not ready to start factoring much in a way of design and refinement.

    A seasoned pro, I'm sure they can find dozens of different ways and reasons for which to use (or not use) gestures.

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    Original post was about the gesture confusion based on Nicolaides book.

    I really would like to differentiate the meaning of gesture in academic traditional drawing and the one used in Nicolaides (and others alike) books.

    I’m not ready for a long lecture (just came back from a long winter vacation), however just wanted to concentrate on the following question:

    What is the purpose of your doing such exercises? What’s the goal?

    If it’s for future animation work or for creating another Spider-Man, then something like Nicolaides will be probably a better choice.

    If it’s for studying traditional art disciplines, then academic school never was up to any kind of scribbles. They made students using models and studying anatomy to such level that they could depict any creature in any gesture, without any kind of scribbles, but yes - with lots of preparation work, studies, sketches, etc.

    At the same time, any artist during his own studies can make hundreds of sketches of all kinds of motions, gestures, movements, etc – for his final work. That’s his preparation and no one cares what kind of tools or methods he personally uses, we only want to see the result of his work.
    But again, academies would never accept any kind of mess in student’s works (including sketches), this is not the way the discipline was taught.

    Here are few samples showing gestures in academic works.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Book Guru View Post
    If it’s for future animation work or for creating another Spider-Man, then something like Nicolaides will be probably a better choice.
    Or another Hercules?

    Giovanni Battista di Matteo Naldini (1537-1591), Hercules and the Nemean lion, and Hercules and the cretan bull, pen and ink over black chalk.

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    By George, you've got it!
    Very nice example, indeed.

    But...

    Quod licet Jovi non licet bovi.
    (What Jupiter is allowed, the ox is not.)

    I'll quote myself:

    any artist during his own studies can make hundreds of sketches of all kinds of motions, gestures, movements, etc – for his final work.
    academies would never accept any kind of mess in student’s works (including sketches), this is not the way the discipline was taught.
    That is my point.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Book Guru View Post
    I’m not ready for a long lecture
    Thanks!

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    Quote Originally Posted by JeffX99 View Post
    I don't understand, why not call something gesture? Most people understand it to mean capturing the action or attitude of the pose. What else should it be called?
    Look back to what you said about the Reilly diagram. People mean a lot of things when they say gesture, I know what they mean but I have to do a translation in my head to figure it out, and Connie's definition is all over the place. A line diagraming the extension of an arm is not a gesture. An action has a beginning and an end. Imagine that extended arm as a punch, it could be a jab, a cross, or a hook. The path of motion in each case is different, even though the "line of action" will look the same. The same could be said about a twisted trunk, is it the beginning or the end of the action? It matters if you're thinking about the action, it doesn't if you're only concerned with the position of body parts. A gesture displays thoughts, feelings, and movements.
    If someone means "1.Overall figure envelope,2. movement,3 height width, 4.general positions of the limbs" then it's clearer to just say it. 1. is shape2. takes into account time and effort, and other physical experiences 3. is measurement 4. is the articulation of forms. Not everyone means these things when they say gesture.

    People are not at all clear on what Niccolaides meant, or what gestures are. http://www.conceptart.org/forums/sho...d.php?t=234377
    "Nicolaides, Loomis, Vilppu, Mattesi, Hampton are all aiming for the same thing,"
    They aren't.

    I don't understand why everyone is so rude to book guru.

    Last edited by armando; January 13th, 2012 at 02:46 PM.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Book Guru View Post
    If it’s for future animation work or for creating another Spider-Man, then something like Nicolaides will be probably a better choice.
    Walt Stanchfield would be a better choice for the animation field. While I find the Nicolaides gesture exercises interesting, the results aren't necessarily clear.

    In animation clarity is extremely important.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Book Guru View Post
    I'll quote myself:

    Quote:
    any artist during his own studies can make hundreds of sketches of all kinds of motions, gestures, movements, etc – for his final work.
    Quote:
    academies would never accept any kind of mess in student’s works (including sketches), this is not the way the discipline was taught.

    That is my point.

    Well, that was also the point I made a couple of pages back: the examples you gave of gesture drawing in the Russian academic tradition do not use gestural technique as it is understood in the West, based on Nicolaides. But I was fascinated to read your view that in the academic approach "no one cares about" how actual artists produce art!

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    Quote Originally Posted by armando View Post
    Look back to what you said about the Reilly diagram. People mean a lot of things when they say gesture, I know what they mean but I have to do a translation in my head to figure it out, and Connie's definition is all over the place. A line diagraming the extension of an arm is not a gesture. An action has a beginning and an end. Imagine that extended arm as a punch, it could be a jab, a cross, or a hook. The path of motion in each case is different, even though the "line of action" will look the same. The same could be said about a twisted trunk, is it the beginning or the end of the action? It matters if you're thinking about the action, it doesn't if you're only concerned with the position of body parts. A gesture displays thoughts, feelings, and movements.
    If someone means "1.Overall figure envelope,2. movement,3 height width, 4.general positions of the limbs" then it's clearer to just say it. 1. is shape2. takes into account time and effort, and other physical experiences 3. is measurement 4. is the articulation of forms. Not everyone means these things when they say gesture.

    People are not at all clear on what Niccolaides meant, or what gestures are. http://www.conceptart.org/forums/sho...d.php?t=234377
    "Nicolaides, Loomis, Vilppu, Mattesi, Hampton are all aiming for the same thing,"
    They aren't.
    Right...what I said I still stand by because most of that diagram is not a good example of action and indicates focusing on details, minior curves, etc. rather than "gesture" as a whole...not saying it's wrong in its specifics...just a bad example. Much better were posted later.

    I agree that most of the time we understand each other when we say "gesture", which is why I question the need for a different term or some lengthy explanation.

    I disagree that the artists you list aren't aiming for the same thing in gesture...the specifics may shift a bit but ultimately most artists understand the term to simply mean capturing the essence of the action or pose. I'm guessing all those guys are doing that in their gesture.

    Merriam-Webster definition: 2: a movement usually of the body or limbs that expresses or emphasizes an idea, sentiment, or attitude

    Basically what I'm trying to say is if you (generic you) don't mean capturing the essence of the pose then you don't really understand gesture, as most artists use the term. Are there going to be slight variations of interpreation and understanding within that definition? Of course, but no more than if we use "snarffle".

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    Quote Originally Posted by armando View Post
    People are not at all clear on what Niccolaides meant, or what gestures are. http://www.conceptart.org/forums/sho...d.php?t=234377
    "Nicolaides, Loomis, Vilppu, Mattesi, Hampton are all aiming for the same thing,"
    They aren't.
    You read that line a bit different than I do. I believe what the message was getting at is that all of those people are aiming to draw well, and they all have different routes they take to that goal. What route an individual takes, one of those or a different one, really comes down to that individual's preferences and strengths.

    As far as Nicolaides and gesture goes, I respect the fact that he came up with the concept first, although I find that the book based on his work isn't as clear on the concept as it could be. That said, him being the originator doesn't mean he's the best, nor does it mean that the idea couldn't be improved upon by others or adapted for different uses, which in fact is what I believe has happened. No slight on Nicolaides, that's just how the development of knowledge goes.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Book Guru View Post
    If it’s for future animation work or for creating another Spider-Man, then something like Nicolaides will be probably a better choice.
    Here in the US, AFAIK, everyone that goes to an accredited foundation program (I have to look up the accreditation agency that accredits top school, forget the name off the top of my head), takes figure drawing in the first year, long before they are completely clear what direction they will take... design, illustration, media, game, film, television, animation or fine arts.

    In beginning figure drawing AFAIK, everyone gets exposed to, and learns gesture drawing (among many other things).


    Quote Originally Posted by armando View Post
    People mean a lot of things when they say gesture, I know what they mean but I have to do a translation in my head to figure it out, and Connie's definition is all over the place.
    Of course they do mean a lot of little things, it's a practice of capturing the generalities of figure drawing, which can encompass many style nuances.
    You're tying to get very specific with something that isn't as specific as you are trying to define it.

    It's a little bit like... people are talking about cars, and you are asking, but if it's red, and it has certain size wheels, is it still a car, or should it be called something a bit different. What if it's meant for four wheeling and isn't as practical for daily commute, is it still a car? What if you use it only for weekend trips, is it still a car? What if someone made it blue, and painted it with pink stripes and put a tennis ball on the antenna, is it still a car?

    Last edited by Conniekat8; January 13th, 2012 at 10:58 PM.
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    A little bit off topic but here's a similar sentiment on what book guru was saying about accuracy, from John Ruskin, who taught an extremely painstaking method of drawing "What is usually so much sought after under the term "freedom" is the character of the drawing of a great master in a hurry, whose hand is so thoroughly disciplined, that when pressed for time he can let it fly as it will, and it will not go far wrong. But the hand of a great master at real work is never free: it's swiftest dash is under perfect government. Paul Veronese or Tintoret could pause within a hair's breadth of any appointed mark, in their fastest touches; and follow, within a hair's breadth, the previously intended curve. You must never, therefore, aim at freedom. It is not required of your drawing that it should be free, but that it should be right; in time you will be able to do right easily, and then your work will be free in the best sense; but there is no merit in doing wrong easily." But as other's have said, it's up to the artist to choose how they want to work, and who they want to learn from. It's important that people have a choice.

    "a movement usually of the body or limbs that expresses or emphasizes an idea, sentiment, or attitude" Signs performed with the body. In drawing it's mostly signs performed with graphics.

    After thinking on this topic some more the way I see it is that there are basically 3 different concepts of what a gesture is.
    1. merely the positioning of body parts in a clearly visible way
    2. the revelation of thoughts and ideas through actions
    3. the giving of life to a medium though inspired performance

    Take a look at contrapposto: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Contrapposto

    An artist working on level 1 will see only the decorative arrangment of forms. As an artist moves towards level 2, I'll just quote directly from the article:
    "Contrapposto was an extremely important sculptural development for it is the first time in Western art that the human body is used to express a psychological disposition. The balanced, harmonious pose of the Kritios Boy suggests a calm and relaxed state of mind, an evenness of temperament that is part of the ideal of man represented. From this point onwards Greek sculptors went on to explore how the body could convey the whole range of human experience, culminating in the desperate anguish and pathos of Laocoön and his Sons (1st century AD) in the Hellenistic period."

    They realize that certain general poses tend to give certain effects. Contrapposto is the name of a gesture. The gesture of grief could be called dolorepposto. If you have to, and you shouldn't, type grieving into google images and look at the repetition of similar poses. The hanging of the head at a funeral is a ritualization of this natural pose.

    At level 3, the level that Niccolaides tries to teach, the artist aims to make the work into an avatar. It's not just just a description, like what I did in the planar analysis, but the art work in a way becomes the thing itself. Niccolaides takes the medium into account, but the impression of life on the imagination of the artist is always given priority, whereas at level 2 the knowledge is still used in a mechanical sort of way "I'll just lower the head and that will automatically make this look sad" at level 3 everything is meaningful, the head is lowered in a specific way and it's drawn in a specific way in a specific medium in a specific part of the picture, everything is taken beyond what you can find in nature, level 2 generalizes while level 3 creates. Michelangelo's David is an example of an avatar.

    Last edited by armando; January 13th, 2012 at 11:09 PM.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Conniekat8 View Post
    Of course they do mean a lot of little things, it's a practice of capturing the generalities of figure drawing, which can encompass many style nuances.
    You're tying to get very specific with something that isn't as specific as you are trying to define it.

    It's a little bit like... people are talking about cars, and you are asking, but if it's red, and it has certain size wheels, is it still a car, or should it be called something a bit different. What if it's meant for four wheeling and isn't as practical for daily commute, is it still a car? What if you use it only for weekend trips, is it still a car? What if someone made it blue, and painted it with pink stripes and put a tennis ball on the antenna, is it still a car?
    I don't have the energy to correct you. A car is something specific, this list of yours isn't, figure it out.""Overall figure envelope movement, height width, general positions of the limbs" "

    edit: it's just like I said at the beginning of the thread. What you mean when you say "gesture" is just a muddle of ideas. Height and width are not gesture... Like I said at the beginning of thread a confused conception in the gaseous state cannot be argued with because nothing is really there.

    Last edited by armando; January 14th, 2012 at 01:25 AM.
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    Quote Originally Posted by armando View Post
    I don't have the energy to correct you. A car is something specific, this list isn't, figure it out.""Overall figure envelope movement, height width, general positions of the limbs" "
    Car is a material piece of machinery, which is why I picked it to create an analogy that is easier to understand. Gestural drawing is a more abstract concept used in teaching of figure drawing.
    The point of analogy is to illustrate the level of generality of the term.

    Car can be used for a number of functions that a car can fulfill, beyond general purpose of taking you from a point A to a point B.

    Gestural figure drawing can also be used for a number of purposes, beyond a general purpose of being used in figure drawing.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Conniekat8 View Post
    Here in the US, AFAIK, everyone that goes to an accredited foundation program (I have to look up the accreditation agency that accredits top school, forget the name off the top of my head), takes figure drawing in the first year, long before they are completely clear what direction they will take... design, illustration, media, game, film, television, animation or fine arts.

    In beginning figure drawing AFAIK, everyone gets exposed to, and learns gesture drawing (among many other things).
    Figure Drawing class =/= learning gesture drawing. A lot of my early life-drawing classes generally played more along the lines of sight-sizing, without any kind of gesture/lay-in. (It wasn't until I was in an animation program which had a specific life-drawing class did I learn gesture.) YMMV.

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    Quote Originally Posted by rabbit run View Post
    Figure Drawing class =/= learning gesture drawing. A lot of my early life-drawing classes generally played more along the lines of sight-sizing, without any kind of gesture/lay-in. (It wasn't until I was in an animation program which had a specific life-drawing class did I learn gesture.) YMMV.
    Ha, Interesting. Thanks for that info.

    Just for clarification of where my statements stem from, places that I've been exposed to so far, personally or anecdotal, gestures are one of the first things they teach you in college level beginning drawing.
    That would include my local college, and schools that I researched in consideration of transfer

    I've seriously looked into Pasadena Art Center, Otis, CSU Long Beach, LCAD, and few others on a more anecdotal level.

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    Quote Originally Posted by armando View Post
    At level 3, the level that Niccolaides tries to teach, the artist aims to make the work into an avatar. It's not just just a description, like what I did in the planar analysis, but the art work in a way becomes the thing itself. Niccolaides takes the medium into account, but the impression of life on the imagination of the artist is always given priority, whereas at level 2 the knowledge is still used in a mechanical sort of way "I'll just lower the head and that will automatically make this look sad" at level 3 everything is meaningful, the head is lowered in a specific way and it's drawn in a specific way in a specific medium in a specific part of the picture, everything is taken beyond what you can find in nature, level 2 generalizes while level 3 creates. Michelangelo's David is an example of an avatar.
    So which level would you classify Vilppu's approach to gesture under?

    @ Nezumi: I thought the concept of gesture already exists centuries before Nicolaides' time and artists were already aware and using it.

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    Gesture in the simplest term is the relationship between things.

    That relationship between two objects can be seen as the "action", " stretch and pinch contrast", "weight", "scale", etc.


    It is usually the relationship between the two forms that we care about and it is what gives the objects context and meaning (or function).

    Without gesture, what we are drawing is only isolated objects and we are not seeing the bigger picture.


    Like how Glenn Vilppu like to put it, "Draw verbs, not nouns~!!"


    Gesture is in everything and there are big and small gestures in a figure.


    On my diagram, it is my attempt to show a student how to ignore the surface muscular details and see the bigger underlying relationships (action line, and general tapering design of the arm).

    Until the student can see that, it will be hard for me to teach them how to simplify the spine (ignore details) and see the bigger relationship of how everything relates to its simple actions.

    (they will get too caught up in complex details which makes the simpler relationships harder to see).


    The handout you have is only one page out of several pages of gesture notes. Which follows with a section on how to break up the spine gesture with the same idea and how the arms and legs follows through or counters the spine movement.


    This arm gesture line example was taught to me by Steve Houston, who like to keep things to its simplest idea when he teaches.

    You can also find many similar notes by Walt Stanchfield in his book, "Drawn to Life".


    Hope this will help clear things up a little

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    Quote Originally Posted by KChen View Post
    Like how Glenn Vilppu like to put it, "Draw verbs, not nouns~!!"
    I believe that one is attributed to Stanchfield...

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    Quote Originally Posted by Xeon_OND View Post
    So which level would you classify Vilppu's approach to gesture under?

    @ Nezumi: I thought the concept of gesture already exists centuries before Nicolaides' time and artists were already aware and using it.
    Possibly true, I don't really know. I don't know of anyone before Nicolaides who had it as an exercise for students and put it down on paper, but on the other hand I don't know everything and could easily be wrong about that.

    In any case, I do believe there are more effective and clear approaches to gesture that have come along that built on what Nicolaides taught his students, so I think I'm safe to say that the modern approach to gesture came through him.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Xeon_OND View Post

    @ Nezumi: I thought the concept of gesture already exists centuries before Nicolaides' time and artists were already aware and using it.
    Yes. They were called "Croquis". According to an online dictionary the first known use of that word (which is French) was in 1805. There's probably a dozen other words in as many languages for the same thing. Nicolaides may have been the first to put down those exercises in a book and given it the term "gesture" but the general concept has been around for a long time.

    EDIT: Some schools around me (PAFA and UArts) still actually refer to them as "croquis."

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    Quote Originally Posted by Nezumi Works View Post
    In any case, I do believe there are more effective and clear approaches to gesture that have come along that built on what Nicolaides taught his students, so I think I'm safe to say that the modern approach to gesture came through him.
    Nicolaides is one of the very few people I would love to spend some time with, asking some questions, hoping to get answers. I often wonder what Nicolaides would say if he read us, walked into our life drawing classes, or just had lived for a fair amount of time. I feel the man is horribly ill-understood, not in the least by me...

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