Space Environ - arrangement input?

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    Space Environ - arrangement input?

    I'm thinking this piece is about done. I had to take a break from my dragon piece for a bit. The only thing I'm not too sure about is the arrangement of the planet's two satellites. I need to keep them in the same plane, but I want them to look dynamic. I moved them around a few dozen times before settling on this arrangement, and now I think I've studied it too long to see it clearly anymore.

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    It's the usual thing with stereotypical "space art": Too May Orbs(tm). Look at our Solar system: there's virtually no vantage point where you'd see two satellites in this kind of proximity. The only way to get a view like this is have two sizable planetoids in orbits that are as close together as the Moon-Earth distance. They'll be out of that arrangement in no time, because every time they pass each other they'll pull each other out of the orbits a little. Also, you have these two extremely close orbits very far from the gas giant. Generally you'd expect such tight arrangements near the big body, not far from it.

    The lighting suggests that either one or both of these moons are out of the gas giant's orbital plane. Even worse plausibility.

    You've smudged the living hell out of the clouds on that gas giant. And the clouds don't follow the form.

    And... seriously, aurora? Visible on the night side with the day side in view? Visible on the day side? Do you have any idea how faint aurora is, and why you don't see it in daylight?

    Do your research.

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    Ack, is that the smudge tool I see? xD

    Anyways, space is a weird place with no reference points / atmosphere to muddle things....That planet on the left could be a few hundred thousand KM away, or a good fraction of an AU if it's massive enough. We just have no way of knowing unless you set up some sort of reference.

    In regards to the moon... I'd make the shadow it's casting have a higher eccentricity (more elliptical)

    edit : In response to the above post .. who the hell says he's trying to make a photorealistic and scientifically accurate representation of space? Space is fucking boring. That's why any space scene you see will be over the top... Also lightning has nothing to do with the orbit plane. Typically planets will be on the ecliptic plane due to how they're formed, but any captured planet / moon doesn't have to follow that rule...

    Last edited by clarithium; January 19th, 2011 at 03:51 AM.
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    Hi Eclectix

    i dont know that much about space, but check out NASA's image gallery
    http://www.nasa.gov/multimedia/imagegallery/iotd.html

    there is a lot of beautiful images of space that might help you improve your drawing.

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    Four moons photographed in transit across Saturn: http://moderateleft.com/?p=5318

    Regarding the aurora: http://panoramicuniverse.com/blue-au...rn-south-pole/

    I appreciate that the clouds are hazy, but this is not unrealistic. Look at a photograph of the visible spectrum of Venus or Uranus for instance. However, now that it is brought to my attention, it does seem a bit uninteresting. I think I'll add a few more defined clouds with twists and defined edges.

    clarithium: I considered giving the moon's shadow a more elliptical shape, but my research indicated that this is actually not the norm. However, in hindsight, most of the photos I looked at were lit more or less directly. It is hard to find references from a side-lit planet with a moon shadow, but after your post I looked some more and turned up one which indicates you are correct (thank you):http://www.photosfan.com/images/saturn-moon-titan.jpg

    Upon further thought, though, it should be impossible for a moon caught in frame to cast a shadow on its parent planet unless either A) the moon is ridiculously (impossibly) close in orbit to the planet, or B) the scene is lit more or less directly. Perhaps I should get rid of the shadow completely, though it pleases me esthetically.

    Bette: Thanks for the link

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    I have removed the shadow and moved the position of the smaller satellite along with it. I also reduced the size of the smaller moon to give a better balance. I completely repainted the planet's surface to give it more detail and make it more interesting, and I added a bit more color to the nebulous cloud in the background.

    Any feedback before I move onto the next thing?

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    while i understand why you made the background nebula the way you did, i think you should paint it by hand. It just looks better that way. Here's a good explanation :

    http://coldflame1987.deviantart.com/...ebula-19068039

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    There's no way any feature on the lit side of the gas giant could be as dark as its night side. I'd suggest to lower the contrast and make it brighter.

    The cloud texture is crisper, but now it looks like wood grain. Not a major step into the right direction.

    As for aurora, seriously, the Saturn picture you posted is a false-color image. The aurora was not even in the same photo with the planet; it was imaged separately and superimposed on a different shot of Saturn. Aurora is way, way too faint to compete with daylight even at Saturn's distance from the sun; and Saturn's aurora can only be seen in UV range. It's invisible to our eyes. Do your homework.

    To whoever thinks that "space is boring": space is fascinating, and you should present it to reflect that it is fascinating, but let's stop at "make up random special effects to make it less boring", n'kay?

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    Space is relative. There is no possible way of knowing how bright the day side is, (how far from the light source, how bright the light source, what spectrum the light source is comprised of, etc) let alone know how bright something must be to be visible in its light or how dark it may or may not be.
    Black spots on Jupiter: http://www.google.com/imgres?imgurl=...1t:429,r:5,s:0
    I won't get into a discussion about the artistic value of composite images using infrared, X-ray, gamma, and ultraviolet light converted into colors that are visible to humans, because almost all of the beautiful colorful space images we see these days are produced this way. I appreciate your honest critique regarding the aurora, but I'm simply going to choose not to take your advice this time around. If I am truly interested in what is possible, I'll talk to an astrophysicist about the remotely plausible. As has been established regarding multiple satellites in frame of the planet, you are no astrophysicist.

    clarithium: Thanks for the tut link. Until I can get a pressure-sensitive tablet and an appropriate software, it is not very practical for me to try and make something organic like that with brushes. Hopefully soon I'll be able to save up for the right equipment.

    Last edited by Eclectix; January 20th, 2011 at 12:45 PM. Reason: updated link
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    I see you aren't interested in verisimilitude and just want it to look "cool". OK.

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    I think you should listen to arenhaus on this one. Lower the contrast of the lit side and get rid of the aurora. Also the nebula neatly fits within the frame of the picture. Naturally it would spill out of frame in some places. Also I would make the larger moon smaller and give it a different look, (maybe ice?) to emphasize the size and colour of the gas planet. The clouds do look better after you repainted it but you could still make it more realistic.
    Flexibility is very important.

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    Thanks for the crits!
    Changes from last version:

    Cropped canvas to improve composition and allow nebula to flow off edges (good call)

    Added more detail to planet surface, and lightened and adjusted colors. After more consideration I decided that the dark black spots did indeed look too much like shadows on the planet.

    Larger moon reduced in size

    I'm still keeping the aurora.

    I originally wanted this to be just a quick diversion but I've learned a lot in the process of improving it. I appreciate the input.

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    Quote Originally Posted by arenhaus View Post
    There's no way any feature on the lit side of the gas giant could be as dark as its night side. I'd suggest to lower the contrast and make it brighter.

    The cloud texture is crisper, but now it looks like wood grain. Not a major step into the right direction.

    As for aurora, seriously, the Saturn picture you posted is a false-color image. The aurora was not even in the same photo with the planet; it was imaged separately and superimposed on a different shot of Saturn. Aurora is way, way too faint to compete with daylight even at Saturn's distance from the sun; and Saturn's aurora can only be seen in UV range. It's invisible to our eyes. Do your homework.

    To whoever thinks that "space is boring": space is fascinating, and you should present it to reflect that it is fascinating, but let's stop at "make up random special effects to make it less boring", n'kay?

    I'm not saying space itself is boring- I love space, and have been studying astronomy / cosmology, and one day I hope to be a serious amateur astronomer.

    But! With the exclusion of certain objects, space IS boring when you look at it with the naked eye. The beauty of space lies in spectroscopy.

    All space paintings / cg you see are essentially romanticizations of real space...

    Example :

    Pretty much all nebulae you see in pictures are false colored / really long exposures.

    4 second true color exposure of orion nebula : http://www.astropix.com/HTML/SHOW_DI...ar_Cluster.HTM
    Imagine it 4 times dimmer, and that's what it really looks like.

    What people think the orion nebula looks like : http://apod.nasa.gov/apod/image/0601/m42_hst_f.jpg
    Beautiful? Yes. Realistic? No.

    Would you want to paint the first one in the name of realism? Hell no.

    TLDR; There is no such thing as a 'realistic' space painting... Basically any space painting you see has random special effects thrown in.

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    It gets better with each iteration. Just a minor suggestion, food for thought. Space is all about, well, space right? And by that I mean distance. I just think this image would benefit from a more horizontal image layout. By adding more space to the left and right of the image, you increase the cool isolation aspect of space.
    Not a big deal, it looks great as it is.

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    Hey I think the last version looks much better. I'd add some more randomness and detail to the nebula but not too much then you would distract from the planet.

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