What Happened to ConceptArt.org?
Join the #1 Art Workshop - LevelUpJoin Premium Art Workshop

Page 1 of 3 1 2 3 LastLast
Results 1 to 30 of 61
  1. #1
    Join Date
    Mar 2008
    Location
    Tokyo, Japan
    Posts
    382
    Thanks
    380
    Thanked 164 Times in 99 Posts
    Follows
    0
    Following
    0

    What Happened to ConceptArt.org?

    I know going into this discussion that this topic will most likely not be a very popular subject but still, I feel the need to bring it up as for that past few months visiting this site, I have grown more and more disappointed in what I've found.

    What the hell happened around here?!!

    Specifically regarding the Finally Finished section and the huge drop in the quality of work that is now allowed to be displayed there. When I first visited these forums a little over 2 years ago, the FF section was scary; It was a place for professional-level or near professional-level artists to post their work and anyone... ANYONE who wasn't quite up to scratch was quickly moved to the WIP/Critique sub-forums to get some feedback. It was scary but it was also awesome and very motivating. Achieving that level of art should be scary, it should be difficult as all the best things in life are worth working hard for. I don't think my own art would have improved as much as it did these past 2 years if it wasn't for the fear and motivation I felt about ever posting in the Finally Finished area. Even now, I don't think my own work cuts it...

    I also feel sorry for the skilled professional artists who post their work in that section only to have it fall away quickly to the 2nd or 3rd page due to someone who really needs to practice more or even go back to the basics, bumping their own thread back to the top (I should add that my intention here is not to call these people out, I really believe they would benefit as much, if not more than anyone to have some fear and trepidation about posting 'finished' work).

    The ConceptArt.org 'Finally Finished' section should be an online representation of what someone should expect from a Professional job interview or portfolio review - like it used to be.

    DeviantArt is for back-pats and crotch-grabs, ConceptArt.org is for making art professionals!

    Reply With Quote Reply With Quote  

  2. The Following User Says Thank You to NeecHMonkeY For This Useful Post:


  3. #2
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Posts
    1,819
    Thanks
    1,540
    Thanked 1,837 Times in 521 Posts
    Follows
    0
    Following
    0
    I agree to some of the things you've said

    Reply With Quote Reply With Quote  

  4. #3
    dpaint's Avatar
    dpaint is offline Registered User Level 16 Gladiator: Spartacus' Retiarii
    Join Date
    Sep 2009
    Location
    Virginia
    Posts
    4,658
    Thanks
    2,628
    Thanked 5,889 Times in 2,359 Posts
    Follows
    0
    Following
    0
    I'm seeing the opposite thing with sketchbooks where people are posting things that are clearly not sketches. Rendering the snot out of something for days isn't a sketch and you aren't fooling anybody by posting stuff like that.

    Reply With Quote Reply With Quote  

  5. The Following 4 Users Say Thank You to dpaint For This Useful Post:


  6. #4
    Join Date
    Apr 2005
    Location
    USA
    Posts
    2,888
    Thanks
    752
    Thanked 3,153 Times in 1,067 Posts
    Follows
    0
    Following
    0
    I thought the FF section was for finished and polished work. Not some shrine dedicated to some grand ideal of art only achievable by the elite. You can't honestly expect people who aren't masters to not do any finished work. Of course there's room for improvement but if someone makes a finished piece to the absolute best of their current ability, let 'em throw it up. Any perceived drop in quality is probably due to either to yourself getting better and being able to recognize mistakes more easily. Either that or people were tired of low activity in the FF section because only professionals were allowed to post.

    There has to be a balance between using the great among us to inspire and making mastery seem accessible to the students. You don't want to create a small group of elites and then use them to alienate anyone who works hard but isn't quite there yet.

    "Astronomy offers an aesthetic indulgence not duplicated in any other field. This is not an academic or hypothetical attraction and should require no apologies, for the beauty to be found in the skies has been universally appreciated for unrecorded centuries."
    Reply With Quote Reply With Quote  

  7. The Following 3 Users Say Thank You to s.ketch For This Useful Post:


  8. #5
    Join Date
    Nov 2007
    Location
    Indiana,USA
    Posts
    1,204
    Thanks
    770
    Thanked 463 Times in 225 Posts
    Follows
    0
    Following
    0
    Dpaint.....Sketchbooks Is like a defult catagory for a body of someones work here on CA. Its main purpose is to have one place to dump all your work instead of completely spreading it thin. I think no ones came to Conceptart.org to fool everyone into thinking a finished painting is a sketch

    Last edited by Demo; July 20th, 2010 at 11:56 PM.
    ~You should never doubt what nobody is sure about~


    Demo's Digital Damsels

    Reply With Quote Reply With Quote  

  9. The Following 11 Users Say Thank You to Demo For This Useful Post:

    + Show/Hide list of the thanked


  10. #6
    Join Date
    Jul 2010
    Location
    Pretoria, South Africa
    Posts
    177
    Thanks
    12
    Thanked 79 Times in 54 Posts
    Follows
    0
    Following
    0
    I haven't been here long enough to be able to say whether the board has gotten better or worse. But I would hope that standards will be kept up. I have searched far and wide for a place where one can get real feedback instead of effusive but essentially unhelpful praise.

    Reply With Quote Reply With Quote  

  11. #7
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Posts
    1,819
    Thanks
    1,540
    Thanked 1,837 Times in 521 Posts
    Follows
    0
    Following
    0
    Quote Originally Posted by Demo View Post
    .....Sketchbooks Is like a defult catagory for a body of someones work here on CA. Its main purpose is to have one place to dump all your work instead of completely spreading it thin. I think no ones came to Conceptart.org to fool everyone into thinking a finished painting is a sketch.
    with that said, the Art Registry + portfolio section is completely useless. Anything posted in it would fit just as well in the FF or Sketchbook or CC section

    Reply With Quote Reply With Quote  

  12. The Following 2 Users Say Thank You to nauvice For This Useful Post:


  13. #8
    Join Date
    Nov 2007
    Location
    Indiana,USA
    Posts
    1,204
    Thanks
    770
    Thanked 463 Times in 225 Posts
    Follows
    0
    Following
    0
    Quote Originally Posted by zwarrior View Post
    with that said, the Art Registry + portfolio section is completely useless. Anything posted in it would fit just as well in the FF or Sketchbook or CC section
    Agreed- I believe the whole Art registry thing was to combat the now non existent Orphan works bill, that and all iv seen from that section is either a complete dump of an artists current work sketches and all or 1 single image. It would be nice if it had worked as intended: a quick search through a section of different artists 5-20 best pieces, but it needs a cleaning.

    ~You should never doubt what nobody is sure about~


    Demo's Digital Damsels

    Reply With Quote Reply With Quote  

  14. #9
    Join Date
    Feb 2009
    Location
    Connecticut
    Posts
    472
    Thanks
    36
    Thanked 288 Times in 210 Posts
    Follows
    0
    Following
    0
    I would agree with some of this.. The FF section should be the best of the best. It should be for pieces that are beyond the need for improvement. (I don't want to say that they're perfect pieces because I feel like there's always room for improvement and once you stop striving to improve your work becomes stagnant, but there shouldn't be any avoidable flaws or errors in basics due to your "style", which seems to be the common argument made for defending a bad piece.)

    I also agree with Buck, though, that it would be counter productive to alienate people from trying to post there. You don't want the section to seem impossible and untouchable. There are a number of great artists on this site, but it really is the same handful of people who are at that pro level who would continually be posting there and it would be sort of like a 'clique'. It's not that a person couldn't ever get as good as they are, but there's a pretty big gap between where most of us are at and where the best of the best are.. and it would take a while to close that distance.

    There has to be a balance between setting the bar high, but making it seem attainable, too. I think that most people coming here who are serious wouldn't necessarily be offended if their work was moved from FF to the Critique section.. It's the people who come here, post ridiculous stuff in the FF and get moved, then have beef who generally don't seem to stick around anyway and they are just looking for ass-pats. I think most people who are actively trying to improve are respectful of the FF because they see what the level of their work could be.

    As someone who is nowhere near being ready to post in the FF section, I do like to go there to view threads for inspiration, so I like to see the best pieces.. I don't want to filter through pieces that are at a similar level to where I am (give or take some) because it doesn't necessarily give me something to shoot for. The few pieces that I've noticed that have seemed out of place have been moved shortly after being posted, so it's no big deal. I do kind of revere that forum and find it kind of insulting when people post out of place, but then I realize that they usually just don't know any better yet. So, they'll either get moved and they'll get the help they need (and improve) or they'll get pissed that they were moved at all and simply split anyhow. Either way the problem gets rectified.

    So far as rendered pieces in the sketchbooks goes, I think that's a personal thing. I don't always use my sketchbook for 'sketches'.. I view it more as a practice area that's just for me. Since I don't consider myself at a level where I've got 'finished' pieces, I wouldn't necessarily make a portfolio displaying pieces that I've worked longer on than I would on sketches. I look at my sketchbook as my dumping ground for whatever I've been working on and would like to improve on/get opinions on. It's a way of chronicling my progress. It's a catch-all.. And I love when people actually do just dump everything into their sketchbooks because it's interesting to see the difference in their pieces. But, again, that could be just a me thing and to each his own.

    Reply With Quote Reply With Quote  

  15. The Following 3 Users Say Thank You to Riley Stark For This Useful Post:


  16. #10
    Elwell's Avatar
    Elwell is offline Sticks Like Grim Death Level 17 Gladiator: Spartacus' Dimachaeri
    Join Date
    May 2003
    Location
    Hudson River valley, NY
    Posts
    16,212
    Thanks
    4,879
    Thanked 16,666 Times in 5,020 Posts
    Follows
    0
    Following
    0

    OK, I just did a big round of housecleaning

    The rules for FF are the same as they have been since 2004, they're in a sticky. Basically, it's the "shop window" for CA, and everything there should be pro/semi-pro quality work. We try to keep on top of moving stuff when necessary, but sometimes things fall through the cracks, and sometimes there are judgment calls. In the future, if you see something that you really think doesn't belong, hit the "report" button and fill in the reason in the comment box. (What you shouldn't do is play self-appointed mod and post "THIS DOESN'T BELONG HERE, DUUURRRRRRRR!" in the thread.)


    Tristan Elwell
    **Finished Work Thread **Process Thread **Edges Tutorial

    Crash Course for Artists, Illustrators, and Cartoonists, NYC, the 2013 Edition!

    "Work is more fun than fun."
    -John Cale

    "Art is supposed to punch you in the brain, and it's supposed to stay punched."
    -Marc Maron
    Reply With Quote Reply With Quote  

  17. The Following 16 Users Say Thank You to Elwell For This Useful Post:

    + Show/Hide list of the thanked


  18. #11
    Join Date
    Mar 2008
    Location
    Tokyo, Japan
    Posts
    382
    Thanks
    380
    Thanked 164 Times in 99 Posts
    Follows
    0
    Following
    0
    Quote Originally Posted by BuckWeisel View Post
    I thought the FF section was for finished and polished work. Not some shrine dedicated to some grand ideal of art only achievable by the elite.
    This is part of my point;

    You make it sound like only a select few (the elite as you call them) could ever achieve a high-level of art. That you would feel better if the standards on display were lower because that's what you're comfortable achieving yourself.

    That's not motivation, that's complacency.

    Reply With Quote Reply With Quote  

  19. The Following User Says Thank You to NeecHMonkeY For This Useful Post:


  20. #12
    Join Date
    May 2005
    Location
    Gdansk, Poland
    Posts
    4,834
    Thanks
    887
    Thanked 1,568 Times in 754 Posts
    Follows
    0
    Following
    0
    I'll agree with dpaint here about the opposite impression on Sketchbook section. Also some people seem to have really high expectations when it comes to level of polish that is posted in sketchbook thread while sketchbooks are generally supposed to be dedicated to personal exploration. It's almost as if quick moleskine sketches were some portfolio pieces that represent everything you're capable of.

    Reply With Quote Reply With Quote  

  21. The Following 2 Users Say Thank You to Farvus For This Useful Post:


  22. #13
    Natzuur-JK's Avatar
    Natzuur-JK is offline Arrrggghhh im a..... ninja? Level 5 Gladiator: Myrmillo
    Join Date
    Jun 2008
    Location
    UTAH, USA
    Posts
    325
    Thanks
    44
    Thanked 56 Times in 46 Posts
    Follows
    0
    Following
    0
    I think that the sketchbook can and should be a mash up of everything, including finished work/speedpaint/sketchs/explorations. Nothing wrong with posting a finished piece in them if you dont wanna post in the FF section, and what about WIP's as well? don't you think that to show those only in sketch form, and not from sketch to final render is stupid, at what point does it become not ok to post it?, "ohhh thats too rendered, post it somewhere else"

    FF section should def be as elwell put it, pro/semi-pro but of course its impossible to be on top of everything and please everyone...

    Freelance/general inquiries @: Natzuur@gmail.com
    Reply With Quote Reply With Quote  

  23. #14
    Join Date
    Oct 2007
    Location
    So-Cal
    Posts
    3,427
    Thanks
    2,994
    Thanked 1,780 Times in 849 Posts
    Follows
    0
    Following
    0
    I did notice the drop in quality there too. It really did push me to work harder when I was rejected. I really wanted to hold my own with dudes like Nick Klien, Kev Ferrara, HPX, N8 Van Dyke and Bumskee, just to name a few. But I understand why it slipped. Nobody wants to down grade an artists hard work. I'm pretty sure there are more artist trying to post in the FF then ever and it must be real tough to keep up with. So I tip my hat to the mods for all the hard work.

    Reply With Quote Reply With Quote  

  24. The Following 2 Users Say Thank You to Raoul Duke For This Useful Post:


  25. #15
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Posts
    1,819
    Thanks
    1,540
    Thanked 1,837 Times in 521 Posts
    Follows
    0
    Following
    0
    the bothering thing to me about FF, is when there's a thread with multiple works, in which one or two of them have newb flaws- Or when someone who generally posts pro works, has made a new thread with their latest painting that really should go back to the drawing board- Its disappointing to see those people being cheered on, and no one points out the obvious flaws, or if some people do, their comments are usually ignored.

    I think that's what cheapens FF the most; once you've made it in there, you can post whatever crap you want, or just post the same kind of art you usually make, with no sign of development.

    I like the sketchbook section the most because artists there are more likely to share what they're good and not so good at, and the more pages you go through, you can see the improvements they've made. I think it sets a better example of what to look up to than the FF section

    Last edited by nauvice; July 21st, 2010 at 04:30 AM.
    Reply With Quote Reply With Quote  

  26. #16
    Join Date
    Apr 2008
    Posts
    1,232
    Thanks
    679
    Thanked 861 Times in 364 Posts
    Follows
    0
    Following
    0
    Quote Originally Posted by zwarrior View Post
    with that said, the Art Registry + portfolio section is completely useless. Anything posted in it would fit just as well in the FF or Sketchbook or CC section
    +1 Those two only make the artwork forum bulky and messy.

    Reply With Quote Reply With Quote  

  27. #17
    Join Date
    Nov 2008
    Location
    A bunch of different places.
    Posts
    635
    Thanks
    299
    Thanked 508 Times in 230 Posts
    Follows
    0
    Following
    0
    I posted something in the Finally Finished section once a year or two ago.

    I was real happy with it at the time, and it was promptly moved to C&C. I didn't have any intentions of working on it any more, I just posted it because it was roughly on the same level as a lot of stuff I'd seen there.

    I realize now that it wasn't actually very good.

    But at the same time, I don't like putting finished works - of any quality, in the C&C section - because everyone then treats it like it isn't finished and that you're going to be working on it more.

    I mean really, what in the hell am I supposed to do? Finish something, tell myself I'm not good enough for "semi-pro", stick it in C&C and explicitly state "This is finished, I am done with it" when the section title labels it largely as a "WIP" section? Do I stick it in the Entertainment and Concept Art section, which doesn't even seem to have any clear direction or standard of threads?

    I'm here to do art, not fuck around with trying to decide whether or not I'm "semi-pro", or to rack my brain trying to figure out if I'm even a worthy judge of that if I'm NOT at that level. It's bad enough I've got to scroll down past all the ads, TAD, and "1.5 MILLION!" just to GET to the art forums. To give myself a headache deciphering where exactly I fit in once I'm there is not something I'm too interested in.

    So I just said fuck all.

    I put everything of mine, of any level, in my sketchbook. I can just stick my stuff in there, it doesn't get moved, it doesn't get looked upon as anything other than "Things I'm doing". It's just art at that point. People either like it or they don't, they comment or they don't, and whatever the status of it - I get to decide that.

    There's no other place for me to be able to do that effectively (here on CA).

    Last edited by Two Listen; July 21st, 2010 at 12:03 PM.
    Reply With Quote Reply With Quote  

  28. The Following 3 Users Say Thank You to Two Listen For This Useful Post:


  29. #18
    Join Date
    Apr 2005
    Location
    USA
    Posts
    2,888
    Thanks
    752
    Thanked 3,153 Times in 1,067 Posts
    Follows
    0
    Following
    0
    Quote Originally Posted by NeecHMonkeY View Post
    This is part of my point;

    You make it sound like only a select few (the elite as you call them) could ever achieve a high-level of art. That you would feel better if the standards on display were lower because that's what you're comfortable achieving yourself.

    That's not motivation, that's complacency.
    If I ever attempted to post in the FF section, we would see what kind of standards I would set for myself. Since I never have, let's not play armchair psychologist.

    I would feel better if someone who worked hard and made a decent finished piece was able to post there without people with unwarranted self importance jumped on them for not being a master. If someone does a piece, runs it through the critique center for a few weeks, then posts it in FF when it's done, what else is there? If they can't find anything wrong with it, and the people who post in the CC can't find anything wrong with it, then I would say they've reached the finish line for that piece.

    Maybe you should man up and post some examples of work that doesn't deserve to be there so we can see what you mean. Or maybe you can stick to reporting threads and spend more time in the critique center so that no piece you find unworthy ends up to the finished section.

    "Astronomy offers an aesthetic indulgence not duplicated in any other field. This is not an academic or hypothetical attraction and should require no apologies, for the beauty to be found in the skies has been universally appreciated for unrecorded centuries."
    Reply With Quote Reply With Quote  

  30. #19
    Join Date
    Apr 2006
    Location
    San Diego
    Posts
    2,851
    Thanks
    1,128
    Thanked 1,402 Times in 557 Posts
    Follows
    0
    Following
    0
    Quote Originally Posted by NeecHMonkeY View Post
    The ConceptArt.org 'Finally Finished' section should be an online representation of what someone should expect from a Professional job interview or portfolio review - like it used to be.

    DeviantArt is for back-pats and crotch-grabs, ConceptArt.org is for making art professionals!
    A bold post but yeah, i pretty much agree with everything you said.


    Quote Originally Posted by Elwell View Post
    In the future, if you see something that you really think doesn't belong, hit the "report" button and fill in the reason in the comment box. (What you shouldn't do is play self-appointed mod and post "THIS DOESN'T BELONG HERE, DUUURRRRRRRR!" in the thread.)
    If we can't put it in the thread, can we put "THIS DOESN'T BELONG HERE, DUUURRRRRRRR!" in the message associated with the "report post"?

    "I must not fear. Fear is the mind-killer. Fear is the little-death that brings total obliteration. I will face my fear. I will permit it to pass over me and through me. And when it has gone past I will turn the inner eye to see its path. Where the fear has gone there will be nothing. Only I will remain."
    --- Frank Herbert, Dune - Bene Gesserit Litany Against Fear

    Check out my Sketchbook! Critique and Criticism welcomed.

    or my Deviantart!

    or check out my: Blog
    Reply With Quote Reply With Quote  

  31. #20
    Join Date
    Dec 2009
    Location
    Montreal , Canada
    Posts
    291
    Thanks
    140
    Thanked 40 Times in 33 Posts
    Follows
    0
    Following
    0
    Quote Originally Posted by BuckWeisel View Post
    If I ever attempted to post in the FF section, we would see what kind of standards I would set for myself. Since I never have, let's not play armchair psychologist.

    I would feel better if someone who worked hard and made a decent finished piece was able to post there without people with unwarranted self importance jumped on them for not being a master. If someone does a piece, runs it through the critique center for a few weeks, then posts it in FF when it's done, what else is there? If they can't find anything wrong with it, and the people who post in the CC can't find anything wrong with it, then I would say they've reached the finish line for that piece.

    Maybe you should man up and post some examples of work that doesn't deserve to be there so we can see what you mean. Or maybe you can stick to reporting threads and spend more time in the critique center so that no piece you find unworthy ends up to the finished section.
    yup I agree we are here to learn . Understanding that awful is awful but as the quote above, when hard work is done it should be commended and not decided by someone who has achieved a higher standard ,to push the thread somewhere else, after all even the person that moves the thread didn't start at the top

    Reply With Quote Reply With Quote  

  32. #21
    Black Spot's Avatar
    Black Spot is offline Pew, Pew, Pew Level 17 Gladiator: Spartacus' Dimachaeri
    Join Date
    May 2008
    Location
    London
    Posts
    9,711
    Thanks
    3,240
    Thanked 5,376 Times in 3,597 Posts
    Follows
    1
    Following
    0
    Maybe a second division of FF pieces might help taking some of the points posted above, and of course if a mod thinks it needs promoting, it should be.


    I didn't think it was possible to be called an artist when you have nothing to say. It's like being a writer who publishes individual words as books and expects to be praised for it.
    Reply With Quote Reply With Quote  

  33. #22
    Elwell's Avatar
    Elwell is offline Sticks Like Grim Death Level 17 Gladiator: Spartacus' Dimachaeri
    Join Date
    May 2003
    Location
    Hudson River valley, NY
    Posts
    16,212
    Thanks
    4,879
    Thanked 16,666 Times in 5,020 Posts
    Follows
    0
    Following
    0
    Quote Originally Posted by ArtZealot View Post
    If we can't put it in the thread, can we put "THIS DOESN'T BELONG HERE, DUUURRRRRRRR!" in the message associated with the "report post"?
    Knock yourself out.

    A little history:
    When CA first started, there was Finally Finished and Sketches/Works in Progress. Work that wasn't considered up to FF quality was moved to the Sketches/WIPS section, but there were the inevitable cries of "why was this moved, it's FINISHED??!!???" As the site grew, and it became clear that CA mission was going to be more educational than many art communities, the Critique Center was set up as a place where work that was finished but not pro level could get the help it needed. Over time the distinction between "unfinished/wip" and "'finished,' but needs work" got fuzzy, and it was decided to combine the two sections.


    Tristan Elwell
    **Finished Work Thread **Process Thread **Edges Tutorial

    Crash Course for Artists, Illustrators, and Cartoonists, NYC, the 2013 Edition!

    "Work is more fun than fun."
    -John Cale

    "Art is supposed to punch you in the brain, and it's supposed to stay punched."
    -Marc Maron
    Reply With Quote Reply With Quote  

  34. The Following 2 Users Say Thank You to Elwell For This Useful Post:


  35. #23
    dpaint's Avatar
    dpaint is offline Registered User Level 16 Gladiator: Spartacus' Retiarii
    Join Date
    Sep 2009
    Location
    Virginia
    Posts
    4,658
    Thanks
    2,628
    Thanked 5,889 Times in 2,359 Posts
    Follows
    0
    Following
    0
    Quote Originally Posted by BuckWeisel View Post
    If I ever attempted to post in the FF section, we would see what kind of standards I would set for myself. Since I never have, let's not play armchair psychologist.

    I would feel better if someone who worked hard and made a decent finished piece was able to post there without people with unwarranted self importance jumped on them for not being a master. If someone does a piece, runs it through the critique center for a few weeks, then posts it in FF when it's done, what else is there? If they can't find anything wrong with it, and the people who post in the CC can't find anything wrong with it, then I would say they've reached the finish line for that piece. .
    The problem with that thinking is people generally can't incorporate the critiques because they don't have the skills and end up saying they are done anyway. Its not about how hard someone works or if they did everything they could. This isn't first grade, artists don't get a gold star for effort. It should be about how good it is.

    It should be for professional level work either work that was published or was done for a project. amateurs may not like the work or think they are as good or can do better but professional work is just that and I'm not talkiing about my mom paid me to paint a fantasy portrait of my dead grampa.

    Reply With Quote Reply With Quote  

  36. The Following User Says Thank You to dpaint For This Useful Post:


  37. #24
    Join Date
    Nov 2008
    Location
    A bunch of different places.
    Posts
    635
    Thanks
    299
    Thanked 508 Times in 230 Posts
    Follows
    0
    Following
    0
    Quote Originally Posted by Elwell View Post
    Over time the distinction between "unfinished/wip" and "'finished,' but needs work" got fuzzy...
    That's because saying "finished but still needs work" is asinine, when it's decided upon by someone other than the artist.

    I don't see what would be so bad about having just a "finished" section, for everyone to post "finished" work regardless of quality. People still put crits in FF now anyway.

    If it's super fucking awesome, star it and move that thread to a special place. We do it now with the sketchbook section, starring memorable sketchbooks of a certain quality. Works just fine and doesn't leave a bunch of people in limbo land.

    Reply With Quote Reply With Quote  

  38. #25
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Posts
    1,819
    Thanks
    1,540
    Thanked 1,837 Times in 521 Posts
    Follows
    0
    Following
    0
    Quote Originally Posted by Two Listen View Post
    But at the same time, I don't like putting finished works - of any quality, in the C&C section - because everyone then treats it like it isn't finished and that you're going to be working on it more.
    I've put my finished work in CC before. And when I was in school, the time the teacher would plan Crits was the last day of the assignment. CC is there to help you improve in general, not improve that one work you didnt finish yet. So getting critiqued on a finished work is helpful so you dont repeat the same mistakes again on your next project.

    Reply With Quote Reply With Quote  

  39. The Following User Says Thank You to nauvice For This Useful Post:


  40. #26
    Join Date
    Nov 2008
    Location
    A bunch of different places.
    Posts
    635
    Thanks
    299
    Thanked 508 Times in 230 Posts
    Follows
    0
    Following
    0
    Quote Originally Posted by zwarrior View Post
    I've put my finished work in CC before. And when I was in school, the time the teacher would plan Crits was the last day of the assignment. CC is there to help you improve in general, not improve that one work you didnt finish yet. So getting critiqued on a finished work is helpful so you dont repeat the same mistakes again on your next project.
    Haha, yeah that would be an ideal scenario, wouldn't it?

    Reply With Quote Reply With Quote  

  41. #27
    kev ferrara is offline Registered User Level 17 Gladiator: Spartacus' Dimachaeri
    Join Date
    Feb 2006
    Location
    Fallingwater
    Posts
    5,060
    Thanks
    1,516
    Thanked 5,151 Times in 1,701 Posts
    Follows
    0
    Following
    0
    My thoughts:

    It might be helpful if FF "ranking" was based on a simple formula... a combination of newness and star rating. This will keep the more professional threads afloat longer and will sink new threads that probably need to be in the crit forum quicker.

    I know I said this two years ago, but I guess I'll repeat it now that the topic is being considered: It might be sensible to rejigger the star system somewhat so that, there are specific meanings to specific numbers. And based on a certain number of ratings, the thread finds its place.

    5 stars = pro level. At this level, critiques are minor and can be offered in the context of praise. 5 stars should allow for the thread to be updated with new images.

    4 stars = semi pro level. At the level, critiques are minor also, but maybe something about the piece bothers the viewer or it is not to their taste but they still "mad respect" it. 4 stars should also allow for the thread to be updated with new images.

    3 star = Significant but correctable problems or damn good but not quite finished. Moves to crit section. Thread should only be updated with a corrected version of the original image. There should be, for each update, another opportunity to vote on the image... either to keep it in the crit section, to maybe redirect it to the classroom (see below) or, if the image has improved sufficiently, to suggest reposting the corrected image into the FF section. There also can be a choice to say, "this ain't going nowhere man. Cut bait and try a different image."

    2 star and 1 star = Not quite ready for prime time. Instead of moving it to the crit section, it is moved, maybe, to a section that teaches the basics... a classroom situation with mentoring, or a place where some radio buttons send the artist to various pre-made tutorials on form, anatomy, lighting, composition, etc. And videos are recommended.

    No star rating (where nobody or not enough people vote) may be a different problem. It might be sensible to consider the no star rating as similar to a 2 star rating. There should be some formula that computes page views. If there are enough page views, but no ratings, the rating becomes 2 star automatically, and the thread is moved to a classroom section.

    Just some ideas. Don't throw fruit. (Unless its red grapes.)

    kev


    OH: And if somebody's thread gets moved, as soon as they log in the same pop-up window that normally comes up when you get a PM, should come up saying your thread has moved to the whatever section (link here) for the following reason (generic text here.)

    Last edited by kev ferrara; July 21st, 2010 at 06:31 PM.
    At least Icarus tried!


    My Process: Dead Rider Graphic Novel (Dark Horse Comics) plus oil paintings, pencils and other goodies:
    http://www.conceptart.org/forums/sho...d.php?t=101106

    My "Smilechild" Music. Plus a medley of Commercial Music Cues and a Folksy Jingle!:
    http://www.myspace.com/kevferrara
    Reply With Quote Reply With Quote  

  42. The Following 2 Users Say Thank You to kev ferrara For This Useful Post:


  43. #28
    Join Date
    Dec 2009
    Location
    Montreal , Canada
    Posts
    291
    Thanks
    140
    Thanked 40 Times in 33 Posts
    Follows
    0
    Following
    0

    elite

    Quote Originally Posted by Black Spot View Post
    Maybe a second division of FF pieces might help taking some of the points posted above, and of course if a mod thinks it needs promoting, it should be.
    extra spin on this, when we finish a piece, I would say its is done , don't like it explain and move on, that being said how about a section called elite where the only way to get there is by another member and not yourself this would end this discussion and also if you feel you need help then put it in the appropriate section yourself not by someone else

    Reply With Quote Reply With Quote  

  44. #29
    Join Date
    Feb 2009
    Location
    Connecticut
    Posts
    472
    Thanks
    36
    Thanked 288 Times in 210 Posts
    Follows
    0
    Following
    0
    Quote Originally Posted by kev ferrara View Post
    My thoughts:

    It might be helpful if FF "ranking" was based on a simple formula... a combination of newness and star rating. This will keep the more professional threads afloat longer and will sink new threads that probably need to be in the crit forum quicker.

    I know I said this two years ago, but I guess I'll repeat it now that the topic is being considered: It might be sensible to rejigger the star system somewhat so that, there are specific meanings to specific numbers. And based on a certain number of ratings, the thread finds its place.

    5 stars = pro level. At this level, critiques are minor and can be offered in the context of praise. 5 stars should allow for the thread to be updated with new images.

    4 stars = semi pro level. At the level, critiques are minor also, but maybe something about the piece bothers the viewer or it is not to their taste but they still "mad respect" it. 4 stars should also allow for the thread to be updated with new images.

    3 star = Significant but correctable problems or damn good but not quite finished. Moves to crit section. Thread should only be updated with a corrected version of the original image. There should be, for each update, another opportunity to vote on the image... either to keep it in the crit section, to maybe redirect it to the classroom (see below) or, if the image has improved sufficiently, to suggest reposting the corrected image into the FF section. There also can be a choice to say, "this ain't going nowhere man. Cut bait and try a different image."

    2 star and 1 star = Not quite ready for prime time. Instead of moving it to the crit section, it is moved, maybe, to a section that teaches the basics... a classroom situation with mentoring, or a place where some radio buttons send the artist to various pre-made tutorials on form, anatomy, lighting, composition, etc. And videos are recommended.

    No star rating (where nobody or not enough people vote) may be a different problem. It might be sensible to consider the no star rating as similar to a 2 star rating. There should be some formula that computes page views. If there are enough page views, but no ratings, the rating becomes 2 star automatically, and the thread is moved to a classroom section.

    Just some ideas. Don't throw fruit. (Unless its red grapes.)

    kev
    I could see something like this working, but maybe it could be more about ranking the users themselves rather than the individual pieces..? Like, maybe there's a forum where people can post a body of work and people who have proven to be the best (those with higher star rankings - pro level) can vote to bump the person up to the next ranking (which should be reflected by their user name, I think) if their work shows they're ready (if they get a certain amount of votes or something?). This could have a positive spin in many different areas:

    A.) When they give critiques, you know what level the person critiquing you is at.

    B.) Provides motivation to move up through the ranks and improve.

    C.) Helps newcomers know who has put in their dues and who they can trust for advice.

    D.) It could help with ranking artwork in places like the FF -- if someone has consistently good work, then they're awarded a certain ranking and their threads don't really have to be monitored for less-than-quality work and it would be easier to filter out those who maybe aren't ready to be posting in the FF section yet.

    Etc.

    I think something like that could actually work and it would help people get known throughout the community, too. It would help upcoming talent be introduce to those in long-standing, it would make those who are the 'best' accessible, it would help people obtain a realistic view of where their progress is ranked in terms of being 'successful'..

    Anyhow, my two cents.

    Reply With Quote Reply With Quote  

  45. #30
    Join Date
    Dec 2009
    Location
    Montreal , Canada
    Posts
    291
    Thanks
    140
    Thanked 40 Times in 33 Posts
    Follows
    0
    Following
    0

    second on that thought

    Quote Originally Posted by intrinsik View Post
    I could see something like this working, but maybe it could be more about ranking the users themselves rather than the individual pieces..? Like, maybe there's a forum where people can post a body of work and people who have proven to be the best (those with higher star rankings - pro level) can vote to bump the person up to the next ranking (which should be reflected by their user name, I think) if their work shows they're ready (if they get a certain amount of votes or something?). This could have a positive spin in many different areas:

    A.) When they give critiques, you know what level the person critiquing you is at.

    B.) Provides motivation to move up through the ranks and improve.

    C.) Helps newcomers know who has put in their dues and who they can trust for advice.

    D.) It could help with ranking artwork in places like the FF -- if someone has consistently good work, then they're awarded a certain ranking and their threads don't really have to be monitored for less-than-quality work and it would be easier to filter out those who maybe aren't ready to be posting in the FF section yet.

    Etc.

    I think something like that could actually work and it would help people get known throughout the community, too. It would help upcoming talent be introduce to those in long-standing, it would make those who are the 'best' accessible, it would help people obtain a realistic view of where their progress is ranked in terms of being 'successful'..

    Anyhow, my two cents.
    you have my vote on this, there something abrasive about finding your thread has moved without a reason posted

    Reply With Quote Reply With Quote  

Page 1 of 3 1 2 3 LastLast

Members who have read this thread: 5

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •