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  1. #1
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    Question on what Richard Schmid wrote in Alla Prima

    In Alla Prima, Richard wrote (and im paraphrasing)....."a 40 degree change in form can be shown with a simple color change rather than a value change." Why? Because we have more colors at our disposal than values..." So my question is: Any subtle changes in value within lights, halftones and darks can be indicated with just a shift in hue of the same value? I did notice it is extremely hard to capture many values with paint as opposed to a B+W medium like charcoal or graphite.

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    That's interesting.

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  4. #3
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    Yeah i found that interesting too. I think I can finally just stick to no more than 5 values rather than trying to capture all 255 greys...lol

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  5. #4
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    yer, i think as long as there is a perceived change in the subject it kind of pieces together. Implying more subtlety in the values. It's really to simplify your values to make a stronger composition. Also i think the hue change probably works best shifting towards the hue of the shadows.

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  6. #5
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    If you look at most master paintings the values are limited to four or five steps so the way you turn the form in the lights or in the shadows is with hue or saturation shifts, saving the value shifts for big divisions between light and shadow

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  8. #6
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    but within those 4/5 steps (many master paintings as we know are very detailed) any other subtle value changes (assuming no glazing is done) are done by hue/temperature shift right? Oh wait just reread your post dpaint. ok i get it.

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  9. #7
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    ok i get it.

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    Its not about details. Look at them in black and white and see how many places in the painting are the same Values. Good paintings start with good value plans color doesn't matter.

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  11. #9
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    AHHHH..... Briggsy.....it seems that Scmid uses more than just 4-5 values as he claims. I see more in those b+w conversions.

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    Quote Originally Posted by andymania View Post
    In Alla Prima, Richard wrote (and im paraphrasing)....."a 40 degree change in form can be shown with a simple color change rather than a value change." Why? Because we have more colors at our disposal than values..."
    I'd like to know the direct quote rather than your paraphrase, to see if that's actually what he says. The other thing is that, while it's a very good book, Schmid isn't always very precise in his color terminology. The fact is, changing "color" (that is to say, hue and/or chroma) without also changing value is very hard to do with an open palette like Schmid uses.


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  13. #11
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    The values are much closer when you show them in grayscale. I just copied your image and changed the mode

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    andymania and dpaint

    I used a grayscale conversion plus some automatic segmentation software to make it easier to see where the tonal gradients are occurring. The gradients are there but the number of steps is arbitrary. The segmentation software also seems to have increased the absolute contrast, although much less than you might possibly think from close up - try looking at the last image from more than ten feet away.

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    Quote Originally Posted by briggsy@ashtons View Post
    andymania and dpaint

    I used a grayscale conversion plus some automatic segmentation software to make it easier to see where the tonal gradients are occurring. The gradients are there but the number of steps is arbitrary. The segmentation software also seems to have increased the absolute contrast, although much less than you might possibly think from close up - try looking at the last image from more than ten feet away.
    I am interested in that "automatic segmentation" software, can you tell me name of it?

    Thanks in advance

    M

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