Microchip inplanted in your body makes everything better - RFID commercial - Page 3
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  1. #61
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    That seemed like one of those mock-up ads for a thriller movie, where everyone is a drone and the protagonist breaks the chain.

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  3. #62
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    GhostValkyrie is offline The deep satisfaction of radical ends.. Level 5 Gladiator: Myrmillo
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    Quote Originally Posted by LORD M View Post
    Oooooook... so now they want us to get microchips inplanted in our bodies. The excuses for it are pretty damn questionably lame imo. Just another way to get more control over the masses and keep track of your location?

    I have heard that in South Korea they are building a city already on this technology. The chip will be your identity.


    They've been trying to get this rolling for quite some time. Doesn't surprise me it's becoming more overt nowadays. Every time a law or policy is created under the pretense of protection it reveals itself to be another trojan horse. lol, like al qaeda will be getting those implants.

    As always; someone wants to control what someone else can or cannot do beyond the realm of them harming a human being due to their own personal concerns and desire to engineer society toward their personal preferences of cohesion. Fascism doesn't always resemble 1932 Germany's boot stomping.

    It's evolved, and is much more attractive to idiots when it comes under the guise of helping/protecting everyone. Huxley must be turning in his grave, and Atlas has certainly shrugged.

    As a note about the security, it's been reviewed these aren't as secure as people seem to think. Data is relatively easier to store, but also easier to obtain when a person has the know how. Some programmers have made a revealing case against this technology by cracking the chip and stealing the person's - essentially becoming that individual digitally. I would think the millions of compromised credit accounts of Citi group members due to hackers, and the thousands of cracked accounts at Navy Federal last year(I am a member of this bank, so trust me when I say I educate myself about matters relating to it.), would tell people to stop and think about the uses of such technology. I don't want innovation and creativity to slow down, but legislating this as law I believe would be a clear violation of my human rights, and consideration of using it to put in humans is a discussion I think should continue before any practice even in the public establishment takes place.

    Buck; You're not entirely wrong, but that means you're not right. When I was in the Gulf, they offered this technology to us. They offered it to my aunt as well. You can be tracked. Of course, back then it was choice - there's no telling if it still is.

    Last edited by GhostValkyrie; October 27th, 2009 at 02:46 AM.
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  4. #63
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    forcefields aren't science fiction anymore. The army's already planning to add them to large navy vessels. Missiles don't bounce off the field, but detenate prematurely. It's been in the Economist for years. It's just costly, so there's a debate about funding.

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    Quote Originally Posted by TASmith View Post
    forcefields aren't science fiction anymore. The army's already planning to add them to large navy vessels. Missiles don't bounce off the field, but detenate prematurely. It's been in the Economist for years. It's just costly, so there's a debate about funding.
    Neither are Rail Guns. I'm all for having the technology, it would be expensive but saves lives and equipment(though the government doesn't seem to care about that) which in turn saves money...wait, that would mean the government would likely still be opposed.

    Anyway; I would hope they could use the 4% defense budget increase to use by utilizing something useful. The number of military membership has been forcefully downsizing for years, yet the expenses continue to be increased. We've been continually given outdated, pre/post vietnam war technology to deal with. The only new stuff we have has been recently legislated away. It makes no sense what we're doing, so I don't see why they're debating the cost of the tech if they won't even use it.

    Ehh, this will get me off on a nasty ramble about wasteful spending if I don't stop. It's ridiculous I tells ya!

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    See, now I am in a bad situation. I could say that I am done arguing about this and that I'm going to shut up, but I can't un-ring the bell. What I should have done was shut up to begin with, let this thread play out in all its Bahm like merriment, and go about my life. But I didn't.

    Luckily though, I have one fail safe. Time. It doesn't matter who here thinks that I am right or even if I am right. Time will tell. I don't need to explain the technology to any of you, or beg you to go read up on it for yourselves because in the years to come we will see who was correct about all this. I could either be having my car door unlocked by a tiny black box in my pocket or we could all be slaves to our robotic reptilian Illuminati Obama overlord. We'll see.

    Sharpton fo' president. I'm outie. Peace.

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    Quote Originally Posted by BuckWeisel View Post
    What evidence do you have that implies the government using this technology to track you 24/7.
    Because they can. If look at the state of the world today, look at increased surveilance everywhere, and then think a government sector had this oppurtunity and not use it, then you are not only naive, you are one of them letting them do it (eventually).

    "If you have nothing to hide, then it shouldnt be a problem" may look like a harmless sentence used for every form of new surveillance tech/method, but it is not the fact that someone has something to hide. It is the fact that he could if he wanted to. Thats called freedom. period.

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  9. #67
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    I think it's funny when I'm taking photos in public, and someone tells me not to - that I'm invading their privacy (this hardly ever happens, but still). Then I tell them they're already being filmed and photographed on average 55 times a day by people a lot more powerful than me.

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    there where is power, there is abuse. there is proof in history . its just they make it smarter this time.

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    also, about the global positioning, I know they can do it, because they do it to any dog you adopt over in Boston. My roomate back in 2002 got a dog, and the chip they gave him caused an infection. They had to remove it. Pretty nasty. The idea is, if your dog runs away, they got lo-jack on him so they can find him again. So, the technology exists.

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    Quote Originally Posted by BuckWeisel View Post
    I could either be having my car door unlocked by a tiny black box in my pocket
    You mean like your car keys?

    Quote Originally Posted by BuckWeisel View Post
    or we could all be slaves to our robotic reptilian Illuminati Obama overlord.
    Or you could have selfish incompetents finding ways to abuse whatever power you hand to them. That's not a conspiracy, and constantly relying on that kind of word association doesn't make your argument any better. Labelling people as Obama haters and idiots will only piss people off and bring an argument down to name calling.

    This technology definitely has its uses, but storing all your information on a radio transmitter or letting people implant you with what can easily function as a tracking device is beyond retarded.

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    Ugh this whole idea disgusts me, I dont believe in conspiracies but those who have said that we dont have the technology to track people makes me laugh. Yes... yes we do.....and if its not to the degree of being in a chip yet then then eh it wont take long. I mean we're making our technology sleeker, more compact everyday. I mean geeze the simplest of car GPS's are close to this in terms of technology and one of those can fit in the palm of my hand. Also, I mean do you really think the government lets out about every technological advances we make? Government research and development facilities have high level security clearances for a reason
    Hell, do you think anyone outside of the government knew about the atom bomb before it blew people to hades and back?


    No I'm not saying that "Ooh this will become where big brother has its eyes on all of us" But I'm not saying its impossible, its far from impossible
    The government is full of corrupt individuals, power corrupts
    What starts as I decide whether to get this implant can become mandatory through a passed law and from there conspiracies could become a reality quite easily

    I like the freedom to go where I please without someone knowing where I am at all times. Would you like if someone was in your business 24/7? No

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    Quote Originally Posted by JFierce View Post
    Ugh this whole idea disgusts me, I dont believe in conspiracies but those who have said that we dont have the technology to track people makes me laugh. Yes... yes we do.....and if its not to the degree of being in a chip yet then then eh it wont take long. I mean we're making our technology sleeker, more compact everyday. I mean geeze the simplest of car GPS's are close to this in terms of technology and one of those can fit in the palm of my hand. Also, I mean do you really think the government lets out about every technological advances we make? Government research and development facilities have high level security clearances for a reason
    Hell, do you think anyone outside of the government knew about the atom bomb before it blew people to hades and back?


    No I'm not saying that "Ooh this will become where big brother has its eyes on all of us" But I'm not saying its impossible, its far from impossible
    The government is full of corrupt individuals, power corrupts
    What starts as I decide whether to get this implant can become mandatory through a passed law and from there conspiracies could become a reality quite easily

    I like the freedom to go where I please without someone knowing where I am at all times. Would you like if someone was in your business 24/7? No
    yea this thing doesnt even need gps, the beacon can be triangulated from cell phone towers or something similar. Anything with a radio freq can be tracked.

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    yeah, i was just about to mention that when i read blahms post. Iphones or ipod touch don't have a gps. Neither does common phones. Still their location can be pinpointed fairly accurately. The ipod touch doesn't even have radio/cellphone capabilities, but uses wifi to find your location. If you have one, go into google maps and see how easily it finds your location.

    So to track an RFID implant you'd only have to put up a couple of radio beacons with $50 worth of hardware. (i pulled that number out of my ass)

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    Sorry, I am philosophically against getting tattoos or piercings on my body, and having this put in goes against those same philosophical ideals.

    Have fun when you all realize that the 1st 3 digits to every id code on each of these is 666.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Ryan K View Post
    If it's implanted below the skin - it doesn't seem like it would be difficult to cut it out...
    Hmmm...What if they implant it right into your balls?

    Last edited by Cron; November 1st, 2009 at 05:16 PM.
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    If you're the concerned about this, wrap yourself in aluminum foil and live in the wilderness, relying solely on archaic and analog materials. For the rest of us...

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    By the same logic we should get rid of sketchbooks, canvases, pencils and paint, as they too are archaic and analog.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Slash View Post
    By the same logic we should get rid of sketchbooks, canvases, pencils and paint, as they too are archaic and analog.
    Yep. Digital's the wave of the future, baby.

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    My views are conflicted on this. On one hand, I understand it would be extremely difficult for a government, any government barring those under personality cults, to implement this kind of technology without a grand public outcry. Possibly even revolution. This thread alone is proof: Apart from a few more practical people, the natrual response is revulsion. Not only due to the possible implications concerning privacy and control, but the very idea of having alien (here used as "other") technology within you is repellant. Should a government finally manage to place these within the majority of the populace, the possibility for abuse is great.
    Conspiracies can almost always be treated with great scepticism (and rightly so) but never totally dismissed. No one believed the government was deliberately infecting black citizens with syphilis during the 1930s as an experiment..but...
    Look it up. Be careful. If things come to a head, we can always flee to a commune somewhere. But its unlikely. So my rambling finally comes to a point: Be doubtful, but cautious. It could easily happen if the factors line up.

    Last edited by Mordus; November 6th, 2009 at 01:42 PM. Reason: Spelling check.
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    I...still don't get the outcry. These are RFIDs. Radio-Frequency identification tags for those who cannot access Wikipedia. They are inert plastic and metal chips, if you're feeling generous enough to call them that. They aren't like a miniature computer that can be injected into your bloodstream so Big Brother follow you into the bathroom whenever you take a dump.

    RFIDs can only be activated with an external source, a scanner if you will. Only when "woken up" by an appropriate scanner's radio waves will it function. And even then, it's essentially just a short burst, active only as long as the waves can be received. So in order to get the sort of "Eye See You" situation everyone's panicking about, Big Brother would need to bathe the entire landmass with a specific frequency of electromagnetic radiation 24/7.

    And then this is assuming that we don't all get fucking terminal brain tumors from 24/7 bombardment by high-frequency radio waves, then what? Whoop-de-shit, the government knows where we are. The government already knows where we are. Or at least where we pay our taxes, where we go to the doctors, where we park our cars, if they're so inclined. Why bother with a catch and release program? The ankle bracelet they gave Martha Stewart for some questionable accounting works just as well.

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  30. #83
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    Shhhhhh, rationality frightens them.

    "Astronomy offers an aesthetic indulgence not duplicated in any other field. This is not an academic or hypothetical attraction and should require no apologies, for the beauty to be found in the skies has been universally appreciated for unrecorded centuries."
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    Last edited by Blahm; November 6th, 2009 at 11:57 PM.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Blahm View Post
    The guy giving the presentation said that the human brain is genetically programmed to work with computers. Just drop some brain tissue on and it'll organize itself. I had to watch it twice to make sure I wasn't hearing it wrong and then I went and got a cat scan to make sure I wasn't suffering from any damage to the head

    He's about as much of a scientist as a soap dish. If those statements have even the tiniest bit of basis on real science, its over simplified to the point of being wrong.

    I just don't get how a group of people who take the position of "Question everything" doesn't even bother to read a small wikipedia article on the stuff they're talking about. If you don't trust wikipedia, I'm sure there are plenty of other resources that explain how RFID works.

    Futurists/Transhumanists are pretty much the same as Intelligent Designers. They claim their message is one of pure science, but it's not. They're just fancy political agendas disguised as "The truth." They are not reputable sources.

    "Astronomy offers an aesthetic indulgence not duplicated in any other field. This is not an academic or hypothetical attraction and should require no apologies, for the beauty to be found in the skies has been universally appreciated for unrecorded centuries."
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    http://www.wired.com/science/discove.../2001/11/48278

    lol buckweisel, nice signature you little futurist you.

    Last edited by Blahm; November 7th, 2009 at 08:04 AM.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Falchion View Post
    I...still don't get the outcry. These are RFIDs. Radio-Frequency identification tags for those who cannot access Wikipedia. They are inert plastic and metal chips, if you're feeling generous enough to call them that. They aren't like a miniature computer that can be injected into your bloodstream so Big Brother follow you into the bathroom whenever you take a dump.

    RFIDs can only be activated with an external source, a scanner if you will. Only when "woken up" by an appropriate scanner's radio waves will it function. And even then, it's essentially just a short burst, active only as long as the waves can be received. So in order to get the sort of "Eye See You" situation everyone's panicking about, Big Brother would need to bathe the entire landmass with a specific frequency of electromagnetic radiation 24/7.

    And then this is assuming that we don't all get fucking terminal brain tumors from 24/7 bombardment by high-frequency radio waves, then what? Whoop-de-shit, the government knows where we are. The government already knows where we are. Or at least where we pay our taxes, where we go to the doctors, where we park our cars, if they're so inclined. Why bother with a catch and release program? The ankle bracelet they gave Martha Stewart for some questionable accounting works just as well.
    They already sell consumer grade rfid scanners with a 10 meter range (for passive reading). Granted, this read distance is for higher frequency chips, my knowledge about how that affects read distance is limited. Still, this is a situation where i'd bet on safe rather than sorry. Install a reader in the doorway of buildings (not unlike whats already in place in most stores) and you could tell who passes by that checkpoint and when. Then do the same to subways, trains etc. (there probably is a system like this in place for subways and trains, i'm just not aware of it.) Or you could put a reader in the stop lights for pedestrian crossing, a lot of those require you to push a button, thus getting close enough to read. Or put them in cabs. etc etc..

    The entire landmass is already bathed in high frequency radio waves. To my knowledge the rfids operate at a couple of hundred khz, which i doubt will cause any more cancer than the constant bombardment of much higher frequency radiation from radio, tv, wifi, cellphones, SPACE etc. Not to mention pollution, food additives etc.

    Sure, powers at be can locate us easily if we choose to use credit cards, passports, cellphones, libraries etc. The key word here is choice. We can choose not to use these things. When we can be monitored without our consent or knowledge, thats when things have a potential to go fishy. This martha stewart person got a bracelet for monitoring her, well, then she KNOWS she's monitored, thats part of the punishment for breaking the law.

    Interesting read, how to clone a verichip with radioshack supplies: http://www.cq.cx/verichip.pl

    Buck: Rationality? really?

    Last edited by Slash; November 7th, 2009 at 07:33 AM.
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    Yes Slash, rationality.

    As in thinking before speaking, understanding the facts, and forming opinions founded by logical thinking, empirical observation and intelligent supposition.

    If the point of this thread was an honest critique of the the technology, then there isn't much of a problem. However, from post #1 it has been about a conspiracy theory.

    As I have said there are problems with RFID, which is why they're not widely implemented. These are problems that are well known by those who work with the technology and can be proven beyond reasonable doubt. But the complaints in this thread have all basically summed up to a giant invocation of Godwin's Law, except replacing Hitler with their dictator of choice.

    There is absolutely nothing wrong with asking questions. But generally you have to ask the right questions. Simply being subversive isn't being intelligent. Most of the points brought up are supported by anecdotes and "reading in between the lines." The problem with reading between the lines is that since there is no hard evidence to go on, any story a person makes up will most likely be whatever story they want. In this case, we have hard facts about RFID and it's problems. That's it. End of conversation.

    Saying that the government could use this to track people or they could use this to control a population is unfounded, illogical, and plain ignorant. I don't care if you don't like the government. It doesn't matter how angry you are or how much you mistrust them. Everything past reality is superstition. I could say that the government is run by reptillian creatures from mars. There's nothing wrong with me saying that. But it's not fact, reality, science, a possibility or anything. I don't know that they're reptillian so I have no place to say that.

    It wouldn't be so bad but people in this discussion don't even know simple things like what electromagnetic radiation is. Regardless of what side you're on, that's high-school level knowledge. So we're all pretty much discussing a technology we understand little about.

    would need to bathe the entire landmass with a specific frequency of electromagnetic radiation 24/7
    If you have a light on, you are being bathed in electromagnetic radiation. And light is higher frequency than radio waves. So even if they do use high-frequency radio waves, it's not even as high as light. If AM and FM radio haven't given you cancer yet, then you're fine.

    I'm really not sure why everyone thinks that their governments don't know who they are. Where do you think your social security number came from? Somewhere in a computer is all your info. Where you live, your age, your D.O.B., etc. You can say "But, but, I can fool that by not telling the government where I live and avoiding the system." Yes, yes you could. If you had an RFID chip you could also avoid the system by taking it out, or shielding it from readers. So why is the latter any different from the first?

    Thesis: The government will use RFID chips to track and keep tabs on the population

    Questions to answer:

    What is an RFID chip?
    How does it work?
    How would a government implement them without causing panic?
    Why would a government need to use such a technology?
    What would the government do if they succeeded?
    How would a government combat those who cheat the system?
    How would a government combat black hats?
    Is this really the most efficient way to control a population?
    Is this technology really viable for this kind of use?
    What is the limitations of the technology?
    Has there been any examples of this technology being used to control/track people?
    Who within the government is working on this plan?
    How many people are involved?
    How do they keep it secret from the people that don't know?
    How can so many people know and the secret not get out?
    Where did I get my information about this plan?
    Were they reliable sources?
    What are the credentials of my sources?
    Does anyone with a solid background in working with this technology agree with them? Why or why not?
    What do the people on the other side of the issue have to say?
    Is there information solid?
    Are their sources also have the credentials?
    Are there any logical fallacies in my opnion on the subject? What about in my opponent's opinion?
    Is there any solid proof such as authentic documents, verified tapes of audio/video from within this conspiracy that back my position?

    You get the point by now.

    Blahm: The idea of replacing one's body parts and internal organs with machines frightens me. Outside of amputee's and disabled people of course. But we shouldn't live forever, nor for a really long time. We cheated the 30-40 age limit already. People should die naturally.

    That doesn't mean we cant do great things while we're here though. There is nothing wrong with having hope that humanity will become a peaceful move into space.

    Last edited by s.ketch; November 7th, 2009 at 04:01 PM.
    "Astronomy offers an aesthetic indulgence not duplicated in any other field. This is not an academic or hypothetical attraction and should require no apologies, for the beauty to be found in the skies has been universally appreciated for unrecorded centuries."
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  38. #89
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    It wouldn't be so bad but people in this discussion don't even know simple things like what electromagnetic radiation is.
    So they aren't qualified to speculate about the ramifications of such technology? While the technology itself may be complex, the purpose is extremely basic. Any six year old could figure out the ramifications for such technology. Whether or not anyone knows anything about electromagnetic radiation is irrelevant.

    there is no hard evidence to go on, any story a person makes up will most likely be whatever story they want. In this case, we have hard facts about RFID and it's problems. That's it. End of conversation.
    First, how could you know there is no hard evidence. What makes you the authority? Have you done 10 years of research and written 5 books on RFID chips or something?

    But the complaints in this thread have all basically summed up to a giant invocation of Godwin's Law, except replacing Hitler with their dictator of choice.
    I think Godwin's law is a bit of a paradox. It's probably the dumbest law ever come up with, thus any argument where someone brings up Godwin's law is void. That's my law.

    Saying that the government could use this to track people or they could use this to control a population is unfounded, illogical, and plain ignorant.
    WHAT??? That must be a typo. I think you meant to say "Saying that the government WILL"

    Has there been any examples of this technology being used to control/track people?
    Check out IBM, and WW2. Oh wait, damn it! I can't use that example because of Godwins law! DAMN IT!

    What are the credentials of my sources?
    Yeah, what are the credentials of your sources?

    How can so many people know and the secret not get out?
    Because even if it did, which I think it has, anyone that beleived would be labeled a conspriacy theorist.

    Is there any solid proof such as authentic documents, verified tapes of audio/video from within this conspiracy that back my position?
    Check out Aaron Russo. He's dead now...

    Does anyone with a solid background in working with this technology agree with them? Why or why not?
    Of course they won't! That's like asking Tobaco companies if cigarettes cause cancer. They now admit it only because there's irrefutable proof.

    The idea of replacing one's body parts and internal organs with machines frightens me. Outside of amputee's and disabled people of course. But we shouldn't live forever, nor for a really long time. We cheated the 30-40 age limit already. People should die naturally.
    So you think people should die naturally, but not live naturally?

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  39. #90
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dimension View Post
    So they aren't qualified to speculate about the ramifications of such technology?
    You can speculate about whatever you want. It's just retarded to "hurr durr technology bad" because of an unfounded speculation about a possible use that it may or may not be used for.

    The government could jam a computer in each one of our rectums and use Wii controllers to move us around. So hey, computers must be inherently evil right? Let's not even give them a chance.

    And holy shit! Nazis using computers during WW2! They used cars too, maybe we should re-think those. And airplanes, and medical science, and mathematics, and anything that Nazis may have ever used.

    I can't remember how many times it came up during the Bush years that he signed some act that allowed him to repeal presidential term limits during a national emergency. Then all the shit about the patriot act giving him unlimited power. Katrina happened and then all the TROOTHERS thought it would happen, but it didn't. Bush never took over the US. So now there's a new guy in office and they're trying their best to turn him into Hitler too.

    It's like if someone said it was going to rain every singe day. Then when it finally does rain, they feel vindicated. I know people who say every few months "Yep, things are looking bad with Iran, it won't be long now until WWIII." Then the time passes, nothing happens. "Won't be long now..."


    So you think people should die naturally, but not live naturally?
    What are you saying here? That you think we aren't living naturally? Pacemaker's are unnatural? Bolts and metal plates that hold bones together are unnatural?

    Or that having a piece of plastic in your hand is somehow a complete game changer and is absolutely different from any other use of modern technology?

    All I was saying that being a robot isn't being human. A chip doesn't make you a robot. There is no slippery slope. There is a very clear difference between a single inert chip and having most of your body replaced with mechanical devices. Don't even begin to try to equate them.

    You have a brain. It is natural for humans to build tools and technology. It's natural for us to communicate ideas and develop intelligence. Living the way we do today was somewhat inevitable. If we live "unnaturally" then so does any animal that builds a shelter or uses tools.

    "Astronomy offers an aesthetic indulgence not duplicated in any other field. This is not an academic or hypothetical attraction and should require no apologies, for the beauty to be found in the skies has been universally appreciated for unrecorded centuries."
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