Microchip inplanted in your body makes everything better - RFID commercial

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    Microchip inplanted in your body makes everything better - RFID commercial

    Oooooook... so now they want us to get microchips inplanted in our bodies. The excuses for it are pretty damn questionably lame imo. Just another way to get more control over the masses and keep track of your location?

    I have heard that in South Korea they are building a city already on this technology. The chip will be your identity.




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    Yay Orwellian dystopia! You would think that people would realize that '1984' was only a book and not a guideline on how to screw the world up. Big Brother is always watching.

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    Oh god no...

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    Sorry, but we're already there - when was the last time you did anything without a card, a reference number or a bit of paper to show you were who you said you were? Hell, to log into CA I needed a username and password - it's like I'm just a line of code in a database here!

    That ad is shockingly bad, but patients do die because they're given the wrong drugs and the mechanisms for control are already firmly in place. I can't say I'm too worried if this is going to be the next development if it cuts out some of the current redundancy and bureaucracy.

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    It's already in you if you got a flu vaccine

    *adjusts his tinfoil hat*

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    Oh wow, this ad is so bad, makes me want to barf.

    And no, I certainly won't be getting one of these!

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    Quote Originally Posted by DuneFishUK View Post
    Sorry, but we're already there - when was the last time you did anything without a card, a reference number or a bit of paper to show you were who you said you were? Hell, to log into CA I needed a username and password - it's like I'm just a line of code in a database here!

    That ad is shockingly bad, but patients do die because they're given the wrong drugs and the mechanisms for control are already firmly in place. I can't say I'm too worried if this is going to be the next development if it cuts out some of the current redundancy and bureaucracy.
    Yeah, but you can always say that your account was hacked or your identity stolen. There are ways to play the system, but if this gets put into you, then guess what, there's no trying to hide where you were when the hooker went missing and your bank account is suddenly $2,000 short.

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    Stark, if that were the only problem it'd be a good thing.

    Back in the 30's there was a comedian named Will Rogers who joked about his birth certificate. He goes into a govt office and they say they can't help him without a birth certificate. He just says, "Gee, where I come from, they just kinda take it for granted."

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    So I guess it's safe to say that this is no longer a "conspiracy theory" anymore? Alex Jones has been saying this for years. I guess the people who were saying "Oh they would NEVER do that" are now saying "Oh well it must be for OUR own good".

    My buddy who works at a government building was offered one of these last year. They were placing them in the upper tricep.

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    This ad disgusts me, next thing you know they'll start making it a requirement to have these implants, is it me or is the government tightening it's grasp on America's nutsack?
    If you are going to make an ad as sickening as this one, atleast make it half-way decent. *FacePalm*

    Last edited by WeAreLegion; October 25th, 2009 at 11:02 AM.
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    Oh god! technology! everybody panic!

    Quote from the guy who posted the vid "What? By vaccines, Immunizations, and now chipping?"

    Yeah guys, let's listen to some people who think vaccines are evil government tools to control populations. Sure is critical thinking in here.

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Microchip_implant_(human)
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Radio-f...s_and_concerns

    In 2002, the VeriChip Corporation received preliminary approval from the United States Food and Drug Administration (FDA) to market its device in the U.S. within specific guidelines. Since its effective approval in 2004 [2], about 80 hospitals and 232 doctors have elected to use the system.[3]

    By implanting such a chip with a patient's medical record, hospitals and emergency workers can immediately gain access to an ill or injured person's medical history regardless of location or condition. Implanted chips are impossible to lose, which could reduce (extremely difficult to steal the implant itself) or increase (may be able to be hacked and read without touching the person) the chances of information theft.

    One major challenge in securing RFID tags is a shortage of computational resources within the tag. Standard cryptographic techniques require more resources than are available in most low cost RFID devices. RSA Security has patented a prototype device that locally jams RFID signals by interrupting a standard collision avoidance protocol, allowing the user to prevent identification if desired.
    Logical concerns:

    -The frequencies used for RFID in the USA are currently incompatible with those of Europe or Japan. Furthermore, no emerging standard has yet become as universal as the barcode.
    -EPCglobal Network, by design, is also susceptible to DoS attacks. Using similar mechanism with DNS in resolving EPC data requests, the ONS Root servers become vulnerable to DoS attacks. Any organization planning to embark on EPCglobal Network may cringe upon discovering that the EPCglobal Network infrastructure inherits security weaknesses similar to DNS'[63].
    -http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Man-in-the-middle_attack
    -Suppose Alice wishes to communicate with Bob. Meanwhile, Mallory wishes to eavesdrop on the conversation, or possibly deliver a false message to Bob. To get started, Alice must ask Bob for his public key. If Bob sends his public key to Alice, but Mallory is able to intercept it, a man-in-the-middle attack can begin. Mallory sends a forged message to Alice that claims to be from Bob, but includes Mallory's public key. Alice, believing this public key to be Bob's, then encrypts her message with Mallory's key and sends the enciphered message back to Bob. Mallory again intercepts, deciphers the message, keeps a copy, and reenciphers it (after alteration if desired) using the public key Bob originally sent to Alice. When Bob receives the newly enciphered message, he will believe it came from Alice.

    The chips aren't secure enough to implement on a wide scale. There is no global, or even a US standard for the RFID frequencies. So how is the evil guberment going to track all of you when they don't even know the frequencies? Not only that but you can clone tags which means that the person that's being read might not be that person. I'm sure the New World Order in all their grand scheming and plans overlooked a bunch of security and technical problems that would thwart their plans.

    Wait a sec....

    Religious Issue

    Some Christians are concerned that the development of implantable microchips and RFIDs are a precursor to events prophesied by the apostle John the Apostle in the Bible's Book of Revelation.[12][13] Implantable chips are seen as technological development that could be used to implement the prophesy that predicted that a "Mark of the Beast" on the hand or forehead will be required for individuals to complete any transactions in future society. According to belief in this interpretation of the prophesy, the fate for those that take the mark will be that they are destroyed or condemned by God.[14]
    Sure. Bible says some people will get tattooed with 666 so let's interpret that as "RIFD is the devil." Another win for religion!

    Last edited by s.ketch; October 25th, 2009 at 11:47 AM.
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    Quote Originally Posted by BuckWeisel View Post
    Oh god technology everybody panic
    Oh god technology used in the wrong way for questionable purposes everybody panic

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    Just a friendly reminder folks: WE ARE WATCHING.

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    Quote Originally Posted by LORD M View Post
    Oh god technology used in the wrong way for questionable purposes everybody panic
    What's questionable about it? What evidence do you have that implies the government using this technology to track you 24/7.

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    Quote Originally Posted by BuckWeisel View Post
    What's questionable about it? What evidence do you have that implies the government using this technology to track you 24/7.
    Don't you find it a bit questionable that all of a sudden we need to get microchips inplanted in us so that everything will work better? They are planning to make this chip have the ability to open doors, start your car, cheeck in at work, as passport and as your ID and the gods knows what more. All of a sudden all our daily endevours will be controlled by this chip - and the government controlls the chip, and thereby controlling you.

    And what if you don't act as they want you to act? What if you're critical towards the government, will they simply turn off this chip so that you cannot execute your daily endevours? What then if you cannot prove who you are since the chip IS your ID? The chip is using radio frequencies, thereby it can be remotely switched on and off with such an application. This chip is nothing else but taking our free will and our rights away from us, just as they have done little by little for many many years.


    I think that you should analyze everything and look at the possibilities that are both good and bad, not just accept anything unknowingly what it do and can do. And as far as I can tell, imo, the bad outweights the good a lot.

    Last edited by LORD M; October 25th, 2009 at 12:31 PM.
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    from http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Radio-f...tion#Passports

    "Standards for RFID passports are determined by the International Civil Aviation Organization (ICAO), and are contained in ICAO Document 9303, Part 1, Volumes 1 and 2 (6th edition, 2006). ICAO refers to the ISO/IEC 14443 RFID chips in e-passports as "contactless integrated circuits". ICAO standards provide for e-passports to be identifiable by a standard e-passport logo on the front cover."

    there are standards for some RFID applications, all it needs is a reader installed in the airport (or wherever) and its easy to immediately know the history of whoever is around that receiver. of course their use make sense in many cases but we shouldnt ignore the massive loss of privacy this would imply.

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    I can't see anything at all wrong with the population being tagged-and-released like cattle. I think this will help the nanny-state take care of us better, and that can only be a good thing.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Stark View Post
    Yay Orwellian dystopia! You would think that people would realize that '1984' was only a book and not a guideline on how to screw the world up. Big Brother is always watching.
    This type of fiction isn't warning us about technology, but its misuse by overbearing laws. This to me sounds like great news

    just the other day I was having a discussion with my parents about how they feel we've become just mere numbers (our social)... they came from a small town where everyone knew each other by name and were friendly with their doctor, banker, priest etc. But we're no longer segregating ourselves in small towns, and doctors today cant keep track of their hundreds of patients. I think a social is Better than a name.. it only sounds bad because its made of numbers, that's just a psychological attachment they should get over with. With names, there are most likely 100+ people who share your same name, but only you have such a social and that makes you an individual less likely to be mistaken for someone else.

    This is an improvement of that, you hear in news stories all the time of dead people with no identity on them. And not to mention this would make identity theft almost impossible... the only people who should fear this are criminals

    Last edited by nauvice; October 25th, 2009 at 12:54 PM.
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    Quote Originally Posted by LORD M View Post
    Don't you find it a bit questionable that all of a sudden we need to get microchips inplanted in us so that everything will work better?
    All of a sudden? This tech has been around for years. I find your phrasing odd. Nobody said we NEED it. Nobody has said "You have to get this implanted, your life depends on it." Like all new technologies, it's being offered and marketed by a corporation. We didn't need the internet, or computers but it sure has made things a bit easier. Why aren't you upset that companies market to hospitals for computer systems that store and organize medical records? Hospitals now are eliminating paper. My doctor's office is mostly electronic already. Nurses use special laptops instead of clipboards.

    This commercial is simply offering a product to store your medical record. It's not a necessity, and there are valid problems with the system that haven't been worked out. Simply fearing it because of unfounded suspicions about government conspiracy isn't a valid complaint.



    They are planning to make this chip have the ability to open doors, start your car, cheeck in at work, as passport and as your ID and the gods knows what more. All of a sudden all our daily endevours will be controlled by this chip - and the government controlls the chip, and thereby controlling you.
    Who is "they"? Scientists you mean? Yes the chips will be able to unlock doors, car doors included, possibly clock in at work, and they already use RFIDs in your passport. These are possible features of the technology. You can already accomplish these tasks without putting the chip in your body. The difference being convenience.

    Not to mention the technological boundaries in the way of this. You can't just switch over night. In order to clock in at work using a chip 1) Chips must be fully secure (they are not). 2)Employers must have readers (this means buying and converting all facilities) 3) New computer databases/serves/networks. This is not a small task for a business.

    The chip doesn't control your life. What you must mean is that people will become dependent on the chip. But we're already dependent on keys. Thats all a chip would act as in this instance. It's not like your soul is downloaded to your car before you can drive it. It's a simple unique radio frequency sent to a device in the door that says "open it" The only difference is that it's hard to misplace a chip inside of you.

    And what if you don't act as they want you to act? What if you're critical towards the government, will they simply turn off this chip so that you cannot execute your daily endevours? What then if you cannot prove who you are since the chip IS your ID? The chip is using radio frequencies, thereby it can be remotely switched on and off with such an application. This chip is nothing else but taking our free will and our rights away from us, just as they have done little by little for many many years.
    What if you don't act like "they" want you to act now? Why not shut down your bank accounts, repossess your home and vehicle, delete your SSN, etc?

    The only way to identify yourself isn't your drivers license. You have a birth certificate, social security card, deeds and titles to property. Your family and friends know who you are. You're making up a pretend world where the only way to know who you are is a chip. The chip is just a replacement for a plastic card.

    If your drivers license was a small plastic cube that you attached to your keyring, how would you feel about it? You wouldn't care. You'd probably say it's pretty cool. But there is this stigma around chips propagated by conspiracy theorists and religious folks. Just like stigma around any technology that people don't fully understand. The LHC is going to cause black holes and destroy Earth, remember?


    I think that you should analyze everything and look at the possibilities that are both good or bad, not just accept anything unknowingly what it do and can do.
    I agree completely. We should analyze everything and fully understand what this technology is. But it's also not about a fantasy or what we feel. It's about reality. Extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence. There's absolutely nothing but hearsay and half-cocked rants that says this is a bad technology that will be used by the government to control us.

    It's not even guaranteed that the technology will take off or be successful. This might just be betamax or UMD with the discovery of something better around the corner.

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    Buckwiesal, I can see how this microchip could be useful, especially in holding medical information. That information you could also put on a card in your wallet.

    This issue isn't as simple as it seems. First of all, it could be used in different countries. In America it may not seem so frightening, maybe, but what about in China, or North Korea? And what information would they put in the chip?

    Secondly, it's historical fact that authoritarian regimes have sprung up in the past, notably Nazi Germany, but also in South America, and Russia. What happens when people with trackable chips suddenly commit such crimes as meeting together in a public space, reading certain books, organizing a protest, etc? There're questions involving degree of use, temptation on the part of govt to misuse technology, and slippery slopes. There's also a question of legitimizing this to the point where it becomes standard - to where people accept it, and inject a microchip at a young age, before they can understand the implications. Say, in 30 years, a lot of people have this. Then, in another hundred years, a country turns several degrees more authoritarian. They have a system in place to oppress many, many people.

    Not all countries relish personal freedoms the way we do in the US. For instance, random roadside checks are standard here in Slovakia - they can pull you over and ask for your documents anytime without suspicion of a crime. Plus, the UK has a host of issues regarding personal freedom. They already use cameras and detectives to track people for the most inane reasons, imagine if they could track you with these chips? Would they?

    http://www.nytimes.com/2009/10/25/wo..._r=1&ref=world

    EDIT: On a practical note, what happens when your medical info changes? How easy is it to change the info on that chip? Say, if you develop an allergy to a certain medicine. Do you then need a second, updated chip implanted? And then what if they read the wrong chip? Just curious. Excising the first chip sounds painful. I'd much rather have a new card in my wallet. Why do I sound like Jack Handey, now?

    Last edited by TASmith; October 25th, 2009 at 01:11 PM.
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    a society where we're becoming robots > society where we're just wild ants.

    At least in either situation, a brain with creativity and imagination is what still makes us human and we artists are the front runners proving that, hurray for us

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    Quote Originally Posted by TASmith View Post
    Buckwiesal, I can see how this microchip could be useful, especially in holding medical information. That information you could also put on a card in your wallet.

    This issue isn't as simple as it seems. First of all, it could be used in different countries. In America it may not seem so frightening, maybe, but what about in China, or North Korea? And what information would they put in the chip?

    Secondly, it's historical fact that authoritarian regimes have sprung up in the past, notably Nazi Germany, but also in South America, Russia. Not all countries relish personal freedoms the way we do in the US. For instance, random roadside checks are standard here in Slovakia - they can pull you over and ask for your documents anytime without suspicion of a crime. Plus, the UK has a host of issues regarding personal freedom. They already use cameras and detectives to track people for the most inane reasons, imagine if they could track you with these chips? Would they?

    http://www.nytimes.com/2009/10/25/wo..._r=1&ref=world
    What about China or North Korea? They already abuse and exploit computers. Should we stop making computers? The chip, like any modern technology could be used anywhere that it's needed. I don't think tribesmen in Africa or South America are going to be getting them though. China and NK are already being controlled by their government without chips. Chips aren't going to change decades of political and social injustice. It's not going to make it better, and it's not going to make it worse.

    And yes it is historical fact that authoritarian governments spring up. Is it historical fact that all authoritarian governments have sprung up suddenly due to one tiny bit of technology? Doubt it. That historical fact has little to do with the discussion of RFID chips. It's a straw man.

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    that seems creepy because of the subject matter... what's more perceived as innocence than a mother and 3 little girls? This happens often to people suspected of other crimes like drug dealing, gang association, etc. her would-be crime isnt as high and life threatening as my examples, so maybe they didnt need to take such a drastic measure, but I dont see the big deal.

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    "and it's not going to make it worse."

    It very well could, and the same people who make that chip for medical purposes here could make a ton of money off it elsewhere for questionable purposes. I never said the technology itself will change a government, but if and when that happens, they'll have another tool at their disposal. There's also a question of identity fraud. If there are readers for those chips, then a thief could get one too, and read people's personal info just by walking by them, or sitting by them in a subway.

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    Quote Originally Posted by BuckWeisel View Post
    Chips aren't going to change decades of political and social injustice. It's not going to make it better, and it's not going to make it worse.
    really? I think it would make a big change for the better or worst. It would make it harder for liars and cheaters to climb their way into the political spectrum, that would be a better change. but in a corrupt government, it would make it harder for revolutionists to hide themselves, would make their situation a bit worst.

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  40. #27
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    zwarrior, when a politician lies in the US, you don't need a microchip to remember it, you need John Stewart.

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  42. #28
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    Of course there's security issues. I said so myself in earlier posts. That's why this tech isn't being implemented tomorrow or practical as a way to control a populace.

    I'll use your Slovakian paper checking thing as an example. Right now the police can pull you over, check your papers and search you for little reason. I agree that this is an injustice and shouldn't occur. But it does.

    So let's imagine all of your papers are on a small chip inside a plastic shell that you carry around with you. The police can pull out a scanner and read this chip. Is this less or more of a crime? The chip simply replaced the papers. Police have to be within range in order to check them. They could already check your papers at will anyways. There is no difference.

    Now lets go with a chip inside your hand. The police pull you over and scan your hand. Before, they pulled you over and checked some papers. Same situation, same crime against privacy, different medium. So why is a chip worse? What logical, rational, argument makes chip reading more invasive than forcing you to hand over physical identification?

    If you refused papers, they would arrest you or beat you up. True, you can't refuse a chip reading, unless you had the device to block it. Even if you did, they would beat you up. If you didn't have papers, you'd be arrested. So having a chip saves you from being arrested even though it's pretty damn bad that you're being forcibly searched just as you are now in a world without a chip.

    The whole point of all my walls of text is that the US isn't suddenly going to be a totalitarian nazi regime because of a chip. Conspiracy theories are baseless fears that usually have 0% evidence to back them up. This technology isn't the downfall of democracy or freedom. It's simply a different medium of information storage/transfer. It's cool to be cautious, trust me I understand that. But to act like this is the end of the world is silly.

    EDIT: And the tech isn't so advanced that normal people can't understand it. Wrap your hand up in tin foil and then it's pretty useless. All it is, is a tiny chip of a material that emits a radio frequency when a scanner activates it. It's electromagnetic radiation. Less advanced than a cell phone signal. Do your cell phones work in tunnels? In large stores? Do you guys know why? You can easily block the signal of an RFID if you wanted.

    EDIT 2:What I'm more worried about is the commercial applications of this. Imagine walking down the street and advertisements knowing your name. A credit chip. A television or video game console that knows who you are. Take a computer in to be fixed and Geek Squad and them being able to scan a chip on the computer that has my identity attached to it.

    Last edited by s.ketch; October 25th, 2009 at 01:40 PM.
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  43. #29
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    I'm generally not so paranoid about the US govt. The thing with a chip, though, is that it could also be equipped with a GPS device. That bothers me a lot more than just having info on it. And there have been some instances in the US of civil rights abuses. Like finding protest organizers and arresting them en masse BEFORE THEY PROTEST. How do you arrest someone for a crime they haven't committed? That and the occasional cop who arrests someone for not having an ID. It's rare but it happens.

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    Nobody is gonna put a chip on me, if i can avoid it! It´s already to much that google knows where i am right now.

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