Page 1 of 2 1 2 LastLast
Results 1 to 13 of 22

Thread: Explaination for creating ¨photoshop type" brushes in painter?

  1. #1
    rattsang's Avatar
    rattsang is offline i am destructor bahhhhhhwwwaaaaaaaa!!!!!!
    Join Date
    Jul 2007
    Location
    ireland :(
    Posts
    530
    Thanks
    149
    Thanked 121 Times in 76 Posts

    Explaination for creating ¨photoshop type" brushes in painter?

    Q: can i create ¨photoshop type" brushes in painter?

    A: not exactly no. the differences in the brush engines of painter and photoshop make it very difficult to create brushes that behave in similar ways in the opposing app. having said this it does not mean that certain effects cannot be achieved in either app, using the right technique you can do almost anything the other app can do, of course this usually means investing considerably more time and effort than is required in the app you are trying to mimic.

    Q: But why can´t i create the simple hard round brush from ps in painter...... its just a simple brush isn´t it?
    A: this boils down to one thing, how opacity works in each app. in photoshop opacity is stroke based, in painter it is dab based. a dab is what a single touch of the brush looks like i.e.the image you use for a custom brush, for the simple hard round brush in ps it is a solid circle. a stroke is a a collection of overlapping dabs. now to how this effects what you can and can´t do. AS you draw you get overlap on the edges of dabs as they cross over each other to form the stroke. when you lay in a single dab in painter or ps of the same color and opacity with a basic round brush you get exactly the same effect. the problem is this is the only time the effect is the same.notic e how in painter as you change the spacing settings not only the contour of the stroke changes (AS IN PS) but the actual opacity changes also. this is because any part of a dab that overlaps another dab will add the same amount of opacity to the one below it.therefore spacing has a bigger effect on how the brush strokes look in painter, the more dabs that over lap in one area the darker the stroke will appear. in photoshop the opacity setting sets the upper limit of the opacity of a single stroke(defined by from when the pen touches the pad until it is lifted) if it is set to 10% any overlap of the dabs that exceed 10% opacity are automatically discounted and with opacity set to 10% you can cross over your stroke with itself without changing the opacity so long as you don´t lift the pen.in painter every time a dab crosses another it will add the opacity of the new dab without exception.
    Attachment 773800

    for strokes to look smooth there has to be overlap, this is where the problem lies for painter. but painter does have a feature to combat these unsightly overlaps, blend. so in painter to get rid of the overlapping edges of dabs you have to use the blend setting. this would be fine except for one thing that makes mimicking the simple round ps brush not possible, stroke cross over. say you ar shading and area with a zig zag stroke, every time the stroke crosses itself it will be darker, sticking out like a sore thumb.



    Q: i don´t understand, you say you can´t create ps type brushes but you can mimic the effects, what does that mean?
    A: Basicly you need to understand how ps makes its brushes look that way and then use what painter has to offer to do the same in a long winded manner instead of thinking of what painter can´t do, because there is nothing you can do about that. there is a way to set the upper limit of the opacity of a stroke in painter too. simply create a new layer and stroke at full opacity (with or without Pressure set in expression) on the layer then change the opacity of the layer and drop it. this is however a considerable burden on work flow, but it is the only viable solution i know of.

    Attachment 773801

    if this isn´t explained propewrly or is to complicated to understand please reply and i´ll try to make it

    better

    rat
    its time to knuckle down and really lick boot!
    LOOK MOMMY! I laid a sketchbook!
    My Blog
    Reply With Quote Reply With Quote


  2. Hide this ad by registering as a member
  3. The Following User Says Thank You to rattsang For This Useful Post:


  4. #2
    Join Date
    Jun 2006
    Location
    Torrance, CA
    Posts
    6,802
    Thanks
    2,278
    Thanked 4,258 Times in 2,074 Posts
    Just a note, that The Real hard media marker brushes don't ''cover themselves" until you lift and make a new stroke. This is in Painter 11 only.
    Reply With Quote Reply With Quote

  5. The Following User Says Thank You to Arshes Nei For This Useful Post:


  6. #3
    rattsang's Avatar
    rattsang is offline i am destructor bahhhhhhwwwaaaaaaaa!!!!!!
    Join Date
    Jul 2007
    Location
    ireland :(
    Posts
    530
    Thanks
    149
    Thanked 121 Times in 76 Posts
    wow arshes thats great, , only difference i see is you can effectively erase in the same stroke by using very little pressure.... hmmm havent seen any posts about this new feature... have i been under a rock?
    its time to knuckle down and really lick boot!
    LOOK MOMMY! I laid a sketchbook!
    My Blog
    Reply With Quote Reply With Quote

  7. #4
    Join Date
    Aug 2005
    Posts
    753
    Thanks
    3
    Thanked 62 Times in 58 Posts
    Thanks for posting this. As a Photoshop "native," it's one of the things that annoys me most about Painter, unfortunately. =/ I would like to point out for anyone having the opposite problem (i.e. trying to get used to Photoshop's opacity), Photoshop does offer Painter's dab-based approach to opacity; it's just called flow instead of opacity.
    Reply With Quote Reply With Quote

  8. #5
    Join Date
    Feb 2008
    Posts
    171
    Thanks
    24
    Thanked 104 Times in 55 Posts
    Thanks rattsang, this thread is a nice idea!
    Quote Originally Posted by rattsang View Post
    wow arshes thats great, , only difference i see is you can effectively erase in the same stroke by using very little pressure.... hmmm havent seen any posts about this new feature... have i been under a rock?
    In fact those new brushes work only with gel composite method so you can only darken your paint with them.

    Corel used a trick to create them and it is the reason why they work only with gel. Instead of using opacity, they used value to emulate the effect and it is why it works only with gel composite method. If you set back the layer to normal, you will see your 20% opacity brush stroke is in fact a 100% opacity brush stroke with value corresponding to 20% opacity once viewed in gel composite method.
    Quote Originally Posted by Datameister View Post
    Photoshop does offer Painter's dab-based approach to opacity; it's just called flow instead of opacity.
    Yes, I repost here this image
    Explaination for  creating ¨photoshop type" brushes in painter?

    Now, no one should understand that like a limitation which makes Painter more limited because Painter offers many many kind of brushes.
    Last edited by hecartha; September 10th, 2009 at 02:37 AM.
    Reply With Quote Reply With Quote

  9. #6
    Join Date
    Aug 2005
    Posts
    753
    Thanks
    3
    Thanked 62 Times in 58 Posts
    I hadn't seen that image before - it does a really nice job of explaining the difference visually. Would have helped me out a lot if I'd seen it a few years ago!

    And I would say it is a limitation, and a rather significant one for someone like me who's addicted to Photoshop workflows, but obviously, there are plenty of artists who make Painter work beautifully for them, thanks to its many unique advantages.
    Reply With Quote Reply With Quote

  10. #7
    rattsang's Avatar
    rattsang is offline i am destructor bahhhhhhwwwaaaaaaaa!!!!!!
    Join Date
    Jul 2007
    Location
    ireland :(
    Posts
    530
    Thanks
    149
    Thanked 121 Times in 76 Posts
    Quote Originally Posted by hecartha View Post
    Thanks rattsang, this thread is a nice idea!
    In fact those new brushes work only with gel composite method so you can only darken your paint with them.

    Corel used a trick to create them and it is the reason why they work only with gel. Instead of using opacity, they used value to emulate the effect and it is why it works only with gel composite method. If you set back the layer to normal, you will see your 20% opacity brush stroke is in fact a 100% opacity brush stroke with value corresponding to 20% opacity once viewed in gel composite method.
    awwww i was hoping it would be a proper transparent brush, oh well. got me all hyped up to upgrade....... hmmmm would it be worth it?
    its time to knuckle down and really lick boot!
    LOOK MOMMY! I laid a sketchbook!
    My Blog
    Reply With Quote Reply With Quote

  11. #8
    Join Date
    Jul 2008
    Posts
    1,047
    Thanks
    73
    Thanked 195 Times in 158 Posts
    Try the demo?
    I was really happy about new UI and a few bug-fixes
    but 11 comes shipped with the dumbest painter bug ever.
    the new hard media brushes are really sweet as they have, I'd call it, true tilt recognition.
    And another thing - it was loading my cpu so much so I just couldn't stand the constant noise.
    I'm looking for p-12, as corel don't seem to care about major patches anymore (like, there's no sign of 11.5 coming)
    Reply With Quote Reply With Quote

  12. #9
    rattsang's Avatar
    rattsang is offline i am destructor bahhhhhhwwwaaaaaaaa!!!!!!
    Join Date
    Jul 2007
    Location
    ireland :(
    Posts
    530
    Thanks
    149
    Thanked 121 Times in 76 Posts
    ive tried the demo..... and there were some notable bugs including some of the now infamous new bugs in things that havent even been changed that painter seems to be known for. things that annoyed me include....

    color management' why fuck with my blacks?
    space no longer scrolls the mixer pad? wtf why remove this feature
    the magic jumping dabs and streaks
    some of the older small bugs not addressed such as the artifacts in scratchboard tool at less than 100% opacity
    radom crashes while rotating the canvas on the fly
    blah blah no one is listening............

    of course on the plus side weve got

    new sizable color wheel
    hard media
    err should nt there be some bug fixes in here some where....

    hmmm cant think of anything else and my trial is over so i cant snoop
    Last edited by rattsang; September 10th, 2009 at 10:34 AM.
    its time to knuckle down and really lick boot!
    LOOK MOMMY! I laid a sketchbook!
    My Blog
    Reply With Quote Reply With Quote

  13. #10
    Join Date
    Jul 2008
    Posts
    1,047
    Thanks
    73
    Thanked 195 Times in 158 Posts
    I remember having issues with resizable colour wheel, lol - sometimes it got stuck and nothing could change its size for a while. I don't know what could be the reason - I never stack it to other panels (layers palette wasn't resizable if stacked)
    Full versions of p-11 seems to have some weird issues with licensing (error 18 and such) - I didn't upgrade so don't know if it happens that often.
    Reply With Quote Reply With Quote

  14. #11
    Join Date
    Sep 2007
    Location
    Chihuahua mexico
    Posts
    290
    Thanks
    46
    Thanked 43 Times in 30 Posts
    http://img41.imageshack.us/i/testiw.jpg/

    The best one that mimics photoshop, its scratchboard tool pen, some people just move opacity down and do strokes, but you will notice it will leave something really weird at the begginning of the stroke, because its rendered, i had found the perfect solution for this annoying thing, just add the presure option in opacity on the brush settings, and you will notice how magically the annoying weird dtroke at the beginning magically dissapears.

    You can do dark strokes and white strokes with this brush, its awesome.

    The only bad side its that you cant do zig zag strokes, cause it will get a weird effect, but for Rembrant tecnique with glazing like photoshop its great, i recomend this brush using it this way, took me a lot of time to realize how to solve that stroke thing.


    This brush its wesome for sketching you will like it.
    Last edited by Elsevilla; September 11th, 2009 at 01:17 PM. Reason: adding image
    There are no such things as bad art, just tight deadlines.
    Reply With Quote Reply With Quote

  15. #12
    Join Date
    Sep 2007
    Location
    Chihuahua mexico
    Posts
    290
    Thanks
    46
    Thanked 43 Times in 30 Posts
    Quote Originally Posted by rattsang View Post
    ive tried the demo..... and there were some notable bugs including some of the now infamous new bugs in things that havent even been changed that painter seems to be known for. things that annoyed me include....

    color management' why fuck with my blacks?
    space no longer scrolls the mixer pad? wtf why remove this feature
    the magic jumping dabs and streaks
    some of the older small bugs not addressed such as the artifacts in scratchboard tool at less than 100% opacity
    radom crashes while rotating the canvas on the fly
    blah blah no one is listening............

    of course on the plus side weve got

    new sizable color wheel
    hard media
    err should nt there be some bug fixes in here some where....

    hmmm cant think of anything else and my trial is over so i cant snoop

    It seems you complain to much about painter, maybe its not your program, if you want photoshop brushes i recomend you to go to photoshop, then when you want painter brushes, come back to this program, what its cool about this programs its compatibility.
    There are no such things as bad art, just tight deadlines.
    Reply With Quote Reply With Quote

  16. #13
    Join Date
    Jul 2008
    Posts
    1,047
    Thanks
    73
    Thanked 195 Times in 158 Posts
    he's complaining about recent versions' bugs, I can't imagine anyone who's fine with program, getting worse and worse.
    I'm on painter 6.1 and 10 right now, and feel no need to upgrade - and those bugs are a few reasons not to do that.
    Reply With Quote Reply With Quote

Page 1 of 2 1 2 LastLast

Similar Threads

  1. Replies: 5
    Last Post: September 26th, 2009, 01:01 AM
  2. Replies: 1
    Last Post: May 1st, 2008, 01:24 PM
  3. using photoshop brushes in painter
    By omar in forum PAINTER
    Replies: 2
    Last Post: November 27th, 2007, 11:54 AM
  4. What type of brushes in painter 8??
    By timtheenchantor in forum ART TUTORIALS, ART TIPS & ART TRICKS - ARCHIVE
    Replies: 0
    Last Post: February 4th, 2004, 10:36 PM

Members who have read this thread: 0

There are no members to list at the moment.

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •  
  • 424,149 Artists
  • 3,599,276 Artist Posts
  • 32,941 Sketchbooks
  • 54 New Art Jobs
Art Workshop Discount Inside

Developed Actively by vBSocial.com
SpringOfSea's Sketchbook