Painter zoom out / rotate function

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Thread: Painter zoom out / rotate function

  1. #1
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    Painter zoom out / rotate function

    hi everyone

    i'm having a hard time viewing clearly my drawings while I either rotate or zoom out to an "irregular" percentage (anyother then 50% or 25%). I'm using painter ver 9.5

    I did check/enable the "draw zoomed out views using averaging" under the preferences, but the drawing is still pixelated as before. Is there any update/fix/patch for this issue? its really annoying because cheaper products (moneywise) like OpenCanvas keeps the drawing crisp clear when rotated and/or zoomed out.

    Thanks in adv
    Lee

    *edit - i know this was asked before but the suggestion was always to enable that option...which still didnt work*

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  3. #2
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    Do you have the latest drivers for your graphics card installed?
    I'm running Painter IX.5 as well and it works just fine, always has.

    There's likely some jagging of edges to occur when rotating or zooming, but your image should still be displayed relatively well.

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    well i'll try re-updating my video cards maybe it helps; but i'm sure they're more recent then the painter version itself.

    I will also post a screen shot after the update just in case

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    Do you mean ctrl 0? It'll zoom out 100% or ctrl - or + And sometimes your resolution has something to do with it too.

    I'm out to conquer the world equipped with a pencil, digital paint and a Sketchbook
    and when I do achieve that goal...I'll conquer the moon too


    "When you draw nervously you end up with a nervous drawing, so drawing strongly produces lines filled with vitality"- Nightow Yasuhiro

    "Use the ability you already have, and use it, and use it, and make it develop itself."-Robert Henri
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    i've updated the video card driver but its still the same

    here's a screen shot how it looks like at 100% zoom rotate - the one on the left is another application

    I know it might not look that bad, but i draw mostly thin lineart more then color painting, and worst thing is that i do not draw at a 3000px resolution as i've got limited hardware
    (my screen res is 1280x800)


    Painter zoom out / rotate function

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    For thin lineart there's nothing better than Paint Tool SAI's ink layer, Painter simply doesn't anti-aliase the viewing, it does if you check "Draw zoomed out blabablalb..." but it's quite slow.


    Also what brushes are you using in Painter? For inking stick to the Scratchboard pen or whatever it's called, it uses the brilliant Rendered engine which is ultra responsive and perfect for ink lines.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Portus View Post
    For thin lineart there's nothing better than Paint Tool SAI's ink layer, Painter simply doesn't anti-aliase the viewing, it does if you check "Draw zoomed out blabablalb..." but it's quite slow.


    Also what brushes are you using in Painter? For inking stick to the Scratchboard pen or whatever it's called, it uses the brilliant Rendered engine which is ultra responsive and perfect for ink lines.
    Paint Tool SAI is another application thought isnt it?

    as for the inking i use the pens cartegory. they almost all do the same if the settings are alike

    as for the 'draw zoom ... ' option it still doesnt do anti-alias even if checked

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    AFAIK, it's just the way it works in Painter. The visual renderer is just very, very crappy. I suspect the very slow brushes also to be blamed on bad code rather than insane complexitiy. Trying Artrage then Painter is a spit in the face of Corel's coders. That said Artrage is too much of a toy to be an option for serious work.

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    The pixellation only happens in rotate, which doesn't use anti-aliasing. Zoom-only can be smoothed using the Area Averaging option.

    Quote Originally Posted by Grégory Makles View Post
    That said Artrage is too much of a toy to be an option for serious work.
    Nonsense.

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    I'd be very happy if I am wrong. I find the soft to be very well coded and smartly designed (something I wouldn't say about Painter, quite the opposite actually). I'd love to switch to it. But let's face it :
    - no custom brushes, you've got one of each kind and that's it. WTF ?
    - no tool to ink with.
    - stencils is actually what you have in plenty of other soft with less control and fancy display.

    That said it would not need a lot of things to become a serious option. Add a real airbrush (Painter has the lead for that), the ability to create a custom brush library (with keyb shortcut like in paint sai), a grid, a selection tool, some pen/felt pen tools and we'd start to get something very cool.

    I must confess thus that my perspective is one from a comic book artitst rather than illustrator (also I do some painting for covers sometimes). No doubt you can use Artrage in addition to other soft (it completes well with Paint Tool SAI for instance) but this is the kind of workflow I try to avoid.

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    Depends what you're looking for. AR does have a basic tool set but it's meant to replicate traditional painting, and if you paint traditionally you just have one canvas and a brush. AR would benefit from a few extras, most of which will likely be implemented in V3, but it's perfectly usable in its current form if, like me, you don't bother with complex workflow. I painted my last three pieces 95% in AR, just using Painter to neaten up the blending right at the end. It's nowhere near as comprehensive as Painter but it does what it does incredibly well.

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    Ok, this is getting OT but when I am painting IRL I do have several brushes, pen, etc.
    I like your painting and I'd be very happy to see what you can do with AR BTW. PM welcome !

    My comic book blog (french).. Some draws by Vincent Makles, some by me...
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    AR is a gimmick, everything is a gimmick in that program, I've only seen one person use it and not look like it was made in AR, it has quite some issue like the cursor not being precise, using the pencil tool is a proof of this. Plus it's incredibly limited and not in a good way, you have to export and import the PSD files, how tiresome is that?

    If Painter has the auto-painters, AR has the auto-tracers with the stencils.

    Simply put AR is a toy for the hobbyist to play and that's perfectly fine, it doesn't change the fact that an incredible talented person with it could make amazing works, after all there are persons who do incredible work with the worse/basic tools. I would not recommend AR2.5 to any serious artist, the tools are simply too crappy, they all look bad apart from the oils which only have one look and it is a very slow program.

    SAI is like a light version of Painter with full anti-aliasing and neat original and usable tools. AR is a joke that got too far, I hope that AR3 changes this because even the developers are aware of this.

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    Art Rage : while I agree it's not suited for most professionnal uses, I entirely disagree on the quality of the tools. The paper pen stunned me the first time I used it - it really had the feel of a 2b on a watercolor paper. I'd tried to get that in numerous software, including painter, with no success. The watercolor/brushes kick painter ass IMHO, although it's lacking some precision (quite like real watercolor BTW!). Same for oil brushes. The only tool I thought to be really lagging behind Painter was the airbrush. Painter made the interesting and smart choice to let the airbrush paint directly in pixel with little to no antialiasing. It's actually the right way to do it IMO, as it's better for print and anything but native res on screen. This way it really keeps the texture that makes all the charm of Bill Sienkiewicz or early Simon Bisley works.

    As said above I'd drop Painter happily in a minute if AR had just a few improvement. I feel like a pro tool is first something that is straight, fast, and provide a solid feedback. Painter, with his messy brush setting sea of panels, outrageously bad visual rendering (zoom and rotation, as stated in this thread), ridiculous CPU use, ridiculous RAM use, is quite the opposite.

    Still, I am using it, because right now it's just the only soft around that has everything I absolutely need (including: good tools for textured inking). But god how it's poorly crafted!

    My comic book blog (french).. Some draws by Vincent Makles, some by me...
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    2 Portus

    AR's bristle technology (that was duplicated in painter mixer palette and later ripped off by corel) is so much superior to the recent painter's realwhistle brushes;
    I don't know what you mean by cursor not being precise, it has an optional precise tablet mode, that is taking advantage of more advanced equipment; and I never had issues with default mode being unresponsible or something (I'm working with a4-sized intuos 3);
    I use it as a part of my workflow for tonns of stuff, including texturing - and it is an excellent tool. Excellent 25 bucks tool - that's even cheaper than upgrading from painter x to 11 to get crappy pseudo-real oils.

    (it still strongly needs a mixing palette, watercolour engine and a little more refined interface, anyway.)

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    Honestly I don't see how it couldn't be used professionally. Not every professional's work is a finished piece that hit the magazine. A lot of it are sketches first. Right now Art Rage beats out Corel's Painter sketchpad. Remember Sketchpad WAS developed for pros to use to start off art. How often do you see us talking about Sketchpad, other than it being too expensive?

    Would you say Sketchbook pro is a gimmick?

    Art Rage does have pieces you could finish on a professional level though, it's about how you use it.

    I'm not sure about the angst about the stencils though, since you can create your own, it's like getting mad at the people who use Pattern Chalk in Painter if it's not their own, or any other nozzle, paper library.

    I believe the last I heard about Art Rage is that they're still fixing a few bugs, it was posted around the 14th of August in one of the forums.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Grégory Makles View Post
    Ok, this is getting OT but when I am painting IRL I do have several brushes, pen, etc.
    I like your painting and I'd be very happy to see what you can do with AR BTW. PM welcome !
    Fair enough about the brushes, I was meaning more that you stick to a brush type rather than only use one brush. After all, AR has the brush sizing, loading and thinner options.

    My last 3 AR pictures are the ones linked via my homepage right now - "Big Blue", "Albert's Gate" and "Stormbringer". I did a bit of blending in Painter but they're 95% to 99% AR.

    Quote Originally Posted by Portus View Post
    AR is a gimmick, everything is a gimmick in that program, I've only seen one person use it and not look like it was made in AR, it has quite some issue like the cursor not being precise, using the pencil tool is a proof of this.
    ArtRage is limited in scope but don't confuse that with it being somehow inferior in quality. I'm not sure where your usage problems are coming from either - I sketch in AR and use it a lot of the time for painting and the cursor is 100% accurate and I don't find it slow at all. The only time it's slower than other s/w is when dropping a layer and saving, and that's because it processes far more information than Photoshop, Painter, SAI, etc.

    The reason for the import / export issue is that AR is the only s/w that has a separate, configurable canvas and the PTG files contain information on paint thickness, consistency and texture. The problem therefore lies with the other software that can't handle this information and not with AR. PSDs, TIFs, JPGs, etc. are not designed for natural media emulation as they don't hold enough data.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Baron Impossible View Post
    My last 3 AR pictures are the ones linked via my homepage right now - "Big Blue", "Albert's Gate" and "Stormbringer". I did a bit of blending in Painter but they're 95% to 99% AR.
    I think that's proof of concept that Art Rage can be used for nice professionnal work, and not only sketches.

    That being said - and hopefully not offending you- I've got the feeling that if you reach the point where everything expressive in the brush stroke is under a certain size in the published picture, it doesn't really matter what soft your using because most of the texture / hand gesture isn't really perceived anyway. My feeling seing those pictures at this scale is that they could be made in photoshop as well or with anything providing flat brushes and blending.

    I am slightly exagerating - there remains a feel of a bit more than that but I guess you can catch my drift =)

    My comic book blog (french).. Some draws by Vincent Makles, some by me...
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    Quote Originally Posted by Grégory Makles View Post
    That being said - and hopefully not offending you- I've got the feeling that if you reach the point where everything expressive in the brush stroke is under a certain size in the published picture, it doesn't really matter what soft your using because most of the texture / hand gesture isn't really perceived anyway. My feeling seing those pictures at this scale is that they could be made in photoshop as well or with anything providing flat brushes and blending.
    That's likely because they're being viewed as very small JPGs. The smallest brushes I use are around 12 - 16% (which equates to 15 or 20 pix) so when viewed at their proper print sizes AR's unique brush-strokes are more visible. It's true though I do the same type of thing in Painter with a similar result, although I would never use Photoshop, it really isn't made for painting.

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    /agree

    I think I may try harder with Art Rage. While the limitations do seem too much for me the brush quality may make up for it. Also oversimplified UI force to simple workflow and who knows, maybe that would be good for me =)

    My comic book blog (french).. Some draws by Vincent Makles, some by me...
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