Sketchbook: One Nice Day - Page 18
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Thread: One Nice Day

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    I'm digging those cubes but why is it that they're not more purposeful?

    What I mean by that is that you seem to throw cube or roughly all the same size around the page and they don't relate in any way to each other.

    Start with one cube and try to draw all the following one as if it was the same cube travelling through space. Try and keep it consistant throughout every position and don't hesitate to make the cube smaller or bigger and its distance from the camera changes.

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  3. #512
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    Quote Originally Posted by TheCoconutChef View Post
    I'm digging those cubes but why is it that they're not more purposeful?

    What I mean by that is that you seem to throw cube or roughly all the same size around the page and they don't relate in any way to each other.

    Start with one cube and try to draw all the following one as if it was the same cube travelling through space. Try and keep it consistant throughout every position and don't hesitate to make the cube smaller or bigger and its distance from the camera changes.
    LOL, the cubes practice's objective was to try to draw a true cube from various angles without any measuring or technical means. My lecturer says it helps to train the eyes, and I find it to be extremely hard, though it looks deceptively simple! Yeah, I'll try to do what you suggest soon.

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    Amazing amount of work going on here, and it definitely seams to be paying off, the figures in the last couple posts are really starting to feel solid.

    I also think your life drawing is looking pretty good, I liked these in particular.
    http://www.oneniceday.com/Artwork/1458.jpg
    http://www.oneniceday.com/Artwork/1649.jpg
    http://www.oneniceday.com/Artwork/1650.jpg

    I caught a couple of question threads in the art discussion section while ago and its always nice to see someone trying to learn more.

    I think you should try drawing your initial block in and interior lines as lightly as you can, because all the dark lines on the inside are turning things into mud. As far as rendering and lighting go I think you could work on Mass lighting and grouping your values into well defined light and shadow shapes, although it appears your working mostly on drawing at the moment I think it would be something to keep in mind.

    on these http://www.oneniceday.com/Artwork/1611.jpg and your faces in general try to draw in the eyes quick and rough on everything to practice eyeballing the placement, just a couple curved lines for the upper eyelid will be enough, on smaller heads just some dark marks for the eye sockets nose and upper lip, I noticed your already drawing the eye sockets and planes, I just think that you should start practicing the placement of the actual eye a little more.
    Just a few quick scribbles to practice the placement and scale will add up over time, I just got into the habit of doing it over the past few weeks and I think it helps a lot, just a thought.

    keep it up all the hard work is really starting to show.

    Tenminutedrawing - awesome learn to draw series http://www.youtube.com/user/moatddtutorials
    A short list of my favorite tutorials http://surfandsnow.deviantart.com/journal/22269212/


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  6. #514
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    Hey~ Local!! Good progress u got here!! keep them coming!

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  8. #515
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    Thanks Surf! Will try to bear that in mind, but this bad habit of drawing dark construction lines is hard to quit!

    @ Yongs: Great to see a fellow Singaporean here wor!

    ------------------------------------------

    While I'm not a fan of Renoir's paintings, he once said, "You come to nature with your theories, and she knocks them all flat.”

    For my case, it's "Guy goes to life drawing session to draw from Nature but She makes an eunuch out of him". Hmmpp!

    Below stuff from the life drawing classes from the past 3 weeks. 5, 10, 15 and 30 min poses:



    Below series of box figures were done about 3 weeks ago; the teacher told us explicitly he wanted to see boxes:






    Life drawings last week. Screwed up very badly for these 2 poses. Brain goes blank and hand trembles with intense fear. I think they were 15 and 30 min respectively:


    Below was the first attempt in a life drawing session to try to wrap torso muscles around the geometric forms. Legs and arms are untouched. The only thing, though, is that the result looks totally different from the actual model. The teacher always says, "You're analyzing the model, not copying". But still, I would like to have the best of both worlds! Maybe in future. Aye aye.


    The usual suspects:













    Have started setting the eyes into the head construction:













    Have started learning about the Serratus Anterior and some experimentation with nose construction. This muscle seems even more complex than the deltoid to draw. It's a good thing that in real life, the external obliques, pectoralis major and Lats. Dorsi partly cover this muscle, which means I only need to draw the visible portion! YAY!



    After producing 2 hideous pieces of crappy self-portraits 3 weeks ago, I made another attempt. This time, it's only 3% construction and the rest relies mainly on observation.
    Proportions are much better than last 2, but I still want to draw like Sargent and Loomis! Oh yeah, I made the hair look more voluminous:


    First foray into learning how to draw stylized, pretty girls. I realized I know nothing about drawing pretty girls at all! The 2 larger ones took about 30 - 45 mins. More practice on these from now on.




    They say love can be nurtured. Can it?
    Such was the case with my color pencils. The Medium Flesh and Deep Red are love at first sight, but I'm finding myself gradually swooning over the stable color produced by Van Dyck Brown. The latter is not as vibrant as the other two, but the brown just look so.....calm and soothing. The brown complements Copper and Black very well compared to the Medium Flesh + Deep Red + Black combo.


    Bought some pencil extenders to prolong life of the color pencils. Problem is, when the pencil gets too short, I need to use a spanner to wank it out as the fingers are not able to grip the tip. LOL



    Resolution for the next 3 weeks:
    i) Do the usual suspects.
    ii) Learn about the Inguinal Ligament, Erector Spinae and Lats. Dorsi (yay finally! My favorite muscle!) and try to wrap them around the construction.
    iii) Do at least 1 more self-portrait, and visit the Three Gardens to draw. I must go out these 3 weeks to draw!
    iv) Do a couple of still life.
    v) Continue with learning about cartoons.
    vi) Do better at the next life drawing session this Friday and screw up LESS!

    Next update: 18 September 2011 (2011 is ending soon? How can it be??!!!)

    Good day,
    Xeon

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  10. #516
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    Another great update. Your cartoons and imagination work are looking better. Congratulations!

    Your SP looks better, but it is still kind of formless, which makes it not read.

    There's this video of course
    ...

    but more than that horizontals and verticals would help you more. There is a diagram of a face somewhere that shows where all of the features line up (maybe Jack Hamm?)

    There are vertical lines running through it... the corner of the mouth to the tear ducts, horizontal lines lining up the eyes, the bottom of the nose and the ears... etc.

    If you measure the face using these intervals... and get the bigger shapes in first... then go back at the end for details, you'll get better results.

    I know that when I remember to use horizontals and verticals (using those lines to locate one feature, and then find another feature on the other side) I get much better and more accurate and proportional results.

    ---

    Also when doing gesture, once you've laid down a single line, keep that line in your peripheral vision when doing the next line... something I just picked up that's really helping me draw from observation much quicker and more accurately.


    Kudos and good luck for more!

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    Yo tks for the advice, Sage!

    Btw, when you say the SP looks "formless", do you mean it's flat? If yes, I wonder if it's because there's almost no tone?

    Pls enlighten me, Sire!

    Good day!
    Xeon

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    Quote Originally Posted by Xeon_OND View Post
    Yo tks for the advice, Sage!

    Btw, when you say the SP looks "formless", do you mean it's flat? If yes, I wonder if it's because there's almost no tone?
    No it's because the shapes aren't reading.

    This is the first image that comes up in Google when I look for "architectural face drawing" (the first image that shows kind of what I was talking about)

    Name:  face1.jpg
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    You have to try to see volumes in your own face. If it's too difficult to see planes, look for the shapes that make up planes (is the cheek a square? Is it a triangle?)

    This will help you place tone, actually. And that will help you achieve the depth. Placing tone inside a formless shape is a much, much harder way to make the shape look 3D.

    Always look for 3D shapes. Always look for volumes. I know Vilppu says gesture is #1; but he's used to teaching animators who already have drawing chops. When doing portraits (facial close ups) how much good is gesture anyway?

    Anywho... just some more food for thoughts.

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    I hope you don't think I'm picking on you, because I see your effort and sometimes frustration and want to help. I also need the work and it helps me to understand how to fix my own drawings

    Here's kind of the breakdown

    Your image mirrored
    Name:  xeon_mirror.jpg
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    You can see the lean of the body easier in this as well as the proportions that are off near the cheekbones/eyes.

    You actually did really well on the features and feature placement, because they don't look strange mirrored (and they're just pretty solid).

    The main problem was that you're using the 5-eyes-wide rule to measure between cheekbones. The head is five eyes wide from the front as measured from the widest part of the skull... about halfway between your eyes and the top of your head. At the cheekbones, the face is much skinnier.

    Your jaw was also slightly off.

    Name:  xeon_fix.jpg
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    For the most part this shows you put the features in well. Your hair might be pretty large and your neck might be long, but the head shouldn't go too far away from the 3-noses-and-an-eye-on-end height for the head. Also your trapezius should be less angled.

    Here it is without guidelines, and mirrored

    Name:  xeon.jpg
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    Name:  xeon_02.jpg
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    Last edited by p sage; August 30th, 2011 at 07:35 PM.
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  17. #520
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    Quote Originally Posted by p sage View Post
    I hope you don't think I'm picking on you, because I see your effort and sometimes frustration and want to help. I also need the work and it helps me to understand how to fix my own drawings
    Of course not, P Sage! Don't be silly!
    Such kinds of feedback like yours are truly priceless and enlightening, because we can draw the same thing for 10 years and making the same mistakes without even realizing it until someone points them out!

    I'll note the cheekbones thing and will try to observe that part more carefully next time. IMO, the hardest part of the self-portrait is always the curvature of the face shape. It's full of curves: curving down this way, jutting out a little, suddenly angled down to the chin etc. The books say that in a frontal view of a head, the jaw line (where the jaw hinge attaches to the skull mass) is at the same line as the separation of the lips, but I can't see that in my own face for some reason, probably because muscles, skin and fat blocks the view.

    PS: I'm very skinny and the trapezius is almost non-existant, thus the neck appears to be longer.

    Good day and thanks a lot!
    Xeon

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    @Xeon, Hey, Hope ya remember me,
    Anyways, an extremely easy way to be extremely good at proportions is to do the follow:
    When drawing any head, draw either an oval-like head-shape or a box-like one, or Loomis' Ball and Plane Method; I prefer the box, it shows you clear perspective and the ball and plane method can fit within; Anyways, draw a line from the nose's edge, the line should align at the down edge of the ear, block-in the ear, from it's top will be the eyes, at that point you've blocked in all of the basics, use Loomis' Ball-And-Plane Method afterwards, inside the box, What about the rest of the proportions? Here's the catch: Head over to "The Drawing Script" link I've posted before and tick only heads, and draw 3-minute gestures, in a short-while, you would absorb proportions easily, park and cafe sketching is as effective if not more.

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  19. #522
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    hey Xeon, my turn to ask you a question...where'd you buy the pencil extenders? I used to have a bunch but lost them all when I moved.

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  21. #523
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    Quote Originally Posted by krysjez View Post
    hey Xeon, my turn to ask you a question...where'd you buy the pencil extenders? I used to have a bunch but lost them all when I moved.
    LOL, you probably guessed it. ArtFriend!
    They now have a branch at Buona Vista MRT. These extenders are located near the area where charcoal sticks and pastel pencils are sold. At least at the Bras Basah and B-Vista branches.

    Good day!
    Xeon

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    I love your sketch poses. Vilppu books right?

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    so come and do drawerings with me.
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    Quote Originally Posted by red123456 View Post
    I love your sketch poses. Vilppu books right?
    LOL, yeah, but also Hampton.

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    I'm scanning a lot less drawings this time as re-sizing them takes too much time and since most of them are repetitive studies.

    Dozens of drawings done in class over the past 3 weeks.












    And below, the usual studies done at home. During the past 3 weeks, I've made an attempt to add the Serratus Ant, Lats-Dorsi, Infraspinatus and Teres Major to the construction.







    I miss my pen, and so.....













    The upper ends of the Lats-Dorsi, the part that twists and then connects to the humerus, is giving me a headache especially when seen from the front, as it's very difficult to visualize the twist and how it fits into the humerus:



    Below are some school work, part of my final year project. Original painting was about 9000+ pixels wide.


    The idea was to convey a Nyonya sewing her stuff on a quiet day.
    The intention was to convey a sense of calm and tranquility but I didn't succeed in that. The "mood" is wrong, I guess. Another challenge was that since this was a setting based on reality, I didn't dare to push stuff too far or it will end up looking totally unrelated to the Peranakan theme.

    One of the lecturers has since told me to study the works of Goro Fujita. I never knew what art was truly about until I saw this guy's shit. His paintings beamed with insane mood and emotions, and I could actually feel it in my bones. What is this power.....???

    If Vilppu has shown me what figure drawing was about, then Fujita has shown me what art is about.

    I've always thought that art was 100% about technical accuracy and nothing else, but that has all changed. Art, it seems, is really more about aesthetics than perfect draftsmanship. Not to say the latter isn't crucial, but surely the layman on the street will be more interested to look at art that looks visually exciting but technically imperfect, than to look at art that is visually boring but technically perfect. I can't believe I realize this only now.....what a big fool I am.....aye.....

    A lesson learned.....a bit too late.....but better than never.

    Some work-in-progress of my next piece, which is about 2 captains of different basketball teams facing off in a match. Small guy vs. punk:



    I've since realized that they're too crappy. Heck, the two dumpy duck-like characters at the top look like they're falling over! I re-did the designs again:




    Working out the layout for the scene and changing some stuff in the digital version:



    Final designs of the 2 characters. I noticed that the ends of the shoes of the first character actually resembles the glans penis! LOL


    His right arm was supposed to be resting on a stand, but I didn't draw that in. I deliberately made his lower legs super-long. LOL


    Partial color studies and logos. I'm not trained in logo design! LOL
    The team names are inspired by the names of the muscles, though I changed "Sartorius" to "Sartoras". Too lazy to think of new names:



    Hopefully, I can complete the painting at around the time of next update. Time is running too short.

    The days ahead: Based on the resolutions made in my previous post, I was supposed to do a self-portrait + outdoor drawings, but due to lack of time + bad health, I didn't. OK, next time!

    Resolutions for the next 3.5 weeks:
    i) Gesture, construction studies as usual
    ii) Get better at drawing the Lats-Dorsi
    iii) Learn how to wrap the Gluteus Medius and Maximus over the volumes
    iv) 1 self-portrait
    v) Draw at the 3 Gardens!

    Next update: 14 October 2011

    Good day!
    Xeon

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    There's a nice stack of work! I particularly like the forms added to the rougher gestures. Maybe this is personal preference but I don't care for the design of Vilppu bodies much... the proportions seem a little wacky to me, as if the figures were made of taffy and are stretched too much through the midsections. That's not on you; you're actually reproducing what he and his best students do, so kudos to you. You could call it a personal problem of mine

    Have you seen Michael Hampton's figure drawing book? He's obviously a Vilppu disciple, and he does offer some different insights into the process. Pretty good book actually. Just got it (a 4th printing). I will probably incorporate some of the lessons in it, if I can stay away from the "taffy pull"

    Keep going... improvement is showing

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    Quote Originally Posted by p sage View Post
    the proportions seem a little wacky to me, as if the figures were made of taffy and are stretched too much through the midsections.
    LOL, I think it's cos' he wants to make the body look more elegant and flowly. )

    Have you seen Michael Hampton's figure drawing book? He's obviously a Vilppu disciple, and he does offer some different insights into the process. Pretty good book actually. Just got it (a 4th printing). I will probably incorporate some of the lessons in it, if I can stay away from the "taffy pull"
    Well well well! In case you didn't realized it already (actually I've mentioned this a couple of times in CA and through my posts), I've actually been following Hampton's book all along! Maybe at some time or another, you may have thought that the "style" looks familiar. LOL

    Vilppu's vids are just way too tough for me to understand. The gesture vid was ok, but from the 2nd vid onwards, everything = near-rocket science.
    One thing Hampton does better than Vilppu is that the former presents to you a series of working methods that you can use in your daily drawings, while with Vilppu, you need to listen to his lecture and then try to figure out how to construct this muscle and that etc. IMHO, Hampton takes Vilppu's teachings and made them a lot more accessible.

    Personally, I don't really feel there's any considerable difference in the way both guys layout their teaching, just that in the vids, Vilppu very seldom draws the way Hampton does, ie: constructing the box and cylinders etc very explicitly and then wrapping each muscle on top etc., although in some of the vids, Vilppu.does draw that way, just a lot looser and more "organic", which is bad, because it's much harder to understand.

    Btw, by 4th edition, do you mean the one where the cover shows a guy sitting in profile and it's shaded in red tone? I only have the 3rd edition and am waiting to get the 4th. Hampton says that the 4th edition has more info on constructing the arms and legs. Does it? The 3rd edition I've has only brief info on the arms and legs and doesn't show exactly where and how to construct the muscles etc (unlike the earlier chapters in the book, where he shows clearly where and how to wrap the latissimus dorsi, erector spinae and trapezius etc.).

    Tks!
    Xeon

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    Awesome Sketchbook , alot of hard work around here , i see that you work alot on construction of head , i think you must only draw an egg with center line of eyes , with studyin proportions and planes from Loomis's book & if you do it 2 hunderds time absoletly you'll get it right and i like you gesture drawings , keep the hard work dude

    Change is such hard work

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    Good effort!

    Definitely remember what p_sage told you about the form.
    And i would also try to do more rendering exercises.
    You tend to draw the shadows very light.
    Sometimes they are very hard and dark

    Keep it up dude!

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    You have a very good plastic figures. Good job!

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    Yep, it's that version. I noticed that for a while Amazon had the book listed as out of print, and it was going for $200

    It seems like an okay book; but IMO Loomis' "Successful Drawing" is superior to it. Just an opinion, though.

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  38. #533
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    Quote Originally Posted by p sage View Post
    Yep, it's that version. I noticed that for a while Amazon had the book listed as out of print, and it was going for $200
    Thanks Sage! Btw, you got yours from Amazon? Been searching high and low everywhere including Amazon but it's not even listed!

    Thanks!
    Xeon

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    p sage is offline in pursuit of hot lines Level 14 Gladiator: Dimacheri
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    Quote Originally Posted by Xeon_OND View Post
    Thanks Sage! Btw, you got yours from Amazon? Been searching high and low everywhere including Amazon but it's not even listed!

    Thanks!
    Xeon
    Nope... got it from BudsArtBooks.com

    They may still have it in stock.

    Thinking connects desire with creation.
    How good are you?

    The Road to Perdition
    clog
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    Xeon_OND - It's always fun to look at your sketchbook because you bring focus to everything you study and I can see you working out problems on paper. As always, you are inspiring.

    My Sketchbook

    "A journey of a thousand miles begins with a single step." -- Confucius
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    I like that rough of your character running out on the field in front of the crowd.

    That is starting to look like something!

    I got Frank Thomas and Ollie Johnson's* The Illusion Of Life: Disney Animation.

    YOU GOTTA get this book!

    (Bought a remastered Bambi DVD-- going to be doing some "reverse engineering" and freeze framing. Oh, and if you keep getting better at this rate, I'm going to start stealing from you too!)

    *two of the "Nine Old Men"

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    Quote Originally Posted by purplegoat View Post
    Xeon_OND - It's always fun to look at your sketchbook because you bring focus to everything you study and I can see you working out problems on paper. As always, you are inspiring.
    LOL, it's a headache, I must admit, but fun when you think you got it looking the way you want it, though in the eyes of people who're better, it always tend to look wrong! If you've a teacher, you'll probably know what I mean.
    One of my greatest secret fantasy is to make art such that even when the experts look at it, they'll go "Holy shit! Your art is perfect!" or "I can't believe I'm seeing Michelangelo in you!" LOL, well....just a fantasy.

    @ P_Sage: Have sent BudsArtBooks an e-mail, since they only list the 2nd edition on the site.

    From Kamber:
    I got Frank Thomas and Ollie Johnson's* The Illusion Of Life: Disney Animation. YOU GOTTA get this book!
    I'll check out the book in the library first, and if it looks promising, I'll get it! But wait till I get the Hampton book first. It's even more elusive than the Abominable Snowman. They should have printed 50 million copies and Hampton would be on his way to surpass Warren Buffet on the Forbes richest list.

    (Bought a remastered Bambi DVD-- going to be doing some "reverse engineering" and freeze framing. Oh, and if you keep getting better at this rate, I'm going to start stealing from you too!) *two of the "Nine Old Men"
    Great to see you learning something about animation! LOL, I guess one day if you really start to "steal" from me, then I would be the happiest guy alive, because it would meant I've improved! I wish.

    Good day!
    Xeon

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    Quote Originally Posted by Xeon_OND View Post
    Vilppu's vids are just way too tough for me to understand. The gesture vid was ok, but from the 2nd vid onwards, everything = near-rocket science.
    Tks!
    Xeon
    Why exactly tough? I think that my miracle month was the month in which I went through all of Vilppu's main lectures on drawing [Broke since then, can't buy the anatomy ones, and I don't really want to pirate em!]
    I mean, it is not rocket-science at all, Heck, Algebra is a lil bit harder!

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    Quote Originally Posted by Necron33 View Post
    Why exactly tough? I think that my miracle month was the month in which I went through all of Vilppu's main lectures on drawing [Broke since then, can't buy the anatomy ones, and I don't really want to pirate em!]
    I mean, it is not rocket-science at all, Heck, Algebra is a lil bit harder!
    LOL, the thing is that he starts out slow and easy but as the lecture progresses, he whacks out anatomy after anatomy and when I see him draw, it's just overwhelming for me. The lectures are not too confusing to follow; the hard part is actually trying to digest all he says and applying them successfully in your drawing. I always find that his lessons are a lot clearer after I read the relevant stuff from anatomy books etc. before hand.

    I prefer Michael Hampton's more gentle treatment. And that Gottfried Bammes new book will help you improve faster than Vilppu's vids will, at this stage.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Xeon_OND View Post
    LOL, the thing is that he starts out slow and easy but as the lecture progresses, he whacks out anatomy after anatomy and when I see him draw, it's just overwhelming for me. The lectures are not too confusing to follow; the hard part is actually trying to digest all he says and applying them successfully in your drawing. I always find that his lessons are a lot clearer after I read the relevant stuff from anatomy books etc. before hand.

    I prefer Michael Hampton's more gentle treatment. And that Gottfried Bammes new book will help you improve faster than Vilppu's vids will, at this stage.
    Well, It's actually easy: Just draw alongside him, and listen.
    If you can't digest exactly everything, there is always a second time, and a third too.

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