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  1. #61
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    First of all they look great Sekino, I think it would be nice to combine details from the human warrior(bracers, sword,...) with a gazelle/satyr, it would be perfetct.
    I also agree with you for the combination of our characters, A, B, C, D. We should stick to the animal like characters.

    New PC have arived, so it's time to do some drawing.

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  4. #62
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    Good idea about the gear for the Gazelle, 3m! Glad to hear you finally got your new machine I'll wait to hear what's Pretty_Angel's take on the Gazelle char before working on it more, since it was her idea.

    Okay, just another quick clarification: Despite the fact that we're steering away from human characters, we can't go too deep into the 'creature' end either (Daestwen mentioned something about that today). Having them animal-based is fine but we need to keep clear humanoid features. For example:

    The lizard-healer character: I'll rework the design to make it a bit more shaped like a dwarf. Right now, it might be a bit too animalistic.

    I'd recommend pushing the monkey-wizard to more human proportions (clearly walking upright, shorter arms...)

    The rhino ought to be some orc-like character, so perhaps a bit more human features on the face... More like some rhino/human mutant.

    Being half/human, the centaur is pretty safe, I think...

    I'll try to post quick doodles of what I mean because I realize it's not exactly clear.

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  6. #63
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    Awesome sketches, everyone! The gazelle and rhino ideas are both spot on and suit their classes perfectly

    Lineup
    Lineup is definitely closing in, think we're nailing all those characters down! My only concern is that the reptile character isn't distinctly African enough. It's possibly too blatant or an obvious choice, but what do you think of having some more "classical African" animals like zebra, lion or hyena instead? I'm just brainstorming here Although I agree that a reptile creature fits the role of a healer/magician, I'm just wondering whether said animal fits the group, it feels a bit like an outsider compared to the other three.

    Races
    About choosing the characters (out of those 5 Sekino listed), I have to agree that having the first 4 is a good group. I had initially always wanted to have at least one human and well, I still wouldn't mind it, but I suddenly feel the group loses some of its dynamics by including one non-animal based. If I remember correctly, Sabrina was quite keen on having one all-human, so we'll have to make sure everyone agrees But I'm fine with either!

    Gender
    I agree that the stealth/gazelle should definitely be female. As for the others, I'm somehow having some difficulties picturing the ape-wizard as female, but probably because I keep getting Rafiki from Lion King in my head when I try! And didn't we agree on having it 50/50 in gender? In any case, definitely female on the gazelle! I'm gonna do some sketches and experiment with the genders on the others (although I believe the rhino is definitely male!), see which one I think fits. In fact, I'm gonna try to do much more sketching in general. Sorry guys, oddly enough, it seems I prefer to plan all the pre-work verbally instead of visually. But it's definitely high time I bring out some visual stuff too!

    Method
    I agree with Sekino from the PM that we should try to assign different tasks to all members. It seems very efficient and gives the final pieces a more consistant look. I think we should first nail down just what those jobs are (sketching, inking etc) and then everyone can shout-out what they personally feel most confident in and prefer doing. I wonder if those separate works should be strictly 4? Or, because of the difference between those jobs (i.e., colouring is more time-consuming than sketching), maybe one could do 2 jobs while another does 1? What do you guys think?

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  8. #64
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    I see your point about the reptile. Now, there are lizards in Africa and I was thinking it could offer a break from the mammals... However, it might be very well breaking the 'rhythm' of the lineup rather than adding variety. I'm absolutely not attached to the idea. But we'll need to think of another option fairly soon, if we go that way. Perhaps we can go with the human after all?

    I'm somehow having some difficulties picturing the ape-wizard as female
    LOL Yeah, it took me a while to think which other character could be most likely female... Then I just pictured the male character's potential wife So I could see some wrinkled-faced monkey mixed with a bit of an old, wisewoman look. It might be different to not have all females depicted as classically 'attractive'. Then again, I don't think the brief specifies a gender quota anyways, so we could only have one female...

    Method

    Yeah, we ough to describe this more in detail because that will be next week's step... Okay, here's a suggestion of how it could work and get everyone involved:

    Final character designs- 4 people (2 on 'good', 2 on 'evil'): Making the final, single portrait for all characters. These sketches should have all features, details, posture, etc. as they are the base for the final result. I though perhaps 2 of us could work on the 'good' lineup and 2 on the 'evil' team.

    Inking- 1 or 2 people: What I call 'inking' here is the process of going over the linework of the final designs and making sure it is evenly clean, crisp and of similar detail. It doesn't dramatically alter the original design, just evens out everybody's lines so the look is more uniform (eliminating blurriness, correcting varying line thickness, etc...).

    Background design- 1 or 2 people: I put this step before colouring because the colours will depend on the background and lighting. I was thinking someone could create some background features, landscape and such for all the characters to be featured against (instead of an empty white). I figure it would be savanna features like dry grass patches, sand, rocks and baobab trees... Basically, creating a unique environment for all our characters to fit in, again, so everything is uniform. The background ought to be simple and subtle since the focus needs to be on the characters. But it would add a nice atmosphere.

    Colouring- 1 or 2 people: This is about laying the colours, lighting and shadowing on top of the linework. I know 2 people is very little for such a big job, but the colours have to be consistent. The blending and choice of tones ought to remain uniform throughout; and since most people tend to have widely differing colouring techniques and styles, we can't really take a chance on having a final result that clashes. This would be the final step.

    I hope this setup allows for everyone to get involved and still get a consistent final result. Any differing/further ideas are most welcome.

    Last edited by Sekino; August 11th, 2009 at 07:22 PM.
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  10. #65
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    I realize there are indeed reptiles in Africa, I was only concerned about the overall feel to the group You do have a point, though, I somehow didn't realize that all others were all mammals! Maybe it'd be alright to keep it as it is. Like you said, it'd be interesting to have it with some dwarfish features (instead of strictly human), so I think that could prove as an interesting mix! If the others won't object, I think we should probably just stick to it after all, we really need to nail down those characters.

    Yeah, we definitely don't need to be super strict about keeping it 50/50 gender-wise if we feel some characters work better as males. But when you described your idea of this old and wise monkey-lady, it suddenly came to me! I think possibly something like a big voodoo/shaman lady could work. I'm too all for making them quite unusual and not fitting the traditional beauty-code.

    Method
    You listed the jobs nicely above! I too was thinking of these same 4 categories, I was just a bit unsure of how many would take care of each. The way you put it seems very fair and rational Okay, so all of us would do something in the first character designs, I like that. I don't mind which one I do, light or dark. As for the other jobs, I think I'm personally most confident in inking. I believe there are others in this team who are far more capable in colouring than I am, so I think I'll just stay away from that!

    I know I'm thinking far ahead, but one thing we nonetheless need to address early in the design process is presentation. I'm talking about the way we present the final portraits. Are we gonna have them strictly 'regular', or could we maybe design a border around each and with an extra column with extra info about the character and their world, possibly some extra poses, sketches and such?

    Remember how the team (yeeet again) GrogroZoo presented their characters? They had them as characters from collectible cards. I thought it was neat! I'm definitely not suggesting copying that, but I like the idea of having some sort of frame that unites the presentation of the characters.

    So should we add another category to the job lists? Ooh, or maybe, instead, it could just "ride along" with the other existing groups? That is, the persons taking care of sketches would also sketch it and then the inking person ink it etc. I'm just throwing stuff out! Did anyone have something in mind already for the presentation perhaps?

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  12. #66
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    Aww man, you were really busy here last night! Sweet!

    Sekino Love the satyr concept! Also had that in mind on a certain point but decided to try the centaur first. I also like 3m's idea. We should go for it!


    Races/Linup
    I have a problem with that human ape idea. I fear that it can end up like a terrible caricature quite easily (or it'll be something like Planet of the Apes - I'm not sure if we really want that). So I'd suggest simply take a human character. I'm usually not that pc but I think it would make things a lot easier - especially since we're suppose to make rather human characters anyway.

    I think I agree on everything else. The tasks sound well organized that way. As I said I'd rather stick to drawing /painting parts and skip the inking. I'd be fine with slapping some paint on the background and characters as well. So just tell me what you need.

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  14. #67
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    Great idea on sharing our tasks Sekino, I agree on everything.
    About races: I think all animal like lineup would be best, and human character among all animal based characters will result in loosing our dynamics. That's only my opinion.
    I'll try to do some background designs today, both for good, and bad characters.

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  15. #68
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    Alright guys! Somehow we started communicating via PMs lately, but I thought it'd be convenient to recap what has been going on there.

    3 or 4 characters?
    I like how Sabrina put it in the latest PM. Quoted for convenience:
    If anyone doesn't really like the sketching/drawing part, then we could just skip that and make 3 characters. Otherwise I'd say everyone picks a character and starts drawing. When the sketches are done we can still decide to scrap an idea that probably does not work as well as we thought. If everything is fine and we have enough time we could also decide on doing 4. Fair deal?

    I think that'd work. What about the others?

    Who takes who
    Eh, stupid title But yeah, we had started to claim the characters in the PMs, so here's what we got so far:
    - Sekino - Reptile/healer
    - 3mMajster - Rhino/warrior
    - AsaB - Human/wizard?
    - Pretty_Angel - Gazelle/thief?

    Sabrina, since you hadn't 'made your claim' yet, I just put the gazelle on the list above, figured you might maybe prefer her, since she was your idea. But if you'd rather do the human, I don't mind at all! I think they're both interesting characters

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  17. #69
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    Who takes who
    Eh, stupid title But yeah, we had started to claim the characters in the PMs, so here's what we got so far:
    - Sekino - Reptile/healer
    - 3mMajster - Rhino/warrior
    - AsaB - Human/wizard?
    - Pretty_Angel - Gazelle/thief?
    I could do both. What would be easier for you? ^^ Oh and, Idk, but wouldn't it make more sense to change the class of the Gazelle? Perhaps it's just the wrong association I have with "thief", haha. Now that I think of it I'd love to make her a wizard/shaman since Satyrs are some kind of wood spirit. I'd imagine them doing some magic with plants and perhaps summoning spirits or something. What do you think?

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  18. #70
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    The list sounds good. I'll get started on re-designing the reptile dude (I'll 'Africanize' it further, too ).

    Pretty_Angel- I believe it might be better to cover as many different classes as possible with the 4 characters. We already have healer/wizard class characters, but I don't mind changing my character to a thief if you feel you have good ideas for a healer.

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  19. #71
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    Ehm... for the list we have 2 caster classes - a healer and a wizard/sorcerer. I actually like your healer lizard so my suggestion would be that we should rather change the human character (if that wasn't clear). Humans are quite flexible anyway. But I first want to know what Asa thinks of that.
    If you think the Human should stay the wiz/sorc then I'd suggest make the Satyr rather a kind of hunter than a thief. Haha, it's not that I don't have enough ideas.

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  20. #72
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    Okey dokey, let's hear what Asa wants to do with the human (I was under the impression she would go for some shaman-like wizard woman, but I don't know anything anymore ).

    I can't really work on my final sketch until Sunday (leaving for the weekend) so if there needs to be a change on my side, just let me know. Otherwise, after Sunday, my reptile is officially a medicine-man

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  21. #73
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    I allready did some sketches of my rhino warrior, but I'll post them on sunday, have to go now to the beer fest, and tomorow is my birthday, the beer is waiting for me.

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  22. #74
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    I'm all for changing the class for the human! Sabrina, go right ahead if you'd rather make your gazelle a satyr-like sorceress Since I agree that Sekino's reptile character should be a healer, how about my human will instead take the gazelle's original class, namely thief or ranger of some sort? I'd definitely love to work with that

    Okay, so is that final, then? That'd be nice to know so I can start the sketching!
    Updating the list:

    - Sekino - Reptile/healer
    - 3mMajster - Rhino/warrior
    - AsaB - Human/thief
    - Pretty_Angel - Gazelle/sorceress

    Majster, no problem, man, you enjoy your birthday and that beer Looking forward to see your sketches!

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  24. #75
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    Since CA tells me you posted that yesterday, Happy Birthday, 3m!!

    Asa Deal!

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  26. #76
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    Sabrina - Coolies!
    Alright, I'll start tomorrow sketching for my human. I'm still kinda unsure whether to go in the thief/assassin area or the ranger/hunter one. Not even sure on the gender yet. Any preferences from you guys, regarding the group dynamics and such?

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  27. #77
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    Since there are two male and one female you could go for a female character if you want. I don't really see why we should make females a minority here.
    For the question of thief/assassin vs. ranger/hunter: That's a hard one. I like both ideas and I think both would fit into our team. In the end I'd say go with what you feel most comfortable with.

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  28. #78
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    Thanks for the input, Sab! Yeah, I too was thinking of making it a female, but just wanted to check.
    As for the class, I'm kinda divided, I really like both kinds! I'll just explore them both and see what works

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  29. #79
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    Hi guys Just a heads up: I was wondering if everyone would be ready to post their character portraits (good + evil), say, by tomorrow evening?

    I'm suggesting it because I realize next week is the last week to prepare the final presentation. It would be great to be able to finish the inking/cleanup this week and have all of next week to do the colours (I suspect that will be a lot of work).

    How does that sound?

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  30. #80
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    Sekino, I really like that two legged fawn character (elf + gazelle/satyr) She looks great and very unique. I'd love to see that character pushed a bit more and perhaps in a more dynamic pose.

    Also I like THIS sketch, many of your works right now don't necessarily look like video game characters I'd like to take roaming around a hostile world and kick butt with. For example the digital paintings of the black humanoid characters in #66 posted by Pretty Angel simply look like portrait studies and not necessarily fantasy characters.

    Anyways, keep pushing guys, cheers!

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  32. #81
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    Sekino, sounds like a good plan! I'll be sure to kick my ass a bit and finalize them

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  33. #82
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    n1va Thanks a lot! Yeah, those studies where just that - studies and no real character ideas.

    Sekino Sorry, I was kinda busy the last days. But you're right, we should hurry up!

    So here are my ideas for the Satyr character:

    Name:  Satyr-Good.jpg
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    Name:  Satyr-Evil.jpg
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    (sorry for the sketchiness - I hope it's ok?)

    I basically stayed close to Sekino's character design and added a bunch of accessories and tried some more dynamic poses as n1va suggested.

    When you think of a fantasy RPG you usually have different armour sets consisting of headgear, jacket, pauldrons, gloves, pants and shoes or something along these lines. Usually you also have accessory like earrings, necklaces or rings. For the different classes these things vary a lot. So for the Satyr the set could look like:
    Head - face paint
    Jacket - wrap top
    Upper arms - bracelet
    Gloves - some more bracelets XD
    Pants - loincloth
    Shoes - more fancy bracelets lol
    Weapon - staff
    Offhand - magical focus
    In addition: necklace + earrings

    As for now, I can still change some things. So let me know if you have any ideas.

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  35. #83
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    That looks great, Sab! I really like the costume elements. The 'sketchiness' doesn't hinder me for the inking, if you want me to get started on it. I will add a few details in the process (more definition on the clothing and accessories, etc...) but most of it will remain the same...

    Actually, I think I'll start on it now and post the result ASAP so you guys can see my idea of 'inking' and makes sure you like how it turns out. Besides, I can't scan my own character yet because we're getting the printer fixed (it's an all-in-one machine- booo). But no worries, I'm getting it back this afternoon

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  37. #84
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    Thank you very much! Feel free to add or correct anything you want when inking. One thing that's somewhat bugging me is that their faces look too different for my taste. So I'd be glad if you could correct that when inking.

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    Nice work there Pretty.
    I'll post my character (good and bad) latter tonight, have to study little.

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    Okay, my printer is toast but my scanner is back I tried inking with the Wacom but it looked like a feathery mess, so I traced over my screen with thin paper instead so I could use ink... hehehe

    I hope I didn't change it too much; I traced most of the elements-

    Name:  Satyr-Good-Trace.jpg
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    Name:  Good-Satyr_Inked.jpg
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    So here are the exact changes I made:

    -Altered a few minor proportions here and there
    -I made her face a bit rounder and the features bigger to better see her expression
    -Added details to the clothing and jewellery...

    I figure details like the facepaint, fabric patterns and the motifs on the staff (that staff is awesome BTW!!) would look better painted in with the colouring since they're not solid edges. I inked patterns on the bracelets so they'd look engraved or carved as opposed to painted.

    I also kept a larger PSD for the colouring, if needed.

    Um, yeah. So that's the inking for ya Any feedback/changes? I'll check back before continuing (I have some work to do anyways). I'll post my reptiles soon...

    Last edited by Sekino; August 19th, 2009 at 04:18 PM.
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  41. #87
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    That's looking great Sekino!
    No changes are needed, this is perfect.
    Here is my rhino warior, I think this should be a good version, the bad version should be done tonight also.
    What do you think guys about it? If you think I need to change something please tell me.

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  43. #88
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    Sekino Sweet! There are a few little things that are bugging me though:
    • the hourglass silhouette is a bit extreme imho
    • the connection of the leg to the hips could also need a little smoothing
    • the shoulder looks a bit wonky
    • is it just me or are her upper arms of different lengths?
    • the bracelet on the arm looks a tiny bit wrong

    Heck, I made a quick paintover:
    Name:  Good-Satyr_Inked.jpg
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    3m Wow, the Rhino looks cool! My only critique would be that the arm he lifts up looks much longer than the other one.

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    And here is the bad guy. I'm not to happy how it turned out, I'll fix it tommorow, to tired now, must go to sleep.

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    I corrected the details you pointed out, Sab (You can see it in the original post: I replaced the old image instead of posting it here) About the arms, if I measure from the top of the shoulders to the inner elbow, they seem the same to me (give or take a couple of mm because of position, maybe?)

    Nice rhino, 3M! I really like where you're going with the evil version, too (the shakles are a cool touch).

    Also, I was playing around with ideas for the final presentation. I think each character is supposed to have its own image (i.e. they're not all on the same image in a lineup like last CHOW).

    Here's an idea, sticking with the comic-book/cartoony feel (I used my old reptile sketch because it was already coloured- and I quickly pasted some savanna pic which would preferably be drawn instead, so it's just an example):

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    At the bottom could be the name of the race and the info on the character, I guess...

    Thoughts?

    Last edited by Sekino; August 19th, 2009 at 04:57 PM.
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