Concept Sketch, advice and critique very welcome :)

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  1. #1
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    Concept Sketch, advice and critique very welcome :)

    Here's a concept for my current project in 3D. I plan to model the two horseback figures fighting in XSI and Zbrush. It is taken from an important moment in Scottish history.

    I would love advice on how to better present my concept, make the scene more dramatic and action packed.

    I would also love to hear peoples thoughts on the pose/arrangement of the characters. It will be a 3d model viewable from all angles so I'm concerned that the two characters separated like this will leave the sculpture lacking a focal point. I originally had them alongside each other just before the killing blow, but I love the defeated warrior slipping lifelessly from his saddle in this configuration.

    Anyway, any thoughts at all could help improve my project so let me know any thoughs.

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  3. #2
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    I think to focal point will be the sword once it is incorporated into both the drawing and the sculpture. Because it is missing from this sketch I believe that is what is giving you the impression that it is lacking something. Actually, I think it is quite good. I like the idea of it being in 3D but it will be a timely endeavour. I would also like to see this deeply textured and colorfully presented. I look forward to your finish product.

    "Creativity emerges only when the imagination is given the freedom it deserves."
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  5. #3
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    Thanks for the quick response!

    Yeah there's gonna be alot of work in it but it's my final project for my 3D masters course so I can concentrate on it.

    As for the sword...I don't think it's too clear in the sketch but the fallen knight has an axe head embedded in his helmet and the character on the left is holding the broken axe handle. There will be other weaponry such as swords but they will be sheathed and worn on the belt.

    Thanks again!!

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  6. #4
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    thats quite an ambitious project..but very cool I really like the subject.

    you can create quite a drama by portraying the moment right before, or right after the two strike each other..
    personally i'd have the knights facing each other and about to strike, because then the viewer has to imagine what happens next and the drama stays..the work keeps its mystery.
    usually I go ahead and explain what happens after that moment just to have fun with blood and guts..but depends if you want a horror picture or something else

    try doing a few sketches with different poses or views, you seem to want something very dynamic see what works best in regards of that..movies can be a good reference
    if you're more confident in 3d you could model a basic horse and rider and use that to pose scene.. then you can just paint over a screenshot and finalize the concept before starting the proper modelling..
    hope this helps!

    Last edited by Shard; May 9th, 2009 at 05:27 PM.
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  8. #5
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    I love how rough this looks, but obviously it's not what you're going for.

    If this is going to made into a 3d model on the computer, maybe try to make a rough model out of clay. It will better help you see how this will look from all angles compared to a 2D drawing which only shows you one.

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  10. #6
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    It's a nice drawing but I'm not getting much of a sense of what's going on. If it were me, I'd build simple 3D models of the horses and riders and work out the massing and composition that way. Just my two cents.

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  12. #7
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    I like where you are going with the figure on the left but the motion and directional line of the right hand figure seems to be pulling away a bit from the interaction. The right hand figure also seems really out of proportion with the horse and it is hard to tell what kind of pose he is doing. What if you had the right hand horse and rider twisting around the left hand horse man like if he was trying to whip around to avoid his sword. This way the image would be less flat and more dynamic. I think if you pictured the fight as if they were dancing and fighting at the same time. Your color pallet feels good to me and the way that you are roughing it feels like water color. Are you going to keep that water color texture or are you going to go for a more rendered finish? Lastly I think that a landscape orientation might not be the way to go and that a portrait orientation would be better and you would have less negative space detracting from your composition.

    Hope that helps.


    Imagination is not a total internal power but rather it is a reflection and multi-faceted projection of our experiences and knowledge. We take in information from the world around us and intuitively re-order it into something new. Something is not created from nothing but simply transformed from what was before.
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  14. #8
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    Thanks for the advice.

    Wow.

    Thanks to all that have posted for taking the time to help me.

    Shardana: Thanks for all the suggestions, really helpful I appreciate it greatly. I initially was going to decide on the moment just before the strike as you suggested but this historic moment has been painted and modelled in miniature before and it invariably is that moment just before the strike. Admittedly this is for a reason as it is a tense powerful moment to capture but I thought I would go for the slightly subtler after the blow look to tell the story of what has just happened with the contrasting forms of the victorious and the fallen. I think i can sell it a bit better with a more detailed drawing of 3d mock up where forms and postures of both figures are much clearer. I'll keep reverting back to the moment before impact as a possible strong alternative though. Thanks again.

    AmandaMyers: Thanks it would definitely help me to realise this in 3D at this stage.

    Giacomo: Similarly, sounds like a good idea, thanks.

    Ito Saith Web: Great comments about composition and re-thinking the setup. I'll take it on board - it's something I'm definitely guilty of, sticking with early semi-successful ideas without fully considering all alternatives and developing my ideas fully. Thankyou.

    I have taken detailed in-pose photographs (which was fun, not with real horses though, just a sofa) and plan to recreate this drawing with much clearer defined poses and character designs. I'll post it up here when I'm done if anyone is interested, likewise with the 3D model once finished. (prob around end of August.)

    Thaks so much to all that had a look or commented.

    Twocats

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    Glad you are getting some good feedback, btw down in the lower corner is a thank button that gives creds to people who were helpful to you. Oh and welcome to CA, I think we should see some good stuff from you soon.


    Imagination is not a total internal power but rather it is a reflection and multi-faceted projection of our experiences and knowledge. We take in information from the world around us and intuitively re-order it into something new. Something is not created from nothing but simply transformed from what was before.
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  17. #10
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    I'm diggin the looseness, but the proportions are off. the arms are too short and the pony on the left seems off.

    I really like the energy though.

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    Thanks for the comments and advice Raoul Duke.

    I feel pretty noobish, but can't find the thanks button. Hmmm. I'll figure it out and send my thanks to you all soon!

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    Update

    Just to update, I have done a less sketchy attempt at defining what I intend to sculpt in 3D. This is pretty much the concept from which I will work, perhaps exaggerating the poses and the contrast between both characters once I get into 3D space.

    As always, any tips would be great, I have literally no experience doing concept work!

    Thanks

    Twocats

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  21. #13
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    In my opinion, if you just finished impaling someone's face with an axe, your arm would be down, people swing down with an axe...It looks to me like he's about to swing the axe, not that he just finished...

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  23. #14
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    My opinion - I'd like a bit transfer the left side horse pose (its right foot up, opened mouth and so on), try to find expreses of excited or abused horses in the interenet.
    There are some examples of "levade" http://images.google.cz/images?hl=cs...art=40&ndsp=20

    I wish you successful work.

    http://www.human-anatomy-for-artist.com/

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    Ok, thanks for the tips.

    I take your point about the swinging action. I'll rethink that and try to make it look more believable.

    A bit more work on the horse pose will help too, thanks. And thanks for the great links too.


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