30 year old DC gun ban lifted.
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  1. #1
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    Yes! Guns and mayhem for everyone!!!

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    but, but...but what happens when all the thugs and hoods in the ghettos of DC get registered handguns??? lol.

    c36

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    Good ol' well-regulated militias, where would the US be without them. The Crips are fairly well regulated if you ask me. Bang-up job they're doing protecting the sovereignty of the States.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Peter Coene View Post
    A small step in (what I think is) the right direction:

    http://voices.washingtonpost.com/raw..._decision.html
    So, what would a big step be?

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    Mortars and RPG's I believe.

    Last edited by Costau D; February 4th, 2009 at 03:21 PM.
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    The District of Columbia's ban on handguns is history because the Second Amendment guarantees an individual right to possess firearms and because throughout much of our history, "the American people have considered the handgun to be the quintessential self-defense weapon...,"

    Personally I'd prefer a shark with frickin' laser beams attached to its head...

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    Quote Originally Posted by el coro View Post
    but, but...but what happens when all the thugs and hoods in the ghettos of DC get registered handguns??? lol.

    c36
    It will be easier to track who they stole the registered handgun from?

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    Well here's something else to add to the list of reasons why I don't venture into DC by myself. Not that it will make much difference in the grand scheme of things; as with all gun legislation, it only matters in the slightest to those who actually follow the law.

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    Praise the lord and pass the ammo!

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    Hasn't DC had one of the highest murder rates in the country for many years (along with Chicago and New York, where firearms are also highly restricted)? Conversely, in areas where civilian ownership of firearms is high, crime tends to be much lower. Most violent crimes in the U.S. are committed with other weapons than guns, in any case.

    You can look up the statistics. I've never heard an anti-gun argument that was based on anything but emotion and irrational fear.

    You guys know that even Gandhi, the paragon of nonviolence, was strongly against civilian disarmament?

    "Among the many misdeeds of British rule in India, history will look upon the Act depriving a whole nation of arms as the blackest."

    -- Gandhi, in his autobiography

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    I don't really care whatever laws people decide on in the US. And if people for some reason think it's a good idea to have civilians playing with guns then so be it... But if it happened where I lived I'd be protesting loudly.

    Weapons should be hard to come over and only carried by police and military. I thought there was enough gunning in the US as it was... but maybe more people need to get shot, I don't know.

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    America scares me.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Atlantis View Post
    Hasn't DC had one of the highest murder rates in the country for many years (along with Chicago and New York, where firearms are also highly restricted)? Conversely, in areas where civilian ownership of firearms is high, crime tends to be much lower. Most violent crimes in the U.S. are committed with other weapons than guns, in any case.

    You can look up the statistics. I've never heard an anti-gun argument that was based on anything but emotion and irrational fear.
    *shrug*

    In the same manner, the province in which I live has the lowest relative rates of gun ownership in Canada, but also ranks near the bottom in rates of violent crime.

    I don't think it's so easy to link X cause with Y result in gun debates.

    Btw, a really telling stat imho is reasons for gun ownership (from a 1996 study).

    Almost 40% of people in the US bought them for protection. In contrast, France and Austria were in the 20's, with all other countries listed (including Canada), less than 10%.

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    Cars are way more scary than guns. I'd like to live in a land where cars were banned. Only public transportation is allowed.

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    I believe that it's about damn time they took that stupid restriction off of guns. People wouldn't be scared of them if they knew the slightest thing about them, I.E how to use them. and just to bring this up guns don't go around killing people at random... People do!!! I am all for self defense, be it knife, sword, gun or shark with lazer beams attached to their heads!!! That's what makes America great, the right to defend self and home.

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    How many times do you actually hear about someone using their gun to protect their home? They'll probably get their gun stolen instead.

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    Quote Originally Posted by RyerOrdStar View Post
    How many times do you actually hear about someone using their gun to protect their home? They'll probably get their gun stolen instead.
    Better to have and not need, then to need and not have.

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    You can a lot of damage with a knife too and that's a lot of crime there too.
    I personally prefer knives, but I would prefer that the person not even get that close. I would also prefer to reason with them so I wouldn't have to use violence but , worse comes to worse, I will protect my family above all else.

    I just think that we should be allowed to protect ourselves/family/property no matter what the *choice of weaponry is.

    logical and within reason*
    so no tanks or c4 please that's a tad overboard.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Atlantis View Post
    Hasn't DC had one of the highest murder rates in the country for many years (along with Chicago and New York, where firearms are also highly restricted)? Conversely, in areas where civilian ownership of firearms is high, crime tends to be much lower. Most violent crimes in the U.S. are committed with other weapons than guns, in any case.

    You can look up the statistics. I've never heard an anti-gun argument that was based on anything but emotion and irrational fear.

    You guys know that even Gandhi, the paragon of nonviolence, was strongly against civilian disarmament?

    "Among the many misdeeds of British rule in India, history will look upon the Act depriving a whole nation of arms as the blackest."

    -- Gandhi, in his autobiography
    Not to mention that violent crimes are on the decline in the US, unlike what the International Association of Chiefs of Police (freedom snatching pigs) would tell you.

    1992 Violent Crime Total=1,932,270

    2007 Violent Crime total= 1,408,337

    1992 Homicide= 23,760

    2007 Homicide= 16,929

    Our population has increased and yet the total is still down.

    There are 2 major methods of measuring crime rates in the USA. There is the National Crime Victimization Survey and the F.B.I. Uniform Crime Reports. These two methods yield different results. See the Bureau of Justice Statistics for more on data collection:

    http://www.ojp.usdoj.gov/bjs/abstract/ntmc.htm



    Interestingly enough, there's something more dangerous than guns out there. Such as doctors, with a higher percentage and number of people dying from things such as malpractice. More people die from falling. Should we outlaw stairs and rock-climbing, too?

    And now for a trip back through time:

    1935:
    "This year will go down in history.
    For the first time a civilised nation has full gun registration.
    The street will be safer, the police more efficient and the world will follow our lead into the future."

    -Adolf Hitler

    1(Civil War) US creates the first gun control laws to prevent guns from falling into the hands of slaves during the to prevent uprisings.

    2The Turkish Ottoman Empire established gun control in 1911, 1914 - 1917 1.5 million Armenians exterminated.

    3The Soviet Union established gun control in 1929. 1928 - 1953, 60 million Russians are imprisoned, poisoned, forced into servitude and exterminated.

    4China. Gun control begins in 1935. Between 1948 - 1952, Totalitarian Zedong exterminates 20 million Chinese citizens.

    5Nazi Germany established gun control in 1938, following it's registration acts in 35 - Do I even need to say what happened there?

    6Guatemala. Gun control laws enacted 1964: as a result, between 1964 - 1981, 100,000 Mayan Indians exterminated.

    7Uganda. Began gun control measures in 1970. Predictably, from 1971 - 1979, 300,000 Christians exterminated.

    8Cambodia. Established gun control measures in 1956, 1957 - 1977
    1 million Cambodians exterminated.

    When I was a child living in Ft. Worth, a man broke into our apartment to steal some goods, and likely with the intent to hurt us seeing as he knew we were home. The man attempted to kill my father, killed our guard dog, and destroyed the items that he failed to escape with. It happened again a few years later. This time, however; my father had a fire arm and gave this criminal the choice to leave. Needless to say he left. We're lucky he never came back for revenge. Personally, I would have forced him to the ground and awaited the police to arrive. Nowadays you can be sued for that. You might cause severe emotional trauma or damage on the poor thug.

    So, sure. Let's take guns from the hands of law-abiding citizens. Give the crooks, rapists, and murders a leg up so they have a chance. Ridiculous.

    Last edited by GhostValkyrie; February 4th, 2009 at 11:46 PM.
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    9 Gun control laws enacted in Canada decades ago.
    gunregistry begins in late 1990s (approx)
    no massacres so far.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Craig D View Post
    9 Gun control laws enacted in Canada decades ago.
    gunregistry begins in late 1990s (approx)
    no massacres so far.
    True, and there hasn't been a massacre in several countries. While you're correct in this regard, I was not trying to imply that it will lead to that; there is a greater likelihood for despotism if the arms of law abiding citizens are taken away. Criminals are not going to turn their guns in, and I think many people understand that police brutality and corruption could sky-rocket without the worry of a citizen defending themselves to that extent. (No, not all cops are bad. But there happens to be that X% that just can't help but abuse and betray what they've been trusted with. Same goes for some people in the military, or any position of power for that matter - including politics.)

    Citizens have the right to responsibly bear arms and defend themselves from tyranny - whether it be a corrupt politician thousands of miles away, a crooked cop down the street, or a rapist next door.

    Last edited by GhostValkyrie; February 5th, 2009 at 07:40 AM. Reason: Grammar
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    Quote Originally Posted by GhostValkyrie View Post
    True, and there hasn't been a massacre in several countries. While you're correct in this regard, I was trying to imply that it will lead to that; there is a greater likelihood for despotism if the arms of law abiding citizens are taken away.
    Not that I want to take a position or something, but when you are speaking of likelyhood and even more so, something tht _leads_ to something else, you are moving on very thin and populistic ice, since you are using terms from social sciences without even the slightest proper statistic method.

    If you want to imply that there's a connection between firearms-laws and despotism you'd have to bring up much more cases than the ones you mentioned, depending on a prior calculation of the statistical power within your data. To be on the save side, I'd suggest keeping the N in three digits, although there's some disciplines like developmental linguistics and certain branches of sociology where the correlation is obstructed with 10 or even less cases. No need to mention that those are having miraculous breakthrough discoveries on a monthly basis

    Anyways, it's possible to make statistical claims with fewer subjects, which takes us to your second part of the "prrof", causality. Statistically speaking, you can only speak of causal relationships in a controlled experimental setting. Since this is definately not possible here, your claim is invalid.

    As are all of your claims to be speaking of facts. they are just opinion, at least as long as you are wavering in the waters of sociology.

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    Quote Originally Posted by ~Faust~ View Post
    Not that I want to take a position or something, but when you are speaking of likelyhood and even more so, something tht _leads_ to something else, you are moving on very thin and populistic ice, since you are using terms from social sciences without even the slightest proper statistic method.

    If you want to imply that there's a connection between firearms-laws and despotism you'd have to bring up much more cases than the ones you mentioned, depending on a prior calculation of the statistical power within your data. To be on the save side, I'd suggest keeping the N in three digits, although there's some disciplines like developmental linguistics and certain branches of sociology where the correlation is obstructed with 10 or even less cases. No need to mention that those are having miraculous breakthrough discoveries on a monthly basis

    Anyways, it's possible to make statistical claims with fewer subjects, which takes us to your second part of the "prrof", causality. Statistically speaking, you can only speak of causal relationships in a controlled experimental setting. Since this is definately not possible here, your claim is invalid.

    As are all of your claims to be speaking of facts. they are just opinion, at least as long as you are wavering in the waters of sociology.
    I apologize. I'm afraid we both made a mistake. I wasn't paying enough attention to my own text. I meant to type "was not", not was. I read your post before the quote and was struck as to where you felt that it was strictly developed on opinions. The rise of despotism isn't merely because guns are controlled, I agree to that. Usually despots rise and convince people to do so. It doesn't mean this is always the case, but it has happened several times. Thanks for highlighting that section. I'll be fixing it shortly.

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    hummm, I dont see nothin wrong with that. All the would be gang members and people who plan on killin people arent gonna be carrying around registered weapons anyways.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Atlantis View Post

    "Among the many misdeeds of British rule in India, history will look upon the Act depriving a whole nation of arms as the blackest."

    -- Gandhi, in his autobiography
    Sorry but this is taken out of context. Gandhi was refering to military weapons not personally held firearms, and the refusal of the British to conscript Indians into the army.

    Last edited by Aly Fell; February 5th, 2009 at 11:44 AM. Reason: Sleplnig
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    Not knowing a great deal about America, i'd have thought DC to be one of the more safer states? Due to the whole "White House, Congress yata yata" being there.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Vehkt View Post
    Not knowing a great deal about America, i'd have thought DC to be one of the more safer states? Due to the whole "White House, Congress yata yata" being there.
    The streets are almost as corrupt as the politics.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Vehkt View Post
    Not knowing a great deal about America, i'd have thought DC to be one of the more safer states? Due to the whole "White House, Congress yata yata" being there.
    Seriously? You're talking about a state full of snipers with itchy fingers waiting on every rooftop. If you live there and look the slightest bit like the president you're out for a rough ride... ;P

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