I was just checking though the references and I noticed that there isn't a great deal of variety in those women. I'm curious where you can find older or obese, even anxeric. Things change as you age posture wrinkles same for when you're obese.
Pay for one month’s subscription at www.3d.sk and then you gather good ones like a maniac. They have the variety and the quality and you don't have to comb the net looking for them. What I don’t like about these is they lack action. You need to mentally add action when you use a stationary pose.
If you can't get enough the porn bug got you and you are actually using your hunger as an excuse not to study, the collector/gatherer gene. Men like to collect good looking fat even if it’s not on their own bodies.
Then you might as well bounce over to www.bravoerotica.com and look for good erotic art. This site have limited it’s self to the erotic nudes, so you don't have to go thought all that sex. You need to learn how to study objectively and pragmatically no matter what you are looking at or you will suck forever. You need to keep your sensuality and sex appeal in your pocket though because you need to be able to present and communicate that to a viewer in your works.
Some say erotic art aren’t good for study, well I'm sure they never noticed a anime girl or any successful female figure in concept art. They sure as hell need to be hot depending on their character. Also the value overlooked from these, they are works of art, and these erotic photographers go out of their way to compose mega interesting lighting and environment where 3d.sk might not be. It’s a shame that these are dumped with other porn. These are high value art.
I would also suggest making a hard copy folder or ring bound collection of ref's for study. Commit yourself, gather a good set of material you feel touches on allot of stuff you need to get down, look for good shape, muscle or even the most smooth ones(Just how smooth is smooth?). If you have an analytical drawing approach and not a copy drawing approach you will learn.
Don't collect like 50 folders,... make one folder (or two) and then sit, even if you use candle light then DRAW.
You can also bounce into a porn shop and look for weird stuff. Get the fat mag’s, gay mag’s, etc.. gather up you pile of FHM’s, GQ’s, etc and get scissors, glue and a book to stick stuff in. Snip stuff you feel you need as a quick ref for anything, use your own creativity in building a high value ref book. There are also stuff you can learn with scissors. Cut muscle groups away and separate them to see and experiment.
I am going to tell you something that might rattle your brain for a nice long time. The importance of gesture. When doing art class life studies. What does playfulness look like? Now browse a erotic art site and ask the same question? Ok now think of Pluto, disney's doggy. Hehehehe!! Wait for the foul implications that you might have to wear off and then REALLY NOTICE the body. What made Pluto look playful? What did you see in these female pic's that was so enticing? See how incredibly lacking arty model poses are for true gesture. >Scratch my belly?<
Now imagine what playful dude's look like, what does a playful non sexual pose look like. >Makes you want to wrestle them girls doesn't it?< OK.. Think of a footballer's motions, dodging advances, jumping on the spot avoiding contact etc... playing with your dog, with a stick, the way it wag's it's tail, barks at you, the funny gestures it takes on etc..
Fearful gestures, a dude getting away from an attacking dog, what his gesture looks like. That is what gesture is supposed to be. The feeling of action and emotion. You need to learn the correct way to do gesture if you were to move from figure study towards drawing from imagination.
A gesture to probe the mind.
What does a righteous indignant woman or art fossil dude gesture look like (Maybe having a problem with this post at this moment).
Just think about what this knowledge can do for your relationship.
Some "serious artists" are infarct also looking for gesture even if they prefer non sensual stuff. It's important to know what you are looking for. Is it pure bodily posture you are looking at(Look at my anatomy) or are there more theme's that you might be looking at that's maybe more dramatic, like innocence for example, unawareness is also one, what does someone look like that is unsuspecting? Most models in an art studio or arty type ref are either “showing anatomy” or “in rest” even if they are holding a sword a gesture is only forcefull for so long untill the model goes "abcent minded". That is why and erotic photographer have to get the model moving like that as he needs to "capture the action"(Something ref photographers cold learn from). It’s important that should you work with ref that you don’t copy gesture when it’s not the gesture you are looking for, you might have to compensate or invent a gesture that is more communicating of the actor’s intentions.
If you have a good camera with a fast aperture etc... Imagine taking shots of your dog while someone is playing with it, now isn't that exactly where Pluto came from?
That and like with porn.. Pluto has got it's behind in the air 80% of the time. He even has his tongue sticking out and looking at you funny. The other 20% he'd be cowering or scared, and then he’d have his behind crunched in forward or concealed. But what I really would like everyone to notice is that playfulness in the body are innocent. It's the brain and conditioning that might make it perverted or nasty. What you are seeing there aint no different than general playfulness.
There are other attractive gesture to look for as you analyze gesture that you could call more "intellectually driven". Female posture could also communicate unavailability through superiority, looking down on you or a body frame that is toned so well that it becomes intimidating(Think male antler psychology and why babes dance up against each other sometimes). These are actually old male frames but its popular today in female gesture, some of those exaggerated knee postures and stuff(You want this!!??). If you become sensitive and teary when working through a lot of ref, it’s better to look for playful and friendly ones. Hehe!!
The body is still the simple one and processes these rejections somewhere in the background. It's also a good exercise to mime the model instead of being the viewer to try and avoid these nasties, making your own body feel and express instead of being the viewer.
That may also be why allot of female artists have a problem studying these types of materials as it might force them to become defiant in order to process it. Issues of inadequacy and competition or seeing stuff as being beneath one self in order to feel "the worthy candidate". A woman could also try and copy gesture's internally to try and mime and experience what a model is doing to try and avoid that and maybe probe to learn something new. As a man I have learn't it's not so much about what you have but what you do with it that makes any female attractive. As a dude I have never noticed that it's indeed the fat pads on a woman's body that trigger the hard wired sexual stuff. A model have these fat pad's in all the right places creating curvatures and subtle plumpness.
I bought a fat porn mag, oh boy, I was really grossed out with all that cellulite that looks like it comes out of the legs like paint out of a tube, but then there are quite the large female's that manage to be really attractive and healthy looking because of their rhythms and gesture. That ideal weight idea flew out the window for me a long time ago. It's whatever your body is designed to look and feel good with that's the ideal and a woman being comfortable in their own bodies that allows them to "open up"
It's easy for a dude to adopt ill models for thinking, that's why as an artist you need to "cultivate" a "healthy" one and force it to be the dominant instead of being somebody else’s pervert. Dude's going through puberty have it hard enough, trying to process this stuff, some end up having crookedness because they are made to believe that they are, the body is simple, it's either feeling happy playful and accepted or rejected and touch is a major part of the language of the body. The ways you look at something are similar to the way you touch something, you need to straighten it and make it a touch of vigor and health and not a decrepit one. The doggy body mind have never really left the building the human mind just have bigger rational part's attached to it so these things needs to learn to coincide. The psychology of your work will come out in some places but allways faced with the psychology of others. And if your mind runs weird creative stuff to tease you.. The good thing I learn't from the NLP master is that even though the mind is capable of thinking anything... the good news is that you don't have to act on it. That is a cure for someone being afraid of their own crookedness for too long. You need to switch the light on a little and brighten up a little. You need to be friends with your own mind so you can visualise productive stuff together(I just had a vision of a long haired dude switching on the light in his yacht cab with pot's and pans hanging everywhere, hehe)
But us average ugly people(I mean rich in character) it's kinda OK for a lady to feel more accepting of themselves, so they can call me a pervert if they want to.
Last edited by George Abraham; May 25th, 2009 at 09:37 AM.
---------------------------------- Scetchbook: View the exhibitionist's stuff.
Mjranum-stock's photos are good reference in general, but I just saw this one today and thought it could make really good reference: Link
It's basically a slow-motion video of a model. It's really good if you need to study motion.
Last edited by Dorkthrone; November 14th, 2009 at 11:10 PM.
i picked up one of the 'virtual pose' books (http://www.virtualpose.net/) at borders and its very useful, and its not just the book itself but it comes with a cd with quicktime files showing 360 views of each pose (about 70 poses per book). the one i got was the 'sculpture' edition but there are many others, both men and women, with a variety of models for each.
you can also buy and download specific poses via the website.