The fraud revealed...
Join the #1 Art Workshop - LevelUpJoin Premium Art Workshop

Results 1 to 13 of 13

Thread: The fraud revealed...

  1. #1
    Join Date
    Sep 2006
    Location
    Los Angeles
    Posts
    762
    Thanks
    21
    Thanked 113 Times in 96 Posts
    Follows
    0
    Following
    0

    The fraud revealed...

    I spend a lot of time on the FF forum, critting other people's work, so I'm a little terrified showing my own poor attempt at last. I can sense the daggers of vengeance being drawn my back as we speak.

    But... why not.

    Just got a wacom, and this is my first attempt at painting with it. All photoshop. I think it might have been better if I had used reference with a little more contrast. Next time.

    Have at it. I'm eager to hear what you think.
    Name:  PracticeWithRef03.jpg
Views: 774
Size:  340.4 KB

    Nathan's Journal

    http://sabrepunk.com/
    Reply With Quote Reply With Quote  

  2. #2
    Join Date
    Jun 2003
    Location
    Olympia, WA USA
    Posts
    2,012
    Thanks
    1,860
    Thanked 486 Times in 325 Posts
    Follows
    0
    Following
    0
    You're putting great big white splotches in her hair where there are none in the photo...

    You are making one calf darker than the other when they are actually about the same value in the photo, despite the cast shadow on the right inner thigh.

    Check the negative space under her left arm pit/above wrist area. It is not correct.

    the shape of her head is weird - you've exaggerated her forehead, giving her a widows peak and her philtrum (area under the nose) hangs too low, giving her a mannish appearance.

    The left shoulder in yours is too round, making it look inflated. In the photo it is actually more of a straight angle. Check that angle and slice off some of your version's shoulder.

    If you fix these issues it could be a very nice piece.

    sehertu mannu narāṭu ina pānāt šagapīru ningishzidda
    abrahadabra
    Reply With Quote Reply With Quote  

  3. The Following User Says Thank You to Izi For This Useful Post:


  4. #3
    Join Date
    Nov 2007
    Location
    columbus, OH
    Posts
    80
    Thanks
    2
    Thanked 138 Times in 24 Posts
    Follows
    0
    Following
    0
    I think much beauty can be found in subtleties. Sometimes it's harder to capture those as opposed to high contrasting subjects. As far as a first time study goes this seems good. I assume you exaggerated here and there on purpose maybe. ie deltoid and hips. If not, Naomi is making some good points. I think some of your highlights are too similar throughout. The booty and deltoid muscle are getting too much light. Look how dark her deltoid is compared to the highlight on her elbow in your ref. Also, notice the subtle reds, pinks,violets on the hands, nose, cheeks, elbows that are lackin in your piece. She needs some color to breath life into her form. And softer transitions from hairline to forehead.

    Reply With Quote Reply With Quote  

  5. The Following User Says Thank You to efortune357 For This Useful Post:


  6. #4
    Join Date
    Dec 2006
    Location
    UK
    Posts
    1,972
    Thanks
    1,331
    Thanked 1,923 Times in 757 Posts
    Follows
    0
    Following
    0
    Naomi and efortune have raised good points so there is no need to repeat their good advice.
    Your sense of rendering local form is good - the 'cross hatching' strokes across the movement of the form is a sound approach. Two things that occur to me:

    It would be useful for you to do a couple of 'self information' drawings of how you think her spine behaves and the pivotal joints of her shoulders and arms in relation to this. If you understood how all the elements of her body behave in consort with each other as a sort of melody your rendering of the forms as they flow into each other would become automatically less 'wooden' or static.
    Getting this feeling of naturalness is not achieved by 'toning things down' but through understanding the stress, strains and rythym of a pose from a sense of being within it. It is the reason that computer rendered models still tend to not look convincing even with very accurate light situations and physical proportions.

    Second thought: You have chosen a very tricky image to study from - most women are not weight lifters so you are giving yourself a couple of difficulties right off the bat. It may have been better to have taken a more conventional 'type' so that the problem of making a quirkiness inherent in the reference image look intentional is left out of the situation.

    Anyway, good stuff, you clearly have a talent for this so all you have to do now is........thousands of more studies! Easy!
    Thanks for posting this - it can be a bit daunting, particularly when you see a name sitting under your post who you know does not spare the rod.

    From Gegarin's point of view
    http://www.chrisbennettartist.co.uk/
    Reply With Quote Reply With Quote  

  7. The Following User Says Thank You to Chris Bennett For This Useful Post:


  8. #5
    Join Date
    Sep 2006
    Location
    Los Angeles
    Posts
    762
    Thanks
    21
    Thanked 113 Times in 96 Posts
    Follows
    0
    Following
    0
    Thank you all for you advice. Every word is true. And I will do my best to apply it all to the next thing I do. Unfortunately, when preparing this for the web, I accidentally saved the original psd at this size and 72 dpi, so there will be no going back and fixing this. Only just a teeny bit mad at myself for that...

    Naomi, that's for the discerning eye. I don't know why I couldn't see those things on my own.

    Efortune, I see what you mean about the other colors. I have made her look like pink mud. Part of this comes from having very little idea of how to apply paint (whether traditional or digital) at all. Do I put varying colors under the others and then paint semi-opaquely over them?

    Chris, thanks so much. It's great to get such helpful feedback from someone I have given feedback to. I will do more more underdrawing in the future. Still getting used to the stylus, which I'm having a hard time using for sketching, so I went a little too quickly to the painting part.

    I chose a bodybuilder because I thought all the muscles would be distinct and easily defined - and easily painted - like painting an anatomy chart. Of course, as you say, most people don't look like anatomy charts, so how useful is it?

    Nathan's Journal

    http://sabrepunk.com/
    Reply With Quote Reply With Quote  

  9. #6
    Elwell's Avatar
    Elwell is offline Sticks Like Grim Death Level 17 Gladiator: Spartacus' Dimachaeri
    Join Date
    May 2003
    Location
    Hudson River valley, NY
    Posts
    16,212
    Thanks
    4,879
    Thanked 16,666 Times in 5,020 Posts
    Follows
    0
    Following
    0
    Too much detail, too soon. Not even so much in how you draw/paint, but in how you see; you're being seduced/distracted by unimportant stuff before you've properly established the context. And that's what's causing all your problems, in drawing, value, and in color.


    Tristan Elwell
    **Finished Work Thread **Process Thread **Edges Tutorial

    Crash Course for Artists, Illustrators, and Cartoonists, NYC, the 2013 Edition!

    "Work is more fun than fun."
    -John Cale

    "Art is supposed to punch you in the brain, and it's supposed to stay punched."
    -Marc Maron
    Reply With Quote Reply With Quote  

  10. The Following User Says Thank You to Elwell For This Useful Post:


  11. #7
    Join Date
    Nov 2007
    Location
    columbus, OH
    Posts
    80
    Thanks
    2
    Thanked 138 Times in 24 Posts
    Follows
    0
    Following
    0
    as far as color. I tend to glaze in color slowly building it up. I never nail a color right off bat. Or match a color I've used previously. So when I mix a new color I also make sure I use it throughout the subject so for example , an arm or whatever, isn't isolated from the rest of the subject. It would be easy to sample the color you already have and go a bit more warm, red, whatever you want and slowly apply it where needed. You'll have to post an original piece soon Keep pluggin

    Reply With Quote Reply With Quote  

  12. The Following User Says Thank You to efortune357 For This Useful Post:


  13. #8
    Join Date
    Sep 2006
    Location
    Los Angeles
    Posts
    762
    Thanks
    21
    Thanked 113 Times in 96 Posts
    Follows
    0
    Following
    0
    Elwell, I am honored just to be worthy of your crit. But it makes me want to sit down with you and ask a thousand questions. I'll start with one:

    Context?

    Nathan's Journal

    http://sabrepunk.com/
    Reply With Quote Reply With Quote  

  14. #9
    Elwell's Avatar
    Elwell is offline Sticks Like Grim Death Level 17 Gladiator: Spartacus' Dimachaeri
    Join Date
    May 2003
    Location
    Hudson River valley, NY
    Posts
    16,212
    Thanks
    4,879
    Thanked 16,666 Times in 5,020 Posts
    Follows
    0
    Following
    0
    Context:
    Nothing is either too large or too small, too dark or too light, too bright or too gray, except in relation to everything else in the picture. You have to be able to conceptualize the large relationships first, because the smaller ones are dependent on them.


    Tristan Elwell
    **Finished Work Thread **Process Thread **Edges Tutorial

    Crash Course for Artists, Illustrators, and Cartoonists, NYC, the 2013 Edition!

    "Work is more fun than fun."
    -John Cale

    "Art is supposed to punch you in the brain, and it's supposed to stay punched."
    -Marc Maron
    Reply With Quote Reply With Quote  

  15. The Following 4 Users Say Thank You to Elwell For This Useful Post:


  16. #10
    Join Date
    Sep 2006
    Location
    Los Angeles
    Posts
    762
    Thanks
    21
    Thanked 113 Times in 96 Posts
    Follows
    0
    Following
    0
    Thanks, Elwell and Eric. Hmmm. It sounds like I have tried to run before I can walk. It's been about 15 years since I sketched regularly. Maybe I should go do that for a while first. Conceptualizing probably comes after being able to handle the medium.

    Nathan's Journal

    http://sabrepunk.com/
    Reply With Quote Reply With Quote  

  17. #11
    Join Date
    Sep 2004
    Location
    Las Vegas, NV
    Posts
    1,617
    Thanks
    305
    Thanked 269 Times in 206 Posts
    Follows
    0
    Following
    0
    Also don't use color picker. Try to paint with instinct. Using a bit of yellow, red and voilet in will the flesh would help. Be subtle with those hues though. You can also add a little green in there as well if your brave. Be careful with mixing colors though it can turn into mud if the colors are not placed in correct areas. Localize the colors.

    Reply With Quote Reply With Quote  

  18. The Following User Says Thank You to Beelow For This Useful Post:


  19. #12
    My57's Avatar
    My57 is offline I will live forever or DIE TRYING! Level 11 Gladiator: Essedarii
    Join Date
    Feb 2008
    Location
    Canada
    Posts
    1,890
    Thanks
    20
    Thanked 541 Times in 531 Posts
    Follows
    0
    Following
    0
    to lazy to read other posts so im just gonna go ahead and make my observations:

    -arms to muscular compared to the real photo
    -nose looks like its more...i dunno how to word this.. the original is more slanted down... depressed more? not by a lot, so it would be a slight adjustment.
    -mouth and eye are a tad larger as well. Meaning the head is also a tad larger.

    sorry i just have this thing for detail when it comes to copying xD im quite good at it, but i've been practicing from my head more often, not as good sadly xD. You should use the blend, blur, and burn tool for shadowing if you want realism. Looks a lot better that way. I think thats why your arm looks so muscular, soften it up with blur and burn xD

    Reply With Quote Reply With Quote  

  20. The Following User Says Thank You to My57 For This Useful Post:


  21. #13
    Join Date
    Jun 2003
    Location
    Olympia, WA USA
    Posts
    2,012
    Thanks
    1,860
    Thanked 486 Times in 325 Posts
    Follows
    0
    Following
    0
    Quote Originally Posted by NathanLong View Post
    Naomi, that's for the discerning eye. I don't know why I couldn't see those things on my own.
    It comes with practice but not until you become a master really - (ie bouguereau) it's hard to check anatomy but it get easier and then you do something stupid like sketch a guy without reference....(re my own little anatomical problem recently) I can only see your mistakes because its not my piece, my brain is wired for different areas. Remember the human form is the most difficult to grasp because - the human eye cannot easily be fooled by a disfigured figure. Our genes are wired to detect flaws. So you gotta live with it. the human figure is the most difficult thing to draw - for human painters trying to impress human viewers.

    So it's the fresh eye, I think everyone can use it unless you check and double check, and even I do that, i dont go to the crit center very much. Although i should....anyways....do what you can when you can, and then grab a fresh pair of eyes I think that is all you can do.

    sehertu mannu narāṭu ina pānāt šagapīru ningishzidda
    abrahadabra
    Reply With Quote Reply With Quote  

  22. The Following User Says Thank You to Izi For This Useful Post:


Members who have read this thread: 0

There are no members to list at the moment.

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •