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Thread: Some thoughts on posting in the Critique Center...

  1. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by Richi View Post
    Ok...how about somebody posted something they needed advice for a project in the future. And after a few days he sees his idea done by someone else. That would mean stealing??? Am I wrong??? Of course nothing is original these days, but stealing is stealing. Simple.
    I am not quite sure what you mean. You are talking about an idea, as in "I was thinking about drawing a forest scene" and later someone posts up excactly this idea. This was not what I was referring to. What I meant was someone getting advice such as "You should re-think your composition, do thumbnails" and the response is "ok thx I'll do that next time" whilst continuing on the current project leading to failure or less desired outcome, even though all the advice they needed, is there.


    Quote Originally Posted by Richi View Post
    And about others pictures. Well, I wouldn't know whether he/she really wants to learn or is just passing time uploading stuff.
    Not everybody is a quick learner and not everybody can learn from others problems.
    Of course not. And that is why I don't have a makro for "piss off, you don't really mean it"- because everyone is treated as hard-working and trying to improve. You will notice that in those threads, where advice is obviously ignored (I do not mean not understood, or applied with difficulty)- I mean blissfully ignored, the work process continues without taking any advice into consideration. Those threads tend to lose a lot of responses rapidly after this becomes clear. I personally don't hold any grudge, I just simply don't respond any more. How much more frustrating must it be for those who actually look back on a solid history of illustration, animation, or fine arts?

    Quote Originally Posted by Richi View Post
    As for me, I don't see any thread not asking serious stuff. Some people may not know what they want from the critiques and may be confused, in that case the reviewer should tell them to be clear instead of taking a grudge for wasting time in the forums.
    The thing is, either this hint is taken as an offense (I am not linking threads here because for the sake of peace and PC, I would rather prefer keeping this general or refer to my personal view) or it is not understood. I find this in my old threads quite a lot. I asked for advice, got it, but I didn't really understand how profound the changes are that I have to make in order to go from A to B. The internet these days, deviantART being right at the front, suggests that learning to draw is a simple, three-step process. If you look at 90% of those "tutorials", you will find that it is always suggested with a certain ease to start fiddling around in Photoshop, apply some colour and the rest is magic. I believed this myself, and found it even more frustrating when I screwed up badly. My wall of text here is illustrated briefly through this:

    How to draw an owl

    The fact that every new person here has to go through the very same step of realizing that drawing is a tough learning process, will ensure that this CC forum will be alive for as long as CA lasts. But frustration (my personal) arises when the same persons after multiple responses, and elaborate responses, carry on like this. I think it is a reasonable sentiment, and I haven't found myself trolling around and being rude to others for what I might have done myself. Merely a sentiment.
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  4. #28
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    to be honest, ive yet to see an original idea in the crit section... if you worry about your pictures/ideas beeing stolen...dont post them...anywhere.

    yet i think the hardest lesson (and one reason people are put off often), is that your ideas arent as precious as they might appear to you. your personal and unique take on a nightelf-archer (what an amazing concept), might not have the impact you estimated. eventhough its your first time, weve seen it a thousand of times.

    one thing that (to me) got lost, is that people who are striving to do art for a living, are recognizing that it is hard work to get there.
    "how to improve on that....", yet havent even done their browsing on the forums, which would bring up some answers and more important questions.

    to me it seems that this is all going wrong, because people still seem to think, that something coming for free, has little value and can be treated easily. people fail to recognize that art is a product of effort (even if some prominent pictures carry the impression its not).

    most of the time to me this is like ... a drowning man asking which move to make next, thinking this one (and only this one) move is a fundamental lifesaving action, and they lived happily everafter... yet would never consider learning how to swim...
    I said earlier, nothing is original. And oh...ideas arent precious. Ok, maybe thats why most of them get stolen. Even if they are not original. And please, don't think others will think the same as you think about your ideas.

    Oooh...I would love to see this happening. Then maybe people will understand. What I mean.
    Whatever....I'm just saying what might happen. And if I would have worried over somebody stealing my stuff. I wouldn't have posted them in the internet in the first place. So, yeah GET OVER IT...
    Also, I would advice checking out some of the recent stealing thing over the internet. Anyway, PREVENTION IS BETTER THAN CURE.

    I'm just trying to improve the community. Well, some people don't like that. I think.
    Last edited by Richi; June 16th, 2011 at 01:48 AM.
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  5. #29
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    its good if youre trying to improve the comunity, i just dont think a closed crit section would do that and explained why. the rest been a rant i had to get off my chest and aint been directed at you.
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  6. #30
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    Hi guys,

    I loved this LordLouis "The internet these days, deviantART being right at the front, suggests that learning to draw is a simple, three-step process. If you look at 90% of those "tutorials", you will find that it is always suggested with a certain ease to start fiddling around in Photoshop, apply some colour and the rest is magic".

    Your quote above put me in mind of something I saw on a PIXAR Dvd in the extras John Lassiter was asked once what software he used to make the movies funny!! You are damn right mate this is a hard game to get into it soaks up hours of every day and sometimes for no progress, your family question your sanity because youre a grown person and yet you are drawing monsters, pixies and elves.
    Is it just me though or are some people just holding out a hand to the community at large and saying fix it for me, or do me a paintover to show me. Where can I download the magic texture brushes that will do the work for me etc etc. There does seem a reluctance to dig in and work at it at the moment to me. (that'll get the responses in Lol)

    And you are right about some people posting and not taking on board the crits they get, and then churn out more of the same flawed stuff next time
    " But frustration (my personal) arises when the same persons after multiple responses, and elaborate responses, (even paintovers) carry on like this".

    Quite often (in my case especially) you have a brilliant image in your minds eye and you howl with frustration because you cant get it down on paper. There are no shortcuts with this drawing game at all! its just work and repetion and study and then more of the same.

    As for making all this private unless you are a member I disagree most strongly indeed, it was browsing this forum that made me join in the first place, Plus I am guilty of not logging in sometimes and just looking to see what the topics are at the moment
    A great kind hearted lumbering bullock



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  8. #31
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    I apologize if I said anything upsetting. Sorry...
    Cheer Up! World's a big place...
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  9. #32
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    Dont worry This is a discussion forum, and opinions are good and need an airing from time to time

    I for one feel the freedom in this forum is one of its strongest points, free opinion, free advice and so on and so forth
    A great kind hearted lumbering bullock



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  10. #33
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    I am curious, how can I get more critic in my threads. My last two have only managed 2-3 replies, which, while helpful and I am grateful, isn't really enough. I've noticed people who are completely negative or unresponsive to critic get 20-30 replies often. I am practically begging for help, what am I doing wrong?
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  11. #34
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    Quote Originally Posted by bullitbikini View Post
    I am curious, how can I get more critic in my threads. My last two have only managed 2-3 replies, which, while helpful and I am grateful, isn't really enough. I've noticed people who are completely negative or unresponsive to critic get 20-30 replies often. I am practically begging for help, what am I doing wrong?
    I can only speak for myself, but just a few things from me:

    1. Your thread about futuristic soldiers. You got very useful critique there, redline and help- but you never fixed the wobbly leg/no knee issue, the dwarfen-statue and the squashed face of the right guy. With stating that you want it to be a portfolio piece, you were not ready to put more effort into it, which the critiques had suggested. The critiques weren't long I know, but they all were down to the point. I am not suggesting that you deliberately ignored critique, you might even have taken it very seriously and tried to apply it, but nonetheless, it is not visible. What helps is that you explain what you did, rather than "next update" etc.
    2. When it comes to environments, threads are never overly populated. Most work here is that of the human figure, and is prone to most of the mistakes- thus more people have an eye to see issues, which is not the case with environments. Plus, your thread showed thumbnails, which of course is an additional factor that normaly reduces the amount of posts, because they show a work in progress and not a piece which needs help.
    3. You are not clear enough about what you want. Just to take the example from the environment thumbnail thread:
    "so i guess id like input on which ones would provide the most challenge and show the widest range of skills" First of all, you guess? And secondly, only you know what is most challenging for you. You got two responses stating which were preferred. Okay, good so far. Then you update, having picked 4 and gone to colour, stating
    "Please help me make this portfolio ready. Dont be gentle, give it to me straight." Sorry but, I cannot help you like this. What do you want? Critique on colour, composition, what are the images intended to do? Even asking "what is important for a portfolio?" would have generated more replies. You seem very uncertain about what you want from the CC forum. Think before you post up your wips what you think you need help with. I personally think that you just have to learn and train more, you are off to a good start and it takes further practice, which the CC forum cannot take from you. Unless of course, there is a specific question.
    4. This is only a minor issue, but something that does bother me: no user avatar. This forum is HUUUGGGEEEEE and thus it is important to create a solid identity that people recognise. It gives the impression that you want to be engaged with the forum, and that you care. This is of course more of a social aspect, but I personally (!) find nothing more annoying than lack of avatars. I tend to remember pictures, not names.
    5. The ultimate randomness of the universe. Sometimes a thread gets more attention for no obvious reasons. The reasons for that are not always the same. Sometimes the threadstarter is registered since 2002 and has made him/herself a "name" on CA, maybe they have been recognized as putting a lot of effort into their work, maybe someone posted a critique that is controversial, or sometimes the images themselves are just so boring and scream "I couldn't bother!" that I am put off answering. And also, don't forget that the time zones play a role. When I start a thread, I do that late evening, my time- because in only a few hours when I will be sleeping, the US of A will have daytime(s) and thus CA most active, which raises the likelyhood of me getting replies.

    I hope I didn't come across too negative or insulting, I hope I could help you a little with the little things that make the big difference.
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  13. #35
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    Hi matey

    This is something I have wondered at myself from time to time,
    Quote Originally Posted by bullitbikini View Post
    I am curious, how can I get more critic in my threads. My last two have only managed 2-3 replies, which, while helpful and I am grateful, isn't really enough. I've noticed people who are completely negative or unresponsive to critic get 20-30 replies often. I am practically begging for help, what am I doing wrong?
    I dont think there is an easy answer mate, maybe people think that you are better than them and dont feel they should comment!? If it helps you I shall look out for your posts and have a look at each and every one, however If I cant see anything to improve then I wont comment, thats another point to consider mate. I'm not one to blow sunshine up your back passage for no reason.

    All the best mate

    P.S. I left a comment in your sketchbook, and you didint reply, so get some more stuff in there because I'm waiting impatiently. lol
    A great kind hearted lumbering bullock



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  15. #36
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    thanks a lot for your thoughts lord louis! Iwill take them to heart and work on the things i can do to be a better member here. as soon as i find an apartment and get al set up i will make an avatar as well. Thank you to Lightship as well! i replied ot my sketchbook thread, but sadly at the moment i cannot upload anything new gimme a week or so haha
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  17. #37
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    Quote Originally Posted by LordLouis View Post
    4. This is only a minor issue, but something that does bother me: no user avatar. This forum is HUUUGGGEEEEE and thus it is important to create a solid identity that people recognise. It gives the impression that you want to be engaged with the forum, and that you care. This is of course more of a social aspect, but I personally (!) find nothing more annoying than lack of avatars. I tend to remember pictures, not names.
    Yikes!

    <--- sheepishly sneaks off and adds an avatar
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  19. #38
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    Hello everyone, Im hoping you could answer some questions I have in this thread as I didn't know where else I could post this. So on to the questions:

    1. Im getting almost no feedback on my sketchbook even though I update everyday and I was hoping people would criticize my work and help me get better. I have posted on others sketchbooks and so far Im finding lots of talented artists that could help me, yet no one ever comments on my work. Why?

    2. Should I have posted here on the criticisms Forums?

    Those are my questions, I just want to be nice and helpful to my fellow artists and hope we can talk and share ideas as this is what I think CA was made for.

    And on another note I will make clear again that my username is the name of a song, I don't have any messiah complex or anything or I wouldn't be looking for help and critics. thanks!
    Check out my sketchbook
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  20. #39
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    Quote Originally Posted by smallergod View Post
    2. Should I have posted here on the criticisms Forums?
    It's not either/or. Sketchbooks are for all your stuff, CC/WIPS is for specific pieces. Often, posting a piece here will lead people to check out your Sketchbook thread for other work.

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