Hardest concepts in art to learn?

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  1. #1
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    Hardest concepts in art to learn?

    Anatomy seems very hard, I can barely get it down. Perspective must be even harder though, I cant imagine being able to draw a guy flipping in the air and then punching, with the angle from below

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    Iím sure different artists all struggle with different things. Anatomy and perspective, for instance, are apples and oranges. Also, whether a particular thing is difficult depends on what tools and opportunities youíve got at hand. If you have a drafting table, T-square, and a good book on perspective, itíll be easier to learn. If youíve got figure drawing sessions available to you, and a good anatomy text, that will be easier.

    I think you are awesome, and I wish you the best in your endeavors, but I am tired of repeating myself, I am very busy with my new baby, and I am no longer a regular participant here, so please do not contact me to ask for advice on your career or education. All of the advice that I have to offer can already be found in the following links. Thank you.

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  4. #3
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    Quote Originally Posted by Seedling View Post
    Iím sure different artists all struggle with different things. Anatomy and perspective, for instance, are apples and oranges. Also, whether a particular thing is difficult depends on what tools and opportunities youíve got at hand. If you have a drafting table, T-square, and a good book on perspective, itíll be easier to learn. If youíve got figure drawing sessions available to you, and a good anatomy text, that will be easier.
    I have like 4 anatomy texts and I go to life drawing but I still havent seen much improvement

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    Anatomy and perspective are easy, all they take is putting in the time and effort. Composition and concept/storytelling are much harder, because they're more abstract, and the standards are less objective. That's why there's so much technically competent but booooooring (or even worse, conceptually laughable) realist artwork out there.


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    Quote Originally Posted by Elwell View Post
    Anatomy and perspective are easy, all they take is putting in the time and effort. Composition and concept/storytelling are much harder, because they're more abstract, and the standards are less objective. That's why there's so much technically competent but booooooring (or even worse, conceptually laughable) realist artwork out there.

    They are easy? It's been a few months since I started tackling it and I've seen very little if any progress. I cant even draw a front view of a figure standing straight. Should I learn the skeleton well first, then the muscles, then trying drawing poses? And then drawing that figure from an entirely different perspective seems like it will be headache-inducing. Not to mention figuring out where all the shading should go! Man the comic book artists make it look so easy...

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    Relatively easy. And a few months is nothing.


    Tristan Elwell
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    hardest concepts in art are

    1. you are never done learning, or you have fooled yourself

    2. no one can learn for you (in other words you have to get off your lazy butt and do it)

    3. you need passion to go far

    4. money is secondary

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  9. #8
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    i always felt that drawing, perspective, lighting, anatomy and all that jazz was really quite simple in the scheme of things. This is not to say i'm a master at any of them because i'm not.

    But the hardest to learn imo is creativity because that's not really a concept you can tangibly teach in 10steps like everything else.

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    1. that the world of art, like the world of anything, is filled with sheep.

    2. that statistically speaking you are one of the sheep.

    3. doing something about

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    Quote Originally Posted by Elwell View Post
    Anatomy and perspective are easy, all they take is putting in the time and effort. Composition and concept/storytelling are much harder, because they're more abstract, and the standards are less objective.
    QFT. I only recently came to realize this.
    Even a technically sub-par drawing can look good with great composition.
    I always wondered why all the professionals scribbled thumbnails look so good. Now I know.

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  12. #11
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    Creativity's easy. Making it work with design is slightly more difficult. Hence Dada and surrealism. Anatomy and perspective are a piece of cake. The hardest things, for me, is the basic human shit that you need to be a great artist: perseverance, patience and hard, hard work.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Zaxser View Post
    Creativity's easy.

    I wouldn't know about that, honestly how many people here are even creative? Just because you can label artwork fantasy or sci-fi doesn't make it creative. A good deal of artwork here just looks like some idea someone else already creatively thought off. Drawing an alien isn't creative.

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    Quote Originally Posted by smellykitty View Post
    I wouldn't know about that, honestly how many people here are even creative? Just because you can label artwork fantasy or sci-fi doesn't make it creative. A good deal of artwork here just looks like some idea someone else already creatively thought off. Drawing an alien isn't creative.
    Was I talking about the artist here? No. I explicitly mentioned Dadaism. Sign a urinal and put in an art gallery. Make a dress out of meat. Piss on a crucifix while somebody films it. All creative. All easy.

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    Zaxser I think you're getting a little too meta on us.

    I'm going with what Elwell said. Technical mistakes are easily corrected.

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    I agree with the others, perspective/anantomy/shading etc may seem hard at first, but all will come together after a lot of practice.

    eventually, an art student will be able to draw a woman and her child perfectly in terms of anantomy/shading/perspect(or whatever other academic he's learned). however, to capture the loving affection the mother has towards the child, can never be learned from any text book. that, is the hardest part.

    all the drawing practices only prepare us for the true art form: to draw what you imagine. a drawing without soul is just another anatomy illustration. take the portfolio on CA for example, I've seen so many *very very* nicely rendered artwork of a character standing there, my impression was "so what?" the type of art work impress me the most are often those that are done in rough sketches, leaving me to imagine what happened in the drawing, and what's to come.

    in conclusion: subject matter > technique. technique can be learnedand perfected.

    just my $0.02

    Last edited by jinny76; October 10th, 2007 at 03:05 PM.
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  17. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by Zaxser View Post
    Creativity's easy. Making it work with design is slightly more difficult. Hence Dada and surrealism. Anatomy and perspective are a piece of cake. The hardest things, for me, is the basic human shit that you need to be a great artist: perseverance, patience and hard, hard work.
    So sayeth the Voice of Experience.


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  18. #17
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    FlameDragon. After reaching certain level of skill you will realise that perspective and anatomy is only the beginning.

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    Composition.

    With enough mileage I'm confident that I'll nail perspective and anatomy but composition is still the subject that makes my head hurt.

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    For me, the hardest thing is the deal with all the dualities...

    To render form while thinking of composiiton. To achieve dynamism in totality and with every brush stroke. To have the abstract expressionism of a piece mean the same as the narrative drama. To be loose, yet realistic. To think simultaneously in depth and also as pattern. To know when to draw something wrong so the whole comes out right.

    And to stay inspired.

    kev

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    kev ..my luv.. the hardest thing for you is to make art with out articulating it into polysyllabic phrases.... ever read Strunk and White "The Elements of Style"?
    If you must translate your philosophy in to words....


    the most diffcuilt concepts for me it finishing and surface.. if I can get the idea across in rough form ...It is most difficult to make myself both to finish it to the approved level

    chaos

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  22. #21
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    You guys know Vyle? I hope he won't get mad at me for telling you this, but he -JUST the other day... Friday I think... was punching himself in the face because he discovered something so obvious about perspective that he had never thought of before.

    He's 34 btw, and he's been doing art... for a loong time.

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  23. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by chaosrocks View Post
    kev ..my luv.. the hardest thing for you is to make art with out articulating it into polysyllabic phrases.... ever read Strunk and White "The Elements of Style"?
    If you must translate your philosophy in to words....
    Yes, I have read Strunk & White, Chaos. I am sorry you found my post wanting.

    kev

    At least Icarus tried!


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    Quote Originally Posted by Justin Oaksford View Post
    You guys know Vyle? I hope he won't get mad at me for telling you this, but he -JUST the other day... Friday I think... was punching himself in the face because he discovered something so obvious about perspective that he had never thought of before.

    He's 34 btw, and he's been doing art... for a loong time.
    Ok Justin, you have to know this was coming. What did he learn about perspective that was so obvious?



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  25. #24
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    He uh.. he won't tell me =(

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    Quote Originally Posted by kev ferrara View Post
    For me, the hardest thing is the deal with all the dualities...

    To render form while thinking of composiiton. To achieve dynamism in totality and with every brush stroke. To have the abstract expressionism of a piece mean the same as the narrative drama. To be loose, yet realistic. To think simultaneously in depth and also as pattern. To know when to draw something wrong so the whole comes out right.

    And to stay inspired.

    kev
    I thought this was well put.

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  27. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by kev ferrara View Post
    For me, the hardest thing is the deal with all the dualities...

    To render form while thinking of composiiton. To achieve dynamism in totality and with every brush stroke. To have the abstract expressionism of a piece mean the same as the narrative drama. To be loose, yet realistic. To think simultaneously in depth and also as pattern. To know when to draw something wrong so the whole comes out right.

    And to stay inspired.

    kev
    That's right on the money. Particularly the point about thinking of form and composition at the same time. Everything should be scratching the back of everything else.
    Here's one for Chaosrocks: A work of art should be like an icecube floating on its own melting......

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    Quote Originally Posted by chaosrocks View Post
    kev ..my luv.. the hardest thing for you is to make art with out articulating it into polysyllabic phrases....
    LOL chaos, you gave me the giggles.

    Kev, what you said was eloquent!

    I think you are awesome, and I wish you the best in your endeavors, but I am tired of repeating myself, I am very busy with my new baby, and I am no longer a regular participant here, so please do not contact me to ask for advice on your career or education. All of the advice that I have to offer can already be found in the following links. Thank you.

    Perspective 101, Concept Art 101, Games Industry info,Oil Paint info, Acrylic Paint info, my sketchbook.
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    I have struggled with Anatomy for countless hours and still continue to, it probably the hardest thing for me to accomplish and I wish it came more naturally.

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    Quote Originally Posted by TheCrowing View Post
    I have struggled with Anatomy for countless hours and still continue to, it probably the hardest thing for me to accomplish and I wish it came more naturally.
    The answer to this is in the last couple of words of your sentence. You are a body, what could be more natural! - What I mean is that you should try to imagine yourself inhabiting the body you are drawing. 'Feel' it as if you are inhabiting the drawing as it is being made. You will automatically have a sense of where the weight is being placed, the points of tension and the main muscle groups without necessarily being able to name them but because you are recreating yourself as you draw.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Chris Bennett View Post
    You are a body, what could be more natural! - What I mean is that you should try to imagine yourself inhabiting the body you are drawing. 'Feel' it as if you are inhabiting the drawing as it is being made. You will automatically have a sense of where the weight is being placed, the points of tension and the main muscle groups without necessarily being able to name them but because you are recreating yourself as you draw.
    I have to disagree with your statement here. I'm sorry, but it sounds like artsy fart rambling.
    There is some validity in what you've said about being 'feeling' the drawing, this is a necessary observation in good gesture drawing.
    However, one must still first have obtained a good level of anatomic understanding through academic studies, life drawings and etc.

    If anybody could just 'imagine themselves in the drawing' and do well, then everyone would be make fantastic drawings.

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