The Rise of the Proletariate

[tcarlson]

The Rise of the Proletariate
hey here is that piece that I promised on my last thread.. let me know what you think...

no reference... took about 6.5 hours from drawing to finish
Ill probably still clean it up a little but hey.. here you are..
http://www.tjcarlson.com/Rise2.jpg

detail

http://www.tjcarlson.com/Rise2close.jpg

[Alex Gering]

Haha, are you a marxist ?

that's a hot topic you're trying to depict there. This is why you should really think about it before you try to paint it. To be honest this is really cheap, technically it's ok but Oh lord its level is that of a 10 year old, good/bad, rich/poor etc

[ChaosEidolon]

I dont understand why posting a hot topic here should be "though about". I find it really refreshing that somebody is posting pieces that depict personal principles, wether or not these may be agreeable by you or even by the majority of the people on these boards.
I beleive that this is one of the most valuable functions that art has, so lets not critizice people's art on something so objective as their political orientation which we are all guilty of being biased about.

As for my suggestions of the piece, i would try and use some more warm tones in the flesh. The blues and purples youre using are working well in defining the variation of flesh tones, but i think without some more highlighting with oranges and reds it doesnt look like it has enough life to it.

[sparth]

let's relax. i think alex just tried to mention that the matter was complex, and that it would have been a good idea for tcarlson to sum up about the title, or give extra explanation, in order to understand the piece even better.
and true, there's nothing wrong in showing political opinions, as long as it doesn't have anything to do with nazi theories, or racist backgrounds. but we're far from it here, ain't we?

sparth

[Swedish Chef]

Ha, looks cool, Tom!

By the way, I was the model for the dude eating the grapes.



Right?

[Erik Hageman]

oh gawd, i dont see what the deal is with using any subject matter for any kind of art. just because you draw something does not mean it is an integral part of your life. if you're an illustrator you have to draw all kinds of stuff, things you may not approve of. things you may find offensive. maybe you don't do a job because of it, maybe you do.

in terms of this piece:

i don't really think it's a childish take. a simplistic one, perhaps, but the whole thing is simple, it is a symmetrical composition, the whole thing can pretty much be divided into equal fourths. static. i think the color modulation is most successful on the grape dangler. the lady in back has a great face but her body is a bit weak. why is she hiding? seems like the ledge should be higher, more out of reach, even for the spear. setting is abstract, i would ditch the crack.

overall i'm not sure what the final piece will try to accomplish, what context this will sit in. i think it would be more effective if you raised the nobles, added way more figures on bottom and had them interact. make the role of the extra chick more clear. good color, maybe use warms in the top part, yellows and flesh. or make them even colder and add hot red to the bottom. more contrast overall.

[Swedish Chef]

Hey, Eric what's up? This is Ryan, from Illustration class last semester. You have some good constructive comments there. We can obviously tell who YOU had for a teacher last year, wink wink.

[tcarlson]

Ok when I started the drawing my intension was to better my understanding of anatomy by creating a drawing to turn into a digital painting of figures from my imagination.... this is something I knew I was going have to do for my upcoming senior thesis idea.
As for the concept, I had been doing some reading on the class systems and decided to display a common angst, and at the sametime use small elements of the composition to push that along, after hear some of these great crits though it makes me rethink somethings.
In the beginning I was thinking of a common object one that could be used for tieing a story together, the red cloth is what I choose. It starts in the hands of a servent who has an upset look on here face, she is clenching her fists and giving the man being fed grapes (noble) a blank stare... It is the look of envy. she has draped the cloth over her fists, that are clenched so tightly, as if to hid them. The cloth is drapped over the noble, and also continues down to the streets, where a man is running his hand across it, creating a ripple. Ripples bring about change, like throwing a large rock out 15 feet into a lake and seeing the result of that on the shore. On both ends of the cloth there is some amount of control by the lower class. This displays that they do have the power to change there situation. If they wanted to they could pull it off of him leaving him exposed, or they could drag him away with him in it.
The working class is shadowed but the foundation in which the noble sits they all walk by not thinking about how to get out of there situation, just that there in it.... all expect the old wise woman who is piering upwards. From her perspective she is probably seeing the noble in the reflection of the shiny spear or halberd and the servent girls. she realizes that was herself in an earlier time, as a young girl that did all of a nobles bidding. She also relizes well looking though the reflection of a spearhead, and seeing the blood red of the drapery that there answer was such a common one, however she feels that she in definately not the one to set those events in motion, so she stays quiet, her top lip pulling more and more under her bottom throughout time.
http://www.tjcarlson.com/Rise2close2.jpg

By creating this piece it does not make me a marxist nor does it mean I support this. I feel an artist by any means should be viewed as impartial.

Alex-
I think it is great that you have different perspective, I mean we are from two different parts of the world... however where Im from if you have a complaint about a piece of work, you explain the problem, I mean let us in on this perspective that you have, to do any less is childish.

Chaos-
I agree with what you are saying, and am currently reworking some of the color mod. on the flesh... thank you

Sparth-
here is my extra explantion... thanks man

Swedish Chef-
Hey ryan... thanks see you in a week

Erik-
You and I think alot a like.. after looking at the piece before I was going to post it, some of those Ideas were floating through my head... excellent Ideas, Im going to act on them soon, thank you by the way your self portrait totally looks like you are stuck in Sarasota FL... I love it man great piece...

thanks

[Alex Gering]

Hi Thomas, sorry I was a bit harsh in my fisrt comment.
Your explanation makes the piece a bit clearer, however the problem is still there.

My main complaint is the too simple concept. You depict a classic topic, which caused controvery one hundred years ago aswell as today. At first glance I only see a rich, lazy guy and below him the "proletariat", dirty, poor, hard-working and angry people. This dividation into rich/poor is the most naive way to go. Such simple concept may very well work with fantasy or sci-fi themes, but the last thing you can afford when you paint political stuff is naivity, unless you want the viewer to laugh about the artist. See, I in no way want to insult you, I just try to give you an important advice aswell as a warning.

[Erik Hageman]

too bad the focus of this piece has been pushed away from the actual painting to the social issues it adresses. debating those issues could entail a lifetime of discourse.

i think this is a cool idea for thesis and i'm eager to see how you connect the cloth.

[Jimmy Scifi]

Hey Alex, I think it is simple minded to judge this piece like you have. He can paint what he likes. In other words the naivity might have been a concious decision. It is not for us to judge what they paint, but rather how they paint it. We must only try to help them paint it better.

I like this piece, the naivity or simple dipiction of the social divide reminds me alot of older works from a time when everything was laid out as such. Nice one bruv, keep going. :D