pig pile update 8 04/11/03

[foster]

o.k. i have wanted to do this for some time now. mainly it is to help me get work done, but i hope a long the way that you will find something of interest.

i will be updating this thread at least once a day as this project moves along. for better or worse in terms of my ego i will try and show all of my mistakes along the way. why not, someone has to learn from them.

dave dorman helped me out of a slump by giving me a starting point with a rough comp. i love his rough comps, they have just enough description to light my fire but are also rough enough to let me make my own interpretations. dave by the way is an excellent draftsman, the roughness of the drawing is exactly what you should be doing when doing your own thumbnails, working out your ideas and compositions.

next i went ahead and shot digital photos of myself in the poses. i had to fill in for all of them as my wife is away. i should have started drawing my own versions of the characters in this composition before i took the photos but i jumped ahead and feel i may have paid a little in trying to make it my own.

after that i sat down and drew the characters out individually as i new i was going to move them around on different layers to tweak the composition. drawing them separately is not good in that it does not give the piece a since of cohesion. so when i get them set up in the position i like and the correct scale i will make another drawing from that. i will post that next. along with this new version i will try to put in some setting and make sense of the lighting.

jon

[foster]

photos

[foster]

sketches

[foster]

pig pile 01.2

[jerO]

*digs a deep deep hole and curls up in it*

[nick reynolds]

Mr. Foster, you are undoubtedly the best. Thank you again for wanting to help us all.

[BoBo_the_seal]

Fantastic!

Thanks again for doing these things. I learn so much from your step thoughs.

Creating a composition and posing characters is my biggest weakness at the moment. Seeing how you work has helped me tremendously.

Thanks,

- BoBo

[foster]

here is another hour and half of work (i think). i should time these things out of curiosity.

i scanned in some tech stuff (two different sources) to start the back ground. then i tried to obliterate it so that it would not compete to much with the figures. the key is how to make them seem to be in a place and even give hints at the type of place without out making the painting all about... the place!

i am trying the work out my lighting. i have two divergent light sources. i want it to work, we will see.

instead of drawing again on paper i decided to do it in photoshop. doing it this way makes working out the lighting much easier and faster.

jon

[oglzogl]

Man! Gotta love it!

It's great how, even though you only see these three figures, you can get a real sense of despiration... A knowledge that there is so much more than just what you see. These characters are up to the challenge. All three looking in different places.. ready for action. Nice!

It's interesting to see how you work too. Thanks for posting these. Can't wait to see what you do next.

A small thing I know, but I like the pose of the woman a lot better now too. Cool to watch how you fine tune these. Great seeing your progress..

[boehmke]

Foster you are way to generous! Thanks for putting all the time to show us your process. I think its very helpful...for me at least...to tell us that you make mistakes. HAHA. Let's us know you are human after all.

I look forward to the rest of the images you have in store for us!

boehmke

[foster]

here is a few more hours work.

i made masks for the figures.

01.6
first file is still black and white i just tweaked some areas, like the big guys gloves and some other things.

01.8
next i decided to start getting color into it. i will address issues with composition and anatomy as they crop up in the painting. if i did all of that in the black and white i would not want to paint over it, so i leave it a little rough so that i can find things out in the paint. this first color file is just like adding a glaze.

01.9
next file i made an empty layer set it on color and started to lay in some local color.

02.0
started to add some color using the multiply mode.

02.1
added some opaque color

02.2
made a copy of image layer and them set it on hard light and then erased areas out. also added some more opaque color.

next i think i will take it into painter and start the real painting.

jon

[foster]

01.8

[foster]

01.9

[foster]

02.0

[foster]

02.1

[foster]

02.2

[R_M]

thank you Jon ....
(can I call you Jon :D ?)

[StephenC]

foster how long does each step take you?

[Kress]

I think it's really cool of you to take time out and post these. Getting some exposure to your process not only demystifies your work (as opposed to thinking you're an art alien) but is very technically educational! (gee I sound like a dork)
Looks great, I like how involved you are in the "underpainting", and seeing this go from thumbnail to ref to digital is fun.
Thanks again! :chug:

[feeb]

All your secrets are belong to us!

[MindCandyMan]

Great stuff jon. Seeing this process is awesome. You make it look easy heheh...although I know it's not. Thanks for taking the time out.

I must say those photos are striking hehehe. If Melissa isn't there how do you take them? I guess there's a timer on your camera?

Tell Lars to get his stinkin butt on here! After seeing his spectrum piece I want to see more!!!

[I.was.ink]

Wow! I can't wait to see the rest of the process!

[boehmke]

Feeb: Your post just cracked me up:rofl:

[Smeagol71]

So you decided to put it up, eh? I'm a little behind, just caught sight of this post, but I'm so glad I did. I think I mentioned to you before how seeing a process like this gives me even more respect for an artist, and this is no exception. Thanks for your hard work and sharing spirit Jon, it's invaluable and much appreciated! I'll be stopping by regularly.

How's Sprinkles?

[jrr]

very nice jon.

[foster]

i just did not think that the woman on the big guys shoulder was working so i am trying something new.

this is all that i have done on this piece, i just have not been able to sit down and work on it.

jon

[feeb]

Much better dynamics. Kudos.

[MindCandyMan]

Looks sweet...I like the update.

[foster]

just more. things are not working together yet. some of the color just does not like it's neighbor.

don't like his nose yet or her face.

jon

[foster]

still more work, and a detail of a section i like.

jon

[foster]

arm detail

[davi]

good lord, that arm detail makes me creamy

[oglzogl]

Holy Smokes!

That detail is great! and I really like the new pose for the woman. And the goggles.... and the big guys face.....

This is very nice to watch. Thanks for sharing :chug:

[boehmke]

Just to beat a dead horse...That arm detail is just about the coolest.
:crazy:

[foster]

o.k i'm going to bed. here is the latest for tonight.

jon

[foster]

face detail

[I.was.ink]

Wow! I am amazed by those skin tones.

Just look at the blues in that tall guy! Fantastic.

O

[MindCandyMan]

This is really coming together well jon. The woman's pose is sweet and the nose on the big guy looks great as well. You really fixed up those areas. Keep pushing this is gonna turn out looking great...it already does.

[wilson jr]

HI! awesome work, Foster!
Thanks to show us your creative process! i'm learning a lot with it!
anyway, have you a specifc palet to paint skins? because is very hard find the right color to paint skins!

Regards from Brazil!

[benzo]

thank you for doing this!

[killing.people]

bad ass

[foster]

this is almost done. the guns still need some love and i am sure that other areas need some as well.

feel free to point out what you think is not working.

this is just another two hours work. little nudges here and there.

i mainly used the loaded palette knife, palette knife, variable flat, oil pastel, sharp chalk (for when i am getting some texture in with the papers) and i used the unsharp filter in photoshop.

no big secrets, just kept working an area until i thought it looked right.

i will work on this a little more then post it in the finally finished area.

if you have questions please ask. i need some kind of stimulation around here!

jon

[foster]

did not do much of anyting to the hand. sometimes it is best to leave things alone.

[foster]

i think i include this detail to show how color and value make the form. it is neat how when you get close things become abstractions.

[MindCandyMan]

Looks totally awesome jon. I am so stinkin bored here at work...this was great to see...makes my afternoon better. In one of the previous updates you had a sterner more focused look on the woman's face...it's gone now but I liked the expression before a little better. That's the best I can do in the stimulation area hehe.

[boehmke]

Jon,

How much work would you say you do in Photoshop and Painter? If you had to break it down between the two.

[foster]

well most of the "painting" is photoshop. i did lay in my color palette in photoshop as i find it easier to use the layers there and i understand what different modes do in photoshop. but once i want to start working the colors around and create edges and brushstrokes that is all in painter. every once in a while i will run the unsharp mask filter on it as things tend to get a little blurred.

jon

[feeb]

My breath caught when I saw this latest update, Jon. You're an incredible inspiration to us art hacks. Huge thanks for sharing your working process in this, one of my favorite of your paintings.

[boehmke]

If you could Jon could you post details of all their faces? All of the detail in there is just screaming to be seen!

boehmke

[jrr]

this is great jon, i love the updates, i love the painting but one thing is missing..... cow bells. it needs more cowbells. i've got a fever and the only cure is cowbell.

[foster]

hey boehmke, i reread my post in answer to your question. i said most of the "painting" was photoshop but i ment to write painter 7.

thanks fo following along everyone.

jrr cow bells? please explain.

jon

[Runcible]

LOL...cow bells. Don't fear the reaper, 'cmon baby!

Funny jrr. I guess if you're not an avid watcher of SNL it might be hard to connect that one with anything. Very funny though.

[killing.people]

yeah-huhuh .. her boob is totally in his face .. :dork:

[jrr]

sorry jon for taking this thread to the abbyss..... yeah chris walken was doing snl... in one of the greatest skits ever. they were doing the song don't fear the reaper and walken walks in as the producer and tells the band, it needs more cowbell. what that has to do with this artwork? i'm not sure. when i'm speechless, i do obscure things....


i think the poses look really strong and not stiff, i'm loving this. fantastic how you changed the girl's pose so much more natural now. are you going to keep the old pose for another painting perhaps? or am i the only lazy bastard that does that?

[Oolong Boartusker]

I apologize if i missed it in the thread already, but how did you create the textures for the wall in the background? Great picture!

[Wrath_of_Dog]

Alright, usually, I'm Mr. Uber-post, but not this time. First, this is a great idea, and a great execution. Watching the progression will help tons of people, right where they need it. Secondly, damn it man, couldn't you have sucked, even a little bit. I know your going to put on your best stuff for the crowd, but damn, I feel like a 6-year old with a paint-baloon now. My ego is now cowering behind my Mountain Dew addiction (think physical manifestation here) and angrily shaking its tiny fist.
:-p

[boehmke]

Jon,
I've noticed that your work has become more gritty the last few months. At least grittier then the images you have in your book. Your letting alot more of your brush strokes stay, instead of blending them away. Is this due to the digital medium as oppsed to oils? Or just the direction you are headed?

boehmke

[behemot5]

i looooooooooooooooooooooove it......:'-(
and it 's interesting :-)

[Kress]

Thanks for sharing Jon. I'm a big promoter of digital painting at school and I love being proven right. Everyone's complaint is that it always looks too "computery" and will never compare to the "feeling" of real paint. While real paint will always, always be the real mccoy, the computer, as you know, has opened up doors for not only reasonable and beautiful facsimiles of real media, as well as places uncharted.
Anyway...
The foreground guys chest and neck is bothering me. It looks grey and foggy and unrealized. My eye keeps going there, and to some extent, to where his read hair overlaps the big arm, because it detracts from the solidity and convincing rendering of the forms. Just a thought.

[endregan]

to see your details and process is really cool, and the working from a reference as well. awesome work, like how you coloured it :)

[DV8]

u

[krayz]

Amazing and highly inspirational. Thanks!

[sumtinsumtin]

absolutly beautiful work, more more more

[Grendel]

Great learnin aid Mr foster

[designgoblin]

Like the rest of you, I found this thread very cool so I made a clean version in HTML from which I captured a downloadable PDF.

Jon has agreed to let me distribute this info for a while so go grab it if you're interested.

GO TO HTML PAGE (with PDF link) >>>>> (http://members.shaw.ca/designgoblin2/Jon_Foster.htm)

I'll leave it there as long as I can but my bandwidth is limited. I left the images large (original size) so you can see as much detail as possible.

Enjoy:beer:

DG>>

[Johannes]

Holy smoly! Great stuff! What really does it for me, is that (please dont take this negatively) your early sketches looks as "unclean and dirty" as mine. Then, of course, you runs away from me. But what I wanted to say is that I see there really is no "magic" involved, just hard work...

Very inspiering - THANKS :D

A question - what resolution pixel per inch do you work in in photoshop?

[MindCandyMan]

Just wanted to say thanks to jon first for starting this thread and to design goblin for creating that...it's really really helpful to have it in that format...great great stuff.

[secundar]

Very incredible work, foster.

Big thanks to designgoblin. If it's alright I have mirrored the PDF. I can also mirror the html if you like. (I was nervous that the page was down as you feared, but i was not too late!:cool:) You can email a zip if it's under 2MB.

PDF mirror here...
http://secundar.homedns.org:8080/~gary/foster/

[thebluepuppy]

lol, i thought i post on this thread and dig this old thread up. right now im actually hunting through all the old threads(very thouroughly) looking for tidbits of information. sort of like a puppy searching for scraps on the floor. lol. this thread is nice. ;)

[teyekanik]

damn man, thanks. shows me alot.

[crazybrush]

Hell yeah!
From beggining to the end...I love the breakdown process and thanks for letting us in. I'm always reminded by your posts how important is to paint traditionally.
Respect!

[J.arlen]

Hey Jon, you're an inspiration. I had a thought about this piece in terms of the composition. I thought you might try losing those round lights for several reasons(which may or may not be valid) one was that they are in what appears to be contradictory perspective to the steel wall looking thing that's running diagonally through the picture. I wasn't sure if that(wall) was supposed to be an abstarct shape or not but it reads as physical at this point. Second the lights seem forced and a little artificial in the broken down rusted environment you have them in, like you'd expect at least one of them to be burnt out or flickering. Third I think the pyramidal compositon of the figures is strong enough without them, and the other surroundings are abstract enough so that I don't question where the light source is.

[ikuru]

Having stared at this picture and read about your process its such a pleasure to actually see it like this...

Thanks for sharing dude.

/Danny