Cal Arts or bust?

[andalaroot]

I was recommended this site by a fellow classmate, and browsing it I saw that there are a number of people here who are in my desired profession, being an animation major.

Well, that said, I need some industry wisdom, and I couldn't think of a better place to ask. I am in the middle of applying to Cal Arts for their Character Animation program. To be honest, I know my work will probably not get me in - I have talent, but I don't believe I have enough yet, so I'm going in this with pretty low expectations, and to see how it all works out. I know Cal Arts is EXTREMELY competitive - I visited the school several months ago, and they told me the acceptance rate is ~10% for character animators. Yikes!

So, my question is simply this: I know that Cal Arts is pretty much the end all be all for traditional animation, which is the field I want to get into. What I'm not entirely sure of, is, if I should just apply to Cal Arts again with a better portfolio or if I should go to a different college, because I know that they (they being in California, where I live) may not put me in the best position to get the kind of job I want. I don't want to go to a college that an employer will look at and not really consider (By the way, that doesn't mean I'm not looking at other colleges - Cal State Long Beach and Laguna College of Art & Design).

I know that a person's only worth as much as their portfolio, but having attended Cal Arts when applying to Disney certainly doesn't hurt, either. I'm just not sure if I should continue to shoot high and likely postpone my career for some time, or settle for an art school where I have a much higher chance of getting in (CSULB).

Any advice? :)

[phasma]

The way I see it, if CalArts is the school you most want to attend and go into debt for, then maybe if you don't get accepted for fall 2007 entrance, you should take classes at a community college. That way, you'd have time to work on improving and re-establishing your portfolio, and you'd earn inexpensive transfer credits that will waive critical studies requirements later on.

If you think CalArts will give you the most valuable and productive education, with which you'll come out most prepared for the industry, maybe you ought to do as suggested above.
If you're just wanting to go to CalArts so that you can put the school's name on your resume, you may consider going elsewhere.

I just sent off my portfolio for the CalArts Character Animation program last Friday. I'll be sending my portfolio off for Art Center this coming month. I figure, if I don't get into either schools, I'll take some animation courses and some more art at a local community college (BCC) and then reapply.
Why would I spend a ridiculous amount of money on an art school that I don't really want to go to, and that I won't get as much out of,
when I could just work a little harder to get into my choice schools a little later on?

Yeah, I don't know if any of that made sense. But that's my current reasoning.

Gooood luckkk!

[rblitz7]

yeah I think phasma said it perfectly.
Im also interested in Cal Arts fall 07 for animation but just like you i dont think my skills are good enough yet. If I dont get into Ringling's animation program I might consider going the community college route.

[dguy]

That's a tough decision. Ideally everyone who wants to do animation should go to Calarts.

It really depends if you have your heart set on attending Calarts. But you have to look at things realistically. If you train by yourself for a year do you think that it will be enough to get in? And how many years are you willing to do this until you are finally excepted?

I think there was someone on this forum who got rejected the first time, flew to Cali anyways and spend a year studying pre-college courses AT calarts and still got rejected the second time around. She ultimately went to RISD.

The point is ideally you should go to calarts. But how realistically that is only you would know. Try to make that decision by evaluating your work and time you have available.

RBLITZ: Come to SVA if you don't get into Ringling. Do you live around NYC? There is like a dozen art schools here, and in the summers you can intern at NBC, MTV, etc.

[NoSeRider]

I wish you guys that proclaim you want to go to some famous school would show some of your work. We really have no way to calibrate what is required from you if you don't show your ability.

CalArts costs over a $100,000. That's serious cash, and I think they're trying to discourage you if you don't have serious talent......However, I often wonder if going to CalArts is really worth it as opposed to other colleges like Laguna College, Ringling or San Francisco Art Institute.

CalArts was really a brain child of Walt Disney....and Disney doesn't seem to have the same influence it once had....which I don't think is a bad thing. I like the variety we have now, as opposed to 20 years ago.

http://fuv.hivolda.no/prosjekt/gunnargrodal/bio.htm
Prior to his death on December 15, 1966, Walt Disney took a deep interest in the establishment of California Institute of the Arts, a college level, professional school of all the creative and performing arts. Of Cal Arts, Walt once said, "It's the principal thing I hope to leave when I move on to greener pastures. If I can help provide a place to develop the talent of the future, I think I will have accomplished something."

[rblitz7]

RBLITZ: Come to SVA if you don't get into Ringling. Do you live around NYC? There is like a dozen art schools here, and in the summers you can intern at NBC, MTV, etc.
Yeah I visited SVA but it seems their job placement is not very good. I asked about where students get hired after they graduate, and the guy basically said "yeah.....well...a lot of students do independent sort of work."

NoSeRider Im pretty sure when I visited Cal Arts they said if you get in, they will really try to help you with the cost. cause if they accept you that means they really want you there.

[thesinfulsaint]

I don't want to go to a college that an employer will look at and not really consider
Just as a side note, employers don't even look at what school you went to. All they do is look at your demo reel. These words aren't even my own; they belong to a guy who used to work for Dreamworks--I had a chance to talk to him at a lecture. He went to a small state school in Ohio, and he made it in the industry. Granted, it took him a few years to work is way out to Hollywood, but he did it. Example 2: I talked to another woman who currently works for Dreamworks (used to work for Disney) over the phone about a week ago, and she said that she didn't even go to art school. She got a Bachelor's degree in communication, and moved out to California because her husband was in film. She started taking classes at Disney, decided to apply for a job there, and wound up being hired. She's been in animation for 14 years, now.

Obviously if you go to a well-known school, the chances of you having a nicer demo reel are higher, but the name itself won't get you anywhere. If you're talented and motivated, you can make it from a school with a less-known name.

:)

NoSeRider Im pretty sure when I visited Cal Arts they said if you get in, they will really try to help you with the cost. cause if they accept you that means they really want you there.
I'm not so sure that's true. The mentality of places like that is usually, "Oh? You can't cough up the dough? Well, there's someone else who would LOVE to be in your position! NEEEXT!!!" ... Ringling is like that, too. That's why they offer so little scholarship money.

Not to discourage you, andalaroot, because I think it's an awesome goal to be going to CalArts. If I weren't afraid of not being able to find a job in 2D, I would be going for the same thing. ;)

[rblitz7]

I'm not so sure that's true. The mentality of places like that is usually, "Oh? You can't cough up the dough? Well, there's someone else who would LOVE to be in your position! NEEEXT!!!" ... Ringling is like that, too. That's why they offer so little scholarship money.
Well I didnt say Cal Arts would pay your whole tuition, they just will work with to try to cut the cost a little. I dont think Cal Arts is very quick to say next because they are such a selective school and therefore don't have many cal arts worthy apps to choose from...but thats just my opinion.

I talked to another woman who currently works for Dreamworks (used to work for Disney) over the phone about a week ago
LOL sinfulsaint, you are determined!!!

[NoSeRider]

She started taking classes at Disney

Personally, I'd like to know how you go about doing this? Because half of getting work in the 'industry' is networking, and basically people proclaim they want to go to some high end school because mostly of it's networking potential.

Sure it's about ability, but...........I got this quote from a Disney Animator in a personal email I was corresponding with. Since it's a bit controversial I'll leave him unnamed, but here's the quote:

Yes, you do have to sell yourself. No, talent is not enough. If talent was enough then Mozart and Rembrandt would have died rich. Both died poor, as did Vermeer and Van Gogh. Michelangelo got sued for uncompleted contracts and Leonardo got more work kissing the ass of tyrants than drawing in his sketchbooks. If the King of France didn't collect him like a bauble for his court in Amboise, Leonardo would have been screwed in his old age. Art schools are responsible for filling young peoples heads with an unrealistic ideal about Art of Art's Sake that is in the main, bullsh*t. You should strive to be your best as an artist out of professional discipline, but never forget that we are in a business, and to the money guys you are just a commodity like livestock.

So how do you take classes at Disney again?

[NoSeRider]

http://academy.smc.edu

Just as a side note. If you want to get inside information about the animation industry, but can't afford CalArts....I recommend going there, just to figure out if you're serious or not.

[thesinfulsaint]

LOL sinfulsaint, you are determined!!!
LOL... Yes I am. :D

So how do you take classes at Disney again?
I'm not sure if it's something that they even offer anymore, and I'm pretty sure you had to know someone to get into them. It was back during the glory of 2D--13 or 14 years ago. She said that her husband was in film, but didn't specify how. It's my suspicion that he somehow had connections with Disney. I could be wrong, but that's just my guess.

And yes, a lot of it is networking. I was just saying that it IS possible to make it without going to a school with a big name; it's just a lot harder. You definitley would have to work your way up the food chain.

[Maxine Schacker]

No one will turn down a great demo reel and portfolio because the SCHOOL you attended isn't known to them.THEY ARE NOT HIRING THE SCHOOL - THEY ARE HIRING YOU. Look for a school that has small classes, working professionals instructing, and look at the student work! If you have the stuff- including a professional attitude- they will want you.

[andalaroot]

Thanks for all the advice, everyone. I'm sending in all my information to Cal Arts, and I guess I'll go from there.

And NoSeRiDeR, that is quite a sobering quote you have from your contact.

[bloaty]

I'm currently a Calarts first year character animation student.

Rblitz- From what I've observed since being here is that the Character Animation department's devotion to their students is extremely stron, and they'll fight tooth and nail for your needs, but Calarts itself doesn't care much.

Here's a rant. Character Animation is pretty much the only program at Calarts that rakes in enough dough for the school to survive. Many Disney animators (including several nine old men) have given enormous sums to Calarts, in the name of Character Animation, which in turn gets divided evenly (I've heard) between the schools and programs. Since Character Animation has the highest student success rate and largest student body compared to other departments, it's rather frustrating that there isn't a large sum of money devoted to keeping Character students here. It doesn't take too much logic to figure that 160 character animation students and 25 music majors do not equal the same amount. Therefore, it's a lot easier for a music major to receive financial help than it is for a Character student. It's a form of contention that kind of separates Character Animation from the rest of the school. If you come here, you'll know what I'm talking about.

That isn't to say, that Character Animation isn't powerless, though. If it's a decision of whether you stay or leave, they'll definitely do all in their power to keep you.

But of course, it's not really about money. If you are really serious about your career, you'll pay anything. And for animation, there really is no better place. And if the alumni list is any indication of where you will go, you will be compensated generously later in life.

Good luck with your applications, guys.

-bloaty

[bloaty]

I'm currently a Calarts first year character animation student.

Rblitz- From what I've observed since being here is that the Character Animation department's devotion to their students is extremely stron, and they'll fight tooth and nail for your needs, but Calarts itself doesn't care much.

Here's a rant. Character Animation is pretty much the only program at Calarts that rakes in enough dough for the school to survive. Many Disney animators (including several nine old men) have given enormous sums to Calarts, in the name of Character Animation, which in turn gets divided evenly (I've heard) between the schools and programs. Since Character Animation has the highest student success rate and largest student body compared to other departments, it's rather frustrating that there isn't a large sum of money devoted to keeping Character students here. It doesn't take too much logic to figure that 160 character animation students and 25 music majors do not equal the same amount. Therefore, it's a lot easier for a music major to receive financial help than it is for a Character student. It's a form of contention that kind of separates Character Animation from the rest of the school. If you come here, you'll know what I'm talking about.

That isn't to say, that Character Animation isn't powerless, though. If it's a decision of whether you stay or leave, they'll definitely do all in their power to keep you.

But of course, it's not really about money. If you are really serious about your career, you'll pay anything. And for animation, there really is no better place. And if the alumni list is any indication of where you will go, you will be compensated generously later in life.

And as far as not going to Calarts and still getting a job within animation is definitely possible, and sometimes even preferable. We've had a number of visiting animators come lecture us who didn't even know what Calarts was. But it's up to you.

Good luck with your applications, guys.

-bloaty