Just Do It Baby

[Silver Rains]

Hi All I like To know your opinion about This Piece .... and i'll be mutch Glad to hear your critique .... Thanks

[Mohdawg]

Is that shoe for a rinho ? the perspective and scales are way off... nice colors , but you really have to put more effort to this.

[Silver Rains]

Mohdawg ... first of all i am not a rinho ... lol that's my shoe .... thanks for passing and i'll take this on consideration

and please pepole any one else have critique .... i am waiting

[Beershite]

I can only second Mohdawgs replie, make sure your proportions and perspective are correct before coloring.
The coloring is nice but redo those little lines you have as higlights. Right now they are to scribbly making everything look messy.

Now do some quick shoe studies:P
Good luck!

[subtle_squid]

Your biggest issue is perspective. Basically you are unwrapping the shoe. We see the top as if from above, and the side as if from the side. If you're going for cubism fine but if you are trying to paint what you see you need to stick to one perspective.

As to your proportions the hole seems a bit wide or the toe is a bit short, thats whats giving you the "rhino" foot effect.

Lastly, don't just mix white in to your color to turn it towards the light this has a tendency to desaturate and cool off your colors. As the color moves in to the light mix white and another color, orange or yellow are often good for natural or incandescent lighting. This will help maintain saturation and indicate the color of the light itself.

[Professor Az]

I agree, this piece needs some work in the perspective department.

The way you have painted this very colorful shoe reminds me of an isometric mechanical drawing. All of the lines that are parallel on the shoe are parallel in the painting. While this is fine in drafting, it doesn't work well in realism.

It seems to me that you have painted what you think you see, versus what you would actually see upon observation of the shoe.

[Silver Rains]

Beershite , subtle_squid : Thanks guys i'll take the perspective matter in consideration .... but i hate perspective i only see it samples in the buldings and cubes stuff like that but in fact i don't know how to make it on the other things such as organic things or such a shoe :^^;: i mean if you have something you can help me with i'll be thankfull to you .....

Professor Az :thanks and i'll try again with the perspective but i don't understand what you said about mechanical painting ... :teeth:

[mbdayton]

Silver,

A good introduction to perspective is How to Draw Comics the Marvel Way (http://www.amazon.com/How-Draw-Comics-Marvel-Way/dp/0671530771).

It starts with the basics of perspective but gets into how to extrapolate that to include more complex shapes.

In general, try and think how the shoe would fit into the perspective cubes you're accustomed to.

You could also think of the shoe in terms of being made up of a bunch of simple planes. If you had to make a computer model of it, with only straight lines, flat planes, and hard corners, where would the laces go compared to the side of the shoe.

As it is right now, it looks like the plane with the laces and the plane with the side of the shoe are one plane. There should be a transition (corner) between the two.

[TheDirtSyndicate]

but i hate perspective i only see it samples in the buldings and cubes stuff like that

spoken like a true 15yr old.
O_o
you have to practice with buildings and cubes.
make a grid, put a couple boxes on a plane, then try TURNING that box on the grid and still keeping it in perspective, THEN try putting something organic on that same plane.
if you dont think perspective drawings of boxes is "cool" , then take a stab at 4 piont perspective:
http://www.termespheres.com/images/perspective/fourpointperspec_drawing.gif
to put something organic in perspective, just break it down to the simplest forms, your shoe is an extremely simple wedge shape that can easily be place in perspective.
try it out.

[Pound]

spoken like a true 15yr old.
O_o



We 15 year olds aren't all that ignorant.

Perspective applies to everything in the 3rd Dimension, because everything you see in real life isn't isometric, planometric or axonometric.

And to apply perspective to something like a shoe, isn't the same ordeal, as when it's applied to buildings. What you have to imagine is what is in front of what, because of the angle you are viewing it from. There is also shortening in any object due to perspective, but something that small ( shoe, rather than building) as long as your view isn't up close there shouldn't be much shortening.

If this is from reference though, it is a classic case, as has already been established of viewing what you think you see. Which can be reasonably challenging habit to break out of.

[TheDirtSyndicate]

....snore....
oh, sorry. fell asleep when i didn't understand the walking thesaurus above me.

pound: i was trying to be funny.
...and i think i succeeded. haha
quit trying to confuse the poor boy, i've been drawing as far back as i can remember, im 25, and i didn't understand a word of what you said. and guess what? you dont need to know all those words to draw things into perspective properly.
perspective is very simple, all you need to do is break things down to their simplest shapes, something easier to work with.
on top of that, we could talk for hours about this, days if you want, but in the end, the only thing thats REALLY going to help him get better, IS PRACTICE.
:)

[Professor Az]

...on top of that, we could talk for hours about this, days if you want, but in the end, the only thing thats REALLY going to help him get better, IS PRACTICE. :)

I would have to disagree. Practice by itself won't make anyone better unless that person understands what he or she is practicing. Understanding how something looks, instead of how one thinks it should look is how to improve, not just knowing the basic shapes, Don't get me wrong, basic shapes are very important, but if one can't visualize them properly by understanding the things that affect that shape (light, shadow, gravity, perspective, ad nauseum), then practice doesn't mean squat.

I kept that one simple for the 25 year olds. >:D

[Silver Rains]

all right guys thanks i appreciate this great debate ....
mbdayton : you gonna make me buy this book ... thank you for caring about this matter
Pound : thanks for defending the rights of the 15years boys :D
complete2 : this 4 point perspective is banging man
Professor Az : thanks again

but guys i just started drawing from couple of months ago ... so you may pardon me for these mistakes in perspect and stuff like that

[TheDirtSyndicate]

I would have to disagree...

well, i was assuming that while you're practicing, you are learning. to me they go hand in hand, i keep forgetting that some people dont learn my doing, they learn better from reading books.
mind you, theres nothing wrong with that, but im a learn by doing kind of person. i didn't learn how to play guitar by studying books, memorizing chords and scales, or contemplating music theory, i just picked up a fucking guitar and figured it out.
mind you i've been playing for 10 years and am only about as good as someone whos played for 6 years with proper training, but I DID IT MYSELF. and to me thats so much more fullfilling. besides, from personal experience, most of the people that i've talked to who have had proper training, studied music theory etc. they've always told me that they envied the emotion in my music.
because learning it on my own was a journey. there was a lot of self discovery there that they didn't experience when learning how to play.
same thing with illustration for me. i do this because i LOVE IT. not because i want to do it for a living.
i dont feel this urgent need to get better tomorrow by reading countless books and tutorials about light, shadow, gravity, perspective, etc.
i want to learn these things at my own pace, and on my own terms, whenever the fuck i figure it out. if i dont figure it out, i'll pick it up from somewhere like conceptart.org or a drawing group, or i'll dig around online and look for a tutorial on how to do something specific that i want to do... but my point is, i ASSUMED that if you just practice, you would be learning.
but again, some people dont learn that way.
my mistake. making assumptions on CA.org always gets me in some sort of debate.
haha

i also keep forgetting that some people just cant naturally see that something is off... even when i was real little i could see that shit was weird with my drawings, i didn't know how to fix it, but i could see it was wrong.
thats why i've always had extremely low self esteem when it came to my art...i thought, and still think, that i suck.
let me rephrase that: i KNOW i suck, because i look at what i draw and can CLEARLY SEE that i suck.
thats why i practice. i want to get better. i know what i need to work on because i can see whats wrong clear as day, and only practice is going to help ME.
and you guys aren't ME.
again, another assumption on my part.

anyway, its 3:22am... im tired, sore, and aparently babbling like a fucking idiot....i dont know if any of that shit made sense, but there sure is a lot of it.
ha!

so i'll leave you with this:

1. close your eyes and visualize the classroom of your favorite class in school
2. pay attention to where your desk was, where your friends sat, where the teachers desk was, where the girl you liked sat, the chalk board, the door, the clock on the wall, the globe on the book shelf, the pencil sharpener, the posters on the walls, etc.
3. now pretend you're a fly, and you've traveled up to the front of the class and are now all the way up to the ceiling in the corner of the room looking down at everyone and everything...

even though you've never physically been up in the corner of this room, you can do this without any problem.
this is called extrapolation. and its a great fucking excercise, something i used to do when i was a bored kid.
but you have to be careful when doing this because you might accidentaly cause an out of body experience and leave your inner self floating about in the universe to get gang raped by the inner selfs of monks who haven't had any in 40 years... not a great situation to be in.

ok... im delirious... i haven't slept in 2 days...
i must go to bed now.

[TheDirtSyndicate]

but you have to be careful when doing this because you might accidentaly cause an out of body experience and leave your inner self floating about in the universe to get gang raped by the inner selfs of monks who haven't had any in 40 years... not a great situation to be in.

just to be clear, i was trying to be funny here, not trying to spark a new debate...
but, if you do happen to be interested in astral projection, there is some truth to the statement i made above. always ground yourself after you project, otherwise you'll leave your astral body floating about on the astral plane unprotected. not a great situation to be in.
soooo... yeah... goodnight.

dont laugh.
im serious.
O_o

[Pound]

I was trying to be funny too. And I was just explaining soem theory, so I didn't mean to be like a walkign thesaurus. But really, ofcourse you don't need to know those words to be good at art. But there is also no point in being ignorant. And you clearly aren't, good sense of humour anyway.


I also could see 'shit' was weird with my drawings, but not everyone can, and when that small mistake can be defined, it is much simpler to counteract.

[Silver Rains]

guys that was hot

[Pound]

Well, from that debate there I am sure you have learnt a hell of a lot. And there were a lot of points scattered throughout out that, some I am not inclined to agree with, but advice nonetheless.


And also, Complete2, I have learnt nothing from a book. I was advised to download a Loomis tutorial, and I completely screwed, it up. Of course I have improved since then, but I don't use Loomis techniques.


And we are in the same situation with musical instruments, I can't read anything in real music, I can understand a slight bit of theory (because i am not ignorant) and that is all I need to know, I have never learnt any of my skills from a book, and especially in art, you will have a hard time learning from a book.

I also find it amusing how you contradict yourself, sometimes, as I said great sense of humour.