question about watercolour brushes :)

[Hyperion]

Hey all :) loving this site hehe :yayca:

Anyways..........

I was just playing around with some brushes in painter IX.5 its a new program for me so im getting used to its MANY-MANY features :)

Well I started out with a simple cavas, I just set my canvas to 96 DPI and did a "file new" 500 by 500 canvas.

My monitor says its at 96 DPI in the driver properties so I just added that to the canvas thinking it was a wise move.

Then I started out with digital watercolour after reading that these were popular set of brushes.

Well I experimented a few strokes with simple water - then I changed brush sets to painter 5 water colour brushes
[yes I collected and installed some extra brushes etc :) ]
and did a few strokes with that, getting the feel of it and things, and all was fine.

HOWEVER as soon as I went back to digital watercolour brushes again -still on same canvas- I got the error..

"only water colour brushes can be used on water colour layers"

wtf? lol

I though digital watercolour brush set was a WATER COLOUR BRUSH SET?

Or am I wrong and digital watercolour brushes is allot different from painter 5 watercolour brush set?

ALSO did painter put some sort of special watercolour paint layer down as soon as I used the painter 5 watercolour brushes on the canvas?

Thanks for tollerating the noob questions hehe :teeth:

Hyperion

[Jin]

Hi,

Get comfortable, 'cause this is going to be a long read.

There's a lot of history behind the Painter IX brush categories used to simulate traditional watercolor, Watercolor and Digital Watercolor (yes, two of them). I'll tell you the story so my answers to your questions will hopefully make more sense:

Painter 6 and earlier versions used a simpler Water Color brush technology and that was the only brush category used to simulate traditional watercolor:

Painter 6 (and earlier version) Water Color

With Painter 7, the Water Color brush category's technology changed completely, to better simulate traditional watercolor. Now Water Color variants could only be used on Water Color Layers. The Water Color brush variants were much more complex and more difficult to learn how to use though it helped if the artist had a traditional watercolor background. There was still only one brush category used to simulate traditional watercolor:

Painter 7 Water Color

A lot of long time Painter users squawked loudly so, with the Painter 7.1 Update, the Tinting brush category was introduced to bring back some of the simpler behavior found in Painter 6 and earlier version Water Color brush variants and the simpler way they interacted with Paper texture. Tinting brush variants could be used to paint on either the Canvas or Default Layers. Though they were easier to use, the Tinting brush variants really didn't look much like watercolor so that addition didn't quite do the trick for long time Painter users who missed the earlier version Water Color variants. Now, with a stretch of imagination, there were two brush categories that could be used to simulate traditional watercolor:

Painter 7 Water Color
Painter 7.1 Tinting (even with a stretch of imagination, not such good watercolor simulation)

With Painter 8, the new Digital Water Color brush category was introduced. It wasn't all new, however, as it was very much like Painter 6 and earlier version Water Color, but with more brush variants and some unpleasant problems. Painter 8 still included the Water Color brush category with its new and more complex brush technology and Water Color Layers so now there were two brush categories that could be used to simulate traditional watercolor (forget Tinting except for what it was good for, plain simple painting):

Painter 8 Water Color
Painter 8 Digital Water Color

With Painter IX, we have the Watercolor brush category (renamed, from Water Color to Watercolor) and the greatly improved Digital Watercolor (also renamed, from Digital Water Color to Digital Watercolor). Again, we have two brush categories that can be used to simulate traditional watercolor and do it better than ever:

Painter IX Watercolor
Painter IX Digital Watercolor


To bring all this into focus:

Painter IX Watercolor is the more complex brush technology originally introduced in Painter 7. It uses Method: Wet which you'll see in the Brush Controls' General palette when a Watercolor variant is selected.

Painter IX Digital Watercolor is the simpler brush technology (no doubt improved since the early days) originally found in Painter 6 and earlier versions, and in Painter 8. It uses Method: Digital Wet which you'll see in the Brush Controls' General palette when a Digital Watercolor variant is selected.

If you Import a Painter 6 or earlier version brush library into Painter IX, you'll see that once converted by Painter IX the Water Color variants (that in their original Painter version used Method: Wet) now use Method: Digital Wet and work like the Painter IX Digital Watercolor brush variants.

So we now have two "watercolor" brush categories, two "watercolor" brush technologies, and two Methods used for these two brush categories.


With all that explained, my responses to your post may make more sense:

Hey all :) loving this site hehe :yayca:

Anyways..........

I was just playing around with some brushes in painter IX.5 its a new program for me so im getting used to its MANY-MANY features :)

Well I started out with a simple cavas, I just set my canvas to 96 DPI and did a "file new" 500 by 500 canvas.

My monitor says its at 96 DPI in the driver properties so I just added that to the canvas thinking it was a wise move.


The appropriate term is PPI (pixels per inch) the term used in relation to digital art. DPI (dots per inch) is a term used in relation to printing.

You could have set your Resolution (PPI) to any number. The usual safe recommended number if you plan to print is 300 ppi but you could work at a lower PPI, depending on how you plan to work, how your image will be used, and where it will be printed (if printed at all).

For painting practice, I'd suggest using 300 ppi because you'll have more color information to work with and I just like working with more pixels on the chance I may want to print the work later on. It's really up to you, though, and you'll find with time using Painter IX.5 what works best for you in each situation.



Then I started out with digital watercolour after reading that these were popular set of brushes.


Digital Watercolor can be used to paint on the Canvas or on a Default Layer, the type of Layer created when we click the New Layer icon at the bottom of the Layers list (third icon from the left), choose New Layer from the Layers palette menu, choose New Layer from the Layers main menu, or use the keyboard shortcut, Ctrl/Command+Shift+N.


Well I experimented a few strokes with simple water - then I changed brush sets to painter 5 water colour brushes
[yes I collected and installed some extra brushes etc :) ]
and did a few strokes with that, getting the feel of it and things, and all was fine.


I'm guessing these Painter 5 Water Color variants were from the Painter IX CD: CPainterIX > Extras > Brushes > Painter 5 Brushes folder. If so, they were already converted by Corel to work like Painter IX Watercolor brush variants, using the newer more complex brush technology. Because of this, they only work on Watercolor Layers. The moment you chose one of these Painter 5 Water Color variants and began to paint, Painter IX automatically created a new Watercolor Layer and that's where your brushstrokes were applied. If you select one of these Painter 5 Water Color variants and look in the Brush Controls' General palette, I think you'll find it uses Method: Wet, the same Method used by Painter IX Watercolor variants.

If instead you had Painter 5 installed (as I do) and used the Brush Selector menu command, Import Brush Library, located the older version Painter.BRS brush library file, made a copy and gave the copy a unique name so it wouldn't overwrite another Painter Brushes library, and clicked the Open button, Painter IX would have converted the library while you waited. When the Painter 5 brush library name appeared in the Brush Libraries list, you could click the Load button and the converted Painter 5 brush library would be loaded and ready to use. If you then selected one of the Painter 5 Water Color variants and checked in the Brush Controls' General palette, you'd see it uses Method: Digital Wet, the same Method used by Painter IX Digital Watercolor variants. You'd be able to paint on either the Canvas or a Default Layer, but not on a Watercolor Layer.


HOWEVER as soon as I went back to digital watercolour brushes again -still on same canvas- I got the error..

"only water colour brushes can be used on water colour layers"

wtf? lol


I think if you'd checked the Layers palette you'd have seen you weren't working on the Canvas after all because there was a Watercolor Layer and it was highlighted (or active) for the reasons explained above.



I though digital watercolour brush set was a WATER COLOUR BRUSH SET?


Nope. It's the Digutal Watercolor brush category. :wink:


Or am I wrong and digital watercolour brushes is allot different from painter 5 watercolour brush set?


Yes or No, depending on how the Painter 5 Water Color brush category was brought into Painter IX.

In one scenario if you brought the Painter 5 Water Color brush category into Painter IX from the Painter IX CD's Extras folder it would be very different because it would use Method: Wet and the newer more complex Water Color brush technology introduced with Painter 7 and work like the Painter IX Watercolor brush category.

In the other scenario, if you were to bring the Painter 5 Water Color brush category into Painter IX via Import/convert/Load of the whole Painter 5 default brush library, the Painter 5 Water Color brush category would use Method: Digital Wet and work like the Painter IX Digital Watercolor brush category.


ALSO did painter put some sort of special watercolour paint layer down as soon as I used the painter 5 watercolour brushes on the canvas?


Yep. I think that's just what happened.


Thanks for tollerating the noob questions hehe :teeth:


Hyperion

At least you're thinking and asking intelligent "noob" questions!

This whole Water Color/Watercolor/Digital Water Color/Digital Watercolor story is quite confusing and no one can be blamed if they need to ask loads of questions.

It's even confusiing for me to explain and I've done it a zillion times and used Painter through Painter 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, and IX and all of the patches and updates that came along with them (except 9.1 and IX.5 that aren't installed yet).... plus three "lite" Painter versions.


Jinny

[Hyperion]

Excellent ) many thanks..

That was a vert thurough detailed explanation and its appreciated :)

What I did was as one of your explanations detailed, I got the painter 5/6 brush sets from the extras folder of off the cd and I just placed their folder into the the "F:\Program Files\Corel\Corel Painter IX\Brushes\Painter Brushes" folder of my installation.

I haven't overwritten any of the painter IX.5 brushes that came with the default instalaltion, I just palced the brushes in the extras folder of the cd into the the brushes folder.

So I can access the brushes inside painter IX.5 via the brush drop-down selection menu.

Welp thanks for the ehads-up it's appreciated :)

Hyperion

[Hyperion]

I did do the right thing in placing the brushes from the extras folder on the cd into.. {drive-letter]\Program Files\Corel\Corel Painter IX\Brushes\Painter Brushes" folder of my installation, didn't I?

I assumed that you had to place each brush directory & jpg file of the same name, INTO the brushes folder above.

That way they list in the brushes selection rolldown menu inside painter it's self.

They all seem to be selectable and working, so I am assuming they're all installed ok.

It was just a question of copy/pasting the folder-jpg combos into the bruhses folder.

Hyperion

[Jin]

Sounds like what you did was to copy brush category folders and their same-name .JPG brush category icon image files into the default Painter IX Painter Brushes brush library folder.

Not only is that a lot of unnecessary work, but for best Painter performance, it's not wise to add a lot of extra brush categories or brush variants to the default Painter Brushes brush library. The reason is that brush library is already huge and adding more to it can slow down Painter's performance.

What you see on the Painter IX CD when you open the Extras > Brushes folder are brush library folders.

It's best to copy and paste those brush library folders into the Painter IX application/program folder's Brushes folder:

Windows - Program Files > Corel > Corel Painter IX > Brushes

Mac - Applications > Corel Painter IX > Brushes

Then you can use the Brush Selector menu Load Library command to load any brush library now located in the Painter IX > Brushes folder (full path shown above).

To speed things up when switching from one library to another, create a Custom Palette and drag a brush category icon from each brush library into the Custom Palette. Click the icon to load the brush library instantly.


Jinny

[Hyperion]

Oh I see thanks :) heh I did a bad lol..

Hyperion