A few questions:

[Kittywolf13]

Seems like i'm just a fountain of questions always. but i dont have any other connections other then you lovely people...so on to the questions!

:?: Anyone know where i can purchase non-photo blue pencil lead??? i've checked the local art store (micheals) and both office max (they have red lead) and office depot...no lead to be found.

:?: are Epson scanners good?

:?: is a general art degree good for Graphic Design? I'm trying to stay close to my home town, the nearest university has an art program, and there are a few graphic design classes...but no set degree.

:?: if general art isnt good for graphic design, then can anyone suggest any schools in the SouthWest area of Florida?? I live in Naples.

Ermm i think thats all for now. i know these are all random and not linked to each other...but i figured i wouldnt spam the forum with multiple threads and just put em all in to one post.

[masque]

if there's a local printer's supply outlet you might find non-repro blue leads and/or pencils there. but call first, they're sort of obsolete in these days of digital page layout. also check the yellow pages for places that do blueprints, they may also have them, or perhaps can recommend a source. also call local printers if you come up dry elsewhere. you may have to order them special, try googling. just out of interest, why do you need 'em?

imo Epson scanners are good to excellent depending on the model & $$$. i used an higher-end Expression (forget the model #, sorry) for years at work, was able to do high-rez repro-quality scans for major print jobs (annual reports, etc). my home scanner is a Perfection 1260 (small), scans OK but the exposure lamp outgassed on the glass, making it useless for top-notch quality. i think that's a bit of a fluke, though.

[figure2]

I found some blue pencil leads here (http://www.draftex.com.au/CMech.html).

I use an Epson Perfection 4990 Photo scanner. The scanner is great, the software is just so-so but it comes bundled with a 3rd party scanning software called SilverFast which is pretty good.

You probably want to find out more about the art program at the local university. A program targeted toward graphic design will put more emphasis on building a portfolio that will hopefully get you work. A general art program may not focus on the type of thinking and problem solving that is required of graphic designers. Do some careful research before you pay the tuition.

[Ilaekae]

Kittywolf, the pencils you want are prismacolor Verithin Non-Photo Blue. They cost around a buck, and their available at most graphic arts sources or art stores that serve the graphic arts. Dick Blick and everybody else in the world should have them online, so if you just google the name I gave you, you'll get a great list of suppliers.

I had a choice between Epson and Microtec scanners when I started using them last century, and I went with Microtec. Epson ARE good scanners...I just prefer the Micros my self.

The other stuff, I think I'm a little too out of it agewise to help you there...sorry.

Masque: Non-photos are still used more than you suspect. Their a mainstay for graphic arts pre-press, and many cartoonists and character inkers still do their preliminary sketches in non-ph blue because it's so easy to get rid of in photo-shop--no erasing.

[Kittywolf13]

thanks for all the info.

i wanted non-photoblue pencils to do all my really rough line work...i guess i could just use my light table, and trace it. but i'm not a big fan on traceing...but its a useful tool. my parents were printers so i have a few pencils left, but i was looking for lead cause i like working with mechanical pencils....but i wont denie good ol pencils. :D

i dont recall the exact model number of the epson i was looking at, but its high resolution was somewhere about 6000 or maybe a little higher. it seems that unless i look online i have a very limited choice in scanners in town. my choices are:

Epson (i dont remember the various model numbers)
Cannon (although the res was really low so i'm not looking into it.)
Visioneer (never heard of this brand.)
and i dont remember if i actually saw any HP's...my last scanner was an HP and lasted well over 10 years.

i understand that i have to carefully research my college choices...seeing as i almost made that mistake once. so i guess i'll just have to look further into it.

[masque]

Masque: Non-photos are still used more than you suspect.no doubt, though most of the pre-press ops i know probably wouldn't know a process or stat camera if they tripped over one :teeth:, and i always associate non-repro blue with waxers, type galleys, reflective line art, and truly mechanical mechanicals :rolleyes: the "bad ol' days." don't think i've seen an actual keyline for better than a decade.

[figure2]

no doubt, though most of the pre-press ops i know probably wouldn't know a process or stat camera if they tripped over oneYou wouldn't trip over one. Being that most stat cameras were quite large you would bump into it and it would hurt. Considering the amount of time I spent in stat camera darkrooms with their open cesspools of photo chemicals in the processors, I can only imagine how many brain cells I cooked.
i always associate non-repro blue with waxers, type galleys, reflective line art, and truly mechanical mechanicalsOddly enough, I never used waxers. The places where I worked always seemed to favor one-coat rubber cement for their mechs.

[masque]

You wouldn't trip over one. yeah, i know, figure of speech and all, but the last true process camera i worked on (in Anchorage, circa 1980) had about a twenty-foot bed, a real monster, i was always stumbling on the copy-board rails (my grace has not improved with age). the shop it was in actually did camera-based color seps on it before laying in a HELL scanner.

ahh, rubber cement. the goobers! the thinner! the "bad ol' days" ;)

[Ilaekae]

...the rubber cement footballs that we made and tossed out the window at passing old ladies and messengers...

There was a stat house in Pittsburgh that operated until about '85 with a wood-frame-on-trellis stat camera that was 60 feet long, and you climbed a set of steps to get into the camera end. They once told me they thought it was built at the turn of the century to accommodate a goofy set of lenses they found in an abandoned factory... They originally used it to blow up architectural blue prints.

[Kittywolf13]

^_^;; i really have no clue as to what you guys are talking about. lol.

[figure2]

i really have no clue as to what you guys are talking about. lol.Kittywolf,

These terms used to be part of standard shop talk in the days before graphic design was done on desktop computers. As far as modern graphic design is concerned it's now just a dead language. Thank God!

[masque]

sorry, Kittywolf. slight attack of old fogeyness on my part. :teeth:

[Kittywolf13]

hahaha. its alright. i mean one of the guys i work with is 70 something, so every once in awhile i get tossed an old word at me...like the other day he was talking linotypes (dont know how its spelled.) and i was like "my parents owned an AB DICK printing press." lol i know letter presses and single and two color printing presses...but thats about it...from there its the giant leap into digital. :)

[masque]

man, my old fogey quotient just skyrocketed -- first job i ever had in graphic arts (any arts, for that matter), the shop had a Linotype hot-metal typecaster (you spelled it right). shades of etaoin shrdlu (that's a fogey trivia challenge, Kittywolf ;) )

[Kittywolf13]

man, my old fogey quotient just skyrocketed -- first job i ever had in graphic arts (any arts, for that matter), the shop had a Linotype hot-metal typecaster (you spelled it right). shades of etaoin shrdlu (that's a fogey trivia challenge, Kittywolf ;) )

Yaaaaaay for spelling it right!!!

booo...for not knowing what the heck etaonin shrdlu is. i have an inkling that you mixed the letters up. if not that i havent a clue anyways...

[masque]

Okay, this one's a "gimmee"

http://hci.stanford.edu/~winograd/shrdlu/name.html

#10 is the one sticks most in my mind, being a fan of that curious form of brain-rot known as science fiction & fantasy ;)

[Kittywolf13]

Okay, this one's a "gimmee"

http://hci.stanford.edu/~winograd/shrdlu/name.html

#10 is the one sticks most in my mind, being a fan of that curious form of brain-rot known as science fiction & fantasy ;)

AHHH! I should of known this!!! He told me about that. and had you mentioned QWERTY i would have instantly known it was referring to the type set up. booo i feel stupid. but i guess i shouldnt. its before my time. ^_^; but i love hearing about the older stuff!!!

[Ilaekae]

Kitty', get Masque to tell you how we used to sit around friday nights at the studio and handcarve the wooden typeblocks for the next week's ads...

[Craig D]

Hey, do you know J Gutenberg? ;)

[Ilaekae]

Man was disgusting...never took a bath. :x

[masque]

Kitty', get Masque to tell you how we used to sit around friday nights at the studio and handcarve the wooden typeblocks for the next week's ads...
Sound FX: hum of vacuum tubes, static, snippets of ghostly voices from the aether as Kitty slowly turns the radio dial...

Announcer:"...brought to you by Ovaltine! And now, 'The Adventures of Puck and Masque,' that daring duo of design, battling kitsch and cliche in a valiant struggle to rescue Metropolis from its own mediocrity. Featuring the voices of Garrison Keeler and Walter Brennan..."


naaaaa....

[CCThrom]

The only one of your questions I have any direct experience with is #3... and who knows if my experience is anything to go by. But having said that, I did get into a graphic design position with a generic art degree. Maybe I just lucked out though. Still I think there's something to be said for a generalist approach... you get a broader perspective that just maybe can give you an edge over the specialists. If you use it well.

Ultimately I think the most important thing is your portfolio not your degree, and a dedicated graphics program would (or should anyway) give you a bit of a leg up in the starting portfolio department. But it's no guarantee, because you can certainly put together a great presentation for yourself with any kind of training. Once you have a portfolio and a job or two under your belt, no one will care about your education. I dunno if that answers anything or just muddies the waters.

I now return you to your regularly scheduled fogeys...

[Kittywolf13]

Ok masque tell me about those friday nights! XD i have to hear this. :P

CCThrom: thats what i was hoping, of course that piles the odds against me. It's just i dont want to move out of my town, because i actually have a job right now that involves some graphic design. so i want to take advantage of that, and gain experience and get my degree at the same time. But there are very few schools in my area...and far fewer that have anything art related..or dedicated. its annoying. the closests are Ringling (which i'm not partial too because of personal reasons.) A.I. but there too expensive and their credits are non-transferable...there are a few others...but i cant recall them...but those would require me to leave on campus or near campus...which means no job. :/ so i'm stuck

[CCThrom]

Actually that might leave you in an ok position... you've got some experience and a job that'll let you work on a portfolio. If any of those nearby schools are tolerable and can get you a BA or BFA in "art" you'll have all the ingredients you need. The only thing you'll lack may be the guidance of real design professors in shaping your portfolio.

It goes without saying though, you do NOT want to take just one guy's word for it!

[Kittywolf13]

CCThrom: your right. but i can only see my limited options at the moment...of course i dont even know how much buisness there is in this town for such a thing. being more general might be fine here but if i move or something, it may not work. >_< baaaaah i hate school and all of this decsion makeing. ;_; it makes me depressed :(

[masque]

Ok masque tell me about those friday nights! XD i have to hear this. :Phey, that's Puck's spesh-ee-al-i-tee ;), prob'ly still whittles out 120pt Bodoni Poster caps for his assemblages (which now that i think of it would be pretty damn cool :teeth:).

besides, me and sharp instruments have had a tumultuous relationship over the years -- i try to keep things business-like and just get the job done, they keep trying to get under (or remove small chunks of ) my skin. **bandages thumb and curses kitchen knife**

[Ilaekae]

...friggin' amashure... :P

We used to prop the little block in our lap and smack the xacto with a book when the goin' got tough. Damn knots...my ex-partner still talks high and squeeky...