Shy of life drawing

[Erik]

Hi guys,

I've never really drawn from life, only from photos. But i want to start doing it. As i can't find any good life-drawing classes around here (or any that are not expensive...) i will have to just go out and draw people.

Problem: i get nervous if i just sit in the park and try drawing people there (without asking). I concentrate so much on being inconspicuous that i draw like shit.... What if they see me and get mad?

Oh, and they keep moving but that i'll have to take for granted ;-)

In short: i am too shy to really do this.

Can anyone tell me how they do this? Are there people with the same problem? Has anyone ever had positive/negative experiences with this situation?

Help is appreciated!

[Landmate]

i have the same problem sort of, I'm pretty shy too and I feel awkward about what people might think when if I stare at them to draw them. The best thing to do is to go somewhere with lots of people, like a mall, and draw there, because your presence is harder to detect ;) and you have alot more choices of what to sketch. Its my humble opinion that drawing this way is more of an advanced excercise, its hard to capture moving people without some sort of training in life drawing, if they arent moving or not asleep, then usually you have anywhere from 20 seconds to 10 minute "poses". pretty hard, for me anyway.

oh and the more obvious approach for not so shy people is to just approach a person that looks like they are going to be in one place for a while and ask if they have any problems with you sketching them (use the term sketch, hehe) and if not, your guilt free ;)

the opportunities I find are usualy in class, and usually from behind the subject ;) for example:

]http://www.doublemoonproductions.com/daily/2-18-03.jpghttp://www.porktaco.com/giggle_o___O.jpg

[egerie]

Why don't you ask a friend to pose for you ? No need to get on a posing stage or anything.. Just draw them while they fiddle on the computer ?
Some might the request really well as a matter of fact... :)

[Inferno]

I've be to 2 life drawing class's, one with a school group of AS (7 people) and another one alone, it's a 1:00 hour train right and a 30:00 minite walk too the place I was not only the youngest there but also the only male in the room.

But it's not as bad as it sounds you go in set your easel up, and just draw this persons in several different length of period poses( 30secs to 1 hour). The best way I can explain why it's not nerve wrecking, is that she/he is not nude, she/he is a model nothing more then practice, a way to a great picture, nothing more then art.

The person doesn't get mad and as far as I know see doesn't look at them really, on ocassion the worst that can happen is that she'll laugh, and not be mad.

Seriously just go to one, they really help you to improve and see atonomy better.
Or if worst comes to worst take your sketch book to a strip club

[Landmate]

read his post next time Inferno, that wasn't the question.

[Erik]

Hey Landmate, Egerie, thanks a lot... Cool drawings btw.

Guess i'll just have to go there and get used to it maybe i won't be awkward anymore after a while...

Good to hear i'm not the only one though. I always wonder why i never see anyone drawing in the park or anywhere. i get to think it's weird...

[Fipse]

I personally like to do lifedrawings in Pubs. The people aren´t normally so aware of me and are acting more natural, they are mostly sitting on one place and you can hide a bit in the shadows. Another goodd possibility are readings of sort for similar reasons.

Fipse

[dbclemons]

Don't psych yourself out about drawing people outdoors. The trick is to not stare. Most people don't like that under any circumstances. I'll just glance up for a second and spend more time working on the drawing. I carry my sketchbook with me all the time and have never been confronted by anyone. Sometimes they will walk by, see what I've been doing, and just keep on walking, or make a comment, but I've never had any conflicts in the many years I've done this. If I were taking photos of them (which I've done sometimes) then I'm more considerate of whether or not they want to be photographed. If you're near a campus then the sight of someone drawing is not uncommon, so you blend in better.

A good way to ease into it is to sit out in an open park on the grass somewhere, then just let the world walk by you. Also, there's more to learn by drawing than just working on people. Animals, trees, buildings, etc, are also fun to draw. I've always had more fun drawing outside than in front of a model.

-David

[sparky | emily]

yeah, don't stare. Look like you're studying or something. Draw people who are busy or have their back turned or are asleep.

edit: oh yeah, also, I have a lot of trouble if I set out to draw people, but if I just sit there drawing other stuff for a while it relaxes me and gets me used to where I am. Before long it doesn't seem very awkward to draw the people. Of course, I've never drawn in a park or something, only in classes and such, but I think the same stuff applies...

[Landmate]

I'll just glance up for a second and spend more time working on the drawing.

I highly recommend you dont do this. It defeats the whole purpose of drawing from life. If you dont have good eye hand coordination skills, then refine those before you attempt such things as are being discussed here.

[Erik]

Yeah it is also exactly my problem...

I would work up enough courage to glance and then look at my drawing much longer than at the figure. This does not give good results for me :-( i wish i had these skills you talk about landmate.

It's stupid really since when i'm just sitting around with no paper i don't have any problems staring :-/

[dbclemons]

Originally posted by Landmate


I highly recommend you dont do this. It defeats the whole purpose of drawing from life. If you dont have good eye hand coordination skills, then refine those before you attempt such things as are being discussed here.

To each their own. I'm more interested in what I'm doing than what's in front of me, and that is the purpose drawing. You're not a camera. My need for a glance is only to record in my head what it is I'm looking at, and then get to it. I guess my advise here is to look only as long as you need to. Accuracy of what's in front of you isn't really all that important. It's what you put on paper that matters.

-David

[Landmate]

I disagree 100%

[Jason Manley]

Erik...keep making drawings that you are not finding to be perfect...you will get better quickly and the drawings you think are good now will be eclipsed. just keep looking...quickly...glances...relax....and dont let the catch you...El Coro says it's fun to treat it like a game...he says the trick is to not let them catch you...to be sly...he says that he treats it like a game and if they catch him then the drawing is done..the game is over..personally i have found very public places like a diner or restaurant to be a good place to do it. people concentrate on their conversation or their food and thus you will have time to pull it off. Ive also had luck at the mall but people are there checking each other out so i always felt like a perv...Im different than el coro...i dont care if they know or not....but i will only do it when they arent looking...heheeheh....keep them guessing. "is that creepy guy drawing me?"


db clemons....I disagree with you as well....part of what you said I agree with too...in the end it is what you put to paper...however if one does not spend an intense amount of time drawing from life than that artist has not spent enough time understanding what they are seeing....and the less you understand about seeing the less you understand about picture making....and also doing conceptual art.

drawing from life is like stopping the car to fill it up at the gas station. before you go anywhere far you need a full tank...the more time one spends away from life drawing, the sooner one would have to stop to fill it up again.

CAREFUL OBSERVATION IS AN ABSOLUTE MUST when developing drawing skills.


Drawing from life is also the best thing you can do for your imaginitive drawings and paintings. drawing from life helps you learn the truths to what you see and brings an artist to a greater understanding of the visual world...as well as a greater understanding of the visual world to your artwork.

dont stop..EVER....it has been some time since i drew from life and my artwork suffered because of it. Im now back in figure and anatomy class trying to catch up on lost time.


I agree with landmate. If you are wanting to be able to make better pictures then draw from life...drawing from imagination can be done as well...but i wouldnt suggest mixing them together if you really still need to draw more from life...if ya know what i mean. an artist needs to know his or her visual vocabulary....just like a writer needs to know grammar. life drawing and painting IS that visual vocabulary.


j

[rimwalker]

I agree with Landmate, if you spend too much time staring at your paper and not enough studying your subject then you might as well work from a photograph or just draw from memory.

It defeats the whole purpose of drawing from life. When you draw from life the point is to study what you’re seeing and to try to translate some of that to paper.

Being able to do great drawings from memory is a wonderful skill, but if you're out drawing from life... draw from life! Save the other types of drawing methods for when you're at home or whatever.

I've been wanting to get myself to the mall to sit and draw for awhile. Once I had to go to a "senior fair" for my work and I drew lots of pictures of senior citizens. They moved faster than I thought they would. :p I felt self-conscious at first but after a while I didn't care if anyone saw. Nobody seemed to notice anyway.

[Erik]

Hey thanks everybody!

In fact i'm going to take my pencil and sketchbook and sit in a shady spot - camo clothing and face paint all done... ;-)

no serious i'm psyching myself up to go out there and if i get something done i'll post it too (maybe)

thanks for the encouragement and Jason i wish i had your attitude ;-) but i'll try el coro's game in stead

E.

[Inferno]

I'm sorry, I read the post yesterday and saw something completely different.

Well, in that case, you can either ask your mates or just do it.
I once got chuck off a train station for drawing while waiting for a train.
So make sure the place you are drawing you are allowed to busk in or the Guards aren't so stubborn that they can't understand your not busking

[Jason Manley]

Im sorry...what is a "busk"?


brits...i tell ya. ya'll take the american language and make it your own.


hehehehhehe


j

[MindCandyMan]

When you do some of these drawings post them so we can see some erik.

I like that illustration you used Jason about the gas tank...fits really well. I recently came to the conclusion that I have to draw from life 24/7 now...because I don't even have a car at this point (metaphorically)...let alone having the gas tank filled.

Eric you will be surprised too when you start drawing in public how something AWFUL looks good to the average person...it's weird...people are funny...

[jrr]

hey jason i like that game, i play a game where in a crowded train i tap a girls ass and blame it on someone else..... exciting!
but seriously, i try to get a few drawings done on the train to work every morning and evening when i get home. most of the time the people on those trains are sleeping. so they don't mind, and sometimes the moving isn't so bad either, if you hold your pencil/pen further from the tip, you'd be surprise of how loose and yet accurate your line can be. i can usually draw a person in one or two stops that's about 2 to 5 minutes. it's great. look at the model and remember it, filther it in your mind and then put it down on paper.
when i get caught drawing them, i just smile and if they look pissed, i draw someone else, i don't look like a thug or anything so they usually don't mind, others like landmate (i mean with that dead parrot on his shoulder and all) would probably scare them into macing him. :evilbat:

[dbclemons]

I appreciate the comments here; the discource and disagreements. But enough about me. I think in the end we all stand together on the results, whatever path we take to get there. Viva la difference! Eric was a bit nervous about having the world looking over his shoulder, and it sounds like he's toughened up enough to go out and do it anyway, and that's what we're here for.

Good luck, Eric. Post some sketches for us to see how you progress.

-David

[Erik]

Well, i went out there and did some stuff today. I went to a terrace and drew. It's really like you said - no one pays much attention to me there (except the waitress girls ;-D) but i did not really bring home any bacon today. perhaps tomorrow when i'm going again...

There is this problem with people - they move. Some people move in the same pattern every time again and then you wait until they repeat and jot down some more lines. Others never repeat.

I have the feeling that - if the work should ever exceed the 30 sec. sketch i do right now - either i should composite many poses of the subject into one, sketching first and then observing and refining while the person may be in a different position (problematic with shades, wrinkles, folds, ...)

Or i should dramatically improve on my drawing effectiveness, not using many lines where i could have used one. I guess it is the latter.

But do people do this compositing trick? I'd like to know how artists manage to reach full detail in an uncontrolled outdoors environment since i'm really out on a limb there. Is it cheating if you fill details from memory?

You've all been a lot of help and if something worth looking at appears tomorrow i'll post it! Thanx!

[rimwalker]

No, I don't think you could consider it "cheating" if you fill in details later from memory. As long as you lay a strong framework down initially from life.

Since most "real world" observational drawings are done so quickly, that they're loose and light. Most artists leave them that way. However, sometimes they choose to work with some sketches and give them more detail.

If you find a certain subject (or perhaps the entire environment) worth working with further than I don't see any problem with adding more details (from memory even) and making that sketch a more completed drawing. It's not like some "Drawing Gestapo" will come hunting you down if you draw whatever the heck you want. :D

[dbclemons]

Originally posted by Erik
Well, i went out there and did some stuff today. ...

Hooray!

My approach to drawing outdoors is eccentially, as you may already have gathered, more like taking notes and studying. For me, drawing from memory is the main goal. As much as I can train myself to remember what I've learned, the better, and drawing quick gestural drawings is a good idea. Also, think of drawing people as they move; what they look like when they walk, their gestures, how their body weight shifts, etc. I even try to just write down descriptions, and recreate it later at home. Many landscape artists do this (Constable used to for instance,) and I think it's a good way to learn.

If you'd like to create a complete finished drawing, you'll need to have someone who's going to stay still long enough, draw them first in case they leave, or draw from memory. Maybe a friend could pose for you if they wouldn't mind sitting still long enough to read in the park or snooze.

-David

[Landmate]

others like landmate (i mean with that dead parrot on his shoulder and all) would probably scare them into macing him.


haha im not scary T___T

im a really shy passivist.... *crys*

[rimwalker]

Aww, poor Landmate.:smirk:

[swampbug]

I read this post and felt the same way when I first started drawing people, and like landmate... most of my people were from the back.

Luckly I didnt get any wierd looks from mothers when I was drawing thier kids. The only people I made self conscious was girls my age. Because they assume I was a run of the mill "dude" lookin at them.

The best thing for me is to look with such casualness at people, that they dont feel uncomfortable.. Smile, and move your eyes around. Looking in different spots confusses them, and they think you're drawing everything around you.



My best expirence was a girl who fell asleep across form me on an airplane.... It was perfect.

http://digitalarts.bgsu.edu/portfolios/tstanto/tradart/doo5.jpg

( the girl sitting next to me kept giving me wierd looks though :D)




Another tip might be. to go to a place where people are walking. And draw them walking. That way. you get better at drawing moving targets ( its hard ) and the person walking, is in control, and may feel less threatened that you are doing something (stalking, or obsessing) to them. Thats my feeling anyway. Because how harmful is a drawing anyways...... ptttttt. :P

I wanna go up to people and ask to draw them sometime. It has to be the right person too. Some people get psyched out if you want to draw them.

[killing.people]

i will never ask someone to pose, unless i want to check something specific, "hey look over there" then id get a good profile on an eye.
its best drawing someone that isnt expecting it. like how i am drawing you right now..

.. i got a kiss and a phone number from this hot chick in a coffee place, she caught me drawing her and came over. she asked me why i was drawing her and i told her because i liked her lips. :dance:

[swampbug]

ohh man!.... thats the best!

[antisleeper]

Originally posted by Landmate
I disagree 100%

same here. when i go life drawing i do the first sketch with out look at the paper to get used to observing the subject. if you spend to much time looking at the paper you end up making up parts which for me never works. each to there own i guess anyway

[swampbug]

During my figure drawing class I've really never made anyhting I'm happy with. It all looks liek crap. BUT, I pay more attention to what I'm looking at, all those humps, bumps and curves. My drawing may look wack, but the humps bumbps andcurves are all thier. So I later learn, how to make the hump bumps and curves pretty, even if its out of my head. So for me, drawing what I see and jsut doing it helps more than... looking at the paper. I dont know if that made sence. but I feel like sayign hump bumps and curves again.


Humps bumps and curves.

[JecaTatu]

oh yes, a lovely thread this one. I love to go around and fill up sketch books with random observations.
-->Erik: first of all, let me just say that you are very fortunate to be living in an area where there are tons of people walking around, sitting in cafes and parks and what not. I've lived in a small desert town two hours out of las vegas for a long time where everyone drives and don't hang out on the sidewalk due to the dangers of heat stroke and what not. So i'd usually go into malls, stores, churches, libraries, or wherever people gather. I've had many experiences like killing.people did. Most of the time if someone notices me sketching away, they'll either keep moving out of their own shyness, or when they approach me, it's with curiosity and interest. Most people are flatered that I would draw them. sometimes i whip out something quickly for them and let them keep the sketch (yes, it's a good way to meet girls too). At a church i used to frequent, so many people knew that i drew the speakers that sometimes members of the congregation would confess to me that they looked forward to speaking assignments so that they could be added to my sketchbook (although some did admit to not wanting to speak for the same reason) Anyway, my point is that artists are uncommon enough to not be viewed as some sort of deviant type of thing. Most people welcome the breath of fresh air that we bring to their lives. Art is so engrained in our souls and daily lives that sometimes we forget its significance to the worlds accountants, waitresses, and homemakers. So i say, get out there and bring the joy!

[jester]

Erik, just try a children's playground! That's what I do quite regularly and I find that children are much more relaxed than adults. But expect to be surrounded by a small crowd of them little buggers from time to time ;) they can be very curious... Also a good chance to draw their parents or older bros and sis who accompany them. (Go to my sketchbook in the Daily Sketchbook section [last page] and take a look - most are only partly finished but this doesn't matter)

Jester

[Erik]

Hello people

Thanks for all the encouragements... I'm still weaning (sp?) myself from the shyness slowly taking 5 minutes at a time ;-)

As for meeting girls: 1. my girlfriend would not allow me, and 2. my life drawing sucks too much ;-) but the summer is coming up!

Hmm.. i never realised that it is entirely possible to live somewhere where there is no people to draw. I must make the best of this and not waste it...

[JecaTatu]

you know... girlfriends are great subjects for drawing from life. The hard thing about that is that you may feel compelled to do a really great job and become intimidated and worry that it won't be perfect. Well, put that aside and just draw her. If she pesters you that it doesn't look good, well, that's probably not good, but I'd say that most times the good ones will be really supportive of you and jump at the request to be drawn. yah, so there's a perfect opportunity for life drawing right in the palm of your hand! yep.

[egerie]

it also helps when your gf/bf used to be a live session model ;) (long difficult poses wooh!)

[Erik]

My first attempts ... since they're not worthy i wont make a new thread for these ;-) but i have to post something to make myself continue.

http://www.xs4all.nl/~erikedf/art/sketch/schets1.jpg
http://www.xs4all.nl/~erikedf/art/sketch/schets2.jpg
http://www.xs4all.nl/~erikedf/art/sketch/schets3.jpg

Sorry i still have no scanner :-(

[jester]

See, it wasn't that bad and scary, was it?!

Congratulations on your sketches, just carry on!

Jester

[Rohan]

Hey Erik I had hese kinda problems for ages. Plenty of subjects and with trains you find very interesting people from varied age groups, cultural background etc but trying to sketch them quickly and accurately without being noticed is a skill I have the rest of my lifetime to master..I used to give up expecting that I wouldnt be able to draw accurately enough at such speed and was waiting for my hand skills to develop to make it possible. I also had the problem of my sketching materials being too conspicuous.

Well my hand skills have improved a little now,
I can say that keeping just one pencil and a small pad (even a postitpad or wads of cheap crappy paper no bigger than pocket size) is really great for this purpose, and has made all the difference with my recent attempts.. with something that size, u can just whip it out even when the trains crowded and people think your making notes most of the time. much better suited than a full size sketchpad for me as it helps me focus on the most important stuff... knowing that detail and complex shading is pretty much out of the question.

occasional glancing (as opposed to constant observation)at the subject can be good and bad. I agree with what landmate said if observational studies are your main aim, but I quite often will fill in a couple of details from memory after the subject has gone, to somewhat complete what I had intended to draw. , but in order to develop that ability at first I believe that spending as much time looking is paramount. I'm prob not quite there yet :p

Most of the time I try not to finish the drawings too much.. I find it detracts from the act of looking and I seem to get the best results when I just focus on a getting few lines down of various thickness over 15, 20 secs this way you stay fresh and get more drawings done too :)

As long as the eye rules the hand, and memory and imagination are used to extend and not replace what is being studied.. then it's all good IMHO.. except for when the mind plays it's objective/subjective tricks but thats what the discpline of drawing can help you control!

I think I just re-inforced other peoples points mainly but theres my two bob.

nice drawings so far.. keep it up and thanks for sharing your experience on this.

Rohan

[julien]

i don't know if this has been answered yet, but 'busking' is doing some art form in public for money. street musicians are buskers, so are those dudes that walk around on stilts or whatever.

keep going erik!

[xulamon]

i work a bar job and am able to sit and sketch for a few hours before it get's realy buisy. often people see my stuff and ask if it's someone i know, usualy a portrait of a friend. a great trick is to find someone to do a portrait of you at the same time you do thiers, makes for an intense sitting and people will wonder if your at odds with eachother. sleeping girlfriends are always great subject matter. and she dosen't have to be offended afterwards, "ew, you made my nose too big." that type of stuff. coffie houses, and libraries are a big favorite of mine, but it's hard to get the eyes as they are usualy immersed in some book or work of some sort, same goes for the sleepers. busking you can usually do just about anywhere as long as you only ask for donations! as soon as you put a price tag on it the athorities usualy check to see if you have a permit tax license and the usual runarround they give to pan handlers, know your spot! i usualy do a quick scetch of the person and work on filling in the details later, inking, color and the like. ask your friends as they are usualy open to you starring at them and flattered to sit. of course getting busted for drawing someone has it's up's and downs. especially when they don't know. the game is fun but having them know is better, the subject will sit for longer, which is not easy in itself for people to do. lately i have people asking to be scetched and not enought time to do it. which sucks especially when she's cute! take some advise from mr. android jones, my own personal protrait guru and do a few of yourself, as your always there and you wont offend yourself as easily as starring at the cute girl all day, while trying to be sneeky about it. be open with what you do and those that matter will make themselves known. hope this helps, i know it's a little beyond the time line of when you first asked but i thought i might be able to help.
vincent

[Erik]

Hey thanks guys!

I recently found out there is a zoo nearby and there are far more people in zoos than animals ;-)

Many tips here, i'll try to post something i did soon but i have to practice more.

[jester]

Erik, don't be shy of posting either!

Jester

[Phait]

I recently bought a Visioneer 6600 flatbed scanner, 48 bit, 600 x 1200 dpi, and OCR (scans text/converts to text) - for only $50 USD new - and it works quite nicely. It's my recommendation - other's may have others, but since no one mentioned anything.. I'm recommending ;)

I'm sure you can get it internationally, I would hope.

http://www.visioneer.com/Products/flatbed/6600usb/home.asp

[S13Drifter]

Hey erik, everyones had your same problems when first drawing from life. And i realise it is really hard to process all that information and translate it onto your paper in mere seconds. But keep at it, try and fill like 20 pages a week if you can. because theres about 1000 bad drawings you need to get out b4 you can get to the good ones. And in terms of drawing people the most important thing to get down is their gesture. Dont really concern yourself to much with the outside contour lines. your first couple strokes should be quick gestural lines to define the pose and the attitude. I'd suggest you take a look at Glen Vilppu's gesture drawings. And good luck, we're all supporting you.

[Lost Dragon]

Someone had this problem in another forum and his solution was fairly clever in my opinion: wear mirrored (or dark) sunglasses. The people you're sketching won't really know what you're looking at. :D