beauty in the detail?

[eli]

hello! this is my first post... i have migrated from eatpoo.com. i really like it here. great artists and inspiration here!

i have never taken any art classes before and i work full time so my only learning resources are the forums and the web.

i practice everyday and am totally obsessed with art. i have been at it for 8 months now, however, i have hit a major wall and need some advice.

i realize i suck with color, but following are two examples of my recent s.p.o.d. pics, inspired by androids work.....
i am at a loss for understanding how to get beyond the "slightly detailed" stage. i am not sure how artists get such fine detail..... i would love to hear some hints and suggestions about how to 'finish' a painting... how to detail it. its simply not enough to just 'zoom' in and detail it... i still end up with all my art looking scratchy... i plan on working more on my value skills with just chalk and paper as jason manley suggested to another noob. but in the meantime any help or suggestions with painter brushes, fine detail, and color would be totally awesome!

these were done with painter 7... i mainly use photoshop 7 but am trying to learn painter.. i have the same problem no matter what program i use. thanks in advace for any help.

first painter image ever.
http://www.sepatown.com/self/aug28.jpg

this second one was just for fun... i wanted to make the face look chisled and cracked but instead i couldnt get it right so i just fizzled and cracked.
http://www.sepatown.com/self/aug29a.jpg

[loken]

That first one is really nice..

Well, uhm, I dont think you need to go into super detail. Like, you dont need to paint every pore on a face or every blemish. :p If you look at a lot of great artists work, they dont paint that much detail. They paint the illusion of detail. They give just enough information to the viewer to suggest the texture of a thing, and no more than is needed. To much detail confuses the viewer. Also constrain the most detailed area to the area you want the viewer to notice first.

Firstly, I would suggest tightening up your shapes. After you have the colors you want down, try your best to define the shapes with the correct edges. Scribbled edges appear as well.. scribbled edges. Theres a difference between controlled looseness (which is actually very precise shape design with excellent value control) and sketchiness.

Secondly, a lot of the subtle details in say, a head painting, are caused by whats underneath. The bone and muscle. Study some anatomy and look for where bone and muscle pop out. You can also exagerate them a bit to get the feeling of form more across.

[eli]

hey thanks loken!!!!

i appreciate the feed back.... i hope i am not acting too much like a noob, but i really want to learn how to painting. i took your advice and tried to work on major shapes and less scribble. i also limited my colors to a less saturated value. its a little under "cooked" but ah well. it must have all worked cuz this one looks more like me than any of the others i have done so far! i am really happy with it.

can anyone else give me a hand? i am faithful and will try anything. i practice everyday till i get it right.... so if anyone could give me some direction i would really appreciate it.

http://www.sepatown.com/self/aug30a.jpg

[eli]

i am still trying to refine myself. working mainly on what loken said.... thanks again loken! i just want to get better. wish i could get some more critiques here. maybe a little suggestion on color or detail? please?

http://www.sepatown.com/self/aug31.jpg

[Dan.v.D.]

well i´m really shitty at painting but i think that for example the detailing attempt in the second image doesn´t look to convincing since the contrast is to high compared to the contrast of the whole face u know

detail follows the same rules as everything else does and since it´s in it´s nature to be rather small it has to defined even more exact. try to apply that what u have done in image nr.3 to it.

hmm i hope that makes any sense :rolleyes:

and thank u for that topic since it made me think about the things u mentioned and i hope to profit from it as well

keep it up

[GrimmAme]

Details aren't everything in SOME pictures.
Like your paitnings of humans here, human skin is generally smooth with few details that you need to pay attention to, but things like the hair - or the eyes, need attention.
The best I can say is - for learning details, you have to learn the textures of what you're drawing, and you have to have PATIENCE to do it, or you'll lose interest/it won't come out good.
For your drawings above -I reccomend blending the colors to get a smooth texture (use layers), and use the dodge tool to make highlights, and use the burn tool to make shadows.
If you've only been drawing for 8 months so far, you don't need to start worrying about details just yet! You gotta learn the basics, all the things an artist needs to know in order to make things good, like anatomy, perspective, and observation and critique.
Practice means everything in the art world, that's all I can say ~_^

Oh yeah - one last thing, there's tons of small small brushes you can use to make the details if you want. Use those small brushes to make small strands of hair, and vary the colors of those lines to give change around the picture.
Now I'm done XD

[keyth]

hey eli. this is keyth from the guest self-portrait section. you should post these over in our main guest page in andrews self-portrait section. we all help each other out and andrew comes in sometimes to offer advice as well. there are a few of us doing it everyday as well....could be a good chance to kick it up a notch.:chug: