intro

[Android]

Painter 7 is the first program I open in the morning and the last program I close before I go to sleep.
While I was at Siggraph last week I met with Wesley Pack Graphics Manager of Procreate , he was very helpfull in anwsering all my painter 7 questions, and very excited to hear my feedback on his software. I encourage everyone to share thier experience with painter 7 here, whats your favorite thing about it? how does it apply to your workflow? and what kind of features would you like to see added to Painter 8? if you have questions about painter 7, or have found problems with it you would like to adress, this is the place for that too.

Painter 7 is my bread and butter when it comes to digital art. I dont know what I would do without it. With our feedback we can help Wesley make the next painter even more groundbreaking than the previous version.


thanks

Android

[Deth Jester]

Quick edit for Josh, You can reload previous version brushes I think.. Have you tried that yet??? Give it a shot..

One of my biggest problems.. is the menu sizes..

You can't colapse them horizontally only vertically to make for more workspace area... I constantly use the layers menu so I dont like to close it.. *havent bother to learn hot keys* but it would be nice if I could decrease the size of the menus.

I have to use it later today and post some ideas... cause I always have ideas...

OH! I like to load custom pallettes, but everytime I close the program I have to reload them, and I tried saving my layout, but when I load that layout, it just opens up the default pallete, and none of the other ones.. Any ideas?

Question about wet paint.. for some odd reason when I use the wet brushes and make a long stroke it takes a huge amount of time to load.. Anythoughts? *Ill try and come up with a more indepth description of the situation*

Layers menu: I like how in photoshop you can combine 2 layers, merge visible etc.. With Painter its very difficult.. you have to drop them to the canvas or cut and paste.. etc.. very agitating.. That would be a nice fix to have... *jsut thoughts*

*thinks of more*

[el coro]

painter 7. i guess i hate change, but i have a system that works in painter6, and none of the features i used are present on seven. i HATE the watercolor tool, and HATE the necessity for layers. i like my digital paintings short and sweet, and it seems painter 7 takes all the short and sweet out of it...if i wanted to spend time rendering, i'd do it traditionally. the same could be said about photoshop 7. i think the brush engine sucks ass, did anyone else use spacing? im a grumpy old man, and i long for the good old days.

[keyth]

man...ya gotta learn the hotkeys. i'm liking P7 just fine. As a matter of fact...i never open up Pshop any more.

[Madman!]

I have never used painter 7 but I get it in like 5 days. Does it have like layers like in photoshop and how is it as far as undos is it like unlimited?

[el coro]

its not about the hotkeys. its the discontinuation of certain features that sucks.

[Android]

. change can be scary but can also take your work to new directions if you let it. There are alot of things about 6 I liked too, in fact I still use 6 sometimes, the old water color brush was cool and I miss it but if you spend some more time the new water color brush in 7 its amazing, it behaves so organicly, my advice is start off slow, I use the wet eraser brush, set it to default settings, chose colors very light colors cuz they will turn out darker on the canvas. start experimenting with the water menu under the brush options, the dry rate is the money bar , moving this back and forth will significantly cut down the amount of time it takes to make the calculation, move the pickup and evaporation bars aroud too. yes this version of painter is more complicated but its worth it. its like a musical instrument you have to tune first but once you figured it out its rock and roll time, once you master the difference, the painter 7 watercolor tool is like an electric gutiar, and it makes painter 6 water colors look more like a banjo. if your stuck on the old watercolor tool, experiment with the tinting tool in seven, create a seperate layer above the canvas> set it to gel or multiply> paint on that layer with the tinting tool and it behaves very similar to the .
Coro I can tell by the way you jugle traditional media from ink to spraypaint to oils that you are a master of tools, treat the water color like a new tool instead of comparing it to the old one and Im sure you will be able to create some mind blowing stuff.;)

[Wizard of KOZ]

Like some one else stated I would like it if the layers behaved a bit more like the Photoshop layering system...complete with thumbnails.

This is not so much a new painter version question but a painter question in general...I tend to find painting in Painter to be a bit more sloppy then photoshop...any suggestions on how to make things a bit more consciece when painting in painter7?

[Android]

every time you open painter 7 open brush tracking under the prefrences, start drawing inside the box, this lets painter 7 get to know what kind of artist you are and how you make your strokes, I always open it up and draw something like an eyeball or a skull real fast and it tunes itself to the pressure I am custom to using with the wacom, I find painter to be infantly more sensative that photo-crop, I mean photoshop(just kidding, I love photoshop too, but I wont ever paint with it)

[N D Hill]

It's official... This forum is now complete!

When I work digitally I work exclusively with Painter. I've owned versions; classic, 4,5,6, and now 7. All of the digital artwork on my webpage was done with either Painter 6 or 7. This is a great idea!

I think it should also be encouraged, that if people want to share any of there tools, they should advertise it here. I'm always on the look out for whatever cool brushes people may make and put up on the web. When in doubt, you can count on at least me being interested. I've made my own brushes available on my website too.

I guess few complaints about Painter 7 would be, as was previously mentioned, the lack of Painter 6's water color brushes. Particularly the broad water brush. I really liked making washes with that and have had a really hard time imitating it with other brushes.

Also, I don't like how you can no longer merge layers that are set to different modes. You have to change them to the default in order to collapse them together. I work alot with shadow map layers and for the sake of simplicity, I'd like to be able to collapse my shadow-map greyscale layers together.

anyway, again, Awesome idea, Android. I'll be sure to stop in often.

Noel

[N D Hill]

Oh. A quick question; Where does one inquire about becoming a beta tester?

[Vhy]

I really think Painter could have a simpler interface. If they improve that aspect of the program more people will look forward to learning new versions.

[Oblio]

I'm the kind that uses a lot of software and while i'm just learning my way in painting I'm in need of demos

Imagine how this virtual school would look if the teachers could see the way I draw, and I could see a demo in exchange.
I don't think it's much trouble to make something like collect for output in the script area to gather all the needed data for a script to work on other computers.
Something to gather the images I use and everything in a folder and.. make it work there. You get the point.

Oblio

[Lunatique]

I use Painter in conjunction with Photoshop, and let me tell you, if Painter had better editing tools, I would drop Photoshop just like THAT *snaps finger*

The ONLY reason I use Photoshop is because it's easier and faster to perform editing.

For example:

1)doing things with layers is just much easier with PS. I can't even combine layers effectively in Painter.

2)I can flip the ENTIRE image horizontally in PS with all the layers, which is VERY IMPORTANT to an artist when trying to spot proportion mistakes.

3)Much more intuitive interface in PS. But, they kinda fucked it up with version 7. I hate version 7.

You see, Photoshop can't touch Painter when it comes to painting, but it kicks Painter's ass when it comes to ease of use and editing power.

I don't like having to use both 50/50 when I paint. It's a pain in the ass to work that way. So either Adobe or Procreate need to go out of their way to kick the other apps ass and TAKE OVER.

Whichever app can combine the power and ease of use of both apps will knock the other one out of the ring.

[keyth]

oh, el coro...sorry, the hotkey statement was directed to dethjuester.

[gekitsu]

vhy: painter's interface really seems to keep people off the prog.
it's true that it doesn't feature some fancy makeup or anything that could provide an easier start for users.
on the other hand, this interface is pure information and nothing else.
so, if you managed to survive the first few days in painter you won't have any other interface again. (like me).
i'm currently using painter 6 and find it very much better than any photoshop version i ever saw just for the sake of information being aligned in menus one after the other.
you know what you want to change then you know where to change it. scroll to that submenu, change it and you're done. no less used slider is hidden in some extra menus that'd focus elements down to frequently used ones.

although, painter and photoshop aren't really comparable. photoshpo is the all-around-solution for everything concerning graphic work, that also means editing and such.
painter, on the other hand is a pure brush engine without anything else. like a high power v-16 engine that is mounted in a raw chassis without mercedes-benz like comfort.

[Jason Manley]

the color adjustment tools in PS are stronger...if you need to do that kind of thing....seeing the adjust color changes inside a little window and not on the image is a pain....

painters brushes are amazing...in comparison to PS.

I long for the old watercolor tool in painter 7....the one from painter six. I will play with painter 7 some more in the near future...for now Im still enjoying six...

the grids are great....

net painter....anyone get this to work yet?

the other PIA is that when i scale images that they do not change in size until after i hit the enter key. this has to be fixed....if i want to scale down part of an image then i want to see how big it is. simple as that.

I use painter every day...its my drug of choice. Its the best painting program out there. period.

j

[Jason Manley]

i actually prefer painters interface to that of photoshop. the color wheel is more intuitive due to my traditional training...the brushes are easy to create, size, use...

plouffe...if you were painting everly day and actually made the attempt to use painter I think you would change your mind. I have painted in photoshop numerous times...each time wishing i was in painter. :) if you are trying to paint in photoshop then Id say you are trying to hammer nails with a wrench. You might as well use the right tool for the right job. tis just my opinion.


photoshop as a painting program is clumsy...the brushes are too unbrushlike. the lack of both the texture and chalks as well as no awtercolor tool makes painter the superior painting program.

photomanip in pshop vs painter is another story...but there is a reason its called PAINTer and photoshop is called PHOTOshop. simple as that.

[Jason Manley]

trust me plouffe...spend some more time with painter....

I remember when i was only traditional in my medias and the digital stuff drove me crazy. It was not until i started using painter every day that it became intuitive....if you dont use it every day it will not be intuitive.

it sounds to me like you are relying on what is familiar to you...instead of learning the program to its fullest.


photoshop is easy for you and is fast for you because you have used it a LOT in comparison to painter...I could be wrong here..but that is what it sounds like to me.


both programs are intuitive for me as i use them both every day. I simply speak from my own experiences with the programs.


j

[Jason Manley]

well..as i said...if you took the time to paint and learn the program you would find it much improved over your current program of choice for painting.

actually..the layers are much improved in painter over the older versions.

still...I do agree with your points you make.

have fun

j

[fonzanoon]

Maybe I am just the easiest person in the world to please, but I love both programs. Both painter 6 and seven(although, before andrew mentiond the fix for those slow friggin watercolors, I wanted to kill someone every time I had to watch the paint dry), and both photoshop 6 and 7.
Now granted I am not butter like the masters here but I happen to find my preference on a day to day basis. Some days I feel like a like a little sargeant brush and somedays I feel like some good ol' photoshop.
It like a good burger from two killer beef shacks they both taste like meat...mmm good meat, so I am happy!

also, on another note: I am sure that some of you have used discreets editing and paint packages. They have one feature that I would like to see appropriated into a new version of painter. There is a mixing pallet that behaves pigmentally. I love the idea of sloshing around my pallet while I work instead of sliding around that little dot. It would be great, you could mix down your colors(odor free!) hit the alt key to eyedrop the color and no worries about sliding out of your pre chosen range. Paraps they could allow the user to pick between the two blending methods(pigment and wavelength), or maybe even have both at the same time. That would be great for developing a shadow/light range and really pushing it.

that it.
enjoy the burgers!

[Jason Manley]

i like plenty of different kinds of art....not all of it is realistic ala bouguereau...or sargent.

plouffe...i have yet to see an image from you that could not have been done in painter if you knew how to use the program fluently....what i am speaking of has nothing to do with style...absolutely nothing.

i never said you couldnt paint....you have already told me in previous conversations that you do not paint enough. I simply said if you took the time to paint...and to use painter...that you would have a different feeling about it.

nobody is critisizing your abilities...or your artistic preferences...i think you are reading into this in ways that are not intended.

all i am saying is that painter is a far superior paint program on many levels. this is my opinion based on thousands of hours painting..nothing more.

photoshop has better layering systems and has better color adjustment tools....and as a painting program it will limit your options and your range of marks. If you are happy working with limited tools then so be it.

photoshop is a fantastic program...I think mullins proved that a million times over.

Im not a fan of photoshops paintings because of the lack of natural and almost chaotic look to the marks that their tools make.

I am however a huge fan of the matter painters and the other great imagery guys who use photoshop...just not a fan of the paintings from that program.

I like paintings that have interesting marks...not an overly similar mark of the airbrush tool from photoshop.

photoshops advantages (its ability to work with deep paint for example) make it an indespensible program...I love it too..its fun..it works...and its not as buggy as painter...what more can i say.

I DO think that painter and deep paint should team up...at least a good importer should be written for them. I do my textures in painter and have to export them to photoshop..save the file..and open it in painter...tis a PIA.


all in all i think each program has its advantages entirely...


j

[Deth Jester]

ADREW THANK YOU!!!! OMG!!! You just made the watercolor brush for me.. I HATED THAT THING!! NOW ITS GORGEOUS!!!! Its like Light and Day! WOW!! *have to do some stuff and post it.. * LOVING IT!!!!

Plouffe,

Quick questions for you. You said that photoshop is the best tool for the job for you. What kind of business are you in? or do you do your artwork just for you? Cause I completely agree if you can get a painting done a lot faster with photoshop go for it.. But if you are learning and experimenting etc.. and do art for fun and yourself... Then Id say put the extra time in with painter..

To be honest my program of choice is Illustrator! I come from a graphic design sort of background.. that is how I got into digital art... But I have been using photoshop since version 4.. I just got painter 7 about 2-3 months ago.. But I don't work in the industry and all my work is for me... My driving goal is that I like to learn.. and if I ever do get a job in it.. I want to be able to use every tool.. that is just how I am.. Also if you end up at a job and they only had painter for you to use.. you might be pulling your hair out...*doubtful situation*

*somehow I feel like a car salesman..am I trying to sell painter?.. hehe* no but honestly it is a truly powerful program and worth learning to use for what it is designed for... so if you have free time to spare and feel like learning..advancing..etc.. give it a whirl..

peace.

[Slater]

Plouffe.... Learning new software is like learning a new language. Its a pain in the ass to learn, but it can open doors for you later on.

I'm a photoshop user myself but I just got painter 7 recently and I'm still stumbling around with the interface and tools. I really want to see if Painter has what it takes to paint better than PS 7.

Does anyone know of any good tutorials for painter that might a help a guy out??

[McNallyism]

I, too, am a photoshop painter, though not because its a better program for painting. I figure there's a pretty good chance that any company that I apply for a job at will have a copy of photoshop for me. I can't count on them having painter. I've worked in painter 6.03 and thought it was really cool, but, like my electronic illustration teacher said, pretty much anything you can do in painter, you can do in photoshop. It might be a little more difficult to do, or less user friendly, but it can be done. I figure its better to just get used to photoshop than to rely on painter, at least for now.

[stephen]

the interface could use some improvements, like let the menus go out of the main window and stuf..... yeaaa... and other stuff like that :o

[Oblio]

like that [Ctrl]+H to hide the menus - how did they ever though of that? Can anyone do that with one hand?

Oblio (is anyone in charge looking at this - I wonder)

[ceenda]

If Painter had a directly additive brush like Photoshop, then I would be strongly tempted to go back to Painter.

What do I mean by directly additive?

When you draw a line with a brush, curve round and go over that line again in one stroke, Painter adds up all the colours.

Photoshop, I presume, works on a "greater than or equal" method where, unless you press harder on the stylus, you WON'T overwrite the line you've allready done in one stroke.

This is why I use photoshop on alot of Painter work... the functionality of the Photoshop brush is amazing for detailed work.

http://www.apab03.dsl.pipex.com/example.jpg

Go on... be daring... call it the "Photoshop brush"... :p

[quantas]

can someone tell me what the difference between painter classic and painter 7 is?

[ceenda]

quantas:

1) Layers. Painter Classic doesn't have layers, or at least doesn't have layer handling in the way Painter 7 does.

2) Perspective Grid. Useful for setting up composition for scenes.

3) Impasto tools. Paint builds up, allowing for nifty effects with lighting etc.

4) More tools and brushes.

5) Watercolour and Liquid Ink brushes.

Worth downloading the demo just to play around with it.

[Jason Manley]

mcnallyism....your digital media teacher..or whatever he was...he is completely and totally WRONG...you can tell him i said so.

he must not have been a painter.

I can NOT make my images in photoshop simply because of three simple facts. Chalk tool...Watercolor Tool...and the much more sensitive brushes.

the photoshop brush..every mark it makes looks exactly the same..either its a linear mark with fuzzy edges or its a linear mark with circular ends and sharp edges.

that little transparent mark comparison...above...those transparent marks do wonders for me as i paint...pulsing pressures of shart to soft...light to dark...thin to thick (scratchboard tool)...opaque to transparent...Like i said in the previous posts...the brushes are superior in painter...throw in a little chaos and natural mark making with the chalk tool..and a little color variation with the watercolor brush and you are good to go.

photoshop cant do any of that. I can smell a photoshop painting from a mile away...sure it's an image..but it's air brush tool is just way too predictable in its mark making abilities to be of any interest to me. I like interesting marks...painter gives me those..even if i can see if its a painting done in painter.

j


j

[AndrewMyers]

anyway, here's my two cents:

I use Photoshop 6 mainly. I have used both PS and Painter *(up to both newest versions) and I like both programs to a very high degree. But I end up using PS6 the most. There are many reasons behind this, mostly because of little superficial things. PS7 is nice, but it's lost some very specific features of PS6 that, as a game artist, I use every day. For instance, in PS6, if you have a brush that's set to change only the size of the brush depending on pressure, then if I lay down a really light mark, I'll get a very thin, but still 100% opaque mark. In PS7, however, if I try doing this same thing (only letting pressure affect size, and nothing else), when I get to a really small level of pressure, it manages to make the mark slightly more transparent AND fuzzy! That makes the creation of very clean video game graphics a bit more difficult.

But anyway, back to Painter, which is what I'm really talking about. There are many great things that I love about Painter, such as the fact that you've got total control over every aspect of your brush (PS7 is getting better, but still nowhere close to the power of Painter 7). But there are some things that just tick me off. For instance:

First, why can't I drag toolsets outside of the program window, like I can in Photoshop? I've got a great setup in PS6 where all of my tools are on a second monitor, allowing me to have only the painting on the first monitor, and I can make the Navigator view large, so maybe I can have a full size preview on one screen while working with a super-zoomed in version on the other. You can't do this is Painter (or at least I don't know how), so I'm constantly hitting CTRL-H just to bring the menus in and out - very frustrating.

Second, what's with the incompatibility of EVERYTHING outside of Painter to be able to view .RIF files? I mean, Painter has been around for at least 10 years, you'd think by now that at least ACDSee would be able to view them. But no. As it stands, I'm absolutely forced to convert my images into other formats if I want to be able to show them to anyone without having to install Painter on their computer (which has happened before, and I assure you, wasn't fun).

Anyone? Maybe I just haven't delved deep enough into the program.

-Andrew

[gekitsu]

Originally posted by Oblio
like that [Ctrl]+H to hide the menus - how did they ever though of that? Can anyone do that with one hand?

yeah, i can do without major problems.

place small finger on ctrl, place index finger on h. it isn't even a stretching that is very unnatural or painful.
i must admit, i have about 3mm fingernails on my left hand and i use them :)

that's most likely a special german ability to press shortcuts like that easily :) ctrl+z (the most important shortcut) on a german keyboard equals ctrl+y on an american one. anyone say stretching? *g

as for painter 8: i'd love to have a chaos checkbox.
yoji shinkawa, the metal gear solid concept artist once said about painter that it is impressive what its brushes can do but it lacks random things like inkbrush's bristles spreading in an unexpected way, a quickly ducted bruch leaving one or two small ink splurts and things like that.
those little chaotic incidences...

[Android]

plouffe - read Dr, Seuss Green Eegs and Ham, I think you have alot to learn.

the way i see it painter and photoshop do a great job of complimenting eachother, I always have both open simultanesouly and bring an image back and forth constantly, my rendering sketching, painting and color work are done in painter/ i use photoshop to clean up scans, configure my canvas and crop my composition, it awesome for combibing two seperate paintings in made in painter together, its also nice for transforming and adjustion perportions and balanceing images, filters rule, and i love adjusting contrast in levels . and it is superior in configuring printouts. both programs share things like painting options and layers, this helps the programs overlap eachother but each have a siginifacnt value of thier own.
instead of wasting time arguing about wich is better lets talk about how powerfull they are when you combine thier powers together. they are both great tools that give artists more options to explore thier indivudal creativity. as far as im concerned they are not involved it a competition but rather a colabaration. if you havent yet spent enough significant time in painter that you are missing out on how photoshop can enhance an image that takes advantage of painters strengths. if you dont use these programs together that you are not fulflling your digital artistic potential.

how do other artists out there combine Painter and photoshop into thier work flow?

[Deth Jester]

Andrew...

Ditto! Have them both open... I normally save as a .PSD so I can take my painter file back and forth and combine layers.. *the hue, lightness. something else... and contrast. brightnest tools in photoshop are my friend...* Also I love the transformation tools in photoshop.. so fast and easy....Quick mask as well... OH!!! You wouldnt beleive how nice that is....

But I have to admit I think that photoshop is my crutch... I want to learn to work on one layer..So that is what I have been doing lately.. I try to only use other layers for foreign objects... or if Im in a hurry do my background on one layer, and charecters on the other...

One filter I really like better in painter than photoshop is the lighting effect tool... Kinda weird.. but I like it better on painter...

oh another nice thing in photoshop is the button on the historys menu that allows you to start a new file from current state... That is really nice if you have an idea and dont want to do a ton of undo's.. you can just start a new file... I use that everyonce in a while... Also the actions menu.. *I have ones for rotate 90's... resize image to 800pixels in height* And a few others... *oh a quick thumnail button* list goes on...

OH!! and with the selection process.. I love SELECT SIMILAR, Modify select.. Expand Contract,,,! that saves me a ton of time... I agree having both is a win win situation.

Anyhow just felt like sharing my thoughts...again.

peace.

OH and save for web rulez!

[worm]

lol.. green eggs and ham

i think the people bashing Painter wouldnt after doing 4 or 5 years of traditional painting.
i have more respect for people who can paint realistically with traditional media.. but thats just me..
:rolleyes:

[stephen]

fix the lame zoom tool... gawd....

[Blankfrank]

I'm printing this thead, some good painter tips buried here. I can't get it to work right for me yet, but maybe these will help.

Weird, but for some reason I can't explain, The application of color feels smoother, buttery or more liquid than Photoshop....I dunno maybe I'm crazy but there shouldn't be a tactile sensation like that on a computer program. An illusion? Anybody notice this? nahh.:confused:

[ceenda]

On a similar note, has anyone noticed problems with saturation in Painter?

i.e. pics look fine when you do them, but when you look at them in Photoshop or IE they look faded.

[Jason Manley]

there is a color setting in your photoshop that is incorrectly...i forget the name however...if it is set wrong then the image will look different entirely...i had the same prob..and a co worker fixed it for me. I cannot remember what the exact situation was.


sorry i cant be of any other help.

j

[AndrewMyers]

It's probably a problem with the Color Management Setup, found in the "Edit" Menu. (I think Shift-Crtl-K but I can't remember)... I had this same problem. If you're not trying to make your graphics look like they're going to appear on some other medium ASIDE from a computer monitor (ie a television screen, PAL or NTSC, a movie screen, for print, etc), then you might as well just turn the color management to OFF altogether. It seems like it should help, but in actuality if you want to make what you're working on be as close as possible to what other people on other computers are going to see, it doesn't do much good to have it on.

Andrew

[Sketch]

This is a question for Andrew and Jason...
Which exact watercolour brushes do you guys use in Painter? Also if you guys get anytime, I'd love to hear your complete process in painter. Thanks a whole bunch guys!

[Oblio]

Since they will make scalable toolbars ;) it would be nice to put a brush preview around there. While you modify the spacing or other params. it is nice to see it realtime (Photoshop 7 style). It will save a lot of time. Right now, i have to check right after every modif. doing a stroke :(

Oblio

[brokencow]

this one is for andrew jones...
What are you favorite brushes that you use for most of your paintings, and would you mind posting them?!!?
please!! pretty please...i won't use painter inless you post them..

this is all so confusing...

[Don]

http://seegmillerart.com/Images/girl-with-a-curl.jpg

There is nothing better than Painter for digital painting.

Shamless plug. I am just bout finished with my book to be published this fall. Tis about character design and digital painting. There will be lots of tutorials and demos. If you will go to the link http://seegmillerart.com/Images/girl-with-a-curl.jpg and click on the image you will see a 4 meg quicktime movie how I painted this image. This is an old image and will not be inthe book.

regards
Don
www.seegillerart.com

[Don]

sorry, correct link
http://seegmillerart.com/Images/girl-with-a-curl.htm

[Don]

sorry again
http://seegmillerart.com/girl-with-curl.htm

[Nordstrand, T]

[Even more sorry Don, The page cannot be found ;)]

Edit: Ah, the last link did the trick. You can edit your post by clicking "Edit" in the far right corner of your post.

Thanks a bunch!

[Don]

:D
I am a little slow but eventually did notice that rather obvious button on the right.

Don

[gekitsu]

good to have the almighty don around here, finally :)

so glad to hear that your book is developing well. i can't wait to finally buy it.

[madster]

Honestly it has a lot of punch and a lot of potential, but there are a thousand little things that just irritate the hell out of the graphics power user...

Palette dialog windows like Mosaic that are big and klugy and not resizable. No keytroke for New Layer. Inability to lock the canvas. Having to confirm every save. Preferences that have to be accessed every single time, instead of a simple "next"/"previous" button command...

The creativity Painter offers is what made me buy it, but I waited 2 years before giving in, and wonder if I still was too impulsive. I am learning from scratch with 7, so have no painter habits to overcome, but my Photoshop experience makes me oh so critical for ease of access like you-know-who provides...

The first and biggest thing procreate could do would be to shoot whoever is the webmaster for Painter. Then, they should burn the code for that STUPID FLASH INTRO, get archived tutorials up, posted and linked, and have someone, ANYONE from procreate get online once a week and answer some questions. SHOW THE CUSTOMER THAT YOU GIVE A DAMN, PROCREATE... The 'Net community has long commented on procreate's lack of interaction with the customer, so make an effort to show you DO care. Something kinda dramatic yet effective, like providing access to all the Painter tutorials procreate acquired from Metacreations in the Corel acquisions...

C'mon, I dare ya.... I double dare ya....

[bytemap]

wow, very interesting thread on painter.

i'm a photoshop freak to say, been using it since version 4. but i must admit, painter's variety and naturalstic feel bring back what i can't afford in real traditional material.

i've only been using painter for a few days. literally. got it as a gift from a friend who use to see me paint and spend gobs of money on supplies that would need to be refilled on a weekly basis.

anyway, i will admit, painter seems daunting at first but from what i've seen with what seegmiller and andrew doing, it looks like one heck of a powerhouse. however photoshop has it's advantages in itself, just look at mullins work and your mouth will drop. these are only a few of the many artist i imagin out there that are taking advantage of these programs.

i will try to learn as much as i can because i want to be at those guys level. the art is just astounding.

on a side note, i wish maybe in future versions in painter that they had an eyedrop tool, would make color picking a bit easier, but maybe that's the photoshop freak in me calling out.

mr. seegmiller, can't wait till you come out with your book. Best of luck man.

[prismacolor]

I agree with madster on the procreate/painter website. SHEESH! Chill with the arty/cool flash stuff and make it simple and accessible. Like it took me a couple of minutes to figure out you could scroll those stupid little windows....

madster - mostly agree with you on the irritating things, but for quick saving, try keyboard command "control+S"(PC) ...works fast for me.

bytemap - hold down the "alt"(PC) or "opt"(MAC) key while in your painting and click - the dropper tool appears for color-picking. The dropper tool is also in your "tools" palette, but the keyboard commands are generally quicker. I think Jason said learning Painter is like learning to play an instrument --I'd say it's pretty true --learning the keyboard shortcuts is part of that process but more than worth the effort.

[Smeagol71]

Hey Don...just wanted to thank you for posting. Your book is on my Amazon wish list and will be an absolute and definite purchase! Your book is one of the very few out there that address the whole digital phenomenon as it relates to character and conceptual design. I'm really looking forward to it and know I will benefit from your hard work. Can't wait to get it!!!!

[the horror]

whats goin on, i've been visiting these forums for a while but never really spoke out, i'm an animation major in school but dream of being as good at drawing/sketching/traditional as some of you guys. I use photoshop because thats what i was taught but i see some of the amazing things you guys do with painter and am awe struck at the speedpaints and renderings you come up with, so i picked up a copy of Painter 7. Now all i gotta do is learn it.... theres my question

does anyone know of any good online tutorials where i could learn some of this stuff, i'm pretty fluent with photoshop, dont get me wrong, i'm not a master, but will what i know in PS help me with painter?

if you dont know of any tutorials, how about some good books?

thanx
horror.

[prismacolor]

There's some good tutorials on the Painter CDs, I'd start there. Then, take a look at the "Painter 7 wow book"
http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg/detail/-/0201773627/qid=1034202003/sr=1-1/ref=sr_1_1/104-2257114-0114357?v=glance

Both Don and Jeremy's books are due out in December
http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg/detail/-/0240805119/qid=1034202003/sr=1-3/ref=sr_1_3/104-2257114-0114357?v=glance

http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg/detail/-/1584502320/qid=1034202171/sr=1-1/ref=sr_1_1/104-2257114-0114357?v=glance

Also, go to Jinny's site; that'll link you up with a lot of online resources:

Jinny Brown

PixelAlley Links - Jin's Painter Classes
see http://www.pixelalley.com
or the PixelAlley Section Links Page at:
http://www.pixelalley.com/pixelalley-sections-pages.html
Visit us in the Painter Forum at In Depth Discussions: http://www.critical-depth.com/cgi-bin/idd/

If you haven't done so already, look at the tutorials on this site as well as the technique area.
Here's a link to get you started (look at Don's post - oops if you've already seen it)
http://www.conceptart.org/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=900
OR
http://www.conceptart.org/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=1024

Happy painting!