post your anatomy studies!

[nil]

i am struggling quite a lot at the moment with muscle structure, and im sure i must not be the only one. i have been doing some studies to try and uderatnd the muscles of the chest and arms recently, but all i have to work from is a reprint of the original 'Gray's Anatomy' which isnt as...comprehensive as id like. i have trouble seeing how the muscles look from different angles and how they move and change shape as the body moves. so, post your anatomy work! anything at all, im sure everyone has something to learn so get posting!

[davi]

try looking for bridgmen's complete life drawing book, i think it's alot easier to see the actually muscle forms and such. I also suggest the book "visualizing muscles" by john cody; It has pictures of a life model one page will have him doing the pose and the other page will have him doing the pose but covered in paint that shows where all the muscles are in the body. I find it insanely helpful... i don't think i have any pictures to post though, just ramble..

[nil]

im too poor to afford these "books" you speak of...i guess ill have to "borrow" them from the library :P

thx anyway :)

[espaki]

Check this thread: http://www.conceptart.org/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=169. You can find most of the loomis books throught this.

-Nate

[davi]

bridgemen art books are like $6-$15

[rubygenesis]

Hi my name is kierston, grooveholmes invited me to join conceptart.org and wow there is some wicked talent in here!
life drawings!

nude 2-5 minutes (pencil)
http://www.infinitejackass.com/rubygen/nudemodel-1.jpg

nude 30 seconds (pencil)
http://www.infinitejackass.com/rubygen/nudemodel-3.jpg

nude 1-3 minutes (ballpoint pen)
http://www.infinitejackass.com/rubygen/nudemodel-4.jpg

[nil]

thanks for all the replies! keep em coming guys! :D

[redehlert]

hey nil,

here's a few good books to choose from for anatomy/musculature:

'human anatomy for artists: the elements of form' by eliot goldfinger
'visualizing muscles: a new ecorché approach to surface anatomy' by john cody, md.

both are excellent and fairly current references for ya to choose from!

peace!

ps. these do cost some dough....save your pennies, it's worth it really!
pss. another good item to go get is a book on greek sculpture - there you can see detailed muscles in the phsically fit!
psss. pm me if you want some anatomical info on the pec and biceps

[nil]

redehlert: here is that pic i was talking about. this was drawn from Grays anatomy like i said before, just trying to sort it out in my head. anyways this is what im trying to figure out:

http://nil1.netfirms.com/armmuscles.gif

[bonedog]

Ok. Here's the scoop as far as I can tell. I took an art anatomy class... and the teacher was a great instructor and an an excellent sculptor. He said anatomy was a lifelong study, so get used to it. You'll always be reviewing and learning new things about the body. Draw plates... and then try to draw them from memory. It's a huge subject... just keep at it.

I have a ton of anatomy books. I find that a lot of the newer ones give you FAR less bang for the buck. If you spend $40-$50 you can get one new fancy book with very pretty photographs but overall isn't that great, or you can get 3-4 used books that are just loaded with great information and have a lot of bang for the buck. Here are some of my favorites:

Artistic Anatomy by Paul Richer has the clearest plates of any anatomy book I've seen. If I want to do a copy of the leg from the side, this is the book I'll use. It also has a large amount of plates... It has probably about 16 views of the arm, while many books just have four. The only drawback is that the text is separate from the pictures.

Atlas of Human Anatomy for the Artist by Stephen Rogers Peck. A ton of information... well-organized. Under $20.

Drawing the Head & Figure by Jack Hamm. Wow. This one was a sleeper hit. I had it on my shelf for years and thought it was a cheesy 50s figure drawing book. Not so. I don't know if there's a better book out there for less than $10. I don't like the packaging and style of the book, but the information is really great. It's a figure drawing book that talks a lot about anatomy... while the others are more strictly anatomy books.

The Human Figure by Jack Vanderpoel. Try and find a used old copy from back in the day... the plates are better than the Dover reprint. The information is almost impossible to read... but I think you can learn a lot just by looking at how he drew things. Again... a great source for not much money.

And Bridgman.

I also like the Vilppu drawing manual.

I'm sure that's too much already. Just remember you can get a lot more for your money if you buy older used books. And don't neglect the bones!

Here are a couple of my typical anatomy studies... nothing fancy.

-bone

http://www.similarselection.org/aaron/otherimages/rightarm.jpg

http://www.similarselection.org/aaron/otherimages/shoulder.jpg

[redehlert]

Hiya Nil!

Just a quick look at the anatomy thus far....thanks for posting a sampler!

I agree with a previous post regarding this being a life long subject. I work on anatomy all day (usually moreso internal antomy than external, but the same rules apply to constant research/reading/practicing/etc.) I also agree with the thought on the new books (although not all are bad) not having too much bang for the bucko. There are a few (see earlier post by me) that are friggin' sweet! Worth at least a look-see.

Okay....musculature initial thoughts:

• the deltoid muscle (sits on the shoulder) is rather huge for the arm. Perhaps the problem is that there is a muscle missing on the outside (lateral aspect) of the arm. You have biceps brachii, biceps brachialis, and the internal aspect of the arm shows the coracobrachialis and medial and long heads of the triceps. So....what's missing? Triceps means having three heads....so what you're missing is the lateral head of the triceps muscle in your figure (this may help flesh out that divot in the arm).
• get into that book you own and look for the origin and insertion points of the muscle. Also, study the bones of upper extremity and chest/thoracic area. This will get you acclimated to studying how bone and muscle interlock/connect/fit/etc...As it stands in your figure, the anterior head of the deltoid muslce is going almost mid-line of the body, whereas in all actuality, it starts/originates about 1/3 of the lateral clavicle. Feel on your own deltoids in the front to see if the connection is at the throat or mid-clavicle...you'll feel it for yourself. I may be reading your drawing wrong....that may be a portion of pec major there in the bold line stroke, but since the rest of pec major is faded back, I'm assuming deltoid.
• Just some additional facts on the deltoid to root it into the arm: there is a bony ridge on the lateral aspect of the humerus (arm bone) called the deltoid tuberosity. This is where the deltoid's tendon connects the muscle to the bone. This tuberosity's location is about halfway down the shaft of the humerus. So, if you know the length of the humerus in relation to the rest of the body you are creating, you can safely insert that deltoid and be all squared away.

I will go into more detail later...have to get back to work....but in the interim, a few items to look into are the pectoral major muscle and the trapezius. Study the origin and insertion points of each muscle and how the relate to other muscles and the bones they attach to.

It's a lot of work, Nil....I'm learning something new all the time and I have my masters in this shite!! I may be a medical illustrator, but that doesn't mean I'm as good as some of the other fine artists showing anatomy illustrations....I'm constantly seeking to improve myself.
; )
You're off to a great start! Will write more later!

Cheers!

Originally posted by nil
redehlert: here is that pic i was talking about. this was drawn from Grays anatomy like i said before, just trying to sort it out in my head. anyways this is what im trying to figure out:

[nil]

:eek: :eek: wowzers, more info?! :eek: :eek:

nah, thats aaawesome. thanks for all the info so far :D stuffs a bit hectic at school this week, but when i next have a chance ill definitely go over all the structure and insertion points etc and post some more pics as i go.

bonedog: sounds as if im goibng to have to go rummaging in second hand book strores, not that i mind doing that!!:)

it all seems so much simpler from outside the skin...looks like i have a log way ahead of me. thx again for all the replies everyone :)

[redehlert]

Hey Nil and other interested indies....

I finally scanned in one of two books I have recommended for musculature and pushed the cover and two sample pages up to my website (see below).
The book is pretty damn good and I'm lookin' forward to the day they paint a woman and do the same thing.

Here the info: Visualizing Muscles by John Cody, MD
ISBN: 0-7006-0426-X
© 1990

the cover:
http://www.redehlert.com/conceptart/books/vismuscle_cvr.jpg

sample page w/o painted muscles:
http://www.redehlert.com/conceptart/books/vismuscle_pg126.jpg

sample page with painted muscles:
http://www.redehlert.com/conceptart/books/vismuscle_pg127.jpg

Will scan the other book asap....

Cheers!

[rubygenesis]

And where would the muscles be without the skeleton? hmmm? all over the floor thats where! :D


http://www.infinitejackass.com/rubygen/skeleton.jpg

Mmmmmm, skeleton....

[redehlert]

couldn't agree with you more rubygen!
knowing the bony anatomy not only builds the framework of the body as we know it, but it also provides us crucial details about origin and insertion points of the muscles!
like your illustration....especially the free formed distal aspect of the radius and ulna - meaning, they aren't attached. creative thar. yar!

i hope you won't take offense to any criticism of your skeleton - which btw i think is very good!
•you may want to drop the lower aspect of the scapulas down a bit....the inferior angle usually rest somewhere between rib 8 and 9, and commonly on rib 8 (at least, that's what my anatomy books suggest).

•i think your drawing also has a fairly deep notch of the lateral margin (from the glenoid fossa to the inferior angle)....looks a bit sudden. i'm sure the viewpoint causes this, but on closer inspection it may actually taper down on a linear rather than curvilinear aspect. this allows ample space for the infraspinatus, teres major and teres minor to attach to the scapula.

•it also seems that the scapula can be moved medially and inferiorly a notch. medially = more towards the spine.

i did this REAL quick in illustrator, so please don't take offense to my suggestions, okay!?!

http://www.redehlert.com/conceptart/skeleton_scapula.jpg

again, please don't take offense...your work is solid and i just want to spread the love.
:nod:

[rubygenesis]

No offence at all! hey thats kewl, but its also weird cause i drew that exactly how i saw it you can tell cause
its the same in both pics. i think the skeleton i was drawing from had really been through some bad times
hence the broken radius and ulna, i think the whole thing was outta wack. :D

Cheer

[redehlert]

yeah....i hear ya!
if it was from a plastic skeleton, i can believe some weird things happenin' if the sun has warped it.
if it was a real skeleton, then damn(!) that's messed up!
; )

i'm glad you didn't take any offense to my comments.
ya never know, right?

btw - awesome work on your web site!

cheers!