Concept Artist needed for Resort

[SWTPD]

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[alti]

"Obviously, this is a non-paying job"

how so ?

if your in any way serious about making a "theme park and or hotel / resort"
how can you not pay for our ideas ?

if you had any faith in your own abilities you wouldn't mind fowarding money to the appropriate artist or artists. :rolleyes:

[SWTPD]

The main reason that we are not going to pay, as of right now, is because we are not 100% the project will go through. We need to get as much as we can done (preferably very cheap or free), then see if we can still continue on. We need concept art to present our ideas to others, so that we would have a better chance of being able to complete the resort. Good question though.

[alti]

ah but you see, to get to the next stage you need quality work, that is ,, you need an artist to devote time to your project for absolutly nothing so that you can make a profit in the end.
artists nomatter how much free time they have or how talented , still need to eat, put petrol in their cars and keep the electricity on .. just like you.


i suggest you put up even a little bit of money, and move this to the paying job section,, you will get better quality work, even if you don't pay that much.- at leat you will be only wasting your own time if nothing works out , and not the artists.

[SWTPD]

alti... we CANNOT provide pay at this time! I have appologized for this and I wish we could! No one in the project is gettin paid...none, notta, nothin. All we get is the friendships and fun.

Oh, by the way (to anyone who IS interested): We are not looking for the highest quality artist! If you can draw and paint good enough so we have a "good" visual, you're welcome to join the team!

[SWTPD]

delete

[goldenavatar]

Are there any contract signings involved in this position?

[SWTPD]

Nope...none yet. If we end up officially getting to go through with it, it is possible that there will be then. However, that won't be for atleast 5 years.

[goldenavatar]

Are you a property developer, or connected to one in some capacity?

[SWTPD]

The property we plan to build this on is already owned by us. We don't really need a realesate agent. However, the property development will become a division of our company (once we get going).

[goldenavatar]

:nohope: I'll pass, but feel free to come back when you've got a paying job and aren't looking for a freebie to save a few dollars.

[SWTPD]

I'd just like to say we could still use a concept artist. However, there still is no pay (for anyone working on this project). If ANYONE would like to help in any way (pictures, cgi, modelling, etc.) please post here or PM me! Thanks

[LordBlack]

I am actually an environmental designer (theme center, museum, retail, game centers....). I am also involve with building the damn thing as well. What you are asking for are speculative design works.....which I have done in the past. But this is only applicable when you are in a competitive environment where you have to do anything to get the job. After all, we (artists) are relying you on the front line and "secure" the deal with our concept artwork. So the obvious question would be...Exactly who are you and what is your background related to the theme park industry. Are you pitching for investors ? Is this well thought out as far as a business plan ?....Have you consider production cost and return investment. In the event your post receives some positive responses (which I wish you will), you will have some young talents pouring their hearts and mind into your dream....So I ask that you do not discount their time and efforts. If an old, salty-dog like me do not get a clear picture of the master plan, then I am not sure some guys can really understand what you are planning to do with their work.....

[flameape]

I am actually an environmental designer (theme center, museum, retail, game centers....). I am also involve with building the damn thing as well. What you are asking for are speculative design works.....which I have done in the past. But this is only applicable when you are in a competitive environment where you have to do anything to get the job. After all, we (artists) are relying you on the front line and "secure" the deal with our concept artwork. So the obvious question would be...Exactly who are you and what is your background related to the theme park industry. Are you pitching for investors ? Is this well thought out as far as a business plan ?....Have you consider production cost and return investment. In the event your post receives some positive responses (which I wish you will), you will have some young talents pouring their hearts and mind into your dream....So I ask that you do not discount their time and efforts. If an old, salty-dog like me do not get a clear picture of the master plan, then I am not sure some guys can really understand what you are planning to do with their work.....

I find these kind of "non-pay" requests frankly, insulting. If one is looking for work for a charitable organization, or a small project (someone's basement rpg operation) or a large project (yours) where there is a clear intent from the beginning to be compensated at the "other end " of the project; i.e., a contract- these kinds of gigs are fine. but there is no indication of any sort of contract for future reimbursement. Why do we in the applied arts community seem to have to be continually requested to do "spec" work- without any contractual intent to future compensation? Do you people think that you're doing us a favor? For free, when you're starting out, we as artists can find literally thousands of non- profits/charities, local community organizations and municipal gov't. departments who would LOVE to get free work done. At least in these situations we are not taken advantage of- and many times can be written off as an "in-kind" donation. Heck- finding a business or two that have no budget but you use the services of will many times be happy to recieve good design in exchange for trade.

When starting out in applied arts of any kind, it is a struggle to be sure. The industry is very competitive- and many out of school need proffesional experiences to add to their portfolio. That's why in design school- we take on internships. At least we're in the oppurtunity to receive compensation- credit for the free work. You have admitted to being property owners- at a scale that would allow you to build/own/ operate an amusement park! Seems to me it takes $ to buy that land. Seems to me it takes more money to pay for Real Estate atty.'s, Land use Permits and even to shlepp around the idea to whatever 3rd parties (investors, etc..) may be involved. Frankly, the fact that you did not advertise this position without at least throwing the bone to the potential artists of future compensation or maybe stock in the company (works for .coms) is really wild.

In closing- please don't take these comments as some kind of snarky (and dissmissable) response. I actually think that it's great to get people involved in your dreams. But technical artists' time is as valuable as yours. We have to eat, clothe and shelter ourselves just like you do. To be honest, if someone came up to you and said, "Hey , um...help me implement an amusement park, do the land development (on paper) and secure concept artists for my dream? And by the way- this is a free spec job- and we have no idea if you'll get a contract- maybe if the investors say yes. Is that a deal?" - You'd laugh them out of your office.

So why are we proffesionals or those breaking in entitled to less respect? If you really have any confidence in your project and frankly have a shred of decency- find the money, offer the contract with the spec deal. Be a bit proffesional. Or at least use the old fashioned (and respectable) practice of using interns; especially really gifted senior/junior illustration students who need the experience! I'm sure if the shoe was on the other foot- you'd be more than protective of your proffesional interests. Empathy, guys...

I empathize with inexperienced artists who feel they have to take on these kinds of jobs- to get "exposure"/practicum. We all have experiences with being taken advantage of by individuals/companies who don't care about who they use, or worse- may not know that they may be engaging in questionable conduct. Both must be educated- obviously, not all of their intentions are foul; but the effect on the young artist in either case is measureable- All of it further serves to allow artists to devalue themselves and their industry.

The Graphic Artist Guild has much to say on this matter- I suggest those offering this "opportunity" and those who have considered this, or others jobs like it, to read up on the subject.

[Arbie]

Try this:

I have a little experience in graphic art, and I could probably get the job done. I can draw and paint real good.
Since you own a lot of property, I would work for trade. I only need 4 or 5 acres of good land with some nice water on it.
How does that sound? Fair enough?
I have a real good sense of architecture and design; I already know what kind of house I'm going to build. Maybe you could provide free labor and construction materials, too?
By the way, I am accustomed to charging a minimum of $25/hour.
What do you usually charge?
Sincerely,
Arbie
:nohope:
I mean, get real!
Yes, there are people out there who will do the work for you for free.
I truly hope you get all that you pay for.