what is todays punk rock

[foster]

what are your thoughts on today's punk rock? what makes them what they are and how they look. what separates them from yester years punks.

post your thoughts and images if you have them.

jon

[Devilock138]

Punk was about rebellion, not submission. It was about hate, not love. It was about society (in general with few exceptions like the Dead Milkmen).

The Punk of the yesteryear were The Sex Pistols, The Misfits, The Ramones, The Clash, The Undead, The Beastie Boys, Black Flag, etc. They began underground and roared and sang about all the rage and hate of the world they came from; the blue collars and the dropouts. they didn't give a shit what anyone thought, they hated authority; left or right.

But that's my opinion.

Edit:

And, judging solely on sound, there is a good number of Punk-inspired bands, but you get a 50/50 on them being 'real' or not. Of course, in the late 70's and early 80's you had posers and fakes and schmoozers also, but not in the mainstream mindset of punk. Avril Lavigne calls herself 'punk'. She's not. She sings about boys and other poppy crap.

The Strokes didn't call themselves punk, but clearly had their influence from the more up-tempo Misfits-styleset (Barely Legal springs to mind). Listen to the song She (about Patty Hearst) by the Misfits and you'll hear it.

Then there's Jet, the Hives... Today Punk is more of an influenced sound then a philosophy like it was.

[RONIN]

Sadly, There are no REAL punk rock bands anymore.

Even bands like RANCID, Bad Religion, Dropkick Murphys, etc. have "cashed-in" rather than "sell-out". That's OK, I don't have a problem with them cashing-in because they still put out quality music (sans the commercial crap song or two they have to put on the CD to get airtime).

But, it shows that the True Punks who don't really give a flying monkey's ass what the record labels want are a dying breed.

edit: AMEN to what Devilock wrote.

[Devilock138]

Originally posted by RONIN


Even bands like RANCID...

I like Billy's new band: the Transplants.

[cucaracha]

I don't like punkrock at all.
The riffs are always the same, pretty annoying high sounds.
The vocals mostly sound like a mice that tries to reach an elephant's ear.
Well, I referred to "classic" punk rock.
But also the sound of skater-punk is just... disturbing, annoying, I don't like it :D

I think the problem is that punk rock didn't really evolve.
Ok, we have the same with rock at the moment - there are a lot of retro bands.

But rock was already nice when it was "invented"... I guess I just don't like the whole punk scene - in Germany, I have to say.

German punks are like this:
They don't work, because they can live by our welfare state -
But they always grumble about our government!

They like their primitve behavior and always talk about not behaving like the society wants it -
But at the same time, they try to teach everyone about politics

That leads to problem nr.3 - you can't talk about other topics than politics or drinking with punks.

They don't like police -
Without police, every non-punk would bash their brains out of their heads ;)

I had many friends in the punk-alternative scene, but I quit to meet them - Just because they always hate something and are always loud and always talking about how they hate "the system"
They should be thankful to live in such a system instead of starving in Africa. Hard but true.

Jet, The Hives, The Strokes? No, that's rock/beat.
Faaar away from punk.

cu

p.s.: I think the american "punk" is very different to the europe...

[Devilock138]

Originally posted by cucaracha

Jet, The Hives, The Strokes? No, that's rock/beat.
Faaar away from punk.

Its not a matter of opinion. Compare Jet and the Hives to the Sex Pistols and its obvious. Its the same formula.

[cucaracha]

Ok, the riffs and stuff may be similar.

But the annoying thing about punk-rock -
uber-screeky voices, dirty-rat-rancid lifestyle and all the stuff I mentioned is not included :D

plus rock/beat is melodic :)

cu

edit: I agree with you about the Hives. They're heavily influenced

[DanSTC]

From studying the history of the Punk movement, I've determined that Punk officially "died" or was "near death" in '78-'79 or so when it all started to become commercialized and lame self-parody. Before that, it was all about rebelling against the strain...but then it became more like any other genre of music with its own bullshit in tow.

Fortunately, there were several groups that managed to keep the spirit alive for a period of time, but the Punk "scene" was pretty much dead by '79 as all the pretentious desperately-trying-to-rebel idiots who had been exposed to Punk secondhand flooded the scene, chasing off all the old-skool punks.

Punk has since managed to stagger from its grave in various oft-commercialized homunculus forms, but has never been quite the same.
That's not to say that there aren't bands out there fighting the good fight; just that punk really is dead.

[cucaracha]

word.

desperately-trying-to-rebel idiots

Germany is full of those guys. Well, not full, but still too much.

Ever tried to talk with such a guy like "shhh it's over, you don't need to rebel, calm down, get a life please..."?

cu

[dfacto]

A bunch of guys scream about how their lives suck and why the system has to come down while they get cash from that same system... :confused:


I just ignore the ideology behind the music and go for the actual thing. If the music is good, I will listen, and if not, I won't. The artist's opinion doesn't matter to me. They are there to entertain me, not teach me.

And cucaracha I know what you mean about the punk fools in Germany. So sad.

I saw this teenage couple walking from a store one day. The girl was dragging a raggedy backpack behind her, and both were dressed up all punk style with shitty dyed hair and piercings and all, and then they were carrying a big case of beer between them to boot. I mean, come on! Is that how you rebel against the system?

[RONIN]

I like Billy's new band: the Transplants.

Just heard a song from them for the first time and I thought it was pretty cool, need to hear more.

I listen to ALL kinds of music (except Country - can't stomach that for some reason) And I like a lot of the new bands like the White Stripes, Jet, etc. Those bands also acknowledge that they are not the "originators" of the sound. I used to skate to Agent Orange, 7 Seconds, etc. and Yeah they sound similar but when you get in a groove who wants to break that.

Bands are at their best when they are young, pissed off and have something to say.

[cotron]

a can of worms has been opened! this is almost like the "what is art?" discussion

I think "punk" is a title that people slap onto music nowadays, and doesn't fit well at all. it categorizes the sound, but like devilock says, it started off on ideology, and the sound was a byproduct of it. the bands now that are trying to get that sound are digging into what's been done and making their own interpretations of it. There's been a resurgence of the fashion, and there's a quite a few crappy bands now playing pop with punk attitude. It's the same as a lot of rap groups now, (puff daddy comes to mind), where style overrides substance. The kids that go to extremes to piss people off and look like homeless clowns aren't being original, they're just copying what was done many years before. these kids are often just wanting attention.

But, it's still alive, and there are still people more into the idea of it than the look of it. i think punk is more about spirit and ethos than it is about sound. The Clash, hailed as one of the best bands to exist, probably my favorite band, was still considered punk in their later years, when they were doing some completely off the wall shit. Rap, reggae, waltzes, they just loved exploring music. What kept them "punk" was that they were doing it for themselves, and were doing things that went against the grain of what was expected. They were on a major label, but they forgoed the royalties to have a triple record cost the same as a single, for the fans. There are bands today that are breaking their backs just to share music with likeminded people, doing their own thing without a care who says they're "punk" or not.

It's a very tricky thing, because the word "punk" signifies a change/rebellion to the norm, but it also categorizes a time period and a sound of music as well. I think this is where all the arguments come from, because it's such a blanket statement.

yeah, i typed a lot.

[Lono]

punk rock is a pretty funny and sensitive word to a lot of people.. specifically those who believe that they might have fallen into that catigory at some point in there lives..
its funny to me now when i think about the concept of a person being strictly defined by the kind of music they listen to.. i guess i felt that way when i was younger,, but i believed it was more of a lifestyle than a catigory..

i personally think that punk rock in its purest form has no quantifiable properties or rules.. it doesnt have to be about anything in partictular even.. it was something unexplainable that happened in the 70's and on into the 80's in my opinion.
it was like a chemical reaction that spread without bias.
rock and roll was being strangled by disco and feel good ballads which caused a feeling of unrest in the youth.. it was a generations extreme answer to the lack of intensity around them..

when punk was new there was no recipe.. some would disagree but i think it got even more interesting when it got to america.. you would have bands like the Minutemen playing shows with DK or mission of Burma. everyone was feeding off eachother and taking things in completely different directions.. but just like anything good in a capitalistic society we will find a way to clone it mass reproduce it and sell it thus draining it of its origionality and quality.. it makes me Nausious now when i hear bands do "punk" covers from other generas of music,, and all they do is speed up the tempo.. its like self mockery and they dont even realize it.

i dont neccesarily think punk is dead,, but if you look in a record store under the catigory "punk",, you will most likely find pop...
its really more of a vehicle for fashion now than anything in my opinion.

i believe punk is still around in spirit.. i catch a hint of it every now and then when i go to shows.. it may not come back with the same face but it was solely the energy that defined it in the first place.. i think the gross degridation in the force fed garbage the younger generation is being bombarded with could easily bring about something similar..


-LOno

[cotron]

well said, lono. and I totally agree with you on the senstivity of the word, I mean, shit... I would have fought people over it when i was younger.

[Locrian]

Originally posted by dfacto
I just ignore the ideology behind the music and go for the actual thing. If the music is good, I will listen, and if not, I won't. The artist's opinion doesn't matter to me. They are there to entertain me, not teach me.

Word. I hate it when people try to drag ideologies along with musical styles. I listen to lots of blackmetal type stuff. But I sure as hell don't follow their "ideologies" or care about what they have to say. I just like the friggen music.

[Lono]

cotron: yah,, you and me must have posted at the same time because we said a lot of the same stuff and i dont remember reading your post before i started typing..
i think we are on the same page man.

:beer:

-Lono

[Lono]

one more thought on the subject..
our generation seems to be obsessed with resurecting and recycling things from the past with only a minor ammount of innovation.. even the big trash rock thing thats happening right now is completely derivitive of the stooges and the stones,, etc.. i think for something to even come close to the raw energy and spirit of punk rock its going to have to shatter that pattern and break all the new standards of this generation.. if you go to enough shows and stay in good touch with the underground music scene you will see occasional instances of this.. all it would take is a little momentum and people might start challenging themselves again.. who knows what might happen?

-Lono

[AnarchyAo2]

I don't care if anyone "cashed in" or "sold out". If I like their music, i'll listen to it anyway. I just tend to like punk rock better then other things. I like some songs outside of punk rock, so I'm not one of those dumbasses who only listen to 1 genre just becuase they want to be dedicated.

[Skank]

ahh, a subject dear to my heart...lets see if i can get some semi-coherant words out here...

lets look at the original definition of the word "punk"
Punk: somone in prison who sucks dick or some other form of sexual favor for cigarettes"

HA! now who the fuck would want to be associated with THAT term?? basically is was big FUCK YOU! to the masses from the rejects and disillusioned youth of the late 70's and early 80's. you think of me as trash? fine, im trash, but im not gonna just lay down and take it like you want me to.
rebelion! chaos! ANARCHY!!
all catch phrases associated with the term punk. it was a natural progression from the early days of rock i think.
the hippies wanted peace and love, the punks wanted CHANGE! complacency wasnt an option. it gave alot of youth something to believe in, something to grab onto and make it their own. thats why you got the crazy hair, wierd styles and all around rejection of anything normal. but, as with any cultural movement, things strayed fromt he original ideals and you had your "posers". i dont care what it is, youre always gonna have people tagging along because its the next best thing, punk was no different.
its kinda come full circle now, except, now, the majority of "punk" kids dont know where it all came from. very few take the time to learn the history of what it is they say they are. (maybe im old school, but, but that just seems ludicrous to me) i think punk, as a music style, is bigger now than it has ever been before. that is to say: bands that are coined as punk are being played on the radio, and on TV ALOT. and i dont see that changing anytime soon. i dont think punk music will ever be able to go back underground, its been changed permanently. there are very few bands who still stick to the ideals of punk, and they arent all the cookie cutter, tripple beat punk band everyone thinks of now when you mention punk. bands like fugazi come to mind...(theres really too many to mention here) i think another good example of an old school punk is henry rollins, he lets his voice be heard, but he doesnt look like a "punk", it was never meant to be just a fashion statement. its become one again. that being said...im gonna die with my leather on, NO one is gonna take my baby away :D
i still listen to my favorite bands, and ive seen them change too, but like what was mentioned before, if it sounds good, i listen to it. there arent many newer bands worth listening to tho.
i think punk is more of a lifestyle too, its not following something just cuz someone tells you to. its thinking for yourself, making your own way, keeping your eyes open and not accepting things as they are. theres always room for change.
and to answer fosters question on what makes the new generation different, i think the only thing theyre rebelling against is curfews and mommy and daddy not giving them enough allowance....

punk is cool now...it never was when I was a kid.

[Skank]

Originally posted by Lono
one more thought on the subject..
our generation seems to be obsessed with resurecting and recycling things from the past with only a minor ammount of innovation.. even the big trash rock thing thats happening right now is completely derivitive of the stooges and the stones,, etc.. i think for something to even come close to the raw energy and spirit of punk rock its going to have to shatter that pattern and break all the new standards of this generation.. if you go to enough shows and stay in good touch with the underground music scene you will see occasional instances of this.. all it would take is a little momentum and people might start challenging themselves again.. who knows what might happen?

-Lono

cant believe i didnt say anything about this..lol
DEFINATELY! true punk rock can be found in almost any local scene....where there is discontent, there is punk rock, and theres discontent EVERYwhere.

[Devilock138]

Originally posted by Skank

the hippies wanted peace and love, the punks wanted CHANGE! complacency wasnt an option. it gave alot of youth something to believe in, something to grab onto and make it their own.

You said what I couldn't articulate right there.

[Hanuka]

some interesting statements about punk so far. glad to see people still know what theyre talking bout here.
i think one cant compare the bands officially labeled punk today with the origins.

i think theres like 3 kinds of bands/people branded as punks:

i know some of these annoying loud assholes calling themselves punks, just because they listen to nofx and sick of it all; always with worn out pants and shoes, stinking, with long hair or mohawks (no offend, i like mohawks) etc. but thats more of a trend than anything else. Just talk seriously with em about politics for half an hour and youll know what i mean. they apply opinions just like most chart-music-listeners do, though most of them take themselves as absolutely independent. the thing is they take their opinions from other sources than mtv.

then again there's another kind of people considering themselves punk which are the obvious sell-out-punkies running around with "the offspring"-shirts or "blink 182" sweaters, without even knowing misfits or the pistols. quite annoying folks - especially cause they take themselves as independent while being absolutely influenced by media and whats called the "alternative/independent charts". Holy cow, how these guys suck.

The only thing/group/bands id label punk nowadays is todays hardcore-punk scene including bands such as ignite, boysetsfire and stuff. sure, these are rather known names without the underground-appeal some might consider being the most important part of it - though they are very political - actually thinking about what they say -, they want the CHANGE, Skank was talking bout. And futhermore theyre doing great music. my opinion ;)

punk's not what it used to be - just my definition of what it became.

--- woot, my 100st post, i just hope its not my shittiest one :P ---

[Skank]

Originally posted by foster
what are your thoughts on today's punk rock? what makes them what they are and how they look. what separates them from yester years punks.

post your thoughts and images if you have them.

jon

im just curious jon, what are YOUR thoughts? were you a 'hawk sportin SOB like me in your youth? :D

love to hear what you have to say about this

[Android]

arent you glad you asked Jon?:)

[gekitsu]

well, i think "true punk" wasn't really a music style per se... it was the musical outcome of a scene and their ideologies.
with the scene (almost) dead, the ideologies outdated and the whole situation changed (so that the old phrases and paroles don't fit anymore), it was obviously necessary to get rules for what is punk music and what not. there the sellout begins...

it's a difference if someone, driven by his ideologies ans beliefs stands before his friends with a guitar he doesn't playall too well and a voice that isn't made for singing and still makes the music he wants to do, just to be a sore thumb and someone who is trying desperately to sound like someone who cannot play guitar properly, dresses up in trousers with holes he ripped in himself and all his content is the struggle to fit in the scheme of "punk music".

i dunno what the situation in the states or elsewhere is like, but i see what is going on here in germany. cucaracha is so right with what he sais and i feel a tremendous amount of joy when i read his rant because those pseudopunks are considered "intellectuals", people with thoughts behind their actions, people that are standing up for something,
in fact, this punk thing seems to be a hollow lie for doing nothing, bitching endlessly about "the system" hailing che guevara all day long and getting drunk inbetween.
this has nothing to do anymore with thoughts behind actions, standing up for what you believe or intellect.
it is about calling everyone who disagrees with "the punk ideology" either a fascist(1), a nazi(2), a dead fish(3) or an unenlightened human being spolt by capitalism(4). you may roll a d4 to specify what exactly you are.

okay... i guess it's obvious punk isn't really my cup of tea. :)
i am thankful for the existence of this movement, though, as it spawned the gothic movement (not those teen angst kids you have over there in the states... true goth. neoromanticism). :)

[Skank]

Originally posted by gekitsu
well, i think "true punk" wasn't really a music style per se... it was the musical outcome of a scene and their ideologies.
with the scene (almost) dead, the ideologies outdated and the whole situation changed (so that the old phrases and paroles don't fit anymore), it was obviously necessary to get rules for what is punk music and what not. there the sellout begins...

it's a difference if someone, driven by his ideologies ans beliefs stands before his friends with a guitar he doesn't playall too well and a voice that isn't made for singing and still makes the music he wants to do, just to be a sore thumb and someone who is trying desperately to sound like someone who cannot play guitar properly, dresses up in trousers with holes he ripped in himself and all his content is the struggle to fit in the scheme of "punk music".

i dunno what the situation in the states or elsewhere is like, but i see what is going on here in germany. cucaracha is so right with what he sais and i feel a tremendous amount of joy when i read his rant because those pseudopunks are considered "intellectuals", people with thoughts behind their actions, people that are standing up for something,
in fact, this punk thing seems to be a hollow lie for doing nothing, bitching endlessly about "the system" hailing che guevara all day long and getting drunk inbetween.
this has nothing to do anymore with thoughts behind actions, standing up for what you believe or intellect.
it is about calling everyone who disagrees with "the punk ideology" either a fascist(1), a nazi(2), a dead fish(3) or an unenlightened human being spolt by capitalism(4). you may roll a d4 to specify what exactly you are.

okay... i guess it's obvious punk isn't really my cup of tea. :)
i am thankful for the existence of this movement, though, as it spawned the gothic movement (not those teen angst kids you have over there in the states... true goth. neoromanticism). :)

these are the rhetoric spewing sheep that the vast majority of people view as punks...people greatly desiring to "fit in"
and feel like they belong to something.
personally i agree with your above statement about the person wanting to do what they want to..its about freedom, not mindlessly following a system of beliefs because everyone else does. its about making your own way and standing up for what you believe in.
i dont think that needs a label on it do you? :chug:

[Devilock138]

Originally posted by Skank

were you a 'hawk sportin SOB like me in your youth?

Not everyone liked mohawks.

I had a devilock down to my chin (yay, now you know why I'm Devilock). I sported it for a whole year before my mom caught me and took the scissors to my head (was 16 then; leather jacket, sleeveless shirt, boots and all). Not one damn picture of it :flamig:.

[Skank]

Originally posted by Devilock138


Not everyone liked mohawks.

I had a devilock down to my chin (yay, now you know why I'm Devilock). I sported it for a whole year before my mom caught me and took the scissors to my head (was 16 then; leather jacket, sleeveless shirt, boots and all). Not one damn picture of it :flamig:.

hehe, i think ive covered about ever steriotypical punk hair style you can think of....cept the devilock...never liked hair in my face.

but like i said earlier, im dyin with my leather on....:evilbat: its like an old friend to me.

[Devilock138]

I gave my leather jacket to a girl... I grew out of it :(. I've still got my boots though:

http://img12.photobucket.com/albums/v36/Donnely138/MVC-012F.jpg

[INFERNOmunky]

lol...devil locks.... yeah i choped mine off last year now i just have hair.....actually all the non-washing of my hair even started turning em to dreds...
good stuffs....

punk....wow there are so many poser punks in the "US" that it makes me sick....half these kids have never heard of the clash or the ramones....there just a bunch of preppy kids paying tons to look poor and scrungie, so that they feel cool, and "punk"......

oh well....i guess theres nothing we can really do about it....except handing out afew bloody noses.....

[INFERNOmunky]

nice boots by the way....man i wish i had a digial camera....mine kick butt...

and boy do they smell

[Locrian]

Ah I'm not too fond of any of the dress and hair styles that tend to go along with punk, but big black boots I can definitely agree on. :cool:

Though I prefer the HH jump boot above all other boot styles:

http://i8.ebayimg.com/03/i/00/c5/6f/08_1.JPG

sex for your feet

[AnarchyAo2]

Hehe, my friend wears boots like those and tucks his pants into them. We called him Sarg for 1/2 a year. but, they do look comfey. BTW, are the Misfits still a band? I'm a new fan to the genre so I really don't know if they are.

[Skank]

Originally posted by AnarchyAo2
Hehe, my friend wears boots like those and tucks his pants into them. We called him Sarg for 1/2 a year. but, they do look comfey. BTW, are the Misfits still a band? I'm a new fan to the genre so I really don't know if they are.

ya they are, but i dont follow them.
im not a big fan of the post danzig era..

[Devilock138]

Originally posted by AnarchyAo2
Hehe, my friend wears boots like those and tucks his pants into them. We called him Sarg for 1/2 a year. but, they do look comfey. BTW, are the Misfits still a band? I'm a new fan to the genre so I really don't know if they are.

Sort of...

There's The Misfits and The 'New' Misfits.

The difference is this:

Glenn Danzig (Glenn Anzalone at the time) started the band in 1977 and quit in 1983.

Jerry Only fought with him for ten years after Glenn said no to regrouping and finally got the name in like 1995 and released an album called American Psycho with a new singer named Micheael Graves.

Now the singer is Dez from black flag, the drummer is the living Ramone brother and Jerry Only is still the bassist.

edit: I agree with Skank. I am a huge fan of the Danzig Era Misfits.

[Lono]

fashion.

turn to the left.

fashion.

turn to the right.

oooooooooh,, fashion..

-Lono

[Skank]

Originally posted by Lono
fashion.

turn to the left.

fashion.

turn to the right.

oooooooooh,, fashion..

-Lono

lol

sorry
that made me laugh .....alot...

[gekitsu]

Originally posted by Skank
i dont think that needs a label on it do you? :chug:

nope. if there is something a larger number of people stand for, it will become a label by itself anyway. :)
the ideals of punk applied to the situation today probably would look very un-punky... would love to see that :) (although i feel it may be quite closely tied to what i stand for as a neofolky goth)

Originally posted by Lono
fashion.

turn to the left.

fashion.

turn to the right.

oooooooooh,, fashion..

re-turn your revolt into STYLE! *sings*

[I.was.ink]

Hey, what do you guys think of the band AFI?

I like their old stuff a lot better. Just wondering....

-Iwasink

[Skank]

Originally posted by I.was.ink
Hey, what do you guys think of the band AFI?

I like their old stuff a lot better. Just wondering....

-Iwasink


their new album is pretty watered down compaired to their older stuff, but the bands got some serious talent.

my fav album of theirs is Shut Your Mouth & Open Your Eyes..good stuff.

[Devilock138]

What I've heard I've liked. They also did a great tribute to Last Caress.

[Hanuka]

i really like afi. sing the sorrow is good as well, though it sounds a bit different from shut your mouth & open your eyes and former stuff (mainly the older stuff was less melancholic, i think).
one of my fav bands atm as well - along with boysetsfire, machinae supremacy, ignite and the mad caddies.

does anyone know farmer boys here? its not really punk. more of a mixture of goth-rock, queen and punk - i love it.

[cotron]

afi's awesome... although it kind of sucks whenever a band you like goes big, more often than not the sound changes to reach a wider audience, and going to the shows is a completely different experience. i remember when I saw them play in a club the size of my basement, and were still singing "i want a mohawk... but mom won't let me get one". the halloweeny stuff is cool, at least they didn't go raprock.

[wes9000]

good discussion. id chime in but it seems most of it has already been spoken for.
yeah its still around in its original essence but you really just have to dig for it.
DIY basement shows and the local scene etc.
And if you look at Skins (and not the $%$# racist ones that call themselves skins...thats a whole other can of worms) today, its still around.
and then even you get similar type movements with underground hip hop etc.



oh yeah. im totally with you guys. the "new misfits" will never be anywhere near the Danzig era Misfits.

eh never been a big fan of AFI, but thats just personal taste. I dont have a problem with them though. they have gotten really "Hot Topic" though in the past year or two...


hmm for anyone interested in checking out a band, id recommend "Against Me!" ... theve been around for a few years, and they tour throughout the country. they do a really interesting acoustic punk

[Skank]

Originally posted by wes9000
good discussion. id chime in but it seems most of it has already been spoken for.
yeah its still around in its original essence but you really just have to dig for it.
DIY basement shows and the local scene etc.
And if you look at Skins (and not the $%$# racist ones that call themselves skins...thats a whole other can of worms) today, its still around.
and then even you get similar type movements with underground hip hop etc.



oh yeah. im totally with you guys. the "new misfits" will never be anywhere near the Danzig era Misfits.

eh never been a big fan of AFI, but thats just personal taste. I dont have a problem with them though. they have gotten really "Hot Topic" though in the past year or two...


hmm for anyone interested in checking out a band, id recommend "Against Me!" ... theve been around for a few years, and they tour throughout the country. they do a really interesting acoustic punk

werd wes, i agree, you gotta dig pretty hard sometimes...up here in alaska theres a pretty thriving underground scene, but if you dont know someone who knows someone you arent gonna find it..

and thanks for the tip on the band, ill hafta check em out.

[Dished]

although it kind of sucks whenever a band you like goes big, more often than not the sound changes

Like the Distillers... :nohope: I miss the good ol stuff like Young Crazed Peeling, City of Angels and We are the revenants...
Drain the blood is probably the only song i KINDA liked from their new album....

Hum..just wondering, would you guys consider a person who listens to both the newer type of punk scene though yet listens to the old school punk a poser or something of the sort?

[Fipse]

Hi, I think with an age of 38 I belong to the very few people on this board who really witnessed the original Punk-Movement. I´ve been in the left-alternative movement in my youth and at this time there´ve been a lot of Punks with it (For the Germans: I even danced Pogo to the "Die Toten Hosen" ´83 in the livingroom of a friend where they played for a casket of beer).

Today Punk is imho a matter of fashion, in the beginning it was a matter of attitude - and politics. The punks Cucaracha was talking about - a mixture of "political beggars" - have got nothing to do with the Punks I met, who´ve been active, constructive in their way and of course aggressive. I think the last few strands of Punk-attitude I observed in the end of the 80´s. After this it became a fashion strand and a kind of music. I wouldn´t say bad music - I still like bands like Greenday but it´s "just" a historical kind of music like Rockabilly, Psychedelic Rock or Acid Dancefloor. Imagine that some of todays Rockabilly musicians still see their music as rebellious ...

To understand Punk in the old days (imagine me stroking my white beard) you´ve got to see that the subcultures were much stricter than today. You´ve been a Punk, a Popper, a Waver, an Eco or whatever and that´s where you stayed and lived with. I don´t know if this is good or bad but there have been much more massive borders between the groups. Today there´s much more interaction between the different streams of youth-culture making it difficult to find pure strands of whatever movement there is.

What I see is that the american punk movement hasn´t really existed. It was more a european kind of thing. In fact the Punks that I knew laughed about the americans trying to get a feeling for this movement. Hey, Billy Idol was seen as Punk ... I think today´s Punk in the US is a watered down revival of an already watered down movement.

Over all I find the socalled today´s "Punks" slightly amusing. Like a friend of mine who´s speaking about the Gothic scene he´s been in in the 80´s said: "The kids are playing in a nostalgic way with stuff they don´t understand".

Granpa Fipse

[John]

I know with that username it might sound pretty dumb. I'm a boy, and with punkrock being kind of macho sometimes and all that. But, to hell with it.
PUNKROCK!

That's what i think about it. I listened to Rancid when i found this thread, but i don't think of me as a punker. I don't like the clothes and piercings for myself, but i think punk attitude was kinda like an antidote to all the hippy stuff my parents did when it was time for me to start rocking out.

For me punkrock is about sitting around getting shit drunk and not care about being rational and all that gentlemans stuff. Punkrock is about partying when there's nothing better for me to do. 40oz to freedom and all that. Skateboards, Metal, Punk, Rock, live or on tape, weed, beer, straight edge :tihi: , cigarettes and just not sitting in front of mtv for the evening. I don't like people who want to sell me stuff or make me believe in something. I believe in living life and being good at it. That's punkrock. Oh, and comics.

edit- i think i made a point for what fipse wrote here. I might also add, uhm, Refused are pretty good. :tihi:
I never really got the point of what punkrock was supposed to 'mean'. It was more like a blank page for me that allowed everything & didn't tell me what to do and what's right or wrong.

[NoUseFrAName]

punk to me:

about a sound more than a song.

about being able to say screw it, I don't like you and your values
AND
screw it, I do like you and your values.

about finding meaning, and not finding meaning(kind of an underlying theme)

what we have today in punk's place:
emo and hardcore saying 'screw everything' and then immediately taking it back in an endless cycle.
people saying 'screw it, I can conform and still be objective'
and then an array of indy and alternative stuff that's more about song, but ultimately shares the same underlying theme of meaning(or lack thereof) as the old punk scene, while excersizing some tact and even some more ecclectic sounds.
There's also the underground DIY bands that kinda preserve the whole oldschoolness of it all too...but to me at least, it feels like they're in a time warp. To be 'punk' nowadays isn't really being punk anyways...real punk was built to transform....or at least with the freedom to transform if it wanted to...and the effort to preserve it all kind of shut's that door imho.
The underground Hip Hop stuff is kind of a new-punk too....remixing a lot of the old flavours, being blunt with their objections.
's all good. The sound carries on, as does the message....not always in the same music at the same time...
at any rate, it's not dead.

-Rob

[MuffinMan]

punk is so messed up, from what i know...punk is in an intersection with four directions... each direction means so much, that one slip could end it. in fact it is dead.

i've known punk for a long time. and what devilock said, there are no true punk bands. punk is just a label on music nowadays. those bands who say they are punk are full of it. they are just a bunch of inspired school drop-out goons who wannabe like ramones or whatever. i've litsened to blink 182, good charlotte, etc. they all suck. alot of times punk is about trying to be cool...that is exactly what blink 182 does. since punk just isn't punk anymore but still just rock. i don't really listen to punk. but for punk i'm talking about a band like nirvana, but they aren't totally punk, their grunge. i liked the grunge movement better than the punk movement. it wasn't all about hating things and "fuck the system".

don't forget nobody takes music seriously these days. if a "punk band" rises up, more like i'm gonna be like "oh, another "punk" band, they won't last".
just like papa roach, after the second album released they went DOWN.
forget punk.

[cotron]

muffinman, your posts are fountains of golden honey.

[Lmharker]

I can't define a 'punk', but I listen to 'punk rock' music.
Bad religion, the Offspring, Pennywise, Blink-182 are just a few I listen to...and no it doesn't mean I walk around with Offspring hoodies on me.
In fact I like all kinds of music, even classical and dance are nice to listen to. Never judge people by what music they're into - people who listen to heavy metal can be very intelligent.

[MuffinMan]

a bold statement...

[Profil]

bah, so my friend and I am arguing about what green day is. It dosent really matter but we're still arguing about it.
I'm saying that Green day is Rock/pop, he is saying that they are Skate punk. Who is the most correct?

[Lmharker]

Interesting. Well, as for my view I don't really mind - it's all still music.

Happy little fellow, isn't he? -----> :^^:

[Lauren Short]

IMO if you aren't British/neighboring european natinality and you weren't anywhere between 15-30 in the 70's you can't be true punk


so basically there is no more real punk at all, the whole punk movement was a social movement by British/european youth to break out of the constriction of society's ways and conservative views

that no longer happens. it can and has never happened here, though a lot of bands such as NOFX or Bad Religion use their music to try to spread ideas, but i don't really think people actually take the lyrics seriously(just my opinion, though they have a point sometimes)


EDIT: wow dished, way to bring back an old thread :P

[MuffinMan]

No one takes music seriously, dude i even listen to bands who scream satanic lyrics and such. i don't give a shit, i'm just in for the music...

people label bands all the time.
people think metallica is rock, but really they are thrash. thrash/speed metal is basically what i listen to the most. alot of those bands talk about satan, hell, fallen angels, death, undead armies, black knights, etc. alot of bands choose a theme for their music. but also it doesn't mean they are satanic, antichrist, nazi, or whatever... it's all just music.

[MattyRyan]

Its not a matter of opinion. Compare Jet and the Hives to the Sex Pistols and its obvious. Its the same formula.

I don't really agree with this. I feel that bands like Jet, the Strokes, even the White Stripes take most of their influences from the 70's rock more than anything. That is not to say that there are not any influences from the punk movement in there.

Today, like many have said, there is not really anything 'punk' out there. I consider everything to be more 'Pop Punk' than anything. Bands like Blink 182, even Green Day are all over produced.

I personally like the Rockabilly punk days when there was the Stray Cats. For that matter, anyone who likes the Stray Cats, check out a band called The Living End. In my opinion, they are probably the closest thing to punk as there is out there.

[sdbarber]

Punk to me is all about opinion and integrity. Having convictions in your beliefs, regardless of what anyone else thinks. thinking for yourself and commenting on how corrupt and ignorant man and the world are.
Modern day 'punks' to me are fugazi, bad religion, anti-flag, pigface- the dead kennedys, jello biafra....

[The Iconoclast]

I don't like the current punk rock, but The White Stripes are good. I like the grungy stuff a bit more than the Simple Plan -esque stuff. I see many full circles, and I think the current generation (my age) is trying to dig up the mounds of culture that was not given the spotlight it deserved. Comics, D&D, music, attitudes. We're adopting all these things and trying to regenerate the interest that once existed. Before the movies, almost nobody I knew actually knew what LOTR was (and who could blame them?).

Unfortunately, the attitudes of ye' 80s (and back) can't really apply today. Many of the ideas expressed no longer apply and there's a reinterpretation of punk. I wouldn't use the same name to describe the breed of punk that is coming out now and the stuff that was there in the 80s (and back).

Honestly, you can see the same trends repeating trying to bring about a cultural balance or equilibrium, but that will never be achieved.

You have the greedy people mad for power causing wars and whatnot. Then comes the hippie who strives for peace. The punk emerges trying to show that things can't be resolved with a simple peace sign. Pop comes around telling the punks to chill out and be silly. Anti-political correctness movements try to bring about another breed of punk. And now we see another action-reaction movement where people are becoming aware that many of the attitudes in modern culture can't really apply and there is a whole new value to "authenticity." People want the real thing. Nobody wants to have fake breasts and nobody wants to be a "wigger." "If you didn't start it, you don't deserve to have it" attitude.

I think every "movement" has been about change and rebellion. I think culture is just a united attempt to rebel against an idea, and when these ideas become accepted or hackneyed, a new minority is established and a new idea flourishes.

[helix7]

I don't like punkrock at all.
The riffs are always the same, pretty annoying high sounds.
The vocals mostly sound like a mice...

Kinda missing the point here...

Anyway...

The punk scene may still be alive and well, but the music hasn't gone very far in recent years, as far as I can tell anyway. The whole idea of punk is skewed, and as previously mentioned, some people think Avril Levigne and Blink 182 are punk bands. Granted a few bands today are showing some old punk and metal influences (Sum41 comes to mind), but in general it's all about the great bands already mentioned from years gone by.

Because of that, I think alot of people (myself included) still listen to stuff like AFI, The Vandals, TSOL, but have moved onto to other things. I'm more into hardcore these days, like Killswitch Engage, Bleeding Through, Atreyu, etc, plus some slightly less intense stuff like Hopesfall and Thursday. None of these bands are punk, but I think it's a similar kind of intensity that I'm drawn to. I'd guess that there is alot of this transition going on, and it will continue unless something really ground-breaking in the punk scene happens.

[thePenguin]

it seems odd that anyone doesnt consider green day punk. they were one of the godfathers of punk. no, im not saying they were the first by far. hell, theres anti-authoritarian messages as far back as the beatles and more (not saying the beatles are punk, but punk roots go back a long way). as far as the underground element, which is part of the heart of punk, green day was underground for a long time on the west coast. they carried their punk sound and lyrics with them when they were signed to their big label. yes, they have pop and rock songs but they are overall still a very punk band. they also do it without sounding "whiney", which is notable in itself. it seems to be the whiney punk that is over produced now as noted by MattyRyan above.

[John]

The whole "underground" thing just sucks balls. /m\ \w/

There'll always be bands touring just because they like to play. They'll never be big. I've seen girls just like Avril Lavigne do the same hippy/punk shit she does, maybe less polished, and noone gave a crap. It isn't about that. It's about selling records, directing videos, writing PR, doing Interviews, and hiring a buttload of creative people to do their thing and get paid for it. That's good. It's pop, it's more than the sum of it's part and some people don't like it. There's always other stuff around for those. For those involved, it's a job, and they work and get paid.
You can't have a carnival without the fireworks. If a band wanted to be all underground and exclusive and all about the music they'd play Jazz. But if you get a manager, release a cd, tour a couple of cities, then you want more. And don't tell me otherwise. I'm serious. It's bullshit. If Kurt hadn't wanted people to listen to Teen Spirit, he wouldn't have recorded it. Punk was as fashion as everything else.
If there's more people involved, some are bound to come up with crap. That's all there is to it. And if noone takes the project serious, then there's even more crap to throw around. And if a band doesn't want videos and interviews, it still doesn't mean they don't have PR. They do as long as they put out a cd, hell, as long as they go on tour. An image is always there.

(edit:)
So what's left of punk is the whole no authorities affair... which is the same. It's a statement that has a certain effect and is supported by certain (childish?) views. The political effect of it all... you know, if there is any...
Nah, there is none. I'm yet to see governments change because of Rage Against The Machine and Refused. It's true, political issues have always been touched on by musicians, it doesn't make a difference if it's the Beatles or Public Enemy.
They just don't tell me anything new. At first they're radical, when you're young... but it wears off and you realize it's just another effect. Meaningful things happen elsewhere. I don't want to bash the opinions, just the medium should be evaluated again. It's gotten stale for me, it doesn't change a thing. It's silly and pathetic.

[Slash]

Again with the labels....

I play in a band myself. Our music may remind you of The Misfits, Bad religion, nofx, sex pistols or even Sum 41. We sing about things we find amusing, things we dont care about and things we DO care about. Are we punks? Some might say so, some might not. We dont really give a fuck. For us, its about having fun, being creative, giving others a good time, Alcohol and sex. IMO punk will never be the same as it were back in the days. It will never be. Trying to do the same as they did back then is futile, it will never be the same. You can either say that punk is dead, or that punk still lives on, and has evolved.

IMO, the bands today that are closest to the original punk, at least in ideology, are bands like napalm death. It is really a matter of opinon. Some might define punk from what it sounds like, some might define it from the attitude. Or both. To me, music and labels dont really matter, since in the end, it is a matter of personal opinion.

I would like to continue this post, but i dont have the time right now. TBC!

[MuffinMan]

what about this whole EMO movement?
it is really getting around these days and it's kinda annoying....
so, since i don't really know alot about emo, i'm wondering if some of you could explain it to me.

[The Iconoclast]

Again with the labels....

I totally agree. My point in my long speech back there was that no matter how you try and define a certain genre of music, bands change as people change. I think the word "punk" has done its job in defining music. Once you start analyzing it in such detail, it really breaks down to being just music. I think that you could definitely call Beatles a kind of punk. I say why not? They also decided to rebel and go against the norm. If they didn't have the punk sound, they definitely had the punk attitude.

Music is music. Keep your mind open to punk, classical, bluegrass, videogame music. WHATEVER makes you feel good...

[helix7]

what about this whole EMO movement?

Emo is weird because the definition of emo as I understand it would classify alot of different artists as being "emo." Bands that typically get the emo tag slapped on them are The Get Up Kids, Jimmy Eat World, Dashboard Confessional, Further Seems Forever, etc. But then you've got bands that get thrown into this category and I'm not totally sure why. Like alot of hardcore bands are classified as emo but not in the Dashboard kind of pussy rock way (sorry to any Dashboard fans), so they get this hybrid label of "emocore," which is equally as weird as the regular emo label. The determining factor in which label a band gets seems to boil down to simply screaming or no screaming. If the singer has a tendency to scream, yell, or growl, it's probably emocore. If it's all harmonics and melodies, or just mellow singing about how depressed the singer is because his girlfriend dumped him for some other guy with trendy black-frame glasses, then it's probably just regular emo. Dashboard? Emo. Hopesfall? Emocore. Promise Ring? Emo. Thursday? Emocore.

At least that's what i've come to know emo as...

[JoshuaTheJames]

I love most all forms of music.

But, I haven't ever found a punk group or song I really liked. Or perhaps I just didn't realize it was punk.

Is there an undisputed insane hardcore dopest of the dope Punk group you could recommend that embodies everything it is in terms of sound?



-JtJ

[MuffinMan]

Is there an undisputed insane hardcore dopest of the dope Punk group you could recommend that embodies everything it is in terms of sound?



-JtJ

two letters....NO

[davi]

i hate all of your music.

[Craig D]

JoshuaTHEJAMES
try listening to the Dead Kennedy's -Plastic Surgery Disaster album


and Filpse, I'm even older than you and the early Ramones the California scene (DK's Black Flag etc.) DOA in Canada etc. definetely fit into the scene at that time without being Euro.
Of course being from N America I could be biased :)

[Skank]

I love most all forms of music.

But, I haven't ever found a punk group or song I really liked. Or perhaps I just didn't realize it was punk.

Is there an undisputed insane hardcore dopest of the dope Punk group you could recommend that embodies everything it is in terms of sound?



-JtJ

Misfits: walk among us. static age, earth AD, any of those 3

[sdbarber]

I love most all forms of music.

But, I haven't ever found a punk group or song I really liked. Or perhaps I just didn't realize it was punk.

Is there an undisputed insane hardcore dopest of the dope Punk group you could recommend that embodies everything it is in terms of sound?



-JtJ

check out
Minor Threat - Complete Discography
Dead Kennedys - Give Me Convenience or Death
Fugazi - 13 Songs
Bad Religion - All Ages
Anti Flag - Die For The Government
Refused - Songs to Fan The Flames of Discontent
Refused - The Shape of Punk to Come
Operation Ivy - Operation Ivy
__________________

[Alex Outbreak]

Oh man, I picked a good time to browse the CA boards.

I haven't read ever comment posted thus far. I'm just going to answer the question by giving my opinion on today's punk rock.

Being born in 86, I can't really give a fair comparison between the early punk movement and today's new wave of punks. I grew up with the punk of the late eighties up to today's stuff. I still love to listen to the early stuff (New York Dolls, Ramones, Clash, etc.), but the later, pre pop-punk stuff is what I connected with. The first cd that I owned was Operation Ivy's Energy E.P. that my brother had bought for me as a birthday present. Almost all of the bands i've heard, up until the past four or five years, I heard through my brother. Hes been doing the whole punk thing way longer than I have. Through OP IV I found out about Rancid, and fell in love with them. Through Rancid, I found Hellcat Record's Give Them the Boot collections, and have found so many other bands.
Today's punk has been streched so wide, that almost any random person can call whatever they want "punk," and feel comfortable and valid in doing so. I'm not trying to complain about "posers," or trying to call the trendy kid's bluff. If you want to call Uncle Tom's Jug Band punk, then go for it. At this point, the line seperating punk and pop, rock, new wave or whatever you want, has been smeared over and over again. There no longer is a clear defenition of punk. The kid with a mohawk, who listen's to Crucifix's Dehuminization, and the kid across the street from him who listen's to bands like The Used, Taking Back Sunday, etc. have seperate, unique definitions of what a punk is, and both consider themselves punks. To me, and this is my opinion of what punk is, punk is being proud of being the black sheep. Punk is not accepting the normality of today's society. Punk is learning, for yourself, about what is going around you, and deciding whether or not that is acceptable to you. I think one of the best things to do, now that the definiton of punk has been blurred, is to try and educate. If the neighbour kid thinks he might be getting into punk, then let him borrow something like London Calling, or one of the Misfits collections. Let him find out how punk started, and let him figure out for himself what he thinks punk is. To me, hating on the kid who sits across from me in History, who's definition of punk is diferent than mine, isn't going to do a lot of good for me. Instead of calling bullshit on the kids who get into it only for the fashion, call bullshit on an issue involving your community, friends etc. Write a song, start your own zine, whatever. To me, thats what punk is. And, like Slash had said, its all about having fun in doing so.
Musically, punk has seen better days. Granted there are a few gems out there (I fucking loved Green Day's new album). But i've heard all these new pop-punk songs before. I feel like if i've heard one song about losing a grilfriend, then i've heard them all. The pop stuff just doesn't generate the same kind of energy that I love, and get from punk.

Hey, what do you guys think of the band AFI?

I like their old stuff a lot better. Just wondering....

-Iwasink

I fucking love A.F.I. Often times you will come across someone who likes a certain era of A.F.I. more than another. A.F.I. is always changning. From past interviews that i've read, when asked why they're always changing they always responded with that they never want to make the same album twice. To me thats a pretty fucking good thing. It might unset a few people when they come out with something new, and it wasn't what they expected, but they have yet to dissapoint me.

Other bands I like, and ones you guys might enjoy; Rancid, The Nerve Agents, Redemption 87, The Frisk, Green Day, Tiger Army, Minor Threat, Dead Kennedys, T.S.O.L, Transplants, The Distillers, Minor Threat.

side note - Devillock, you should check out Son of Sam. Davey Havok from A.F.I. got together with some members of Samhain a little while back and did a Samhain psuedo-tribute project. I don't know if i'd exactly call them a tribute band, but I have a feeling that you might like them.

another side note - Since it seems a lot of you like the Misfits, it might be worth mentioning that, from what I hear, Glenn Danzig has decided to do one more final tour. The great part is, hes playing with Doyle.

[Blind]

Are we still talking about music? Heh...

There's two kinds of music: good music, and shit. You either like it or you don't. But it doesn't matter what kind of music it is or what category fucking MTV put it in for you. Forget all these labels and categories that the music industry tries to wrap around bands & songs just to try and get you to feel like you're part of some movement or ideology that doesn't really exist. It's all bullshit to spur sales of one thing or another. Just keep your ears open and decide for yourself, it's that simple. You don't need to dress a certain way to be part of the club. And all this political baggage that comes with some brands of music? Ugh... avoid it like the plague. I don't want some twit with a guitar trying to tell me what to think anymore than I want a politician doing it.

Shut up and play. If you suck, go away.

Heh... I'm getting old and cranky :perv:

[The Iconoclast]

I don't want some twit with a guitar trying to tell me what to think anymore than I want a politician doing it.

Nice quote. :bashful:

[Slash]

Joshua: try Napalm death - enemy of the music business.

[liam.c]

there seems to be no set rules the diffrence from say crimpshirne to crass to conflict to embrace to sham69 to the stooges or dead boys to samhain to the freeze .. well you get the point

if you skim all thease and say hay waht are the commen things it seems to mee the main things are fuck u. and do it your self ,the diy ethic being the most previlent aspect though the early days to now <except now many of the
old diy guys have lables of there own ,and biger lables <since greenday hit>have seen that theres cash to be made >


this DIY ethic is verry strong with artests that and the avant guard flavor

i can say for me i probably look more normal then i even have but ill tell ya im more "punk" then ive ever been lol

sound wise it seems that now low end bands are much more skilled then thay once were .. hell grage bands i hear around town are much much more musicly skilled then the germs were at the time of the start lol this might have alot to do with the reddiblity of information .. muchlike the art game .. and the availiblity of the tools <computers are godamn amazing ... 1200 bucks or less gets you one hell of a studio ... much cheeper then 1-- per hour at a real one >

the other thing i think witch stands out under the punk banner is <good or bad > the shit that the bands are saying and the kids listing are feeling are hart felt thay really mean it ... some times its fashion but that happens with any movement

its verry difficult to nail thease things down especialy with loaded words .. take emo for example rites of spring or early jawbraker or embrace would probably not be considerd emo now .. though at the time thats waht it was <ROS i guess was a sorta proto emo>i had a frend from germany staying with me once long time ago and he laughed at the term emo .. he said of corse its emo all music is lol ... his discription for emo as it was was girlypunk hehe >


so now if you really want to get to waht it is or where its at you must of corse discribe the recording instrament .. you must of corse say .. this is waht it is to me <or you have soo much trouble like is it a partical or wave problum :)>

so for me if i am saying wow thats "punk as fuk" it usualy involves .. the DIY ,the fuck you ,and the really meaning waht thay saying .............. this might encompass soul music on some days .. or it might not have any thing to do with music at all!

one thing thats intresting to me is probably a huge chunk of this comunity has been influenced by this movement or its off shoots . and that to me is awsum ! like your mans said those who controll the symobls controll the world :)
keep going mates

[John]

Hey, i've got another related question. I think it's weird that punk (to me) was a reaction to all the boring music back when it originated. Wasn't it meant to be new and exciting? Now a lot of punk is just a repetition of a certain style, or formula. Especially 'punkrock' geared towards the mainstream market, like Blink 182. Isn't more of a punk attitude involved in stuff like Fantomas, Blood Brothers or some Hiphop acts, trying to sound different, or radical? In 'Hiphop' (broadly defined), Ninjatunes comes to mind.
What's your thoughts on that?

Edit: I just had to add Einstürzende Neubauten to the mix.

[Blind]

Hey, i've got another related question. I think it's weird that punk (to me) was a reaction to all the boring music back when it originated.I guess it depends on when it originated. When was it? I was always of the impression that it was the mid-70's. If that's the case... music was defintely not boring in the 70's.

[John]

Yeah, let me put it this way... i'm a bit too young to've been there, but there's definitely a punk attitude that is important to the whole, um, movement. For a lack of better words...
Anyway, i think there's many bands that have been influenced by punkrock. What about Aphex Twin for instance? There's definitely more to it than a "four chords + bass" formula.

[Gezstar]

interesting topic. i'm a punk rock nutcase.. i can honestly say that the music changed my life when i was a teenager. going to see bands like nofx, millencolin and the vandals were some of the best times, and i still listen to a lot of that music (interspersed with more and more mellow stuff as time goes on though, hehe).

someone mentioned green day. i was, and am, a huge fan of theirs, and was pretty disappointed at the lashback they got so soon after their major label breakthrough - even though 'dookie' was, and is, a classic album. it seems like sometimes popularity is a burden. and the whole notion of 'selling out' is bullshit. if going to a major means a) getting more people to hear your song and b) getting money to eat and make more records, instead of ending up a homeless loser like the guy from crimpshrine, then why not do it.. punk is about being yourself, not following a 'punk rock rule book'.

i also don't agree that these bands are simply rehashing what their predecessors like the ramones and the clash (another two of my faves) did back in the seventies and eighties. listen to No Use For A Name's 'Hard Rock Bottom' to witness one particular evolution in mood and sound since those days.

Lastly, for any old skool punk rock fans, i'd like to recommend Social Distortion's new, and possibly best, album: 'Sex, Love and Rock 'n' Roll'. It's a modern day masterpiece. ;)

[Dan.v.D.]

what is todays hip hop?
what is todays blackmetal?

[Chяis]

Punk well I'd have to say the band Sevendust and I suppose Bif naked has some punkiness in it.

[Molly]

Punk is about anarchy, not about anything else......

If it's not here now, go back and have a look...

Dead Kennadys: Nazi Punks Fuck Off. California uber alles.

The Clash: London Calling

Sex Pistols: Pretty Vacant & 'God Save The Queen '- just because:)!!!

rebelion these days seems to be a little bit waterd down.....which kind of misses the point.

Molly x

[AnarchyAo2]

If a "punk" song doesn't anything to do with politics or some sort of ranting on society, then I call it pop, or just rock.

[Xen]

normally i wouldnt get involved in arguments about music and stuff, since you cant argue about someone else's personal taste. but really, if you want punk, listen to crass. they might not have been so technically outstanding but what they were doing was actual punk music. just read their lyrics for "punk is dead". it mightve been written in the 70's but it sure as hell applies to todays music scene as well.

http://www.plyrics.com/lyrics/crass/punkisdead.html

[knowmind]

i'm not sure what u mean by todays punk rock.....
ive been into punk rock since about 1989......and i guarantee that 99.9% of you have a completely different definition of punk rock than i do.rancid,blink 182,good charlotte,this is NOT punk rock,this is pop.
punk is an underground movement,not something you see on mtv.
how many of you have been to a show at cbgbs? how many of you have gotten into fights with 50 skinheads? how many of you know who sham 69 is?
how bout the vibrators?
punk is an ethic,hell its a way of life ,and none of this manufactured,corporate bullshit that you see on mtv or hear on the radio has anything to do with it.
if you want to hear a REAL street-punk band listen to the Templars.

[cotron]

I'm hoping some better political music will surface now with Bush at the helm...
The Reagan years had some awesome bands :P

come on bands, only 4 years left!

[Marcatili]

I'm adding a few bits and pieces...

First up, I don't listen to much contemporary 'punk' music and don't have much time for the mainstream style and it's infinite variants on the same theme- it is pop music for people who don't want to admit to liking beyonce.

I listened to a feature put together by my local radio station today- the feature was actually prepared at the height of the punk movement. What it revealed, or reminded me, was that even the Sex Pistols were a 'manufactured' band in some ways. They were carefully managed and basically used as a tool to create anarchy. Their look and the whole 'punk' look was essentially created by Vivienn Westwood- it was her and two friends from art school. One managed the band, the other managed the media surrounding them and Westwood did the clothing (if anyone knows more about this or wants to correct me, go ahead).
According to this feature, the punk idea actually began in New York but never really bloomed there. The reason punk blossomed so well in Britain was in response to the very real poverty and hopelessness that the population felt in the face of a recession. Punk sought to rebel, definitely, but it also documented the feeling of the lower classes in Britain in the period of the mid-late 70s (at least the Sex Pistols did). As Johnny Rotten said, punk was the music of the street in that place and time.

The punk ethos, as I understand it, transcends musical genres and actually can be found in all different styles of trend breaking music- particularly that which is anti-oppression, whether musical or political. I think it's fair to say that the record labels exercise musical oppression in many ways today.


In my mind punk music is defined by groups like:

At The Drive-In: Not their earlier stuff so much which was semi-standard punk/emo sorta style but their last album "Relationship of Command", which I think was heading into a more 'true' punk style/attitude/ pursuit. Attempting to find new musical ground with reference to old punk music as a style.

Rage Against the Machine: More their early stuff- the film clip for Killing in the Name was the first film clip that scared me with it's raw energy, fury and passion. As well as the obvious political message. In fact, for me, that's the closest thing to the original punk ethos that I can think of that came out of the 90s

Aphex Twin: I guess in terms of a genre, Aphex Twin's music would be considered 'break-core' but as far as I know, Richard D James pioneered an approach to dance music that sought to demolish traditional ideas of what music is, to break it down and rebuild it from the wreckage.

NWA: As was said earlier, Hip Hop, in a sense took on a 'punk' sensibility in the way it challenged authority, it created or came out of a whole culture of the street, it was in itself a whole new musical genre, it documented life as a poor black american and the many issues that poor black americans faced in the early 90s. For me, NWA embodies a lot of that early energy that I would associate with a punk attitude.

I don't feel as 'qualified' to make these sort of observations about punk as say, devilock or skank but that's how i look at punk anyway.