combining realistic technique and imaginative ideas

[oolong]

I guess the grass is always greener on the other side! My problem is no longer that I don't feel like I'm improving, but that after spending so long doing commissions of other people's characters, realistic studies, figure drawing and painting from reference, it's been like pulling teeth to combine my newly polished skills with personal, creative stuff that would be appropriate for a portfolio. People tell me "I'd kill to be able to draw like that" but on the inside I wonder if I've lost the creativity I used to have before I went to school, when I would just be full of ideas of stuff to draw and not care what the shading looked like, whether the color theory was correct, whether all the proportions were perfect, and I was still proud of it...

When I just let loose and sketch out ideas, I revert back to the graphic, cartoony way I used to draw and they turn out interesting and it's okay for illustration but too abstract/stylized to be turned into a 3d model. When I use a photo reference, I have a tendency to spend too much time getting small details to look the same, and the parts that are unreferenced look rougher than the parts that aren't. I can imitate the style of established concept artists pretty competently when I'm looking at their work, but it ends up looking like I'm biting their style and I know if I submit a portfolio full of unoriginal work, I'm going to let everyone down after getting a job. I don't have much of a 'style' or even an idea of what I want my style to look like.

Even just coming up with ideas is tough - I don't really have any fantasy or sci fi 'worlds' in my head like a lot of people do (I do write but it's realistic and historical fiction), so i end up relying on stereotypical tropes like 'elf magician' or 'space marine' but it seems disgenuine and derivative, I don't feel proud of it or like it's good enough to be in a video game, even when other people tell me it's a good drawing. I feel like my strength is springboarding off of vague ideas other people have and developing them into a fully fleshed thing, which is why i want to go into illustration or concept art rather than fine art - when I have a blank canvas sitting in front of me, it's overwhelming, I have no idea where to start besides repeating stuff I've seen somewhere else or non-representational doodles.

What gives? Anyone else have this problem and have some tips for how you fixed it?

[Elwell]

http://gurneyjourney.blogspot.com/
Specifically, http://gurneyjourney.blogspot.com/2009/09/why-i-wrote-imaginative-realism.html

[oolong]

http://gurneyjourney.blogspot.com/
Specifically, http://gurneyjourney.blogspot.com/2009/09/why-i-wrote-imaginative-realism.html

Thanks for the link! I was always a big fan of the illustrations in Dinotopia, and will definitely pick up this book when it comes out.

I guess that brings up another problem though - I can see from this guy's process that he frequently makes maquettes, goes out and takes photo reference, etc. But for a highly deadline-oriented field like concept art, this wouldn't be feasible, would it? How do people develop images on the fly and still make sure the shadows and stuff are all in the right place - is it a better use of my time to just memorize how a basic human shape would be shaded from a specific light source and use that same light source every time, or do you just worry about getting the important parts like the face and costume looking good and let some of the accuracy be sacrificed?

[Noah Bradley]

How do people develop images on the fly and still make sure the shadows and stuff are all in the right place

A whole lotta practice.

Study light on form by doing slow cast drawings. Eventually you'll be able to cast light on imagined forms somewhat realistically.

[Elwell]

How do people develop images on the fly and still make sure the shadows and stuff are all in the right place
By studying form, planes, and the principles of light. With experience and training one is able to "model" and "render," so to speak, mentally.

[oolong]

I wonder if I've been studying the wrong things, maybe, because that's something that's never intuitively 'clicked' with me, even after all this time I can draw something like a sphere, a cube, a cylinder or other simple object and be able to shade it fairly well, and I can draw cast shadows, but anything with subtle curves in it I have to rely on my memory of other pictures I've seen. And even with the simple geometric ones, it's more like I just remember 'yes, there's a line made by the edge of a circle of light that the shadow follows', not picturing it as a 3d sphere in my head. I spent the past year in an atelier where I learned to train a sense of 'linelessness' into my work when I'm painting from a reference or life, but it's still more like i'm drawing outlines of 2d shapes corresponding with the 3d object i'm looking at and then memorizing exactly what shape the shadows make and how dark/light they are, and painting them in based on eyeball measurements, not truly being able to 'see' light hitting the various angles of the form. I guess I just always assumed this was what it meant when people say 'once you learn ____ it becomes automatic'. I'm thinking I might try practicing drawing one of those 'faceted heads' with strong angles from memory until I can do it right, and maybe looking at the 'broken down' heads in some of my how to draw books and drawing the intermediate steps of the process... Any other advice?

[Elwell]

What you are describing is the real deficiency of most modern atelier-style training: the focus on visual transcription over the analysis and interpretation of form. This is excellent training for working from life, but does very little for working from your imagination. Check out the American illustration tradition (Pyle, Bridgman, Loomis, Reilly, the Famous Artists School, etc.).

[Camilla]

Rotating a figure "in your head" and visualizing the shadows has caused me great procrastination.
Burne Hogarth has written some books about how to construct the human figure in space (Dynamic Figure Drawing, Dynamic Anatomy, Drawing Dynamic Hands and Drawing the Human Head) and they have been very helpful to me. However, there's not much about rendering shadows. I guess that is quite impossible to explain. I'm afraid we just have to practise, practise and practise.

While I have been obsessed about making correct shadows, I have noticed that a lot of other artists don't. They cheat big time - or to put it more politely: they use lighting as an effect.
Take Caravaggio. His lighting looks convincing and true to life, but if you look closely, you will see that his lighting is by no means correct. He uses light to make the composition work.
And look at a lot of concept art. Here, too, realism has largely been sacrificed in order to get a more interesting compositional effect.
I am, of course, not saying that it is not important to strive to get shadows right. Being able to do so is obviously a powerful tool, and Caravaggio knew his shadows for sure.
I'm just saying that you should not become a slave of your shadows but master them and use them as a tool.

I hope this makes sense.

[oolong]

Definitely true Elwell, and was one of the reasons I didn't plan on coming back to the atelier for another year even though i learned a ton. I have some books by those authors so I'll re-read them and check out the others.

Rotating a figure "in your head" and visualizing the shadows has caused me great procrastination.
Burne Hogarth has written some books about how to construct the human figure in space (Dynamic Figure Drawing, Dynamic Anatomy, Drawing Dynamic Hands and Drawing the Human Head) and they have been very helpful to me. However, there's not much about rendering shadows. I guess that is quite impossible to explain. I'm afraid we just have to practise, practise and practise.

While I have been obsessed about making correct shadows, I have noticed that a lot of other artists don't. They cheat big time - or to put it more politely: they use lighting as an effect.
Take Caravaggio. His lighting looks convincing and true to life, but if you look closely, you will see that his lighting is by no means correct. He uses light to make the composition work.
And look at a lot of concept art. Here, too, realism has largely been sacrificed in order to get a more interesting compositional effect.
I am, of course, not saying that it is not important to strive to get shadows right. Being able to do so is obviously a powerful tool, and Caravaggio knew his shadows for sure.
I'm just saying that you should not become a slave of your shadows but master them and use them as a tool.

I hope this makes sense.

Yeah camilla, that makes a lot of sense. Guess i just need more practice so i can figure out when it's okay to 'fake' the lighting and when it isn't.

[J Wilson]

http://gurneyjourney.blogspot.com/
Specifically, http://gurneyjourney.blogspot.com/2009/09/why-i-wrote-imaginative-realism.html

I got a chance to see the new book (James Gurney had two copies available for people to flip through) during his demonstration at Art Out Loud this past weekend. As you'd expect, it's super high quality and full of great material. I wish I'd taken more time to look through it, but he had two of his travel sketchbooks there too, and those kind of stole the new books thunder for me :P I'm really looking forward to grabbing the new book when it comes out soon though.

[darkwolf29a]

Just from what I read on the link...Many Thanks Elwell, I will, definitely be buying the book. It has numerous things going for it, and the price is very nice as well. I think the combination of a decent price, plus a very helpful subject will make this book a huge success in the art world. I'm looking forward to getting my copy.

I'm in art school now, and they are teaching it in a traditional manner...I think. My first drawing class was about working through the standard topics: still life, some light figure drawing, etc. But, they didn't touch on drawing things from your head. So, I am thinking that this book will cover that issue for me.