confederate soldier(updated)

[CleptoCat]

Wow been a whiel since my last post. Something for a family member. Hes a big civil war buff and I was asked to paint him as a soldier. Anyway this ones has been a big learner for me and I feel that there could be a ways to go. i would appreciate crits big time.

UPDATED!
http://www.dragonthree.com/condon6.jpg

Merry Christmas

[jca]

well we all know he probably doesnt like black people..

[CleptoCat]

Oh gimme a break people. Being from the south and/or knowing your civil war trivia doesnt mean you dont like black people. WE are no more prejudicious than in any other part of the country...PROVEN FACT! Being southern doesnt mean your missing any teeth and I doesnt mean watching bug zappers is a past time. The Civil War is one of the most influential wars in American history .

Your reply is more prejudice and hateful than this guy I promise. Please just crit the painting.

Great now Im gonna be too irritated to go to sleep. I knew I should of just kept this pic to myself. Stereotyping morons.

[Mykro]

Honestly, I don't find it offensive at all. The fact that you're showing the soldier is a good document, regardless of opinions. That said you need to tighten a few areas up. The belt buckle, the hands, the eyes. The flag could use a little work, but I like the tattering, makes it feel antiquated and battle worn.

[usagi yojimbo]

i dunno, the first thing i think of when i see a confederate flag is slavery.

if your friend was a ww2 buff would paint him as a nazi? i admit that i dont know that much about the american civil war so if theres a diference id like to know what it is. i just think its wierd that this guy would want to be painted this way

[Samurai]

Ok, this could turn into a flamewar really quickly. I know that a history lesson is probably something better left outside of an art forum, but let me try present an unbiased historical viewpoint from Canada here to help avert what is going to inevitably end up being a threadkiller of a fight.

Contrary to popular belief, the North didn't set out to free the slaves. It was something of a noble afterthought. Yes, it was great, and it was one of most the significant features of the war (and human rights history), but it wasn't what the conflict, at its core, was about.

Conversely, the South's role wasn't about hanging on to slavery either. It was a feature of their agenda, but it wasn't, again, what the war was all about.

Also, I should note here that for the most part germany, it's soldiers, and its citizens were completely unaware of the atrocities happening in their country. Much of the pervasive atmosphere of racism in the country might have had something to do with the heavy Third Reich propoganda machine. Again, your average German didn't have a clue.

And lastly, how much influence do you think the average footsolder, north or south, left or right, has on the decision making power of the leadership? The movements of these various armies had nothing to do with the average man, but rather, with the agenda of those that lead them. It's unfair (even if only inferred) to compare Hitler to the likes of Jackson and Lee. It shouldn't be an us vs. them attitude, but rather see that good men died for causes that weren't their own, and ascribing racism to those actions is just a surface issue that will only end in fighting. Furthermore, how much of the evils of any particular army can be ascribed to an artist and an enthusiast a century and a half after the fact? Either way, trying to forget that the south exists is an injustice to history and a good first step on the road to repeating the mistakes that both sides committed in the past.

So, that said, the painting is quite nice. More than anything you need to tighten up your details.

And to the rest of you, try not to make inflammatory comments on either side of the issue.

[WalkingDead]

New to this site, but I am confused... I thought this was an art board not a political site. I really like it. Even though it is your family member, you managed to give him the tired, weary look of a civil war war torn soldier.

[CleptoCat]

thx for the crits and such people

Mykro..Samurai: Ill work the details a good bit more. Also Samurai thank you for trying to clear up the history part of this.

usagi: No I would not paint him as a nazi. Partly because he doesnt live in germany, but mostly because of the awful fact of what a nazi is. And finally he didnt ask to be painted this way...it was suggested as a gift kind of like when you go a get a picture taken as a cowboy. Thx for the comment

Walking Dead: The cool thing about art is that it really does come from life even politics. Also acheiving the tried and weary look was easy since he is generally tired and weary ;)
Thx for the comment.

Hopefully Ill update in a few hours

[stalecracker]

[ FIRST of all...]

Clepto... Looks good. Keep up the good work!!!

[Second of all...]

WOW!!!
JUST when you think it can't get ANY more dense in this forum... it does. Let's all go crack some history books and learn a bit about the SOUTH.

Of course... I am one to talk.

I am a Southerner AND I was born in Germany.
SO, Usagi... I must be one Jew-burning, Afro-American hanging-goose-steppin-good-ol'- boy to you... YEEHAW... SO

I guess, by your standards of judging (seeing ONLY the surface and believing propaganda is based solely on fact) I could throw out a couple *legitimate* views about you based on your handle.
Lessee... your probably short, Asian, have Black hair, drive slow and LOVE to eat rice and drink Saki!!! YAY, I'm Sherlock Holmes (You know, that cop from England) Just kidding... you're probably a birkenstock-wearin' Liberal...

Was I close?!?

Hmmm.... rereading what I wrote.... that was amazingly INSENSITIVE and JUDGEMENTAL.
*wink, wink* Do you SEE my POINT?!?

GIMME a frikkin break.

Thank god for people like everyone BUT Usagi and jca...

Merry Christmas!!!

[usagi yojimbo]

like i said before when i see a confederate flag and i think of slavery, and like you said samurai, it was a feature of their agenda which they fought for. so to me you painted a family member wearing a symbol for slavery,

i tried not to sound too aggressive but i guess i came off that way anyway. im genuinely curious because i really dont understand why people will have confederate flags on their license plates and stuff

and stalecracker, dont think ive had any kind of revelation because of your post, i didnt judge anyone

[stalecracker]

and stalecracker, dont think ive had any kind of revelation because of your post, i didnt judge anyone

You didn't? My bad... I must've read something ELSE.



...because i really dont understand why people will have confederate flags on their license plates and stuff

...i just think its wierd that this guy would want to be painted this way

[jca]

WOW. oops..:(

all right all right, i just thought people around these forums could find the distinction between an over-exaggerated statement and a sincere one. i'm sorry for all the BS it generated. i guess my humor is way too dry. if someone had said that about my piece i probably would have laughed but, we're all different right?

apologies directly to the man in the picture. and also to clepto.

to be a little retrospective on the whole Civil War, I'm very glad that the North had won and Lincoln chose to abolish slavery because if he hadnt, who knows how god-awful the Confederate States of America wouldve been like. we all know the reason why the South wanted to fight was because they fought for states' rights, and the Union wanted to abolish slavery. southern plantations (who had a strong economic grip on the nation) needed slavery as a form of employment. which is the reason they didnt want to abolish it. that's why i really don't have much respect for the Confederate flag. like usagi, all i see it symbolizing is slavery.

anyway, it was a joke strictly for myself. sorry for offending anyone, i apologize sincerely.

[CleptoCat]

Okay so maybe I was nieve to think that this issue could be over look and I could just get some feedback.

jca: Joking is a wonderful thing I was just hoping that this subject wasnt going to come up all together. I sometimes forget how people view the south. In particular those who knowing nothing of it.

Stalecracker: Thx man. Any ideas on how to get some texture into the jacket. Maybe even just somemore enery.

usagi: ok

[Mr. Teatime]

Allright, I wont add any crap about the Civil War because I don't know much about it, thanks to boring teachers.

It looks a little flat to me, especially in the hands. It's a great picture, that in my opinion needs a little more work, no offense. Just give it more shadows without completely redoing the picture. I like your shading on the face, neck, and bandana, just continue to the rest of the guy.

Nice work overall! :)

[CleptoCat]

Mr. Teatime: Agreed. Something about my paintings always looks flat. I think its my reluctancy to use really dark colors to shade with. Thx

[.cfb]

I'll just reinforce whoever the fuck said that the Civil War wasn't about slavery.

Since the signing of the Constitution, States Rights had always been an issue in the colonies, and, at Civil War time, states. The South was mad over high tarriffs and anti-states rights (in their mind: anti-liberty) Northerners. South Carolina was the leader in the revolt, and they were the hardest hit by the tarriffs (cheifly the Tarriff of Abominations). The south had slavery because they needed it to support their way of life, agriculture. When slavery was abolished by lincoln with the Emancipation Proclomation, the South was in shambles.

The Civil War was fought over states rights, not slavery. Most Southerners didn't even own slaves, and were less rascist than the Northerners, because they were used to being around blacks. When the blacks came up North, the Northerners were frightened of them.

Lee was totally against slavery, but he fought for Virginia because he lived there.

Associating the Confederate Flag with Slavery is a huge misconception - you should associate it with high tarriffs and agriculture.

Anyways, tighten up the croth and face, and give some definition to his midsection.

[usagi yojimbo]

alright, this is the last time im posting in this thread (i promise)

stalecracker: i wrote that post except the last bit before you even replied, you just hit submit reply before me (check the time if you want).

and just because i said i dont understand something doesnt mean im judging it

now quote whatever you want from this if you want. i think ive explained myself enough already and i really dont care anymore.

cleptocat: sorry for wrecking your thread, ill be more careful next time

[ZeroWave]

Overall I think it still looks pretty unfinished..is a good start though

[gallon]

I'd add some more contrast , maybe choose a side that is in the shadows.

On his jacket, you can see the lines of his "chest-muscles". It's alright if it's really tight and made of thin cloth. As a uniform I'd assume it's a bit padded and thick, but I really don't know anything about these uniforms they used. The south is prob. a hot place. Check some refs and see how the fabric "falls" on the body (wrinkles in the cloth, so on....)

one way to adding texture is simple by using a textured brush. If u use PS 7 that is....

If not...i guess you can stop reading now...
Choose a brush, go into the brushes tag, choose texture ( if u click the word texture you can choose from some different ones, I myself wouldn't go with a cloth texture as the are a bit "square".
Then work it in with a bit of opacity, and use different colours as well ( Nothing is one-coloured, and this'll add more life.

That's a little something. Merry christmas and hope it helps

[Killer Napkins]

well when i see a confederate flag i think of gta .. wh=ith those hicks i dunno im crazy hahaha haghzfsdhgfyf08^*TFT*Y!F^F)*@Dffdx2fdvg